Taco 10/14 see first post for BG numbers,tough day !!

Discussion in 'Lantus / Levemir / Biosimilars' started by Cindy&Taco, Oct 14, 2018.

  1. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Oct 21, 2017
    http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...3-pmps-248-3-311-5-259-11-63-11-75-46.204813/

    Need help please, already gave 2 tsp 13 carb
    +11 63
    +11.5 49 ( 2) teaspoon 13 carb
    +11.75 46 (2)TSP 17 carb,
    AMPS 55, (2TSP) low carb
    Post 118
    Before AMPS +11 63, +11.5 49, + 11.75 46
    Taco 10/14 AMPS 55,+.25 59, +.50 72,+ .75 74,(+1 89 Shot reduced dose 2.75u) +1.50 65,+2 53,+3 70,+ 3.50 65,+4 58,+4.50 55,+5 65,+5.50 70,+6 61,+6.50 54,+7 76,+7.5 77,+8 80,+8.5 80,+9 77,+ 9.5 66,(+10 65,gave 2 tsp hc including the meat and gravy,)+10.5 97,
    SKIP SHOT +11.5 113,Back to original time , +2 128 (12am),+3 158,then PM meal,+5 260,+11 471.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2018
  2. CassAndGordy(GA)

    CassAndGordy(GA) Well-Known Member

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    Did you shoot???? It may be best to skip
     
  3. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    No, he was 1 hour from AMPS
     
  4. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    Test again and post. Skip shot for now.
     
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  5. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    ok, AMPS 55,
    + .25 59
     
  6. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Can I shoot 1 hour late ? at what reduction? will be home all day to monitor
     
  7. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Your new dose will be 2.75. If you shoot late it will throw your schedule off. His next shot would be 12 hours from now or a half hour early. If you have that flexibility to get back to your shot time which at 11/2 hours will take 3 days, 1/2 hour every 24 hours or 15 minutes each cycle you can shoot. Otherwise skip. Then you can shoot tonight whenever you want.
     
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  8. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Looks like him not eating his PM affected his numbers. If you do skip, I would still get a couple of tests in for the sake of data without insulin.
     
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  9. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    If I shoot in 15 minutes, he will be 1 hour late, so tonite, I shout 1 hour early?, I just need to get that part down for now, and then ask about what to do for tonite later. Thank you :bighug:
     
  10. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    30 minutes. Or 15 minutes each shot until your back on schedule.
     
  11. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    I'm going to shoot, he did eat his PM, I just havent put it down, it's down now,
     
  12. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    BG 74 , 10 minutes before +1, think that's good for a 2.75 ? with lots of monitoring?
     
  13. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    I can't answer on that. I don't know what I would either. Maybe others will chime in.
     
  14. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    It will keep putting my time back , if I wait any longer, and I'd like to keep as close to schedule as possible. Is there anyone to tag?
     
  15. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Shot a reduced dose, 2.75 @ +1. He's hanging on to the 80s.
     
  16. Rosie & Bailey

    Rosie & Bailey Well-Known Member

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    Taco's keeping you busy this morning!
    Hope he surfs safely for you today:D
     
  17. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    Monitor closely as I'm sure your doing.
     
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  18. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Thank you so much for hanging with us, he's dropping, feeding regular LC, but not very interested.
     
  19. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Given how early it is in the cycle, the dropping BG and lack of interest in eating, I would be careful about feeding too much at this point in time and go straight to high carb. If you have some gravy food, drain off the gravy and give him some gravy to lap up rather than the meat portion. You may be steering for awhile and you don't want him refusing to eat when he needs to.
     
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  20. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    13,17,or 25 carb? I have a 17 open?
     
  21. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Leaving 911 up until I'm more comfy,
     
  22. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Use the 17% if you have that open already. Just give him a tsp. or 2 of the gravy and keep checking BG to see if he is holding, rising or continuing to drop.
     
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  23. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    OK, cant cant any gravy out of the 17, opened a 25 and watered it down some, 2TSP,
     
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  24. Sienne and Gabby (GA)

    Sienne and Gabby (GA) Senior Member Moderator

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    Just an FYI - You didn't shoot a "reduced" dose per se. Taco's numbers dropped below 50 at +11.5 so the 2.75 is your new dose.

    When you're watching numbers, you may want to be testing every 30 min. to make sure you know whether or not to give HC. Given that what you're seeing is carryover from the depot being a bit too full at the 3.0u dose and that you really can't reduce again, it's OK to be steering Taco's numbers with a bit of HC.
     
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  25. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    I did shoot a 2.75, 1 hour late, :)
     
  26. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Giving high carb 25 , watered down some, 1 -2 tsp at a time,
     
  27. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    I see he is now up to 70. Keep checking and if he stays steady try a tiny bit of low carb. If he is falling again, then go for the high carb gravy. Don't want to boost him up too far just want him to surf in good safe numbers.
     
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  28. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Didnt get a chance to update, fell down to 65 @ +3.50
     
  29. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    He's not falling much, more of less steady, so try the low carb to see if that will hold him.
     
  30. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    I'm wondering now if I misunderstood something. :) He was on 3Us before his 46 @ +11.75, so, I dropped to 2.75, am I correct?
     
  31. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    OK, should I wait until after his test in 10 minutes? and how much ? Please :)
     
  32. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Yes you are correct. You decreased his dose by 0.25u which is the usual decrease when kitty drops below 50.

    Wait for the next test. He may just be coasting and he's still in safe range. If he's down more, then a tsp. of LC food and recheck in 30 minutes.
     
  33. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    yes down again 58
    , still low carb?
     
  34. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    No he's dropping so I'd go for high carb.....just a couple of tsps. of gravy. Don't fill him up as he's got a ways to go till usual Levemir nadir.
     
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  35. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Giving 1 TSP Fancy feast flaked tuna, can = 5 carbs , had already given, now giving watered down 25 carb, 1TSP.
     
  36. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    was already sending when I saw this,hoping he'll hold steady :) TY :bighug:
     
  37. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Found a 25 carb fish, ate only 1 tsp gravy, not watered down, hoping that works
     
  38. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    That's fine. It should boost him up a bit and keep him surfing. Just don't feed too much at any one time because it looks like Taco likes to nadir late in the cycle sometimes right at pre-shot.
     
  39. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    1 TEASPOON is all he would eat.
     
  40. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    If you are having a hard time getting him to eat, then stick with the gravy if that is all he will lap up. You want him to take something in if he needs it and it sounds like he's quite full at the moment so better to stick with less filling gravy.
     
  41. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    @Kris & Teasel Hey Kris, is there any possibility you can keep an eye on Cindy & Taco. for a bit? Not many on today and I have to go get ready and head out shortly. Taco is surfing in the greens but it looks like it may be a long surf with a lot of steering and I don't want to leave Cindy on her own.
     
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  42. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    That's all he's had except for that 1 tsp tuna, +4.50 BG55
     
  43. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    2 TEASPOON 25 carb gravy @ +4.40 ,cant convert time, so +4 + 40 minutes , sorry :(
     
  44. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Ok, I think you may have to resort to some bigger guns to keep him from dropping. Do you have any karo or maple syrup on hand? If he's still dropping at next test, give him a 1/2 tsp if he will lap it up or rub a bit on his gums. This will give him a quick boost and buy a little time for whatever food he has taken in up till now to settle a bit. The syrup will only last a short time but it should boost him long enough to ensure he'll take more gravy if needed.
     
  45. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Yes, I do, have either. Will do in 15 minutes to next test. He lapped up 2 TSP 25 carb gravy, a little bit ago.
     
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  46. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Don't use the syrup unless he's still dropping. If he's steady let him surf...no gravy, no syrup and just keep checking him.
     
  47. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    OK, can I use honey if I want to,?? I'm hoping not to use anything . :)
     
  48. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    You can use honey. When I had to keep steering I would use gravy and sometimes add a few drops of honey to a teaspoon of food Max would eat. It’s hard sometimes keeping them hungry so you have to experiment to see what works.
     
  49. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    @tiffmaxee Are you able to keep an eye on Cindy and Taco for a bit? I have to head out shortly and don't want to leave her alone.
     
  50. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    HI :) thanks for standing by :) I got a raise to 65 @ +5 :) Testing again in 30 minutes @ + 5.50. Not giving anything , correct?:bighug:
     
  51. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Roger! :)
     
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  52. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    :cat::)
     
  53. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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  54. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Did Taco have his famotidine this morning? I ask because he's had an awful lot of food he isn't necessarily used to today.
     
  55. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Thank you @Red & Rover (GA). Looks like Cindy may be chasing Taco for while and I hate to abandon ship! There are so few people around today! Hopefully more will sign on in a bit.
     
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  56. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Yes, he had his famotidine, actually, he's really hasnt had all that much. It's been 1 teaspoon of gravy every 30 minutes, then that 1 TSP of FF flaked tuna. Usually by now he's had about 8 oz of food and 8 oz of water. All teaspoons today have been gravy except for the one tuna TSP.Oh, and the 1 1/2 oz of salmon, the other food he wouldnt eat, went in trash. Thanks for sticking around, be back in a minute.
     
  57. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    A 70@ +4.50 without anything since his 65. Holding off on anything for another 30 minutes. Is that ok?
     
  58. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Yes, that's okay. You want to see a continued rise that is not food/gravy influenced (although with Lev and Taco's late nadir, that may not be the case).
     
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  59. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Yes, he's mostly had a late nadir, this time he decided to have a very late and very low nadir. The drama cat strikes again. ;)
     
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  60. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Any gravy now?
     
  61. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    The earlier gravy is wearing off.
    You have two options.
    1. Encourage a surf by feeding a bit of LC.
    2. Gravy to prevent further downward movement. Given the Lev and late nadir, I'd go with this one.
     
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  62. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    OK :) gravy time,2 TEASPOON , ate, but, really didnt want to.
     
  63. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Cindy, I have to dash out the door to pick someone up from the out-of-town bus. Fifteen minutes each way, so I should be back in 40 minutes tops. You have been doing a fantastic job keeping Taco safe today. Keep Taco surfing with LC or gravy as long as you can. Anything between 50-150 are healing numbers.

    I'll tag a few people to see if they can keep you company for a bit.
    @Ella & Rusty & Stu(GA) @Larry and Kitties @Amy&TrixieCat @Pamela & Amethyst @CassAndGordy
     
  64. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    OK, thank you, hope someone comes along :bighug:
     
  65. Rosie & Bailey

    Rosie & Bailey Well-Known Member

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    Hi Cindy,
    Hopefully someone more knowledgeable comes along soon. I'm a newbie so I can't really offer advice, but I can keep you company and send hugs.:bighug:
     
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  66. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    The gravy should keep him up for a bit.
    Do you have karo, honey, maple syrup on hand if Taco loses interest in the gravy?
    I'm out the door. Back soonest.
     
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  67. Rosie & Bailey

    Rosie & Bailey Well-Known Member

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    @Carol in Chicago has answered questions for me in the past.
    Maybe she can be helpful?
     
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  68. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Thank you, I wouldnt mind those numbers without intervention, He's really showing himself today .
     
  69. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    YES! all that :) Be safe :bighug:
     
  70. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    +6.50 BG 54 dropping, using honey, 1/2 TSP I hope. :(
    Given @ 5:40.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2018
  71. Rosie & Bailey

    Rosie & Bailey Well-Known Member

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    Oh yes, he is. He wanted your attention, and he got it.
    Seems like you've been doing an amazing job of steering with the help of everyone here.
     
  72. Rosie & Bailey

    Rosie & Bailey Well-Known Member

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    I'll check to see if anyone else has logged in.
     
  73. Rosie & Bailey

    Rosie & Bailey Well-Known Member

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  74. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Please do
     
  75. Carol in Chicago

    Carol in Chicago Member

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    Hi Cindy - You are doing great. I'm reviewing your SS and will be right back.
     
  76. Rosie & Bailey

    Rosie & Bailey Well-Known Member

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    Most recent update
     
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  77. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Thank you so much !! Gave 1/2 TEASPOON honey 8 minutes ago, when do I test again, 15 or 30 minutes ?
     
  78. Carol in Chicago

    Carol in Chicago Member

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    Looks like nadir has been around +7. Given shot was 1 hour late I'm assuming +7 / +8 for nadir today. I will watch for your +7 number.
     
  79. Carol in Chicago

    Carol in Chicago Member

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    I would wait on more honey or food for now. Let's check at the +7. Do I understand that +7 is indeed 7 hours from your shot time today or is it different because the shot was late?
     
  80. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    How long before test with honey? 15 or 30 minutes, the high carb hasnt done anything for him all day
     
  81. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Shot was given late and reduction because of his + 11 and after that.
     
  82. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    The +7 ,7 hours from his shot time today, I'm documenting real PLUS times for his shot today.
     
  83. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Shot was at 11am, instead of his usual 10am.
     
  84. Rosie & Bailey

    Rosie & Bailey Well-Known Member

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    Looks like it's been more than 20 minutes since the honey. How is he acting?
     
  85. Rosie & Bailey

    Rosie & Bailey Well-Known Member

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    I think Wendy had mentioned you want to wait 30 minutes after giving honey to test.
    Found this online:
    The study found that 75g of honey raised blood sugar and insulin levels in people without diabetes within 30 minutes
     
  86. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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  87. Carol in Chicago

    Carol in Chicago Member

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    Great! 76 is a good safe number so you have done everything right and now know how to get his attention.

    The action now is to wait 30 min and re-test. What we are looking for here to to confirm he won't drop too low as the honey begins to wear off. So... take a break, but don't let your guard down. Be back here in 30 min to report a +7.5 number.
     
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  88. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    20 minutes here , not 30 ;)
     
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  89. Rosie & Bailey

    Rosie & Bailey Well-Known Member

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    Cindy, you've been doing an amazing job all day! Hopefully, Taco is done adventuring and settles down for you.
    Thanks for coming to the rescue Carol!
     
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  90. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    I was thinking while I was out.

    It is not too early to start asking experienced Lev user about tonight's dosage (keeping in mind that there are fewer people to watch late at night). I only have theoretical knowledge of Lev. I'd would want advice from a pro.

    1. no shot - to drain the depot and give you a night's sleep
    2. a one time BCS (big chicken shot - to drain the depot but still keep some of the momentum
     
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  91. Carol in Chicago

    Carol in Chicago Member

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    I'm looking for the +7.5, but while we wait - who can we tag for experienced lev dose guidance? I like the idea of a BCS and would do that with Lantus, but can't advise re: lev.
     
  92. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    YES! I'm already worried about that, I had to use the honey once, 1/2 tsp. I dont know anyone on here , as I just came back not too long ago. Any Ideas?
     
  93. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    BG 77 @ +7.5 , what is a BCS , like a big reduction?
     
  94. Carol in Chicago

    Carol in Chicago Member

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    OK good. Hold for now because 77 remains a safe number and we have seen no further drop. Next test is in 30 min to monitor further to confirm safe number and determine if you have stopped the drop or if it is starting again.

    Yes - BCS is a large reduction in dose given for a reason such as depot drain or because you need sleep.

    If you are comfortable taking down the 911 now, it might be good to change it to a question re: lev dose advice.
     
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  95. Wendy&Neko

    Wendy&Neko Senior Member Moderator

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    Feb 28, 2012
    The purpose of 911 is to draws eyes in the case of a medical emergency. Taco is surfing nicely and you have plenty of eyes, time to remove the 911.

    A BCS could be something like half the regular dose, for one time only.
     
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  96. CassAndGordy(GA)

    CassAndGordy(GA) Well-Known Member

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    I am sorry I missed the tag earlier... I am actually out at an event, so I can't be super watchful. But it looks like you've caught a few other Lev users attention.

    You're doing a great job Cindy!
     
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  97. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    May 18, 2016
    Looking at your spreadsheet, it looks like Taco is fond of a double dip cycle. A minor drop mid cycle and the usual Lev drop at the end of the cycle. Just putting this out there for any Lev users who look in.
     
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  98. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

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    Oct 21, 2017
    I do feel like I had a medical emergency, I have kept Tacos BG up for 12 hours with high carb gravy and honey once, I'm sorry if I caused you any problems. He started his day with a 46 and the high carb gravy did nothing, I'm sorry again :(
     
  99. Wendy&Neko

    Wendy&Neko Senior Member Moderator

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    If you are asking about your new dose going forward, Taco is a long term diabetic. Been diabetic over a year. According to TR, that means holding the dose until he goes under 40, or one week in solid green numbers. So, going back up to 3.0 units. An argument could be made to take the reduction if he was hard to bring up, but other than his late nadir for the PM cycle, he has been above 50 all day. Thanks to your diligence. However, if you need sleep, a half dose, something like 1.5 units, might give you a break. Or skip if you really need to sleep. Shooting something could still mean an active cycle.
    @Red & Rover (GA) I am not seeing the double dip, can you point me to an example cycle? What you could be seeing is a drop at onset, then going down more towards nadir. A double dip is a second dip after the nadir, but not as low as the nadir.
     
  100. Cindy&Taco

    Cindy&Taco Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2017
    He has been over 50 all day because of gravy every 30 minutes, and honey, if I had to go to work , I would have come home to a deceased cat :( anyways, I'll figure out what to do, maybe I need to switch protocols, because I will not let him go below 40.
     

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