High glucose/not eating

My cat Ravan is 15 yrs old He's been raised on a raw meat diet all his life. 8 months ago he refused to eat his raw chicken (1st time?) He'll eat some cooked & he'll eat the Instinct Rabbit. End of January he was diagnosed with diabetes.Lantus 2X a day 1 unit. I test his blood before his shot am & pm & have checked it several times in between. I'll try to fill out a spreadsheet tomorrow. Four days ago at 9am his glucose was 352 I gave his 1 unit of Lantus after he ate. At 8:30 pm glucose dropped to 68 so I skipped the insulin.the next morning at 3:30 glucose 404, 9:am 392 after he ate I gave him 1 unit of Lantus at 9pm it was 306
I'll skip to today ( you'll be able to see his readings when i fill out the spreadsheet) Yesterday at 8:30 pm his reading was 348 I was cutting up a large piece of liver to give him a little before his shot & went upstairs for a minute. Ravan ate the entire large piece of liver. The next morning (today) at 4:30am glucose 406 8:40am 425 11:50 449 he hasn't had any food since the liver yesterday.I did give him 100cc of ringers. He's not drinking water either. Checked at 4:30 pm 429 he finally ate a spoon of sardines at about 8:30 tonight at 9pm his glucose was 390 I gave him 1 unit of Lantus.
Now I'm worried his glucose might drop very low like it did several days ago to 68. I also gave him a syringe of chicken baby food before his shot.I'll check his glucose again at 1130pm to see if it's dropping.I haven't slept much in 24 hrs & feel very stressed out.I did buy the strips to check ketones but he's not drinking or peeing for several hrs now.Should I be feeding him with a syringe every few hours? This is all overwhelming!

 

Ketone test is a must. Try to syringe some watery food into him if he refuses plain water. A trip to the vet might be necessary if you can't get a ketone test done at home.
Are you using the alphatrak? 68 isn't too low on a human meter but it is the "act now" number on the AT meter.
I'm thinking it might be possible he's got an upset stomach from that extra liver he ate but with his higher numbers my first thought is ketones.

 

I'm using a Relion Prime meter 11:30 last nite glucose was 377 3am checked his glucose (6 hrs after insulin) it's down to 213 Checked ketones Negative! He ate about a tbl.spoon of Instinct Rabbit canned food. I think him eating all that liver caused him not to eat & maybe his glucose to stay so high. Does that sound right?
If his glucose comes down more do I still give 1 unit of Lantus at 9am,his regular time? Or should I give less? He's also drinking water now. I'll check again at about 7:30 am.

 

Glad he’s doing a bit better, and yay for negative ketones!!! We usually keep the Lantus dose steady unless the kitty has a bg under 200 (once we see more mid cycle data on the spreadsheet that no shot number will come down too) If in doubt, post here for help. And if you need help setting up the spreadsheet, let us know and we’ll get someone to do it for you.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/

 

I’d give the 1 u dose this AM. It’s great that ketones were negative. You should keep a close eye on him today, feed small amounts regularly and keep getting water or watery food into him. Do the testing routine I put into one of my posts on your other thread. Keep posting here for help and to let us know how it’s going.

 

Ravan woke me up at 6am, hungry, I thought Oh his glucose must be low . It's down to 163! He ate about 1 1/2 oz. of chicken in gravy Soulistic. I'm concerned his Glucose will keep going lower. 5 days ago he was eating but his glucose went from 352 to 68 in 12 hrs. Thank god it didn't go any lower. I did NOT give him the Lantus & it slowly came up to 208. If I had given him the shot I'm sure it would have gone a lot lower. I'll check him again this morning in an hour. I thought if it's below 150 no insulin?

 

163 is good and he’s eating, that’s great!!! Normal glucose in cats with a human meter is 50-120, so you’re safe. Test again when you can and of course before you’re ready to shoot. Since you’re testing and he’s eating better, I would agree with Kris, that unless he’s real low at shot time, you would give the shot. Just post back with the number and we’ll help.

 

Should I post back here for you to reply or just stay on the main forum?

Ok I see that you are going to the main forum to check on me. I'll just post here. Thanks guys! It's taking me a while but I'm getting the hang of it.

I downloaded the spreadsheet, where can i see one filled out?

7am glucose 260. It went up from the food. His regular shot is between 8:30 & 9am

If his glucose is still over 200 should I give 1 unit as usual or maybe 1/2 unit to be safe it won't drop way down?

 

Post here. I will likely be at work by shot time, but maybe @Kris & Teasel will be here. If not, someone else will be.

 

I added some info to post above

 

I'm here. I'll be going out for a while later on but can check in often today. Here's some useful info (already gave you some of this):

It would help us if you set up your signature (light grey text under a post). Here's how:

• click on your name in the upper right corner of this page
• click on "signature" in the men that drops down
• type the following in the box that opens: kitty's name/age/date of diabetes diagnosis/insulin you're using /glucose meter you're using/what he eats/any other meds or health issues he has.

Another thing that will help us help you is to set up a spreadsheet like the one we use here. We can all see it and look at it before offering advice: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/
Here's a link to an explanation of how the spreadsheet works: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/understanding-the-spreadsheet-grid.156606/

If you reread the instructions for setting up the spreadsheet (SS) it tells you in there to click on the blue "share" button at the top right. You have to click "anyone with link can view" and input the URL for the SS in the bar that's there.

Also - copy and paste your SS URL into your signature so we can see it when we click on that link.

.................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

Here's the basic testing routine we recommend:

1. test every day AM and PM before feeding and injecting (no food at least 2 hours before) to see if the planned dose is safe
2. test at least once near mid cycle or at bedtime daily to see how low the BG goes
3. do extra tests on days off to fill in the response picture
4. if indicated by consistently high numbers on your SS, increase the dose by no more than 0.25 u at a time so you don't accidentally go right past a good dose
5. post here for advice whenever you're confused or unsure of what to do.

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Here's an explanation of what we call "bouncing". It explains why a kitty's BG can go from low to sky high:

1. BG goes low OR lower than usual OR drops too quickly.
2. Kitty's body panics and thinks there's danger (OMG! My BG is too low!).
3. Complex physiologic processes take glycogen stored in the liver (I think of it as "bounce fuel"), convert it to glucose and dump it into the bloodstream to counteract the perceived dangerously low BG.
4. These processes go into overdrive in kitties who are bounce prone and keep the BG propped up varying lengths of time (AKA bouncing).
5. Bounce prone kitty repeats this until his body learns that healthy low numbers are safe. Some kitties are slow learners.
6. Too high a dose of insulin can keep them bouncing over and over until the " bounce fuel" runs out and they crash - ie., have a hypo episode. That's why we worry so much about kitties that have had too high a starting dose prescribed by the vet and the owner isn't home testing.

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Here are some tips on how to do urine ketone testing (VERY important of BG is high and kitty isn't eating well!):

• put the end of the test strip right in his urine stream as he's peeing
• slip a shallow, long handled spoon under his backside to catch a little pee - you don't need much
• put a double layer of plastic wrap over his favourite part of the litter box and poke some depressions in it too catch pee.

Most test strips have to be dipped and allowed to develop for 15 seconds before viewing the colour change in very good light.

 

Re filled in SS: if you want to see any of our SSs just click on the blue link in our grey signature text below our posts.

Re no shot BG for today: post your morning BG test number here as soon as you get it. If it's at or very near 200 you should give 1 u of Lantus. Get another BG test at +2 (SS lingo = 2 hours after the injection). If it's similar to this AM's pre shot BG test or a bit higher you probably won't see a big drop. Is it's 50+points lower, plan to test at +3, +4, etc.

 

Since you shot at 9:30 last night, you need to shoot no earlier than 9 this AM. We try to stay as close to 12 hours as possible, and only change dose times by 15 min to a half hour at a time. Kris gave you a lot of good info. Check it out and ask any questions.
Short answer to your dosing question is to give the one unit, but post here with the number first. He’s eating now and you’re testing plenty often enough to catch any low numbers.

 

Thanks for catching the dose timing thing, Sharon.

 

Ok I'll work on the signature & spreadsheet later today I think I need some sleep now,at least till 9am when i test again.

 

Ravan's glucose 9am 361 He doesn't want to eat because he ate 1/2 can of food 2 hrs ago. Do I still give a full dose 1 unit or less? Last shot was at 9:30pm his glucose was 390 1 unit of Lantus brought it down to 163 in about 8 hrs?
Spreadsheet, do I fill it out on the computer ? I was looking at the directions & I think I have information overload combined with little sleep. I didn't find where it said if I fill it out on line or not. I'll look at it more closely later today.

 

Did you give the shot? It should be fine.

 

Yes to 1 unit this AM. There are techie folks here to set up the SS for you: @Chris & China ?

 

Be happy to set it up for you. Just click on my name and choose "Start Conversation" to send me a private message so I can get some information I need

 

I gave Ravan his 1 unit of Lantus at 9:30 also a syringe with baby food I'll check him again at noon.

1:15pm Checked his glucose it's 467 ! why is it going so high? He had 1 unit of Lantus at 9:30am glucose was 361 I was worried it would go too low.

 

He may be bouncing. Sometimes when a cats glucose drops lower than they are used to the body releases stored glucose and the bg ‘bounces’ high. They do not have to drop very low for this to happen.

 

I always get very worried when his glucose so high. Is there anything I can do to bring it down? He won't get his second shot till 9:30pm. I've been checking his glucose all night so neither of us got much sleep. He's "Very " soundly sleeping since i checked at 1:30. I think I'll wait till about 5pm to check again. I know I should check every 2 hrs to get the curve but he really hates getting poked in the ear Now when he sees me he runs. Ravan is nearly 16 yrs old. I don't want to constantly stress him out.

 

Once you set up a spreadsheet and start tracking his BG numbers patterns will appear. Without that data we're just guessing. In the short term it's better to be high than too low. You don't need to do a full curve to figure out his patterns. Go back and reread my post #11 above to check the testing routine we recommend and the explanation of why BG can go from low to high so quickly.

Please do take up Chris (&China)'s offer to set up a spreadsheet for you. We rely on it heavily to figure out dosing.

 

There’s not much you can do at this point. If you contact Chris, she will help you get the spreadsheet going. That will help us see if this is a bounce or not. Just click on her picture and then on ‘start a conversation’
Is he eating better today? Is it low carb food?

 

Did that, waiting for the reply. Did I do this incorrectly? I went to "start a conversation" & put in some info but did not receive a reply yet?

 

She may not be around right now. If you don’t hear from her by tonight, we’ll tag her again.

 

The first time I locked the conversation so I did it again just now & left it open Which way is correct?

I did the signature,Is it OK? Is there anything else i should add?

 

if you want to try, send me a conversation and I’ll let you know if it comes through. I’m somewhat computer illiterate...

 

I got the conversation that JoyBee meant for @Chris & China. Too many Kris/Chris's ...

 

Should i lock the conversation or not? I better send it again to Chris & China this time .

 

Do whatever way you messaged me. That worked. I’ve not noticed the locking option...

 

Ok. Thanks

 

I got it.....and yeah, I tend to pop in and out but am happy to help!

 

Ravan is not eating or drinking water all day. He acts Nauseous everytime I give insulin & all day. ( I did give him Pepcid but it didn't seem to help) I offered him several different foods but he just turns away, same when i offer water. He's been sleeping all day. He looks very lethargic ,depressed. I tried to give him baby food in a syringe & he struggled so much I felt terrible forcing him.I decided to wait till about 8:30 to check his glucose if it's still high should I give him the regular 1 unit of Lantus? Should I force feed him? This is such a roller coaster ride!

 

I suggest you consult your vet about anti nausea and appetite stimulant meds if Cerenia isn't helping. I think you mentioned trying Cerenia in an earlier post, didn't you?

 

I have a problem with giving Pharmaceuticals. I'm 71 & do not take any meds. I have always tried to use Homeopathic or natural products. My cat Jai was given Buprenorphine ( it states on the web site not to give it to an animal with respiratory problems "can cause respiratory distress" but the vet gave it to him & he did go into respiratory distress & had to be euthanized. In my life I have found many Vets & Doctors concerned more with the money than the wellbeing of their patient. (no I never used Cerenia) Next I'll try slippery elm. I do think the Insulin makes him feel sick,nauseous.
I'll try to work on the spreadsheet tomorrow. What info do you need from me?

 

Looking back over this thread, it looks like he ate pretty well this AM. Is he normally a good eater or picky? I prefer not to use meds too, but it’s important that he eat. Not enough calories can cause ketones, but also hepatic lipidosis. Try the slippery elm tonight. Hopefully it will work.

 

Thanks Sharon I'm feeling pretty down right now. Getting ready to check Ravan's glucose. I'll post the result in a little while.

His reading is higher than it was at 1:15 today It's now 474? He hasn't eaten all day why is it going higher? I am so worried. Yesterday at this time he was at 390 after the insulin it dropped to 163 in 8 hrs It looks like it will probably do that again.
Even though it's high do I still need to get food into him before the shot?

 

It’s good if you can get something in him. Have you given the slippery elm? I’ve taken that myself and it works well. How long does it take to start to work? If he’s not feeling well, the stress and any inflammation could be causing higher numbers. Has he been peeing and pooping normally?

 

I'll give him the slippery elm a few mins before I try to feed him at about 9:15 He gets his shot at 9:30 tonight. No BM today he hasn't eaten anything since this morning at 6am it was only about a tablespoon of canned food. He did pee a lot this afternoon. He doesn't even want to drink water.
Do I still give him the regular dose of insulin? I'm worried it will drop the glucose really low like yesterday.

 

That 163 from yesterday isn't that low, if that's the low number you're referring to. Low is below 50 on a human meter. He needs insulin because he could very easily develop ketones. Try syringing a bit of pureed food into him and give the 1 unit dose.

 

163 isn’t too low, especially 8 hours after the shot. It’s actually a pretty good number. Normal on a human meter is 50-120. Were you able to get a nap today?

 

I slept for a few hours. Thanks for asking. I'm feeling depressed. This up down , up down is hard to deal with. For Ravan & for me (his sister Peggy Sue has High liver enzymes They think it'd pancreatitis . So she's not eating either. )
I just got Ravan & her to eat about a tablespoon of Canned Wild caught Tuna. Just plain,no salt, in water.( the slippery elm does help) I hate to give him fish. I don't think it's good for him but I guess it's better than nothing?

163 is a good reading but I was checking him every hour worried it would go much lower. One time it dropped to 68. I'm going to give him his 1 unit of Lantus now. I just hope the glucose doesn't go too low.
Thanks to you all. You can't imagine how much I appreciate your help. I've lived alone for a long time & it's nice to has some one to talk to.

 

Glad they both ate a little. What are you doing for Peggy Sue’s liver enzymes? Have you tried Milk Thistle?

 

YES, She had blood work last summer & her enzymes were high. The vet wanted to sell me some product he recommended. I asked to see the bottle & the main ingredient was Milk Thistle. I told him no, I wanted to try the milk thistle I had at home. He was not happy about that (his little bottle cost $57)
I gave her milk thistle mixed in baby food & a little distilled water every day for a month. Had blood work done again & her enzymes were way down! I'm still giving her the milk thistle but she is looking sick & barely eating. I'm worried it's her liver enzymes up again & this time the milk thistle doesn't seem to be helping.Her & Ravan are from a litter of 5 that were born in my garage. After feeding them every 2 hrs for days(the mother cat got hit by a car,kittens were only a few days old) I kept them all! In the last 2 years 3 have died. One had heart disease, the other cancer & the last one was Ok one day & dead the next. Don't have any idea what happened to her.I have a very difficult time when i lose one of my kitties.Now I'm worried sick about the last two. My other cats from years ago all lived to be at least 19 some to 22 yrs old. I was so hoping Ravan & Peggy Sue would also live a long life.
I'm going to get some sleep I'll check Ravan a 3am Yesterday his glucose dropped 177 points by 3:30am.

 

Wow 19-22 years is great. You must be doing something right! I’ve had several live into 20’s too. It’s always so hard to loose our babies.
Do try to get some sleep.

 

Ravan's glucose was still high at 6am 414 He came to his dish to eat but barely ate a spoonful He still looks nauseous. The slippery elm helps but i'm not sure how often he can get it. I think it interferes with digesting the food. (Yesterday at 6am his glucose was 163.) At 9am he did eat another spoon of food so i gave him 1 unit of Lantus at 9:30
Last week his glucose wa 352 at 9am & dropped to 68 by 9pm (I will work on the spreadsheet today. ) I don't want to keep checking his blood every 2 hrs. He cringes when i come toward him or runs & hides. He's never done that in 15 yrs. It's breaking my heart to see him like this.
Ketones negative at 6am

 

He might not have another drop like that from 1 u this week. Their insulin needs change often. We tend to focus on a few days at a time only although the older data is good history. You don't have to check him every 2 hours. The goal is to see how low a dose gets him so be strategic in your testing and aim to test when the Lantus dose should be at its peak action - usually somewhere around 5 to 7 hours after the dose.

 

Thanks Kris, I'm just starting to fill out the spreadsheet,can I start with two weeks ago or is it better to go back to the beginning?

I've been looking at the other spreadsheets but I don't see Chris & China's ?

 

Yes, put all your data going back to date of diagnosis. In the right hand "notes" section of the spreadsheet include any key information like a food change, vet visit, supplements change and so on beside the relevant dates.

 

OK,Thanks.

It's almost 11:30 Ravan is asking for food ( his glucose must be dropping) He ate a few licks of canned food & 4 tiny pieces of raw liver. He also wanted to go outside.It's only 34 degrees today & windy. Normally I wouldn't let him out on a cold day but i thought it might perk him up.He lasted about 3 mins & came back in. He's back sleeping.I'll check his glucose at 3pm.

 

Finally finished the spreadsheet. In the beginning I only tested 2 X a day before a shot. I'm going to take a break When I get back I'll try to add it to my signature.

 

what is his appetite like normally? Are you sure there’s no infection anywhere? Has he been checked for pancreatitis? I’ll tag @Marje and Gracie to give you Slippery Elm dosing info.

 

If this were my kitty, I’d get him to the vet. A cat that is not eating and has unregulated diabetes can be at risk for diabetic ketoacidosis. Are you checking his urine ketones?

As much as you might distrust vets, I would not risk this as DKA can be deadly and it can happen fast. If you test his ketones and they are negative, then it’s likely something else...perhaps pancreatitis. But if you aren’t testing ketones, they need to be checked. If you can’t get a urine sample to stick the urine ketone strip into, then he needs to go to the vet. DKA causes electrolyte imbalances and is caused by (1) not enough insulin (2) not enough food/water (3) infection.

 

My regular vet is great. Problem is he recently got a new guy who's supposed to be an "expert" on diabetes.(Has all these letters after his name.) The man may be educated but he's probably over 80 yrs old & I do not agree with a lot of his advice. He told me I HAD to get a animal Meter & insulin for cats. He wanted to draw urine from Ravan with a needle to check for ketones,I had read about this & told him No. After I brought Ravan home he looked very sick. He gets extremely stressed in the car & at the vets. I called the clinic & my Vet was there. He said to bring Ravan in
When I got there my Vet felt Ravans belly & said ,there's his bladder, the other vet said," I couldn't find it! "He brought an ultrasound machine in, put Ravan flat on his back( Very stressful position for an animal & unnecessary for this test) Ravan was crying out & struggling. I stepped forward & asked them to please lay him on his side. My Vet,( that I've always got along with, raised his voice & told me," Stand over there & let us do our job" He also said ," stop going on the internet ,reading all that garbage!" I'm 71 yrs old & felt humiliated, he did not need to talk to me like that. I started crying,(very stressed out!) The "Expert" poked a needle into Ravan's belly 3 times before he found His bladder! The entire time Ravan was struggling & crying. I'm supposed to be there to protect him, to provide comfort. That is not what happened. After all this unnecessary bullshit his ketones were negative.
When I got home Ravan could not walk. He was in pain. He lay with his belly flat on the cement basement floor. For 5 days he had pain urinating. & laid on the flood for 15 mins . each time. When i called the vet & told him he said,that has nothing to do with my test. Bullshit!
Do you understand why I do not want to take him to ANY vet. This is not the first time I've had a terrible experience. I've been to 6 or 7 different Vets over the 45 yrs I've lived here. Sorry to make this so long. I've been checking Ravan's ketones every day ,negative.He probably does have Pancreatitis , his sister had high liver enzymes. They are nearly 16 yrs old, I do not want to put them through any more pain or stress. But I will try anything I can to help them.Does that make sense?

 

Sharon. Ravan usually eats good. He's a big cat, usually weighs 0ver 14 lbs. He not fat, just tall. I was told he might be part maine coon. Every time I give his insulin he appears nauseous. His Ketones are negative. I'm new to this web site but NOT new to taking care of animals.For over 51 years now I've had cats,dogs, birds a rabbit. I truly Love animals. When I say that, I really mean it. They are like my children. When I hear people say they,"put their cat or dog down" I don't understand. If that was a child that was very ill would you," put your child down?" Over 15 yrs ago I became Vegetarian so I could afford to feed my cats raw meat. I've been on disability for 18 years. So when i hear people say I can't afford to feed my animals that expensive food I think ," just how much are you willing to give up to really take care of you animal companion?" I guess I have very different ideas about what it means to "Love" an animal.

 

Would like to see pic of Ravan, I always enjoy seeing people’s cats, share if you would like to

 

Joy I can tell you love Ravan and Peggy Sue, and I’m sorry you went through that with your vet. How long ago was that? I’m an animal lover too. I’ve also had dogs and birds, rabbits and now have chickens and horses in addition to my 12 cats. They absolutely eat better than I do, so I know where you’re coming from!
It’s good that Ravans ketones are still negative, keep testing for that. I don’t know much about hepatic lipidosis, but if he doesn’t start eating soon, you may need to watch for that too. You say when you give insulin, he seems nauseous, is he eating before the shot?

ETA, Yes a pic of Ravan and Peggy Sue would be great!

 

I hope you can get him eating soon. I worry about hepatic lipidosis too. At least you can test for ketones. Has he ever had pancreatitis?

 

Today is better,so far. Ravan keeps going to his dish nibbling at what I put down. He's definitely doing better today. Yes, he eats before his insulin. ( if he doesn't I put baby food in a syringe & feed him before I give him Lantus).Within a few mins after his shot he starts looking nauseous. Making little smacking movements with his mouth,like he has a bad taste.Then he usually sleeps. I'm very attentive & connected with my animals. I think I notice things that other people are too busy with their lives to notice. I'm home a lot with them.
I recently bought Ketone strips & check his urine every day now. So far it's been negative for ketones.
The incident with the Vet was at the end of January when he was 1st diagnosed with diabetes. I brought him & Peggy Sue in in January to have blood work. They were both not eating as usual . Three of their siblings had died in less than 2 years so I was concerned. When the vet took blood for the test he shaved their neck & took it from the Jugular vein in their neck. Ravan was very stressed out, he hates it in the car & at the Vet. My regular Vet is very good at drawing blood. No Problem. We had discussed what might be wrong & we both thought it might be their kidneys.The next day I was shocked to hear his glucose was 500 & he has Diabetes. ( I didn't know at that time that stress can raise their glucose way up).Peggy Sue had high liver enzymes. Vet said it could be Pancreatitis or her Liver. He said a liver biopsy would possibly tell. I declined a biopsy. I gave her milk thistle every day for a month. Had blood work again & her liver enzymes came way down. Looking at the spreadsheet I still wonder if he really does have diabetes. I was giving him 0. 5 & .25 units of insulin for a while & start thinking maybe the insulin is causing the problem? Maybe it's just my wishful thinking? So, how would I know for sure he has diabetes & didn't get a high reading due to extreme stress? He definitely appears a lot sicker now,on insulin , than when I 1st brought him in . This is my 1st experience with Diabetes. It's very frightening & confusing! I'll try to post a photo of my kitties tomorrow. Ravan needs his shot in a little while. Has anyone looked at his spreadsheet yet? I just copied it into my signature.
Thank you all for your help. Night for now.

 

One thing you can try is urine test strips that show ketones AND glucose. If they test positive for glucose spilling into urine your kitty is definitely diabetic. You BG test numbers show you he is. The urine test would just add more weight.

 

Glad you got the SS set up and posted. A cat can get a higher reading from stress, (as well as from pain or inflammation) but once the stress is gone the numbers should come down to normal ranges which on a human meter is 50-120. The fact that Ravans numbers are not staying in the normal range points, unfortunately, to diabetes. I have a cat that I had to take to the emergency clinic. While there his glucose was 279, but after we were home and he was feeling better the number dropped to 65 and has stayed in that range since.

 

how is raven doing? i am hoping he has tested negative for pancreatitis. ..make sure it is the right test...there are two...one is more reliable than the other...know this from experience ...pancreatitis can cause alot of ravens symptoms...low appetite ...nausea...vomiting...and very much pain (i know i have had it myself)....has he been tested for
any heart conditions?...these can cause nausea...also do consider his diabetes may be secondary to another underlying cause...cancer...sry to alarm you...

 

Ravan seems a bit better today. He woke me asking for food. Now the problem is all he'll eat is fish or liver. Before he got sick I rarely ever gave him fish or liver. I also gave him some chicken baby food in a syringe with Slippery elm for the nausea, before the insulin.
Hi Allison, you mentioned 2 tests for pancreatitis. Which one is the more reliable one? After the problems at the Vets, I don't want to put Ravan thru all the stress again but I'll see how things go. What is the treatment for pancreatitis?
How do I post a photo of my kitties? ( I'm not so good with the computer.This has all been a learning experience)

 

Glad he’s eating better! If he wants fish and liver, that’s ok for now. When he gets better you can switch him back to his usual food. To add a pic, click on your name at the top right of the page. Then on avatar.
I don’t know what the tests are, but I’ll look them up and get back to you

ETA The two tests are the SNAP which is usually run in the vets office. It will tell you yes or no
And the other test is the SPECfPL which is sent off and is the better test. Here’s some more info on pancreatitis
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/a-primer-on-pancreatitis.83108/

 

Hi Sharon,I tried several pics but each one it said," this file is too large? "There just regular photos. I don't know what else to do?

Ravan is again refusing to eat. He barely licks at a tiny bit. This afternoon he ate about a teaspoon of liver It's 8 pm & I offered him several kinds of food & he won't eat. This is scaring me again.He looks like he's losing muscle ,walking slow & a tiny bit wobbly. Sides look much thinner. I watched a video about syringe feeding & the woman gives her cat 4 large syringes of pureed food 2X a day! I think Ravan would vomit if I gave him that much. Have any of you syringe fed your cat. How much did you feed?

Gee, where is everybody? I tried to start a conversation with Allison but she did not respond.

 

I can’t help with the photo thing, I’m pretty computer illiterate too! I just used photos I took with my phone or iPad.

I’ve syringe fed a few times, and I just give as much as they will tolerate (use your judgement, you know Ravan) and I did it multiple times a day rather than just twice. You really should consider the pancreatitis test. Also, maybe try some Hills A/D food. It’s not too bad carb wise and it’s supposed to be a high calorie recovery food and easy to syringe. You have to get it from a vet though.

 

I have had to syringe feed sick cats in the past but I don't recall the amount. It was frequent and it was messy. In the worst case the kitty ended up with a surgically installed feeding tube for three weeks and I syringed pureed food through that until she started eating normally on her own again.

 

no magic pill for pancreatitis (i had it and it hurts)...for humans or cats...

sorry Ravens mom...I am just not able to navigate this website too well...I was very busy today but DID get your message and definitely want to talk to you more as we do have sooo much in common wow...losing three cats in such a short period of time would have me wondering how much more i could handle ...and now you are facing two other sick kitties...i am always going to be here if you need/want to chat...I hope reaches you immediately but i am not sure how this works...let me know how soon you get this...sending hugs to you and your kitties....Allison

 

Kris & Teasel,What was wrong with your cat, that you had to force feed. & how did it all turn out?

 

btw...i too have tried to keep conversations going and I think ppl are just not getting my messages as maybe there is not much communication between the different forums?...

 

You mean Bubbles ? or Mor Mor?

 

Hi Allison, I'm on the computer so i just got your message. Thank you for the reply. I need to get Ravan's glucose reading now but I check back in a little while.

 

ravens mom...I can give you the details about Bubbled my beloved little angel....it might be helpful ....my other kittty Mor Mor is not well either as I have talked about aswell ...so wasnt sure which mitty you meant...

 

Allison I think the question about the sick cat was for Kris & Teasel.

I just checked Ravan's glucose & it's back up 437. I'm confused. If I give him a tiny bit more Lantus his glucose might drop very low. It did before to 68. I don't know what to do?

Allison, Any information would be appreciated. I'm wondering if I should start syringe feeding Ravan & Peggy Sue. Neither one wants to eat since this morning.

 

Does anyone know if krill Oil is OK to give the cats every day? I read one article that fish & Krill oil can aggravate Pancreatitis? It's possible that both Ravan & Peggy Sue do Have Pancreatitis. They sure have all the symptoms.

 

She stopped eating for reasons that were never clear. Hepatic lipidosis is a danger under those conditions so the vet recommended a feeding tube. I agreed and after three weeks of tube feeding she was eating well on her own. The tube was simply pulled out and the cat had many healthy years after that.

 

hi its Allison..we are somehow missing each other at a very important time for your cats...if you suspect either cat has pancreatitis they need to get to a vet STAT...now...it is very painful and can be life threatening according to what my vet has said...can u call a vet and ask advice? I am not qualified to advise you on this....are they very lethargic ...vomiting...appearing in any way to be in distress??

 

It would really surprise me if both cats had pancreatitis at same time...its not contagious...

 

Hi Allison, Ravan was diagnosed with Diabetes but at that time the vet said something could be going on with his Pancreas or Liver also.Peggy Sue also had high liver enzymes. Last week I cooked some Salmon in butter for them & they gobbled it up . But an hour later they both vomited it all up. I read later that cats with Pancreas problems cannot have fat It must have been the butter that made them vomit. I ate some of the Salmon & I was OK so nothing was wrong with the fish. Peggy Sue & Ravan are from the same litter so maybe they just inherited the same problems?

talk more tomorrow. i haven't been getting much sleep lately. i'm off to bed.

 

i am not a vet....I want your cats to survive whatever they are going thru...i so want to help you...at some point you also need to help yourself...but if your cats are vomiting or otherwise in distress...I personally wouldnt wait....I am so sry I wish i had more answers ....dont wait...u might be very sry u did....just my thoughts....

 

Good morning Joy, how is Ravan doing, is he eating better? I don’t know about the krill oil and pancreatitis so hopefully someone else can answer that. I think the reason his numbers are up is because he is not feeling well. We don’t know if it’s pancreatitis or something else, but pain, inflammation and the stress of not feeling good will make the glucose numbers higher. You joined us on Sunday and he wasn’t eating well then, the weekend is coming up, so you may want to consider a vet visit now.

 

Hi Sharon, Ravan ate a half can of food at 3am, 7am a few pieces of liver,10am a large shrimp. I just checked his Glucose & it's 488. Right now he's eating again ,the other half of the can of food. I've been giving him a syringe of baby food with slippery elm 2-3 times a day & it's definitely helping with the nausea. I really don't want to bring him to the vet Some cats seem to deal fine with going in the car & to the vet. Ravan gets so stressed out it takes a week till he calms down. (Maybe he takes after me? ) In 15 years these last visits are the only time Ravan has been in my car or to a Vet, It really freaked him out.Not only that I need to make an appt. at least a week ahead of time. I get along with this Vet just fine It's his staff that gives me problems. I mentioned it to the Vet & he said Oh they're just trying to protect me,they feel i'm too generous. He gives me a break on the bill & his"girls" don't like that!

Do you have any idea why his glucose is jumping around? Today from 285 at 3am to 488 at 9am? yesterday it was 267 in the morning & went to 437 in the evening. Did you or anyone else look at his spreadsheet? His readings seem to be all over the place. What causes that? Do I need to increase / decrease his Lantus? When I look at the spreadsheet it seems he was doing better on 0.5 units of insulin? Does anyone has some advice/suggestions for me?

 

Hi Allison, I do appreciate your advice. Ravan & Peggy Sue are not vomiting. Since I started giving them slippery elm they are both eating better. It sounds like you have a lot of faith in your Vet. saving your babies? I've not had great experiences with "ANY" Vet I've ever gone to. Maybe it's just me.I have trust issues with doctors in general. A lot of people just do what their doctor/ Vet tells. They think "doctor" is infallible. I'm not one of those people. I question everything.And read everything I can find on the subject. That's why I'm here on this Forum. I have faith that the people that have gone through the same problem my cats are having can give me some good advice. Less than a year ago one of Ravan's sister stopped eating. I called my Vet & he wasn't in. A woman associate of his said to bring her in. She thoroughly examined Clarise, even took urine from her bladder with a needle. She could find nothing wrong. She advised me to take her home & if she wasn't feeling better to come back on Monday ( it was Saturday afternoon)
Clarise lay down on the couch & fell asleep. I went to the store, less than an hour later I came home & she was dead! I'll never know what she died from. I'm still grieving over her death. This is only one many such things that have happened when I trusted the "doctor" would know what to do.

Have you had great outcomes with your Vet? Has he saved any of them?Maybe I just haven't found the right one?

 

hi Joy...sry you are going through this with Raven...I went through the same issue...Bubbles wasnt eating...
I have had both good and very bad experiences with vets and I too do not trust everything tbey say...I read everything i can like you do and it has really helped me when nonvets were around...it sounds like you are barely even sleeping...having to feed Raven at 2 am...take care of yourself too...you need to sleep too!..I am the wrong one to ask about high and low numbers...many msny ppl on here know about this so plse i hope you post this in main forum asap...sooo sry about your other kitty passing away like that....I can see why you do not trust vets...I have had some bad advice from vets too...keep us posted please...not sure if you can get your kitty to vet for this but it might really help...has anyone mentioned appetite stimulants or anti nausea meds? they really help some cats....

 

Raven's mom...sry did l get your name right...I apologize if not! i get confused easily it seems these days....

 

Allison,this makes me laugh! That's exactly what I just wrote to someone else on this forum. I'm getting confused who I'm talking to. Yes, JoyBee is the name i use here. Slippery Elm seems to be working to increase kitties appetite. Ravan & Peggy Sue were eating good this morning. I hope it continues!

 

I’m so glad they are eating! I understand about not wanting to stress them with a vet trip. I’m Lucky that my vet will come to my house (extra fee of course) for my scaredy cats. I’m not a spreadsheet expert, but his not feeling well and eating right may have something to do with it. He may also need a slight increase in dose. To get better dosing advice you should post on the Lantus forum. It’s very busy there, so be patient if you don’t get an answer right away.

 

Thank you Sharon. The first few days it seemed a lot of people responded Now you & Allison seem to be the only ones trying to help. I do appreciate that! I'll get on the Lantus forum later today. Still haven't been able to get a photo of my kitties posted. Message states,Photo is too large? I don't understand that. It's the same as all my other photos. I don't have Photoshop on my computer & Paint (which can resize the photo) is frozen & doesn't respond. Every time a get an update on Win 10 something else BAD happens in this computer!

 

Sorry I can’t help with the photo thing, all I use is my iPad or iPhone. Let me know when you post on Lantus forum and if no one responds, I’ll tag a couple of people to help you.

 

Yes, you might want to increase a little to 1.25 u if he's eating better now.

 

Thanks Kris, I was thinking of trying that tonight. But did you look at Ravan's spreadsheet? he did seem to be doing better when he was on 0.5 Units of Lantus. When he was on the low dose he was eating OK.

 

Yes, I did look at your SS. In FD a month ago is ancient history though, especially when other issues have cropped up more recently - poor appetite for an unknown reason or possibly pancreatitis. For whatever reason the 1 u dose isn't as effective now as 0.5 u was then. It's the nature of FD to be a dynamic thing, not a static thing. This is one of many reasons we recommend home testing and tracking data on a spreadsheet.

 

i am so glad to hear that....!!u have been on my mind big time today!