1/14 " Buddha Kitteh" update ....

Hello to all of Elmo's godmommas!!! Elmo continues to chug along.Still no try at Lantus but I am not opposed to using it if it would insure a strong remission. His behavior is about the same, not as alert as I thot he'd be off of vetsulin, bit constipated but very good appetite. After very good advice I gave him a snack at +9 this morning (set my alarm cos not sure he would get up and eat from feeder... this reminds me of baby days, except I'm not 30 anymore ) and he has been in green all day. Would love to know what you all think as you well know Elmo after all your care/advice these last few months. I am just going one day at a time but if I'm missing anything( like the +9 snack idea, should I try a small dose?) please give me your wonderful thots/insights/wisdom....also, I am keeping daily contact with Jo and Ozzy ...she is an amazing young woman, juggling a high power career and giving Ozzy wonderful care .....amazing ...trusting and praying all is well with you and yours...hugs and scritches to Noodler, Teasel , Miss Menace and all wonderful civvies.....
@Critter Mom
@Kris & Teasel
@MrWorfMen's Mom

 

Today's BGs
+11. 73
AMBG. 84
+3.5. 81
+7.5. 94
At +9 will get snack ......

 

Looks really good, Beth. I'll defer to the Lantus Ladies who have far more experience at the remission dosing. What do you give him for his constipation? Do you add warm water to all his meals?

 

Hi Beth,

Great to get the latest on the Buddha Kitteh!

If the small, regular feeds keep his BG tamped down then that could point to Elmo having a problem with impaired fasting BG levels but normal post-meal control: the pancreas produces bolus pulses of insulin at mealtimes helping to keep BG levels down but does not secrete enough basal insulin to balance glucose released from the liver during longer periods of fasting. Here's a very good, plain English web article that I found particularly helpful (the sort of info I wanted on day one but it took me ages to find this):

How Blood Glucose Control Works - and How It Stops Working


Mogs
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Point of interest: In the latter stages of Saoirse's pre-remission Lantus treatment I used a slightly unorthodox approach to dosing - partly out of necessity because I was not able to monitor her sufficiently well due to my own poor health. I took advantage of Saoirse's natural tendency to run lower at night and I gave her drop doses of Lantus on the AM cycle only.


Mogs
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Hi Kris ! For constipation I give 1/16-1/8 t miralax as needed. Try not to use too much cos read not so great for kidneys. Have started up 1t pumpkin in last few days and syringe 10cc warm h2o several times a day . Good thot to start adding warm water to his food also. And yes, the Lantus Ladies are amazing and knowledgeable as well as supportive!! We r in good hands !!

 

Hi Mogs !!! Hope u are steadily gaining strength and rest . I had thot not being on vetsulin would have energized Elmo more than it has but mayb e my exoectations were a bit too high. . He still is a bit lethargic but wrestles with the boys and carries his mouse around. I'm wondering if his hips are t bothering him.Was hit by a car when very young ( before we found him) and never was quite right in his hips after that . Thank u for info also. So glad to know you've gone before is in this, showing it can be done . Hugs and prayers to you !!

 

Poor Elmo! I'm really sorry to hear about what happened to him when he was younger. (((scritches)))

Still feeling very poorly here, Beth. Thank you for asking.


Mogs
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I d not know why except that Miralax draws water into the intestines and thus more water intake is required.
For humans, there seems to be no real reason either. See:
https://www.drugs.com/answers/why-is-miralax-not-recommended-for-someone-who-269598.html
https://www.kidney.org/blog/ask-doctor/miralax-safe-use-level-3-kidney-failure

 

Thanks Larry!! Had read that in the nebulous "somewhere"

 

Mogs, we think about and hold you in our heart every day ...you deserve all things good and whole..that's my prayer for you .

 

I'm really liking all those green numbers Elmo had today and I'm not sure what I'd do in your shoes. If you were to try the Lantus, I like Mogs' method of maybe giving a little itty bitty dose as described by Jill, (push plunger in as hard as possible and let it go with needle in vial to suck up a teensy bit like 0.1u) but only on a day cycle so you are not going to have to monitor through the night. His numbers are great but you do want him to have a strong remission. While he may just be a kitty who runs a bit higher naturally anyway (and who knows because none of us checked our cats before diagnosis!) he could also need that little extra nudge. Maybe give him another day or two with no insulin to see if he brings himself down more or at least stays in the greens and then decide. I don't think there is a right or wrong answer here.

I've got the cheerleaders practising backstage so keep up the good work Elmo!

 

Aww, thanks Linda ....so glad it looks like things have been a bit quieter for you all..haven't seen many long all nighter pj parties...you have earned a reducie for sure. Scritches to Menace

 

Do you give b12 at all? That could help with energy levels. So nice to see him doing so well

 

9 days until officially in remission. That's just awesome.

 

Hi Janet !!! B12 is a good thought !! I ordered but never used. What dose would you suggest and does the Zobilene (so) have any sugar in it ??

 

SP not so...spell check will be the death of me

 

When the specialist put a block on Saoirse getting insulin again after her clinical signs started to deteriorate when insulin therapy was withdrawn after 2nd OTJ trial it was a constant battle to keep Saoirse in remission numbers through food manipulation. Her clinical signs continued to deteriorate and her remission lasted less than a year; it would have been shorter were it not for the mini meal feeding. (Still SOOOOOO angry at that specialist! Saoirse was so well in herself on the once-a-day microdrop dose: if I had been able to extend the insulin support for longer her pancreas might have recovered more.)


Mogs
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Zobaline is for diabetic cats so I'm sure there's no sugar in it.

I was giving 2 500 mcg a day of b12, so 1 mg....
I am sure the zobaline has dosing instructions on it, no?

 

The Zobaline bottle has dosing instructions.

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Behavior news: without giving B12( going to do later in afternoon), at +3 Mr Elmo is chasing his younger brothers around, trying to get a wrestle match going...they r too kind so when he gets a bit insistent they jump up on a chair where they know he can' t reach without his step stool. He then hangs on the edge, swatting at them...they are so kind to their older brother

 

Very nice AM+3 today.

Was the running around before or after the test, Beth?

.

 

Hello Mogs...the running around( short lived) was after the +3 and a small snack. Im doing the +3; +6, +9 snack deal today . He has not gone to lay down, is casually laying and trolling around the kitchen..wants fed again, watching the poor birds try to fly to the seed in this horrendous wind . I feed him 2 , 3 oz cans, one in morning, one in afternoon. He usually eats about 3/4 can initially and the other 1/4 can divided as snacks at 3, 6 and 9.

 

Thanks for the info, Beth. I was curious as to whether the better BG level was driving the improved activity level or whether the improved activity level had lowered BG.

I always noticed a marked improvement in mood and energy levels in Saoirse when she was running in the lower part of the normal range (safely on Lantus, not the 'tanked BG' episodes on Caninsulin). Between the BG testing and the observations I made I got to the stage where I could roughly gauge what range she was running in just by her coat condition and her behaviour at any particular point in the day - and, incidentally, by the consistency of her saliva! (Slightly more viscous at lower BG numbers. Who'da thunk it?)


Mogs
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Elmo is a bit more subdued this a.m. thus far...AMBG was 101...+3 was 87...gave him about teaspoon and a half snack at +3...probably going to give a pokey break now that in greens unless anyone thinks differently... to you, Mogs

 

Since you didn't shoot no reason to poke. It's looking good

 

Oh thank you , Janet !!! Elmo may yet be another vetsulin success story like ur CC

 

And no, I am waiting until Thursday to start b12...gave him his homeopathic remedy today( Nux Vomica 30 c for stomach) so didn't want it possibly competing with b12...also his behavior is more subdued compared to yesterday(Tuesday)... sleeping more , not roaming around...appy and LB are normal...

 

Mogs, I read the article you
referred me to about BGs at fasting levels but if that is Elmo's problem what is the solution??? One look at his SS shows the blues, even tho low blues mostly, clustered around PS. What do I do , Yoda ???

 

I know you didn't ask me, but Low blues are great esp with an alpha track. Elmo has no problem. My cat is often in blues... Sometimes as high as 140's... He's doing fine.

 

Hi Janet....no, I'm glad for your input...because I was switching to Lantus I needed to switch to a human meter so those blues are human meter blues...took me a while to switch my mind from AT readings to FreeStyle readings....just hoping Elmo makes a move either lower or higher....I want any remission to be strong and permanent as Elmo is 17 and I don't want to put him thru another round of poking and shooting. Want this season of his life to be as simple as possible, as simple as I can make it anyway . Please give me any and all info and insight you might have ..You have been where I am now and I value that experience and insight ! Thanks for keeping an eye on us !!

 

OK, I'll pipe up with more anecdata-- I never did get my Amber to shake the blue AMPS's. Like you, I was determined to get as strong a remission as possible, so I kept going with the microdoses, and then the micro-microdoses, until I finally got tired of getting sub-50 numbers and feeling like I couldn't leave the house during the day (my work is flexible, but not that flexible!) and started an OTJ trial. Blue AMPS's all the way through. Since then-- OTJ for 6-7 months and so far, fantastic numbers on all her spot checks.

The trick is: I just don't ever check her in the early mornings anymore.

P.S. I don't actually recommend the "ignore it, and it's just like it went away" approach, but it is what it is!

 

Nan , I love what you said and so glad you shared it. This whole deal with Elmo,the "here we go on Lantus" then having him be too low with no data could really mess with my head. I've been practicing the "whiff of Lantus" drop which is microscopic.....all that said ,like you, I am ready to do what is best for my kitty boy ...right now he is making that decision a challenge ...keep an eye on us and chime in please!!!

 

You know you can still use Alphatrak with lantus, right?... Unless you wanted cheaper strips.

 

If Elmo is like cc, those numbers will average lower over time. Look at my ss and notice my off the juice trial. With two exceptions, ALL blues. Now look at the weeks following... Tons more greens. His body is healing and learning to adjust and self regulate. Give him a little time.

 

Will do! Been following the Buddha kitteh from a distance for a while anyway!

 

The way I dealt with it was to keep Saoirse on a permanent feeding schedule of mini-meals every 3 hours. If the specialist hadn't put up the roadblock to getting the Lantus prescription I would have continued to give Saoirse a tiny droplet of insulin once a day for as long as it was safe to do so.


Mogs
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Thank u, Mogs.....praying for you to get rested and whole

 

Yes I knew I could but the cost of strips ( especially on days of multiple testing) was getting to me. Switched to FS meter cos like AT but realized strips were outrageous as well. I now have a Relion as back up that will become my main meter if needed once I run out of FS strips. The cost of strips is highway robbery (says Captain Obvious )

 

FYI....AMBG 114....+3 73

 

after a good poo at +3 Elmo behaving more alert, more "well"

 

Yes-- I think the mini-meals is the way to go. When I was still getting (or, er, measuring) blue AMBGs, Amber was in the process of figuring out the autofeeder, and (because it took her a while!) was still missing her "wee hours" meals. Most mornings, in addition to the blue glucose readings, she was greeting me with some clear vomit, indicating an upset stomach. She's not doing that any more now that she's figured out her meal schedule, and I wouldn't be surprised if her AMBGs are looking better too.

 

Thanks, Nan, for keeping an eye on us and ur insight and experience. It really helps. Today is day 8...really trying hard not to focus on it. My plan is to stay the course thru the 14th day and see where we are then. The variable unique to Elmo( as far as I know) is the whole long term hyperthyroid issue which is possibly/probably playing a part in this . At any rate, if we make it the whole 14 days it will thrill and satisfy my new vet who suggested it in the first place( not knowing Elmo's body would choose it on its own) so he won't be able to say I didn't try .

 

Be sure to let the vet know that you're having to use food manipulation to keep levels down, Beth.


Mogs
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Thank you, Mogs .....r u saying that I shouldn't have to manipulate food to keep levels down ??? Right now I feel like I don't have much of a choice. His present numbers don't give much wiggle room, especially in pm cycle. Would love ur thoughts on this...I'm just taking this one day at a time..not focusing on the day it is . Are u saying if his pancreas is healed I would not have to manipulate feed ?? Would it be a possibility to slowly back off the mini meals and see what his numbers are? I've only been doing mini meals the last few days and really see no difference between feeding them and not. This is confusing , Mogs, so glad you know what Elmo and I are going thru and can advise. I covet and treasure that advice . Going to start b12 , low and slow, as is Elmo's style/MO mixed in with evening meal. Praying u rest/ sleep well , that u gain strength with each hour.

 

P.S. Are Elmo's numbers similar to Saoirse's numbers at this point? Or did she have higher numbers and more wiggle room ??

 

I'll have a look tomorrow and reply then if that's OK, Beth. (Still feeling really unwell and unbelievably tired.)




Mogs
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Yes, yes...wait til tomorrow. I posted hoping you were asleep and post would be waiting for you in morning... absolutely NO RUSH. I pray you can quiet your mind and your body. Praying for sense of peace to overcome and cover you, dear Mogs. You r in my heart and thoughts constantly...you deserve to be healed and whole and that is my hope and prayer that I will not back down from

 

Good morning...AMBG 98...yeah for .....started 1/2 b12 yesterday pm meal...starting low and slow due to his sensitivity in general

 

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WHOOHOO! Way to go Buddha Kitteh! Your godmamas are so proud of you!

 

Good morning, Linda, momma of sweet Menace. I have been giving Elmo's unique way of doing this whole thing( hence the name Elmo's excellent Odd Adventure) lots of thought and prayer and , for now, am going to let his own body lead my decisions. Not that I am opposed to anything(such as Essence of Lantus dose) but on this day I am going to continue to watch and take note and allow his body to lead me in this "on the bubble" situation we find ourselves in. I give you and all those who have helped us, guided us, total freedom in chiming in with advice, insight and guidance..Elmo is where he is, I have the confidence I have ,because of this wonderful board and loving, caring, knowledgable fur parents like you.. You have been with us from that scary night in late October, along with Chris and MaryAnn...for that I will always be eternally grateful and NEVER FORGET !!!!

 

Beth, I love the moniker "Elmo's Excellent Odd Adventure". Sent me into giggles this AM. I think you are doing the right thing. Let Elmo lead you as he refines his sugar dance steps. He's not tripping on his own feet at this point so you can just follow and breathe! We are all excited and keeping watch with you!

 

Linda, after his diagnosis, I could never have imagined such support, such knowledge, such love and compassion . Elmo says" FDMB ROCKS !!!!"

 

It's the best!!

 

Amen , Kris....its better than the BEST...I preach the gospel of FDMB everywhere I go....at my vet and my holistic vet where they both now refer people to this life giving, peace giving oasis called FDMB .....there really are NO words

 

Linda, I think Bill and Ted would approve of me borrowing that title....makes me want to watch that silly movie here on this icy, grey wintery day

 

Good morning !! Second green AMBG in a row.....day 10 has officially begun ....looks like he may be getting serious about this .....btw, has anyone heard from Mogs ? I know she was feeling poorly so didn't want to tag and disturb any rest ....have her on my heart

 

@Kris & Teasel @MrWorfMen's Mom ......hey Elmo godmommas, have u heard from Mogs ???

 

I'm glad if she's taking a break and getting rest and well......did not want to disturb lest she is...but still a bit concerned. Last contact was Thursday....

 

No I haven't Beth. However, I checked in her signature under postings and she was on yesterday after midnight.

 

We all worry about Mogs but she did post very early Friday morning on another thread so I think she is finally just taking a much needed break. I wish the distance did not separate us so much. We all worry but Mogs has taken a "leave" for an extended period before to replenish her batteries. I'm sure Mittens et al and a few other close calls with which Mogs was engaged over the holidays have taken their toll. Mogs is still healing from the loss of her own beloved little girl and I'm sure the recent holiday events re-opened some fresh scars. We all know Mogs says she is going to rest but then is right back on duty. I too have a hard time "turning it off" so I understand that but Mogs' silence is deafening when she's not here. Wonderful to know there are people so caring in this world but all we can do right now is keep Mogs in our prayers and send healing thoughts to help her regain her strength.

 

Buddha Kitteh you look so good in green! Go Elmo! You got this by the tail buddy!

 

I, too, found the crises of the holidays very tiring so I can't imagine how much worse it must have been for Mogs. That was one heck of a stressful time.

 

This past holiday season was indeed stressful and exhausting. It seemed there was constantly some critical situation going on and sometimes two or three at a time. I know how wiped out I was and Mogs was involved in far more than me. I quite honestly don't know how she did it but I'm sure it has taken its toll. It's tough to back off because these situations prey on your mind even when you're not online even when you know others are monitoring. It's tough to accept but we can't save them all and sometimes it's ourselves we need to take care of so we can be there when needed the next time. I just pray Mogs is finally getting some much needed rest and allowing herself to heal.

 

Kris and Linda...I gave thot of and held u both in prayer after the Mittens crisis. So glad you all have taken a much needed and deserved rest, to recharge. It wore me out just to watch so cannot imagine the toll it took to give of yourselves as you did. So so glad u r taking care of yourselves . And praying Mogs is doing the same, that she has someone checking on her there ....kinda makes a person feel helpless. You all mean the world to Elmo and I...beyond words to express .......rest and replenish .....well earned

 

Yes...yes...yes....

 

Kris, I know u aren't but at times it seems u r super human . I have learned to say no to yes things ....that after a stressful period I rest as long as I need, with no proclaimed deadline for it. I'll just know when I know ...and that's that .

 

I will need all ur support in the next phase. I want to do all possible to keep him safe and in remission , especially at his age.

 

Ok....makes me feel better. Seems she is listening to her body/mind and taking care of herself. Like all of us, to be able to turn off what is going on and give heart and mind a rest.

 

You give me too much credit, Beth. I'm VERY far from super human!!

 

We're not going anywhere Beth! You're stuck with us because each kitty helped is a triumph we all celebrate.

 

Day 10! Awesome!

Do you realize that he is down 6.5% for the amps these last five days from the first five? Go Elmo.

 

Oh thanks, Janet...and I will be posting this on vetsulin forum !!

 

@JanetNJ .....would also appreciate any remission pointers, things u have learned as u have gone through this with CC !!! Will have lots of questions !!!

 

Just keep doing what your doing.... Feeding low carb food, and spot checking her numbers. It's nice not having to get up in the middle of the night to check because you're worried. It's nice to be able to go away and not have to be concerned about missing a shot time. It really is a relief. Not to mention all the money saved in test strips. Hahaha

 

Oh I totally relate....will be weird to not do those things ....do I need to keep up the snacks at +3, 6 and 9 ?

 

Day 10 BGs....AM 88...PM 83

 

If he's hungry, yeah. I free feed so I don't worry about that.

 

Buddha Kitteh updates now on Vetsulin forum