AMPS 478, PMPS 553 Advice please

Discussion in 'Lantus (Glargine) / Levemir (Detemir)' started by Sean & Rufus, Feb 8, 2018.

  1. Sean & Rufus

    Sean & Rufus Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2018
    Hey all-

    If you could take a look at my ss, yesterday amps was 144. Never saw a number that low. Now we are back up again since. He probably is bouncing, I think he prefers the higher numbers (argh). He really acts "better" with the higher numbers, so we need his body to like the lower numbers. Anywho, my vet broke up with me yesterday and I have an appt with specialist next week. I'm going to get some pm numbers and more day numbers asap, but do you think I should drop down to 5? Or even 4.5? This whole 144 number is awesome and scary at the same time!

    Thanks!
     
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  2. Dyana

    Dyana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    I'm sorry your vet broke up with you, but things happen for a reason. I hope the specialist is more open to working with you and not on an ego trip.
    I hope with more testing that you can find more of those hidden blue numbers. Best Of Luck to you and Rufus.
    And yes, he is bouncing from the 144, unless it was a bad test, but let's just figure it wasn't ;) and plan to catch more bounces breaking.
     
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  3. Sean & Rufus

    Sean & Rufus Member

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    Jan 10, 2018
    Thank you :) I did test twice on that 144, so hopefully wasn't a "bad" test!
     
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  4. Amy&TrixieCat

    Amy&TrixieCat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    I'd be inclined to hold the current dose for now, but yes - definitely get some more tests to fill in the blanks so you know for sure what is going on.

    Have you decided which method you prefer to follow - Tight Regulation (TR) or Start Low Go Slow (SLGS)? They are both good methods, and while they are structured a little differently, they give you excellent guidelines for making dosing decisions. One thing to keep in mind is that both methods are structured around human meters rather than the AT, so you would have to make slight adjustments to the numbers. There are stickies at the top of the forum explaining both, and as always, we are here to answer any questions you have about them.
     
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  5. Sean & Rufus

    Sean & Rufus Member

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    Jan 10, 2018
    I'll have to re-read the 2 methods, but isn't the difference between the 2 on how you get tom get them regulated? How you start the process? I guess from what I read, the slgs method would work bet, because of less testing?

    As far as human meter, I'll have to talk to specialist, and then my next vet about that. Once I get him regulated, and have less paperwork and the vets input, I think they would be ok for me switching to a human meter. Sure would be easier to figure out dosing from here, and way cheaper to boot. From what I have found, vets are only comfortable with feline meters.
     
  6. Carol in Chicago

    Carol in Chicago Member

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    Apr 5, 2017
    One point to consider is many vets won't want you to home test and may actually discourage use of a human meter. You know the value and safety in testing, so don't let them talk you out of it.

    My vet suggested the AT meter when I asked about home testing, but I knew from everything I learned here I wanted to use a human meter. It's not a question of right or wrong - you need to be comfortable with any treatment plan and working with the vet to help Rufus.
     
  7. Sean & Rufus

    Sean & Rufus Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2018
    My new vet, which was my previous vet, was shocked that my vet was telling me to NOT test at home. Can't go to the new old vet until after the specialist. Confused yet, I'm getting there :)

    I think the vet won't mind me using a human meter, as long as I can show her that I know what I'm doing and can explain the numbers to her.

    And a forum member generouslly donated about 80 AT2 test strips to me, so I have about 150. That won't last as long as I think it will though hahaha
     
  8. Amy&TrixieCat

    Amy&TrixieCat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    With both methods, we encourage at least 4 tests a day - the two pre-shot tests, and at least one mid-cycle test, with more testing if the numbers indicate necessity. In general, it's just plain not safe to test less than that.

    The main difference is that TR is more aggressive, with lower numbers for earning reductions and more frequent dose increases. Even though it is more aggressive than SLGS, they both safety measures built into them because above all else, safety comes first. Additionally, TR is an actual protocol that has been published. SLGS is more of a guideline that can be somewhat adapted to personal needs (ie, kitty eats some kibble, etc). Despite how the name sounds, SLGS does require a good knowledge of how a cat responds to insulin, because it isn't as structured as the TR protocol.

    Either meter is fine to use. The two main reasons we encourage a human meter is because the methods are developed around human meters so that makes it easier to interpret results, and of course strips for human meters are so much cheaper and easier to get. One thing that we don't encourage is flip-flopping between different meters, though - that can lead to a lot of confusion.
     
  9. Tracey&Jones

    Tracey&Jones Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2016
    Exes are exes for a reason. Good luck with your new one.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2018
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  10. Bronx's dad

    Bronx's dad Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2016
    That 144 could've been a bad test too, just something to consider. If you don't get enough blood on the strip, it will read a low reading. Whenever I get a reading that seems too low, I test again right away.
     
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  11. Sean & Rufus

    Sean & Rufus Member

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    Jan 10, 2018
    Thanks for the info. I'm hoping when things work out, he'll get wet food for shot time and I'll have young again LID for him to graze on. Looks like both allow for that. I probably will end up SLGS, but need to read up more. My mind is mush right now, so I'll have to check it tomorrow.
     
  12. Sean & Rufus

    Sean & Rufus Member

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    Jan 10, 2018
    I did retest. Same blood, 2 different strips. It was 144 and then 162 I believe. Rufus is a bleeder once you get him :)

    I am kicking myself that I didn't retest before I gave him the insulin an hour later.
     
  13. Sean & Rufus

    Sean & Rufus Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2018
    No kidding. She was "frustrated with me". Because I had suggestions on the thing I read here. Whatever. I told her I wanted us to be a team, but only she has a degree. It's all good. Just was super convenient for me 1 minute away. I love my old vet so it's cool.
     
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  14. Wendy&Neko

    Wendy&Neko Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2012
    If you are feeding dry food, you have to use SLGS as the dosing method. That means you don't reduce the dose until you see a number below 90, and you hold the dose if you see nadirs between 90 and 150. That's what you've seen so far.

    Never assume a vet will insist on the AT. Mine was so pleased I wanted to home test she just told me to get the one that needed the smallest blood drop. She used a human meter in the clinic. Months later she asked me if I wanted to use the AT, but no sale. :p
     
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  15. Sean & Rufus

    Sean & Rufus Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2018
    I just can't catch a break. Giving Rufus his insulin this morning and he does something he's never done before. I pushed the needle in, and he meowed (he does feel it every once in a while), but this time as I started to push the plunger about half way through he scootches forward real quick. I think he got about 3/4 of his dose. I could kind of smell the lantus at first on him, now I cant really. Hopefully I got close to all of it him.

    And I'm really questioning that nice 144 reading. I was so exhausted last night, only got 2 pm readings. Was hoping to get a 3 or 4 am one. Hopefully tonight.

    You ever start to wonder if the universe is against you? My luck has been nothing short of non existent the last year.
     
  16. Amy&TrixieCat

    Amy&TrixieCat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Yeah, sometimes it feels like the world is beating us up...but we're here to help with the FD part at least. Don't worry about this morning's shot - we've all done furshots. It's part of the deal....it even happens when we we've been doing this for years. The main thing is to never ever re-shoot when you think you've done a fur shot.

    Since you did test twice the other day, I'm confident the 144 was the real deal. As we mentioned, these bounces can take several days to clear. It is frustrating that they can be so stubborn, but hopefully over time that will change.

    The extra readings you got where perfect. This is the kind of information that is very helpful. Keep up the good work! (And, it's a good idea to start a new condo for today, too, rather than keeping this one going.)
     
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  17. Juliet

    Juliet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2017
    Three tests a day are okay if you work full time tho right? I get both preshots and a before bed test but a day time cycle I can’t get.
     
  18. Juliet

    Juliet Well-Known Member

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    Sep 8, 2017
    Done that many times. Sucks but nothing you can do about it. I just tell myself it’s just one cycle. Next one will be okay.
     
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  19. Sean & Rufus

    Sean & Rufus Member

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    Jan 10, 2018
    I know. Just disappointed because I wanted to collect some good data with the weird good number that popped up the other day. And if he's bouncing it's probably not good to get a half shot or whatever he received.
     
  20. Juliet

    Juliet Well-Known Member

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    Sep 8, 2017
    :bighug:
     
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  21. Sandy and Black Kitty

    Sandy and Black Kitty Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2009
    Great job testing before shooting and getting some PM cycle tests!
    Keep up the good work!


    All data is good data :cool:

    When you have a furshot, whether partial or full, the cycle count starts over.
    Hold the current dose and continue to test strategically, varying the times from day to day so that when you step back and look at the ss as a whole there are no huge white areas.

    Carry on testing before each shot and getting mid cycle tests both AM and PM and the picture of what 5.5u is (or is not) doing for Rufus will gradually come into much better focus.

    Don't forget to test daily for ketones and to note the results in the remarks column on the ss.
     
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