Debra and Yoyo
Very Active Member
Day 14 @.40 Units Lantus http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/1-31-yoyo-amps-254-4-248-pmps-313-4-216-8-297.210153/
2/1 Yoyo AMPS 262,+4 216,+5 217,+7.5 222,PMPS 215,+4 282,+6.5 219
- Thread starter Debra and Yoyo
- Start date
Rosie & Bailey
Very Active Member
I hope Yoyo comes down today.
I see you are experimenting with Yoyo's feeding times. While I was sick, I accidentally missed several of Bailey's meals because I just slept through the alarm. That turned out to be a good thing because I accidentally stumbled upon lower numbers simply by giving her first post-shot feeding @+3 instead of +2 or +2.5. I think even those 30 minutes makes a big difference.
What I think works for Bailey is starting her with a small amount of food just as the insulin onsets(+3), then giving her the bulk of the food when I think it's peaking (+4 for Bailey), slightly lesser amount of food as she goes past peak (+5.5), and finally a snack @ +7.5 to keep her tummy from getting upset.
I don't know if something similar would work for Yoyo, but sharing just in case.
How is Yoyo's weight?
I see you are experimenting with Yoyo's feeding times. While I was sick, I accidentally missed several of Bailey's meals because I just slept through the alarm. That turned out to be a good thing because I accidentally stumbled upon lower numbers simply by giving her first post-shot feeding @+3 instead of +2 or +2.5. I think even those 30 minutes makes a big difference.
What I think works for Bailey is starting her with a small amount of food just as the insulin onsets(+3), then giving her the bulk of the food when I think it's peaking (+4 for Bailey), slightly lesser amount of food as she goes past peak (+5.5), and finally a snack @ +7.5 to keep her tummy from getting upset.
I don't know if something similar would work for Yoyo, but sharing just in case.
How is Yoyo's weight?
carfurby (GA)
Very Active Member
I see Yoyo teased you with that yellow yesterday. I hope he gives you some blue today.
Debra and Yoyo
Very Active Member
I really appreciate you sharing all your knowledge with me......Thank You!
As for Yoyo.....it seems any food at any time makes his BG go up. I usually give him 1/2 can at AMPS or PMPS and then I was following with the other 1/2 can at +1. Well, now that I have stopped taking +2 readings because his ears were sooooo bad, red and blotchy, I started to give him his 2nd 1/2can at +2 and was hoping that he would be more receptive to the food as he usually isn't hungry at +1. Well he eats it, but still isn't really hungry. Sometimes I just let him eat as much as he wants as you can see on his SS, because his weight is low and it bothers me as I don't know if something else is going on with him as he has other health issues.
His numbers have been staying in the yellow area, he probably needs an increase soon.
Rosie & Bailey
Very Active Member
That's possible, but don't give up experimenting with different times. I stumbled upon something that worked for Bailey, but when I was trying all those different times in the past, I thought feeding time didn't matter.
That's a possibility. Maybe just a little nudge will be enough to get him kickstarted. I always hesitate to give dosing advice because I've seen where what I would have done would have been the bad choice, but it seems like Yoyo could benefit from an increase.
I'm glad I gave Bailey the dosecrease even though she was pretty stable. Her numbers are much better now, and she spends even more time playing and active. Actually, she just earned a reduction. I just have to figure out how much to reduce since I like to bring her down slowly.
Debra and Yoyo
Very Active Member
I'm happy for you and Bailey. When their numbers are GOOD, it makes you feel so much better! I hope Bailey appreciates what a Wonderful Mom you are to her!
Debra and Yoyo
Very Active Member
Lately Yoyo's favorite color is Yellow!
I have been putting antibiotic cream on Yo's ears to help with the reddness and it has helped BUT when I take his BG levels I am having trouble getting blood. The blood seems to be effected by the antibiotic cream, his blood looks real thin and will not register on the meter. I have tried washing his ears before using the lancet but it really itsn't helping. I am going to stop using the antiobotic cream and see what happens. Have you ever run into anything like this?
carfurby (GA)
Very Active Member
Yes. If I put too much Neosporin on Furball's ear I can't get a good blood drop. I just barely put a dab on after each test. If you can't do it after each test, just put some on each night right before you go to sleep. That will help.
Debra and Yoyo
Very Active Member
I thought I was going nuts, the blood mixes with the cream and I can't get a sample. I didn't realize this at first and then I started putting the pieces together. I can't win, red ears or a good sample
For now, I won't put any cream on his ears. I may try some ice after taking his blood and see how he tolerates the cold. This should be fun
Gill & George
Very Active Member
Hi Debra, I've not visited before been awol from the board for a while
Are you still doing SLGS? I only ask because you are testing enough for TR and just wondered if you'd forgotten to update it on the signature.
Just an observation on the food. I would try and avoid feeding in the latter half of the cycle. On lantus feeding after +6 for many cats can be counter productive, in the latter half of the lantus cycle when the available insulin is waning a meal can bump up the numbers even if it's a LC meal, this then results in the following PS being higher than it might need to be. Since lantus is better at grabbing onto low numbers and yielding low flat cycles, than it is at dragging high numbers down, it's preferable to avoid bumping those PS numbers up.
Some cats do seem to be more sensitive than others to this, with George I could feed as late as +7.5 and it never seemed to bother him, but he never seemed to be particularly carb sensitive, having said that if I did give him something late in the cycle it was rarely more than a couple of teaspoons. On the ss you have meals of 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 cans at +8, I would say that's probably too much for that point in the cycle.
It is true that for some kitties not eating for 6 hours can lead to acid tummy and make them sick. What you can do, if that is the case for your kitty is give them snack of something like poached chicken breast, just a few small pieces, that should solve the problem with the acid tummy without raising the BG
NB you will also see that it is sometimes recommended to give a snack at +9 to try and bring the numbers down, this is only for cat on micro doses where the pancreas is working and a little snack can stimulate the pancreas to produce some of it's own insulin and bring down the PS numbers, but it has the opposite effect on cats that are on larger doses and who are likely solely relying on injected/exogenous insulin to control their numbers.
To give you an idea with the feeding, try to feed the bulk of the food for the day at amps and pmps, then some mini meals in the early part of the cycle.
eg Georges total food for the day is as follows
3 ounces amps
2tsp +2
2tsp +4
2tsp +6
3 ounces pmps
2 tsp +2
2 tsp +4
2 tsp +6
Is Yoyo still loosing weight? has he stabilised? He is still spending a lot of time in yellow, if we can get Yoyo to spend more time in the blues and greens you will more than likely see his body condition improve.
He's been on this dose for 2 weeks and over the last 5 days overall his nadirs have been creeping up, so yes I agree I think he could do with an increase.
Are you still doing SLGS? I only ask because you are testing enough for TR and just wondered if you'd forgotten to update it on the signature.
Just an observation on the food. I would try and avoid feeding in the latter half of the cycle. On lantus feeding after +6 for many cats can be counter productive, in the latter half of the lantus cycle when the available insulin is waning a meal can bump up the numbers even if it's a LC meal, this then results in the following PS being higher than it might need to be. Since lantus is better at grabbing onto low numbers and yielding low flat cycles, than it is at dragging high numbers down, it's preferable to avoid bumping those PS numbers up.
Some cats do seem to be more sensitive than others to this, with George I could feed as late as +7.5 and it never seemed to bother him, but he never seemed to be particularly carb sensitive, having said that if I did give him something late in the cycle it was rarely more than a couple of teaspoons. On the ss you have meals of 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 cans at +8, I would say that's probably too much for that point in the cycle.
It is true that for some kitties not eating for 6 hours can lead to acid tummy and make them sick. What you can do, if that is the case for your kitty is give them snack of something like poached chicken breast, just a few small pieces, that should solve the problem with the acid tummy without raising the BG
NB you will also see that it is sometimes recommended to give a snack at +9 to try and bring the numbers down, this is only for cat on micro doses where the pancreas is working and a little snack can stimulate the pancreas to produce some of it's own insulin and bring down the PS numbers, but it has the opposite effect on cats that are on larger doses and who are likely solely relying on injected/exogenous insulin to control their numbers.
To give you an idea with the feeding, try to feed the bulk of the food for the day at amps and pmps, then some mini meals in the early part of the cycle.
eg Georges total food for the day is as follows
3 ounces amps
2tsp +2
2tsp +4
2tsp +6
3 ounces pmps
2 tsp +2
2 tsp +4
2 tsp +6
Is Yoyo still loosing weight? has he stabilised? He is still spending a lot of time in yellow, if we can get Yoyo to spend more time in the blues and greens you will more than likely see his body condition improve.
Debra and Yoyo
Very Active Member
Thank you for taking the time to write to me.
Yoyo had gained some wt back, but presently he has lost wt again. He was always a big boy at around 16#'s. After his surgery in Dec 2017 when his leg was removed due to cancer, his normal wt was around 13#'s. Now he is around 11.4#'s and he is thin. That is why you see different amounts of food that I feed him as noted on the SS. When he wants to eat, I try and give him whatever he wants. He is a picky eater and I usually have to hand feed him, spoiled-Yes.
I was feeding large amounts of food at AMPS & PMPS and then @+1. (He will not eat an entire can at 1 feeding. I break it up into 2 meals). Lately, since I stopped the +2 test, I have been giving him his morning and pm bulk at +2. Then at +4, and +5 approx 1/4 can. I was skipping +4 feedings when his numbers were lower to see how low he would go, but now he seems to be stuck in yellow and on the flat side so I have been giving food at +4.
I will cook up some chicken for later feedings but I don't think he will eat it. He has to have his certain types of food or he will not eat at all. I did not know about the +9 feeding with low doses. Thank you for letting me know. But I don't know how I can get him to eat chicken at +9. Can I give him some of his canned food at +9?
Again, I appreciate your advice.
Many thanks!!
Gill & George
Very Active Member
At his current dose, I would avoid feeding at +9. When I say low dose I mean, a micro dose lower than 0.25 inisuch cases we would use the +9 feed in a cat where his numbers are mostly green but are bumping up to blue at PS, that feed at +9 can help lower the ps into green by stimulating the pancreas into producing it's own insulin, which in turn brings the ps numbers down. But that's not where You is at.
With his other health issues, and the picky eating it does make it harder. I would aim to get his food in before +7 if you can. Whatever schedule works best for you both. You might find that he'll be hungrier at preshot if he hasn't eaten for a few hours.
Have you tried raising his bowl, sometimes that can help especially if they are feeling a bit icky. When George was I'll with bad teeth last year he would only eat if I hand fed him, is it possible he has some mouth pain?
With his other health issues, and the picky eating it does make it harder. I would aim to get his food in before +7 if you can. Whatever schedule works best for you both. You might find that he'll be hungrier at preshot if he hasn't eaten for a few hours.
Have you tried raising his bowl, sometimes that can help especially if they are feeling a bit icky. When George was I'll with bad teeth last year he would only eat if I hand fed him, is it possible he has some mouth pain?
Debra and Yoyo
Very Active Member
Since being a kitten- I have always brushed his teeth weekly so I know that's not a problem. Yoyo has just always been a picky eater but he always had DRY FOOD to nibble on throughout the day and I feel that the dry food added extra calories to his diet which I no longer feed him since being diagnosed with diabetes.
Gill & George
Very Active Member
If he's a nibbler, would he graze on his wet food if you left it out for him? Some kitties do ok with grazing. You could pick up his bowl at +6 or +7 ??