can someone look at pony's numbers, please?

Hi, I just set up a spread sheet and want to make sure that you all are able to view it. pretty sure i did it correctly, but i've been wrong before. for some reason the really high numbers that should be showing up as black are just staying white. these are the only numbers i have for pony. she just switched off of 8 units of vetsulin and i just started home testing. as you will be able to see from the ss, i have already made 2 dose increases, and rather quickly. my vet advised me to do so. can someone please look over the numbers and just tell me what you are noticing? am i making a big mistake with these increases? it looks like it is bringing the numbers down a little. i am now using humulin n. pony is 12 and she has not been clinically doing well with the switch. i made the switch from 8 units of vetsulin to 3 units of humulin n on 05/10/10. she has been losing her appetite, excessively drinking and urinating, tired, and bloated since the switch. i want to try and regulate her on the humulin n, but will switch to another insulin if i can't. she does not have ketones. many people on this board tried to help me several days ago when i was freaking out the day i started home testing and first saw the really high numbers. i was really, really new to this board at that time and a lot of the help was just confusing me mostly because of the jargon. i have calmed down now and have been able to get the ss up, so i am hoping to maybe reconnect here and make use of everyone's combined experiences. please help me continue on my journey with pony by checking out the ss(see, jargon, and now i am using it!). thanks(that is short for "thank you").

 

Hi there Elise,

We're both attempting to use the same insulin and oddly enough we're both coming down from an 8u shot BID.

This board is much slower than the big board, but the folks here understand the insulin actions of these particular insulins better.

I looked at your SS and really don't have the experience to comment on it, other than it looks familiar....Atlas was starting to look the same way, except even more flat.

I did a lot of reading on chronic rebound and started to wonder if the potential was there. It might be something you would like to discuss with your vet after you try to dose increase. I started to strongly suspect it as the dose went up...so did the numbers with no decrease at onset, nadirs, etc. Just higher numbers all around until it started to flatten out the curve. Which with chronic rebound is what happens. If it is chronic rebound it can look identical to needing to increase dose. That is where home testing can help, the records you keep can help the vet and yourself make what is hopefully the best judgment calls you can for your pet.

I dropped his dose by half and got a huge move into lower numbers in that 12 hour cycle. Still not too good, but lower numbers. I am seeing the vet today to discuss the chart and a checkup on Atlas.

I am sure someone will be along to give you some good advice.

 

Hi Elise,

I am not a vet and will just share my experience and opinion. I think the doses with these fasting acting insulins like Vetsulin and Humulin N are often bumped up way too quickly. I think this is where the problem often lies with newly diagnosed cats. Before you know it, the cat is receiving very huge doses (8 units, 5 units and even 4 units is a lot) of these fast acting short duration insulins which often results in the opposite desired effect. Another thing should be pointed out about the initial starting dose. Some vets will set the initial starting dose of Vetsulin according to the weight of the cat, like they do for dogs. I truly believe in FDMB's famous approach of "Start low and go slow" as to not miss the optimal dose.

I did quickly look at your numbers....it appears you got better movement from the smaller dose of 3 units that the 4 units of humulin N, even though preshots were higher. It could also be that the 3 units was still too much (especially as a starting dose).

Like Blue mentionned in post above, you could be dealing with Rebound.
Are you feeding dry or wet food?
The dry is higher in carbs and you may need a higher dose to compensate. If you are feeding low-carb wet food, IMHO I would start a smaller dose and hold while testing urine for ketones and see if BG numbers improve.
I hope this helps a little.

 

I know nothing about Humulin N so I am not much help for Pony, but Elise has posted in HD as well and it seems Pony is testing HI at ps today.
Can someone please take a look at what we have said in the the other thread and offer some suggestions to Elise?
thx
Elise and Pony from HD group