Bibo's 3rd day!

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (Welcome & Main Forum)' started by Taline & Bibo, Aug 8, 2010.

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  1. Taline & Bibo

    Taline & Bibo Member

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    Jul 19, 2010
    Good Morning everyone!
    Today is a new day, and I decided I'm not gonna stress out! I just tested his bg +11 and it was 371. Eleven hours ago when I gave him his shot of .50u, I felt his fur being wet. So I'm thinking perhaps, he didn't get much of insulin last night. So in less than hour I'm gonna give him his dose and I'm confused between 2 #s. 1u or .75u? Is there anyone out there available to help me with an advice? Thank you guys.
     
  2. Karen & Smokey(GA)

    Karen & Smokey(GA) Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    I'd go with the .75u.

    PZI Vet Idexx ...really....where did you get that....it's no longer manufactured.
     
  3. Taline & Bibo

    Taline & Bibo Member

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    Jul 19, 2010
    I got it from my vet, 3 days ago, but it expires this month, I realized yesterday, and he said that these are not available. I don't know what else to get for next month. I heard about another type of PZI called BCP that I got the link for to order http://www.bcpvetpharm.com/ and their # is:800-481-1729. What do you guys think of this one for the next vial?
     
  4. Hope + (((Baby)))GA

    Hope + (((Baby)))GA Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Mishka is on IDEXX and I plan on using hers up way past the expiration date. When I switch I will go to BCP.
     
  5. Taline & Bibo

    Taline & Bibo Member

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    Jul 19, 2010
    I just gave him a .80u, little less than 1u. And he's eating now! I have been noticing that he's grooming himself a lot. Is that a sign of anything?
     
  6. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Good morning Taline. Yes, the grooming is a good sign. Their coat tends to get dry and they don't take care of themselves when they feel bad. The wet food really helped shine up Oliver's coat, and he started to take care of it as soon as he felt better.

    The dosage sounds good. Try to get in some spot checks during the day - especially around that +6 mark.
     
  7. Laurie and Mr Tinkles

    Laurie and Mr Tinkles Well-Known Member

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    May 9, 2010
    Very good decision on dose, 1u is too much for him. As Sue said, be sure to check his BG to make sure he isn't going too low. I would check at +3 or +4, since he was so low early yesterday. I haven't used Indexx or BCP, so those with experience with it would be better to guide you on specifics for those PZIs. There's some general PZI info with links to more here viewtopic.php?f=24&t=1979&start=0

    You're doing great, I hope his numbers are great today so it's less stressful for you! Low, but not too low, ok Bibo? :smile:
     
  8. Rob & Harley (GA)

    Rob & Harley (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Good decision to not stress today.

    You're getting good advise

    Have a great day.
     
  9. chriscleo

    chriscleo Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    please stick with 0.8u at least a few more times so we have a better idea how the insulin is working.
    if the blood sugar drops too much or you still have an unshootable number at +12 reduce a tiny bit further. otherwise please stick to the dose a few more times.

    you mentioned U100 syringes before. yes, many of us at PZI use(d) them (cleo switched from pzi vet to lantus), and they make dosing a lot easier/more precise.

    if you get the ones with half-unit measurements (make sure it says that on the box because clerks sometimes mess up), each black mark on the syringe represents 0.2u of U40 insulin.

    i use 3/10cc, 5/16" needle, 31 gauge U100 syringes with half-unit measurements and get them either at walmart (some walmarts have phased them out tho) or via hocks.com. they come in a box of 100. hocks.com does not require a prescription, nor do many states. the 5/16" needle is shorter, so it's easier to insert.
    some vets are uncomfortable having clients use U100 syringes with a U40 insulin because they worry the client will make a mistake in conversion. but if you count each mark as 0.2u, it's pretty hard to make a mistake.

    it's hard not to stress when your little guy is sick, but remember that all of us went thru this. most of us were no smarter and no more experienced than you are now, but we all learned and you will, too. many of our cats have lived long happy lives with insulin, some as long as 14 years. it's a godsend for a diabetic cat.

    i happened to like PZI Vet a lot. of the insulins available now, many people have been perfectly happy with BCP PZI, and prozinc is showing promising results. lantus or levemir are also great insulins. they all have their pros and cons. pzi vet, in my opinion, is great because it can knock high numbers down pretty quickly and takes well to dose adjustments. some of the others require very consistent dosing.

    the point to keeping the dose consistent for a few days is to gather more data on how your cat is doing on the insulin. if we keep varying the dose, it makes it harder to figure out what's working and what isn't. BUT, if your cat's number is too low at preshot, again, wait 15 or 20 min and retest, don't wait an hour, in case the number shoots up when the insulin is depleted. big jumps or drops in blood glucose don't feel good, so we try to avoid that.
     
  10. Taline & Bibo

    Taline & Bibo Member

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    Jul 19, 2010
    Hi again,
    I got good numbers: +6 is 67 and I gave hin 1/3 can of ff wet so I can keep his bg from going down. He had thrown up, and I think, this morning when we were in the garden, he ate some grass, and I saw some long grass in his vomit. Should I worry about the vomiting? He does throw up every once in a while,like once a month and it's been like that for years.
     
  11. Laurie and Mr Tinkles

    Laurie and Mr Tinkles Well-Known Member

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    May 9, 2010
    Nice number! I wouldn't worry about vomiting once after eating grass. All of my cats do that, I'm not sure why, but it's a cat thing! If he vomits again, then I would be more concerned about it. I've never had a cat that didn't vomit once in a while! No stressing today, ok? ;-)

    Looking good so far today! I'm interested to see what his PS # tonight will be. Did you see Chris' post above....staying with the 0.8u dose unless the ps # is low again? I agree with that, and her reasoning for it. I'm hoping this dose will be better, crossing my fingers that you get a nice 200 ps#. :smile:
     
  12. pamela and tigger

    pamela and tigger Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    It is perfectly natural for cats to eat grass and then sometimes they will throw it up. It helps them to get rid of furballs, plus grass has folic acid in it which is a much needed nutrient for them. Here are some good links:

    http://www.pawsonline.info/grasseating.htm

    http://www.knowyourcat.info/info/catingrass.htm

    You are doing great!
     
  13. pamela and tigger

    pamela and tigger Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    One more thing...

    When you get a chance can you set up a profile with some history on Bibo and what has transpired to date in his short diabetic journey? How he was diagnosed, what he was eating and what he is eating now, other health issues if any.

    This was something that people were encouraged to do more routinely on our old board (we switched over to this new board format at the end of last year), but it is not as 'simply' done on this new board but it is not hard. It is important to have a profile so people can get to know you and you don't have to repeat the same stuff over and over. To me it is almost as important as having a spreadsheet. Here is a link on this board that will help:

    viewtopic.php?f=6&t=17766

    Also, next time you are at the drugstore you might buy some Keto-diastix and when you see Bibo peeing try and get a sample to make sure there are no ketones building up in his urine. These will also tell you what his urine glucose reading is but this should not take the place of a more current and more accurate reading that you get with your meter.

    P.S. you will see my profile by clicking on the icon next to the PM button on the right. I have an old profile format. The instructions above will give you a newer version.
     
  14. chriscleo

    chriscleo Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    that was a beautiful number at +6. next time, no need to feed that (unless he asked you for food). that's a purely undiabetic number and very nice. looks like 0.8u or a tiny bit less will be a good dose for him for a bit. stick to it for a few more shots unless he goes too low. anything 50-70 at midpoint is a great number.
     
  15. Terri and Lucy

    Terri and Lucy Member

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    Dec 29, 2009
    While 67 is a great peak, when the drop is that big (from 468 to 67) on PZI, it sets the stage for rebound. Like I said on the PZI forum, I think you need to drop the dose back to .5 units.
     
  16. Taline & Bibo

    Taline & Bibo Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2010
    I will Terri. Thanks. And as far as Ketones, I already tested bibo's urine 3 times in the last 3 weeks, and it was negative. I will give a background detail on Bibo on my profile soon. He's newly diabetic, and I suspect it was a combination of high carb kibbles that he was eating plus a very stressful situation happened to him, when 2 months ago, we had our carpets removed, and he was petrified when they started removing our bedroom's where he sleeps under the bed. He was so upset and scared, that he was breathing so hard. and Immediately after that, I started noticing him drinking and urinating so much.
     
  17. Taline & Bibo

    Taline & Bibo Member

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    Jul 19, 2010
    I got a new reading +12, 117. So I'll be checking again in 2 hours and see. I definitely want to give him a .25u even if his bg is below 200, because for some reasons, when we're asleep his glucose is rising. Last night as a said, I thought I gave him .5u but I think I missed it and had a furshot.
     
  18. Terri and Lucy

    Terri and Lucy Member

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    Dec 29, 2009
    If possible, I'd test again in an hour instead of waiting 2 hours. Sometimes with PZI you will see a low zoom up pretty quickly. He's really trying to get off the juice--and you're doing a great job of helping him. Paws crossed for you both.
     
  19. Taline & Bibo

    Taline & Bibo Member

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    Jul 19, 2010
    I will Terri. Let me ask you this or anyone out there. Are 3 cans off ff pate enough food for Bibo who's 14.2 pounds. He always wants food from me, because he was used to eat freely, now I give him 4 separate meals. 1 can in the morning, 1/2 can at noon, 1 can in the evening and 1/2 can at midnight or whenever I get up in the middle of the night to go to the bathroom. If you guys think it's too much, I can lower it.
     
  20. Taline & Bibo

    Taline & Bibo Member

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    Jul 19, 2010
    I tested again PM +1.5 and the bg was 139. I guess I'm gonna feed him his dinner and perhaps test in 2 hours again. Like I said earlier that i'm planning to give him only .25u later tonight. Please any advice.
     
  21. Terri and Lucy

    Terri and Lucy Member

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    Dec 29, 2009
    3 cans (9 oz) is a lot of food. Lucy was 14 lbs in her younger days and the most she ever got was 6 oz plus a couple of small (2 tsp) treats in between. But if Bilbo is a healthy weight, I wouldn't change anything. If he's a bit on the chubby size, you may want to cut back.

    I'd still test in an hour and I'd give .5 instead of .25. But you hold the syringe so you need to do what you feel comfortable with (especially overnight).
     
  22. chriscleo

    chriscleo Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    he was too low to shoot again at shot time so i'd go to 0.5u for a few doses to see how that works. wouldn't go to 0.25u unless you wanted to get something in him and couldn't wait any longer for him to be shootable.
     
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