Anyone familiar with Glipizide? Other ?'s as well...

Venita and I have been working with a lady here in Va Bch who has a diabetic kitty, Song. Song's mom is needle phobic so the vet put Song on glipizide. We have been working with Ann to get Song on an appropriate diet, which does seem to be helping a bit. Her first fructosimine was in the 500's (I think that's what she said on the phone.) She has been feeding DM wet and dry (I believe the dry is most of the problem) along with a bit of beef FF and some Beechnut Beef baby food, since Song is willing to eat Beef FF I suggested she dump the DM completely and feed the FF. She says Song seems much perkier when she eats the FF Beef, more than when she eats the DM. This leads me to think dumping the hc crap might help. Oh, she puts the pill in with the food, a bit of baby food with the FF all mixed up and Song eats it fine. Ann is very willing to dump the dry and canned DM and feed Song LC FF.

She recently removed chicken from Song's diet because whenever she feed it Song gets liqui-poo but says the beef does not do that. Also suggested dumping chicken and sticking with beef if that makes Song happy and keeps her eating low carb. She says Song does sometimes get picky and will refuse to eat unless there is kibble on it. I suggested Evo and Wellness and Ann said that she's tried Evo and it was a failure. I suggested she try Wellness Core and use it only as a last resort and will show her freeze dried treats as an alternative if it's just that Song needs to have her interest stirred to get the eating started, maybe that would do it. It does for Bella, but sometimes I still have to put a few pieces of kibble on her food and then she gobbles it all down and licks the bowl clean ohmygod_smile

Ann said the vet told her not to give two pills but he also told her to feed DM dry ohmygod_smile so.... I know nothing at all about this pill or how to dose it or if that would need be adjusted up at all at some point but if the food change works and her numbers come down... how will we adjust to prevent hypo other than skipping a dose? 1/2 a pill? 3/4? I'm not sure the pill's dosage but can call Ann later today to find out if need be. I don't know if this pill is dosed based on weight of the cat or based on numbers. Song is not overweight that I know of. Other than seeing to be sensitive to chicken she is healthy overall, again as far as I know. No other health problems have been mentioned.

Ann is NOT currently home testing. The only numbers we have are fructosimine numbers. I will be showing her how to test on Monday. I am hoping we can work around her needle phobia at least for this by using the lancet device. We will try anyway =) Ann and her sister will be coming over to my house on Monday afternoon, I'll use Tugger as a test subject and maybe pick on Bella if we need to work with a fractious kitty (Ann doesn't think Song will tolerate testing well)

I plan to print a copy of J&B's food list for Ann to take home with her (forgot to mention Ann is not computer savvy) Any suggestions for other things I can print off for her to take home? Other than, you know, everything. :lol: Someone really needs to write a book. Seriously.

Does anyone know the carb content of the DM wet and dry? I know it's higher than the beef FF (3%) but I would like to give Ann accurate info and I am not seeing it on the list?

Below is the most recent email from Ann. She is very worried that she will not be able to handle insulin shots because of her needle fears so we are trying diet for now. She's afraid she will have to give Song up if it comes down to shots. I am hoping that dumping the dry and home testing will get this under some sort of control. If anyone has any other ideas or suggestions, I'm all ears!

 

I can't help with the Glip, but needle fears... See how she feels about practicing using water and an orange. I know, sounds weird, but if she can get used to the feel of the plunger and drawing the insulin, things may work.

If you have an old vial of insulin your tossing, use that or if there's not enough insulin for practice, draw up water with a sryinge and dump it in the vial. Vial would be best since the rubber stopper is what most insulins use, but if you can't find a vial, see if she'll draw up water from a glass for practice. Shoot the water into the orange for practice.

 

You can find the dm on the charts. highlight it for her so she can see the carb content.

 

Good thinking Jennifer! I'll be sure to pick up some oranges before Monday. I have Tugger's old vial of Lantus in the fridge still, it's not cloudy or anything so I haven't pitched it yet. We can use that if she's comfortable enough to try. Brady is coming with a pen and some more is being sent (or maybe not at this point lol) so I'll still have backup just in case.

Hillary, you're right... it is there, when you look in the right place ohmygod_smile I guess I didn't scroll far enough down the page when I was looking. Checked again and sure enough, there it was.

 

Dry food:
Purina DM (CNM-DM)
% calories from
Protein: 50
Fat: 37
Carbs: 13

Fiber (grams): 0.3
Phosphorus (mg): 37
Calories per cup: 592

Canned food:
Purina DM
% calories from
Protein: 46
Fat: 47
Carbs: 7

Fiber (grams): 0.8
Phosphorus (mg): 259
Calories per cup: 194


If it helps at all, when Gwyn's base food was A/D (13% carbs; we did A/D because of health issues), she needed 4u of insulin BID. When we finally managed to switch her base food to Wellness Chicken (3% carbs), she dropped to needing 2u BID.

 

There is hope that Ann can overcome the needle phobia and learn to give insulin shots. Believe it or not, I'm needle phobic. When the vet told me I had to give insulin shots to Tinkles, I told her that I wasn't sure I would be able to do it. But I am able to do it, although I was *extremely* stressed the first few days. It is still stressful for me every time, which is why I give the shots while Tinkles is eating. The orange is a GREAT idea, that will help her if she can get herself to try it. I don't have any trouble with the blood testing.

I pass out when I get shots, I.V.s are a nightmare. I lay down and have someone talk to me to distract me from the needle, that usually helps. Silly, I know, but I can't help it! I have trouble even watching other people get shots. My sympathies to Ann, tell her to breathe, keep breathing...focus on the mechanics of it, lift the tent, push, press plunger...don't think about what it is too much. I never try to pull back the plunger to look for blood, it's just too much for me. Good luck!

 

Since I'm new to this board, I will put my very cheap $0.01 in here. LOL

I've tried Blackie on Glipizide when she was first diagnosed and was giving her 1 1/2 pills 2x a day. After a bit, the pill didn't work well enough, and Blackie started vomiting. We took her off the pills, put her on Vetsulin, which was later recalled (we were told that the company wasn't making it anymore... I found out through the 'net that it was being recalled). We then put her on ProZinc insulin. I've had a diabetic dog 11 years ago, and was the only one giving him shots back then. I remembered how to do, but I still don't enjoy doing it. Don't think anybody does, really.

Anyway, she needs to watch Song with regards to the pills' reaction. IF at all possible, try opening the jaw with 1 hand and insert the pill past the gag reflex area of the cat's throat quickly with the other. With Blackie, I held her by the scruff with my left, and pried her jaw open and popped the pill in her mouth with my right (I'm right handed). Here are a couple of websites that may help:

http://video.about.com/vetmedicine/Give ... a-Pill.htm

http://www.wikihow.com/Give-a-Cat-a-Pill

I've never done the last method in the 2nd website before. That's something new to me.

And yes, Song's owner needs to get over her fear of the needles. Here's another website that showed me where to insert the needle:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OL17Bkgd ... re=related

Good luck, and I look forward to updates.

 

Another tip to remember when giving insulin shots it remember to breathe. I, too, start stressing out when I start drawing the insulin into the syringe. You CAN overcome it. Just remember to breathe, and remember that you're saving the life of a beloved furbaby. Yes, I admit that I start getting a bit sweaty (hence stress), and I just try and calm down. Cats are extremely sensitive to our moods, and "feel" what we're going through. So, the sooner you can tamp down those fears, the better you and your cat will be, and the smoother the medicine times will become, as well. My Blackie's already surprised me a couple of times this past week with getting close to me when it comes to her shots. She's NEVER done that before since we've started this. She knows that this is part of our daily routine now. There will be times when she'll hide, but I'll find her. I always do. LOL