8/10 Stu AMPS 361, test results, +5.75 222, PMPS 305, +4 348

yesterday: viewtopic.php?p=218115#p218115

Hi Everyone, First of all, we want to thank all of you for your wonderful support last night when we got the news of Stu's kidney disease. I will have a lot to learn, that's for sure! It also looks like there is more bad news on the way: the preliminary results of the Free T4 test came back from the lab and Stu's number was "7.4 (high)" (reference range is 0.8--4.0). So it looks like Stu has a hyperthyroid along with everything else (this might explain why he has lost weight). When all the tests come back we will have a conference with the vet. I'm about to work on attaching the results of Stu's blood test to my signature, or uploading it as an attachment. Not sure how to do any of this, so it might be a while. If I can't do it, I'll simply put the numbers in my next post in today's condo.
WCR: Stu's AMPS are still high. I shot the .75, but I think I should go back up to 1 unit tonight. I'm sure that these high bgs are not doing him any good. Otherwise he is subdued, but OK. 2 installments of breakfast + some chicken chunks with yogurt have been eaten. We've been outside, lounging around (very warm and humid today). Ps are accounted for (massive pee!). I'm about to give him a +3 test (DH is at yoga, so I'll have to do it myself). Back later with the test results (which I will also post on Health).
We are glad we decided not to go to NYC. That would have added another layer of complexity to an already complex situation. I can watch the Mets on TV!
Thanks again,

Ella & Stu

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361 test results will follow

gosh Ella - when it rains it pours.. Sorry so sorry on the thyroid problem. That too can be dealt with. I have had a kitty that was diagnosed with hyperT, we opted for the radiation approach, which brought everything back in line. I wonder how the FD will play into all of that. Try not to worry - you guys will get him through this.

When I attached Mannie's labs I created a google document, published it as a web doc, and attached it in the same method as we do for the SS's. It should work for you. Good luck!

Probably a wise decision on the dose. Good luck with it all - I know you guys will do just fine. Alot to learn - one step at a time, read as much as you can, breathe, and know all will be well.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

I'm so sorry to hear of Stu's problems, big hugs to you and lots of scritches for Stu. I know its overwhelming but you'll get through this. We're all here for you.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

not that it changes anything significantly, but i think that's a T4 reading you got there. the free T4 ref range is 10 - 50, for Antech.

when you talk to vet, ask if they checked Stu's blood pressure at the last visit? i hope they have the capability to check it - if they don't, ask if there's another local vet they can refer you to that does.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

This is the first I'm reading of your problems .. and I'm sorry you guys are going through them. But as you know, there is a ton of support on this site, not only for FD but for almost any cat health problem that exists! I'm sure you will find all the information you need here to keep stu happy and healthy ....

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

Hiya Ella -

Just catching up. You have a lot to process right now. :YMHUG:

Lots of good advice yesterday re: urine test/possible UTI/possible CKD. I have some experience with CKD kitties (currently have one in the early stages), but I do know my vet wasn't willing to say early stages until two or three similar test results (she had high and similar values a year ago, but they returned to normal). This time around, we started with the urine sample (needle, in the vet office)...seeing if it was a UTI influencing the numbers. It wasn't. Then treated with fluids, epikitian and rehmannia eight for a few weeks and - numbers went down slightly, but still out of normal range. It was at that point the vet was willing to say early stages. We're also watching her thyroid too...she's on the low range of above normal (T4 value of 2). I know there are some considerations when treating hyperthyroidism and CKD...I am sure others will chime with good advice.

Glad to hear Stu is much himself...hacking up hairballs, wanting to go out. Lots of pets to him and hugs to you.

Lots of yoga and breathing right now! We are all here for you!

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

Hi again, While I try to figure out how to post the lab results in Google (I'm not sure we even have results from all of the tests yet), attached is what I have thus far.
Thanks for looking and telling me what these things mean!

Ella


Stu's lab-test results, 08/09/10 (reference range in ( ) ) (don't have ref. range for USG) (no results for calcium or phosphorus)


HCT = 37.3 % (24.0 - 45.0)
HGB = 12.1 g/dL (8.0 - 15.0)
MCHC = 32.4 g/dL (30.0 - 36.9)
WBC = 11.6 x109 /L (5.0 - 18.9)
GRANS = 9.1 x109 /L (2.5 - 12.5)
%GRANS = 78 %
L/M = 2.5 x109 /L (1.5 -7.8)
%L/M = 22 %
PLT = 585 x109 /L (175 - 500) (high)

ALB = 3.4 g/dL (2.3 - 3.9)
ALKP < 10 U/L (14 - 111)
ALT = 172 U/L (12 - 130) (high)
BUN = 41 mg/dL (16 -36) (high)
CREA = 2.7 mg/dL (0.8 - 2.4) (high)
GLOB = 4.6 g/dL (2.8 - 5.1)
TBIL = 0.4 mg/dL (0.0 - 0.9)
TP = 8.1 g/dL (5.7 - 8.9)
Glucose = 172 g/dL
USG = 1.020

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

Hi Ella,
I am very sorry to hear about Stu's diagnosis, but it does not have to be a death sentence any more than his diabetes was. Blackie was diagnosed with early renal failure in January of 2009 and he has done quite well. We feed him Wellness Turkey & Chicken and Merrick Cowboy Cookout which are fairly low in phosphorus. Can you post Stu's bloodwork? There are also supplements you can give Stu that will help. If you're interested in what Blackie gets, I think its in our profile.

Ella, I know how devastated you feel - I went through it with Blackie's diagnosis, but Stu can live a long and happy life. Carolyn already gave you some great links - I also belong to 2 other yahoo groups for CRF and CRF/Diabetes if you want those links.

My prayers and thoughts are with you.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

Ella, you have a lot on your mind right now. You'll get through and understand these things one by one. You'll be an expert before you know it.
We're here for you. Some give good advice, and some can hold your hand as you and Stu face these new challenges.
I'm a hand holder. Hugs for you and schnuzzles for your little master chef.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

Ella, Sorry for the news with Stu - but there is lots that can be done for him. Tuscany was also a hyper T cat. She had the radiation tx when she was 9 y/o. Has been fine since then with the thyroid. She also has had mild renal disease. Stu's numbers look very much like Tuscany's. She has been bopping around the high 2's on her creatinine for awhile (few years). As some one else mentioned - I avoid foods high in phosphorus and add extra water to food when I remember. One of our other cats was also hyper T - he did end up needing thyroid supplements after his radiation treatment.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

Ella, I missed this last night, been trying to get caught up this morning. I know absolutley nothing about kidney issues, only a little about hyper-T, but there is tons of support here and I *know* that everyone who does have knowledge will help you interpret the results and give you ideas of how to manage Stu's newest diagnosis. You can handle this! It's overwhelming, I'm sure, but hang in there and wait for the whole picture. It may not be as serious as it looks right now.

I'll be thinking about you and checking in for more news. :YMHUG:

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

Ella.....oh my....I am so sorry for all of this...are you taking deep breaths? Sending hugs and healing thoughts to you and Stu.....

I have no information on any of the things you are facing....but after reading what was posted lat night and then today, I am so happy that you are here. The people on this forum know so much about so many issues.....Isn't it wonderful that you have everyone's input?
Last week, things were a lot more simple, aren't they? I am so sorry that you are having to deal with all of this...I see a lot of reading and doing for you now. I am glad that you canceled your trip.....now that you have this new information, I agree that it is best to stay home. I recall how impossible the dx of FD was ...and I am sure it was the same for you. but, you went ahead and did what you had to do. It will be the same now....changing Stu's diet and possibly giving him fluids. But you and he will manage all the changes. Whatever it takes, I know you are up to the task. We are here for moral support....sending best wishes for Stu and for you.... :YMHUG: :YMHUG: :YMHUG:

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

Ella, can you put in the ref ranges also? Diff labs use diff ranges, and most of us don't walk around with sets of ref ranges in our heads ;-)

You can write it like this:

BUN = 41 mg/dL (14 - 36)
CREA = 2.7 mg/dL (0.6 - 2.4)

Also, would you include phosphorus and calcium from the bloodwork, if they're available?

if you did a free T4 and/or urine culture and sensitivity, those won't be ready today.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results will follow

Sending a lot of ((((HUGS)))) for you today

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

More hugs you can handle this. We are all here for you.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

Hi again, I added the reference range in my list above, as requested by WCF. Sorry I don't think I have calcium or phosphorus numbers. Also, I don't know if the vet took blood pressure. When he calls with the rest of the results, I'll ask. At the moment, my mind is in turmoil and I have to go out for a walk. I have no idea what any of these abbreviations stand for!! I thought my profession had unusually difficult terminology for the layman, but medicine takes the cake!!!

Later,
Ella & Stu (who is asleep in the breeze of the fan)

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

that's because this is just day 1. you'll pick up the important ones fairly quickly.

here, this may help: Just Diagnosed? What you need to know first
read this too: When to use SQ fluids to help you prepare for your discussion with Stu's vet on SQ fluids.

would be very helpful to know what his phosphorus and calcium levels are - do ask vet for those. these levels will help you determine how aggressively you need to limit his dietary phos, and whether you need to start him on a binder.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

Ella, I can not give any information, but I am here for support for you and Stu. You and Stu will get through this, as you did with his FD. We are all here for you

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

Ella,
I'm sorry I didn't see your b/w results earlier in my previous post. It looks to me like you've caught this early and that is a very good thing. Stu's creatinine & BUN are not that bad. It may be that you won't have to do SubQ fluids right away - but that is up to you and your vet. Hopefully after all this sinks in and you've got more information, you'll feel better. And don't forget, we are here for you.
Ele

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

Ditto!

I am glad you went to walk - It will help you. Relax, deep breaths - it will get better. I am no expert, but agree as much as I can with what Ele wrote - the levels are not that bad. and what WCF said is true - it is day 1. In time you will know all.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

This link will help with recognizing the abbreviations and what the test results mean: lab values. Just keep in mind that you don't want to focus on only one value. Lab results are interconnected and you need the big picture.

It's a foreign language. You'll catch on. You did with the FD and you will become fluent in this, as well.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

Thanks again, everyone. The web sites recommended by WCF and Sienne are a big help. And I've ordered the book Tess recommended: "Your Cat" (by Elizabeth Hodgkins). I've been reading for much of the afternoon. I think we'll be able to get a handle on all of this, even though it does seem to be "triple whammy" (FD, CRF, and HyperT). Good thing Stu is strong and I hope he can remain so! When the rest of the test results come back we'll have another talk with the vet. In the meantime I'm going to go to Plattsburgh tomorrow to get Stu some Merrick Cowboy Cookout, which is what Ele feeds Blackie and has pretty low phosphorus as well as pretty low carbs.
I didn't get to any of your condos today, but that doesn't mean that I'm not thinking about everyonel: I'm just thinking more about Stu! Hope to do some visiting tonight.
Thank you all so much for your support.

Ella & Stu

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

Bear and I are sending you our best wishes!! Oh, Mama wants to send her wishes too. She's a civvie. All three of us are thinking of you and Stu!

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

No advise, but big :YMHUG: :YMHUG: :YMHUG: for you.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

Just more ((((((((((((Ella, DH and Stu))))))))))))))

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, +3 269 test results, +5.75 222

Sending (((((((((((BIG HUGS)))))))))))

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, test results, +5.75 222, PMPS 305

Hi again, No word yet from the vet about the other tests. We'll call him tomorrow about the phosphorus and calcium tests; I'm not sure that they were done. In the meantime I have decided to focus on diabetes, since Stu's numbers have not been very good lately. This evening we went back up to 1 unit (from 0.75, which he did not seem to be holding). I'd like to bring him out of those pinks because that would be better for his kidneys, too.
Off now to get in a few condo visits. Thank you all again!

Ella & Stu

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, test results, +5.75 222, PMPS 305

no worries Ella - Number one priority right now is Stu. There is much to learn. And I hope your vet ges back to you soon with the rest of the results. I don't know how helpful this may be - but Mannie's labs just came back and his notations for phosphorous and calcium are grouped together with the creatinine and the BUN - maybe yours is the same? Good decision on the dose, I think. good luck with everything - take tonight off from the kidneys, enjoy some time with Stu - relax some...

Hey Stu! it's me Mannie! I hope you are OK buddy - I am sorry that your red stuff came back the way it did - but it will be OK, ya know? So don't you worry! Your bean is working very hard to understand it all. She will too! - my bean tried to explain it all to me, but I don't speak doctor very well and kinda got lost.... Maybe I can come and visit you tomorrow and we can cook stuff or something. You wanna go surf tonight? I don't care what color you are - I am red - yeah i know - my bean messed to today and gave me a fur shot, so yeah - red. See you later OK? ~~ Mannie, and ((((HUGS)))) to my buddy.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, test results, +5.75 222, PMPS 305

((((Ella)))) I can't add anything to all the advice you've gotten already. Knowing you, you'll tackle it all, and soon you'll be the one visiting others with new diagnoses and helping them.

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, test results, +5.75 222, PMPS 305

((((Ella))))

I know it can be difficult to get multiple disease diagnoses in one day, but just take deep breaths. You can get through this, and Stu can be a happy and healthy kitty despite the multiple disease processes. There are so many here in the same boat, and that helps both comfort and knowledge-wise.

Ditto on all that WCF said - she is a wealth of information and knowledge in the CKD department (even if she doesn't always think so ;-) ). A few more things I'd like to add too.....

The Hyper-T is probably causing Stu to need more insulin, because his body isn't able to properly utilize all of the insulin that you are giving him. You may see sharp drops and quick spikes, or you may just see many high numbers. This is normal with untreated Hyper-T and will settle down a bit once he starts Methimazole or has the I-131.

Stu's renal values will probably worsen a bit after treatment for the Hyper-T. Right now the added blood flow to the kidneys are causing his creatinine and other renal values to look a bit better than they truly are (Hyper-T masks renal disease, as you can see in Sasha's lab work). Some vets like to run pre-existing renal kitties that develop Hyper-T a little "hot" (meaning that they keep the T4 and FT4 a little higher than they normally would with a non-renal kitty). I have my own opinions on that.....it really just taxes the kidneys additionally to do that IMHO, but it is not uncommon to hear a vet suggest it.

Dr. H's book. I've read it, and used to frequent the diabetes board that she was a part of. She does lay things out well, but there are also many strong opinions in the book that aren't backed by much more than just words. Just take everything with a grain of salt and do lots of research from multiple sources. I'm not saying that it's not a bad read at all, but there are lots of resources out there that can provide good info.

Just like with diabetes there is a learning curve with Hyper-T and CKD, but you will pick it all up pretty fast. You're certainly in the right place! :smile:

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, test results, +5.75 222, PMPS 305

Just amazing the support you have here.
Did you ever think what you would find in the board when you joined???
Thinking orftu and you Ella.
We are watching and supporting.

Big Big hugs from your buddy Max, and me too!!!!!!

 

Re: 8/10 Stu AMPS 361, test results, +5.75 222, PMPS 305

Another quick thought - if you don't have a drinking fountain yet then now would be a great time to get one. Between the diabetes and Hyper-T and CKD, encouraging as much oral fluid as possible is always a good thing. I have the Petmate Fresh Flow Deluxe and really like it (as does Sasha, of course ;-) ). My only suggestion is to use distilled water instead of bottled or tap in order to prevent the build up of mineral deposits within the fountain.

 

Hi again, Everyone, Just wanted to thank you all again and say good night. Stu is happily munching away on his bedtime snacks. The automat has been filled for the +9 snack, and we are all going to bed.

Ella & Stu

 

OH My Dear Friends-Where was I that I didnt catch this?? I am just so upset for you!! I just know that whatever STU is facing will be dealt with , with Love & Knowledge, and the devotion you always have for him...I have read that as they age many cats get CRF, or kidney issues..
But who expected this for Stu?? OK let's just take one thing at a time, and deal with it, as you have a wealth of experience & love here..
I am sending healing vines & all our love to all of you & I know Stu will be just fine..The shock is the worst part, next comes the treatment--
We will be here for you--Healing HUGs from Us to all of you!!

 

Ella, if Stu likes Cowboy Cookout, PetFoodDirect usually has a good price and there's usually a coupon code floating around the internet for a better deal with them. If not, you could call them and ask how to get on their mailing list and I'll bet they'll give you one over the phone.

 

Thanks Nina, I already order with PetFoodDirect and am on their recurring order list, so if Stu likes the Cowboy Cookout, I'll simply add it to my order.

Ella

 

More hugs!!!

:YMHUG: :YMHUG: :YMHUG:

Sending happy and positive kitty vibes to all of you~

 

oh wow stu! i hope you feel better soon, your bean is the best! no worries man she's got it under control! hey i have an idea for your famous salmon crusted pizza!
how bout you use "little birdies" i will make you some "birdie soup" my bean said you might like that. and i will see what kind of birdies i can get for you! doodles >"<


I am so sorry to hear about Stu :YMSIGH: sending you big hugs for your (((((family)))))!!!

 

Huge hugs to you sweetie. We've been managing Purrcie's kidneys disease for about three years now, and my kitty Rafter lived to be 21 with kidney disease. It can be managed. For sure you are in the right place for all the help you could need, just ask! I realize how overwhelming all of this is all at once, so do take care of you and don't forget to love on Stu as much as you can!

Sending healing vines and hugs.
Myla and Purrcie