HELP PLEASE..Chronic kidney disease AND Diabetes

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (Welcome & Main Forum)' started by Tennessee Tuxedo, Apr 12, 2018.

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  1. Tennessee Tuxedo

    Tennessee Tuxedo New Member

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    Apr 12, 2018
    I am new here and hope I am in the right area for this posting....... My name is Paul, and my cat Tennessee, has had diabetes that I have been treating, advised to do so by my Vet, with 1 unit of glucose for about a year now. He has been pretty stable at this dose. He was pretty much a vagrant cat that had been living life without a human and savaging the neighborhood for quite some time. Therefore I don't know his complete health history, but have managed to pick up that he actually lived in one of the neighborhood homes with his owners, until they moved about 6 years ago! So, I have adopted him, and he me, and established care with a local vet. He is a "senior" cat. Obviously don't know his exact age. He is an awesome cat! I recently had him in for a teeth cleaning and due to the need to sedate him, his blood was checked and I had the sad news that he had Chronic Kidney Disease. I have been reading a lot of information in the past couple days and am confused as to the best diet for him. To my understanding, having diabetes, he needs a low carb/high protein diet, but with the kidney issue a lot of information says they need a LOW protein diet. Upon further reading, I discovered that low protein diets are somewhat controversial for chronic kidney disease.......the hyper carnivore that a feline is means they are designed to eat pretty much straight up protein. I am hoping for some advice here as to the best way to feed him to give him the healthiest, happiest, longest life I can help him achieve!
     
  2. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Aug 17, 2016
    Welcome! There are many members here with experience with kitty kidney disease.

    Re his diabetes: what insulin are you using? Is your vet monitoring his blood glucose levels?
     
  3. Tennessee Tuxedo

    Tennessee Tuxedo New Member

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    Apr 12, 2018
    Yes, his Vet IS monitoring. Using Novalin for Glucose. He was at 90 and has been between there and 105 for last several months
     
  4. Veronica & Babu-chiri

    Veronica & Babu-chiri Well-Known Member

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    Aug 5, 2016
    Hi and welcome!

    How nice of you for adopting him and taking care of him!

    The feeding is a little bit controversial but I think that right now there is some consensus that restricted protein diet is not necessary for CKD (cronic kidney desease) unless the desease is very advanced ( that would be stages 3-4) what stage is Tennessee ? Do you have some information on the blood tests they did it would be helpful if you posted them.

    If he's not very much advanced you may want to search for a low carb low phosphorus diet in order to address both issues by giving him a diet that helps control his diabetes and helps take care of his kidneys

    I'm guessing you are not home testing, would you be willing to do it?

    This is a link where you can find very good information about CKD http://www.felinecrf.org/how_bad_is_it.htm
     
  5. PussCatPrince - GA

    PussCatPrince - GA Well-Known Member

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    Nov 25, 2017
    Morning from New Zealand Tennessee Tuxedo & welcome to the FDMB. Your cat is a bit of a dude.:cat: Mine is an English gent. :cat:

    If you look at my signature you will see that my old cat has both diabetes and kidney disease stage II.

    I try to look for low carb for the diabetes but also for low phos for the renal disease. I also stay right away from any dry food & ensure that there is plenty of water around . I also add a little water to any food. From what I have read it is suggested that low protein or poor protein is not so good for a cat really. It kinda starves them so I ensure quality protein for my cat.
     
  6. Tennessee Tuxedo

    Tennessee Tuxedo New Member

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    Apr 12, 2018
    Yes, Thank you so much PussCatPrince! I seem to be looking in a good place here. I was feeling a bit lost and not sure where to get good advice. So much to read on the internet!! Some good, some bad....I have read what you have indicated as well and am coming to see that maybe main line veterinary medicine is a bit too quick to recommend all of the so called "kidney support" brands of cat food out there. Many of which are LOW protein! and cats need protein!! I am still learning and value any insight. Thanks again. ........................ALSO, just figuring out how to navigate this board so you are the first I have replied back to from here, others have been through my email so not sure if they were posted, but THANKS TO ALL OTHERS THAT HAVE RESPONDED BACK AS WELL!
     
  7. Veronica & Babu-chiri

    Veronica & Babu-chiri Well-Known Member

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    Aug 5, 2016
    Vets do tend to get a bit scared by CKD so most of them jump into lets give kidney support food but forget about diabetes and actually an unregulated diabetes will end up making his CKD problem worse, here's the link to Dr Lisa's list, look for food under 10% carbs and as low phosphorus as possible http://catinfo.org/docs/CatFoodProteinFatCarbPhosphorusChart.pdf and as mentioned as long as he's in early stages the suggestion is to keep away from renal diets since they are super high in carbs
     
  8. Veronica & Babu-chiri

    Veronica & Babu-chiri Well-Known Member

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    Aug 5, 2016
    Click in the "Reply"option that is at the right side of each post to answer an specific comment or just add a new one at the end
     
  9. Zoey & Carol

    Zoey & Carol Member

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    Jan 4, 2015
    My diabetic cat, Zoey, was also diagnosed with kidney failure in January. She was so sick that I almost lost her. There is a great website for CKD kitties https://tanyackd.groups.io/g/support. There is a wealth of information for CKD kitties! There are also food lists that are good for both diabetic and CKD kitties. One that I've found that seems to be good, and Zoey likes it, is Organix Grain Free chicken pate and turkey pate. There are several others recommended, but that might be a good place to start. It has low phosphorus, low carbs, and middle of the road high quality protein. I also add a phosphorus binder to her food. She has gained weight, and is feeling happy and healthy!
     
  10. Beth 73

    Beth 73 Well-Known Member

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    Aug 2, 2016
    Hi Paul ! You are in the exact right place for Tennessee and yourself . My Elmo has elderly kidneys too so I feed low carb/low phos . Easy thing to do first off is add water to his food ... you will learn how much he will tolerate til it’s too mushy for him . Far as food, Elmo’s current fav is Whole Earth Duck that I order from Chewy . Lots of members on this Board have extensive experience with caring for diabetic/ kidney kitties so you will get a ton of great help !!!
     
    PussCatPrince - GA likes this.
  11. Bellasmom

    Bellasmom Well-Known Member

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    Feb 12, 2018
    Welcome Paul, you have found a great bunch of people here, you couldn’t be in better hands
     
  12. Zoey & Carol

    Zoey & Carol Member

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    Jan 4, 2015
    Beth is right about the water. I can actually use equal amounts of wet food and water for Zoey, and she loves it. I also add powdered PhosBind to her food.
     
  13. Zoey & Carol

    Zoey & Carol Member

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    Jan 4, 2015
    Beth, do you know the protein, carb, and phosphorus information about Whole Earth Duck? I'm looking for a couple different kinds of food. Zoey likes variety!
     
  14. Beth 73

    Beth 73 Well-Known Member

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    Aug 2, 2016
    Hi Carol :) According to Dr Lisa Food List, Whole Earth Duck protein 28%, carb 4% and phos 130 . Elmo likes Holistic Select chicken pate and turkey pate as well . Hope this helps :bighug:
     
  15. Beth 73

    Beth 73 Well-Known Member

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    Aug 2, 2016
    Carol, just read you are feeding Zoey Wellness . In June , revised Wellness numbers came out and had it coming in at very high phos values, higher than those on Dr Lisa’s list from earlier in the year . You can search threads from June to find that info cos can’t remember off top of my head . Wellness was our go to for a year and I immediately stopped feeding tho Elmo’s favorite :banghead: What these companies are thinking when they do this is far beyond me :woot::facepalm:
     
  16. Zoey & Carol

    Zoey & Carol Member

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    Jan 4, 2015
    I found that out a couple of weeks ago. I did stop feeding her Wellness then. I will change my signature. That's why I was looking for a couple of new foods. Thanks for info on a couple of new ones. I'll try a can or two and see if she likes them. The good thing with Zoey is she loves to eat! Except when she was so sick with kidney failure.:(

    It is frustrating when companies change the formulas! When kitties are so fragile, it would be nice to count on good foods.
     
    Beth 73 likes this.
  17. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    Jun 8, 2016
    If you could post the most recent lab reports that could be helpful in advising you.

    Check out our food list and choose foods under 10% carb and under 250 phosphorus to feed. (Under 200 is better if he currently has high phosphorus values) I used to feed bff cans when I had a cat with ckd and another one with diabetes. Was good for both. You don't want low protien unless he's late stage 3 or 4 as it can cause muscle wasting and is generally high on carb.

    http://catinfo.org/docs/CatFoodProteinFatCarbPhosphorusChart.pdf


    If you can't find a lower phosphorus food he likes another option is to add a phosphorous binder to his regular low carb food (Aluminum hydroxide).
     
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