can't use back legs..anyone know what this could be

As of 3-4 days ago...Alley has lost the use of her back legs. It first started out where she was a bit wobbley and her back legs and body where walking sideways. Now, she is not able to move them at all. I had her at the Vet and they put her on iv fluids and potassium for 16 hrs. She is back home and her potassium is normal but still can't use her legs.
Her back legs just lay stretched out on the side of her body. In brief..she has Renal Failure, bladder and yeast infection as well as anemia. She has been on Clavamox, anti-fungle med,phosphorous binder(new),potassium, sub q's and appetite med. I will write more later.... but I have been up for days now and just trying to see if anyone has had this experience and what it was and also what the options or treatments were. She has lost a lot of weight from the kidney problem and has a very boney spine from high phosphorous. Since she has been home tonight...she is very alert and eating well.
The vet said we could try Epogen ( to increase her red blood cells and maybe strenght)but didn't seem very hopeful that it would help her legs. Her back paws are very pale and colder than the front paws. I have her on the puppy training pads since she can't walk on her own.
I am looking for anything this could be and treatment option...or to know if there is really nothing else I can do. This kitty has been through sooo much, but I never thought that her losing the use of her back legs would be the reason I would lose her. My vet doesn't seem to think there is anything else to do...other than trying Epogen because of her advanced Kidney Failure.
She can move around..in kind of a circle ..her front legs are fine. If I try to stand her up..her back half just falls to the side. She is now trying to pull herself across the floor and toes wiggled a little.
Any thoughts or ideas is greatly appreciated!!!!
Thanks,
My sweet Alley and Leslie

 

((((Leslie and Alley)))) I'm so sorry you are going through this. I don't have any suggestions but wanted to let you know that you both will be in my prayers.

I have read in other posts in the past that there are some others here whose babies can't walk but I don't remember who it was, hopefully they will see this and stop by soon.

 

Does she have any history of heart problems? If so, it could be a clot. There's a thing called a saddle thrombus, which is a clot that partially or completely blocks blood flow to the hind legs. That may or may not fit in with the legs being colder and paler then the front legs; Jess and Earl would probably have a better idea.

My Gwyn had a saddle thrombus in 2007 that left her hind legs not working for ~7 weeks. She did recover the ability to walk and was perfectly normal soon thereafter. We did have to put her on drugs for hypertension and anti-coagulants, in case she threw another clot.

ETA: here's a link to a post I made recently about some things we did to adapt to Gwyn's problems at the time (link here).

 

Even if it is not diabetic neuropathy, have you tried methyl-B12? This supplement helps any nerve condition because it is the vitamin nerves need the most to regenerate. I have not used it with my Oscar, but others have, so hopefully someone will chime in on how it is dosed. I have used it myself for nerve damage though.

 

here is the one I recommend:

http://www.vitacost.com/NSI-Vitamin-B-1 ... cobalamin/

simple to use - empty one capsule and mix into food daily

I like this one as it doesn't have sugars like many of the others in it - the only binder is rice flour and being a complex carb the bit that is in there didn't affect maui's bg's at all.

 

I agree about the possible clot, but also, was an xray done? Could she have twisted or hurt something during a jump?


Regarding the potassium, if she was low at the vet, she may need potassium (Tumil-K pills) every day. Tucker crashed in late March, he was completely limp, it looked like he had left me, but it was low potassium. We've kept him on the pills, 1.5pills BID and now we get the blood checked every few weeks, it's was low end, then a few weeks later normal, he maintains it at about 3.9 (when dx was 3.2 I think).

 

Leslie I'm so sorry to hear this. How is Alley feeling today? She is peeing and pooing on her own? How is her breathing?

This sounds like an arterial thrombo-embolism (ATE), aka saddle thrombus. If a clot forms in the heart, it goes into the aorta (where all blood goes to be distributed throughout the body). THe aorta is nice and big, so no clots get stuck there, but when the clot travels down to where the aorta branches off to feed the hind legs and tail, it can get stuck right at this junction. Tell-tale signs are acute paralysis and evidence of lack of blood flow (cold limbs, pale skin). If the clot dissolves (our bodies break down clots naturally) very soon afterward, movement is usually regained. If it takes a long time then there are two complications: one is that the nerves to the legs may have died from lack of blood flow, and so the cat may not walk or may not walk normally thereafter; the second is that all of the toxic waste products that could not be moved from the legs (b/c of lack of blood flow) can rush back into the rest of the body and cause problems. This is called re-perfusion syndrome One of the dangers is potassium, so if there is a rush of potassium into the blood it can cause irregular heart beats and other issues.

Do you have a cardiologist in your area? Do you think you could get her in today to be seen? If you tell them your cat is a suspected ATE they will try to fit you in. It is important to know if ALley has heart issues for several reasons: one, if her heart is big enough to make a clot, her risk of congestive heart failure is very high. Two, a cat at high risk of CHF should not get SQ fluids or steroids. Steroids can be very useful in treating spinal disk disease so this info would be helpful as you pursue other diagnostics.

If you don't have a cardiologist around, do you have a good ER with a critical-care specialist? Or in some towns w/o a cardiologist, an internist will do heart stuff.

 

Hi there,
If your vet determines this is not a saddle thrombus, and that it could be a pinched nerve, please send me a PM. My first diabetic became paralyzed due to an advanced form of arthritis called spondylosis. The board helped me out greatly with ideas and things to do for him. He went from being paralyzed to paraplegic, and, had he not ultimately had a stroke, I feel he was pretty close to regaining the use of his legs. First things first, though. She does need to see a vet immediately in the instance that it is a clot.
Sending you much love,
((((hugs))))
..C

 

I cant say what is wrong, though many ideas have been presented for you to look into. I certainly hope one of the first things your vet checked for was a clot and ruled that out. Of course ruling out any bloodwork that could be causing it is important.

My Latte had a similar episode a few weeks ago. She has arthritis and apparently a back issue now. I put her down after fluids one day and she walked a little wobbly in the back legs. After a few steps she started walking sideways (just as you described). It was terribly scary. Eventually she couldnt walk. She scooted herself on her side. By far one of the hardest things to watch.

We did xrays after the vet checked for a clot. Xrays showed she had nothing left between the last to vertebrae to protect each other from rubbing. It was also thought she tweaked something really bad. I set up an area in the house with litter box, food, water, and harder surface bed all in one spot (of course next to my bed, which I put on the floor to be close). I gave bupe 3x/day, spoon fed, held water up to her mouth...anything to keep her still. It was very scary, because I knew if she could not start walking again in the next few days I would have to set her free.

In a couple days she was fully capable of using her LB, walking to her regular water bowl and even eating a little from regular bowl on her own. She walked around a little, but I really had to discourage it. She was still very wobbly and could often only take a few steps at a time before falling over.

This was maybe 3-4 weeks ago? She can still be wobbly, especially after taking her out of her carrier...she starts the sideways walking for a dozen steps or so. She struggles walking on soft surfaces (like beds) and can easily fall over. She now prefers to lay on hard surfaces, like the floor..over her normal beds. I dont blame her. She sits funny - legs wide. If she tries to sit like a normal cat (legs together), she cant get her butt all the way to the ground. Occassionally she tries a little jump up or down something and it can be hit or miss as to how that works out. I really dont let her do it if I can catch it.

My vet was terribly puzzled when i brought her in (actually 4 vets), until they got the xrays back. So if your vet can rule out other things related to clots and blood work disturbances....make sure to get an xray.

Good luck. I know it is one of the most heartbreaking things to watch our kitties not be able to do anything for themselves. In fact, for me...of all the stuff we have gone through...its by far THE WORST. I hope it can get better for yours.

 

Thank you soo much JJ& Gwyn!! You are always sooo helpful!! She did go into a diabetic coma and then had a heart attack about 15 mins after I had found her. I had just gotten her to the vet at the time she had the heart attack and they did bring her back. I have not been told she has any heart problems when they listen to her heart...they have said everything was fine.

When I found her the other night she seemed out of it....at that time she had not been able to use her legs for about 1 1/2 days but her back legs were getting weak and wobbley a couple days before that. When I picked her up that night...she kind of gasped like she did when I had found her in a coma, but she was alert...I mean eyes open but kind of sluggish and out of it. I first thought ..oh noo she is having another heart attack but then I sat her down and she seemed fine as far as breathing. She did start to quickly look down at the ground as if she was watching something move but there was nothing there. That only lasted for a few seconds and I thought she was just trying to wake up. She was very weak from dehydration and somewhat low potassium but had been to the dr that day(Thurs) and the day before. The vet said he wanted to wait till the next day(Friday) to see if she improved with more sub q's since I had reduced them the prior month.
It was around 2:30 am Fri ( didn't want to wait till the morning because it just seemed to get worse)when I took her back to the er vet and she stayed there till last night (Fri) till about 8:00pm. When I took her into the vet I didn't even tell them anything about the gasp or her looking around quickly for those few seconds.. I had told them that I had tested her BG ealier that night and it was 66...which was very low for her but then I feed her and it went up to 150. I had called the vet that evening right after I took her bg and they said the vet would call back if he thought he need to, but I didn't get a call back and I thought that was probably because her level went back up.I had not been testing her bg levels for several months because she had been stable since Dec. But I did that night after the vet because when her diabeties had been unstable after the coma...her back legs got wobbley at that time. But never where she didn't walk.

At 1st we thought maybe it was from the low potassium but it is normal since being in the hospital again. Now, I am thinking that maybe she did have a sezure or it was low bg that caused this. Did your cat have a couple of days where she could walk but very badly or was it all at once? Did the vet give her anything for the strombus? Alley has seen several vets but the er vet that was there in the middle of the night was not very helpful at all and just seemed to tell me..that she is not going to get better and I should put her down!! That really upset me...because Alley has come back from everything..a coma, heart attack where shee died, diabeties etc and that vet was just RUDE. She actually told me I was grasping at straws!! All the other vet at this specialty vet..have been great!! I am going to send a letter about that night. The other 2 vet vets she saw didn't say there was a way to check for strombus..is there?? He said that he just thought it... could have been a serzure, a disc problem or the aniema. They said the only way to check for a disc is an MRI....which they would not opertate on her..so that is not something to do. They said that an xray would not show a clot..is that right??

When I got her home last night after about 2 hrs...she did get up and walk about 10 steps but VERY wobbley and to the side..then she fell down and hasn't walked since. She is still able to move around in a circle. I will do the massage on her legs. Her legs are very boney and almost fell like there isn't any muscle there anymore. Will the phosphous binder help that get better? I have been an absolute mess since this has happened!! It is soo hard to watch her not be able to walk, but she is alert and seems fine otherwise. It has helped a lot to read this and know not to give up yet...and that there is a chance she could get her legs back as several people have said on here!! I have stopped crying for a few hrs now .

The bed you made...way it just foam on the side..or all over and built up on the sides to help keep them upright?
Also did your cat have cold back feet and pale? I was not told that a clot could go away...or that they could get their legs back!!

 

Thanks so much!! They did put Alley on potassium at the hospital and I am giving her potassium at home. Her potssium level is now normal but legs are still not working.

 

She was at an ER Specialist. She had an Endocriologist which she saw when she was walking wobbley but he is not back in til mon. I will take her back there then. I am suppose to talk too the other er vet today but he put her med to increase her red blood cells.

 

Thank you for the info....and NO..they did not do an xray!! I am really upset that I am reading on here that they should have!! They had her on fluids and potassium at the hospital. She is home and we started her on Epogen to increase her red blood cells and strenght, but that will take several days before it even starts to work. she seems fine except for the back legs still, but she is alert and eating. I think she has only urinated 1-2 x's today.

 

Should this be b-1 or b-12. Can I get this at the Health food store??

 

Thank you sooo much!! This was extremely helpful!! No they did not do an xray!! What is Bupe?? They just said it could be a clot, disc, aniema, or arthritis and started her on Epcogen for the aniema. Sounds like she needs an xray and I am about to explode on the Vet's that saw her!!
You are right this is by far the worst to watch her go through!!!!!!!! After getting on here today and reading all the experiences ...I have not cried the past 4 hrs, don't feel so bad about her being on a wee wee pad, have more strenght for myself and have hope that she could walk again after some time. Please all response's to everyone on here. I written a lot of different things to everyone and I think the response to JJ & Gwyn has a lot of info in it!!
Thank you so much!!

 

Hi Leslie --

> Thank you soo much JJ& Gwyn!! You are always sooo helpful!! She did go into a diabetic coma
> and then had a heart attack about 15 mins after I had found her. I had just gotten her to the
> vet at the time she had the heart attack and they did bring her back. I have not been told she
> has any heart problems when they listen to her heart...they have said everything was fine.

When they listen to Alley's heart, they're listening for things like how strong it is and how fast it's beating and whether they hear a murmur, etc. The ability to throw clots is often completely unsuspected until it actually happens. In our case, while we knew that Gwyn had had a mild, intermittent heart murmur since she was 4 months old, we didn't know she was having major heart problems until after her fourth stroke. We brought Gwyn to an oncologist for something else entirely, and the oncologist referred us to a cardiologist for a work-up.

The cardiologist took one look at Gwyn's extended medical history, did an ultrasound of her heart, and said that the 'weird neurological meltdowns' she'd been having were probably strokes and that the two months of hind-limb paralysis was almost certainly a saddle thrombus. We'd seen a *lot* of specialists in the intervening years, and this was the only one that could offer any explanation at all for what was happening with Gwyn. (In defense of the specialists we saw, Gwyn almost always managed to present her problems with atypical symptoms, and she generally responded somewhat atypically to treatment.)

But the down-side of not getting the saddle thrombus diagnosed until 18 months after it occured was that by then Gwyn had recovered the ability to walk on her own. I've no idea whether there's any treatment that we could have done at the time to increase her chances or speed the recovery; we did it all alone.

If Alley were my cat, I'd take Jess' advice:

If it is a saddle thrombus, it's possible that Alley will recover on her own, but there may be something a cardiologist can do to increase her chances. And, unfortunately, you should know that not all cats *do* recover the ability to walk. However, given that Alley was able to make some effort earlier today, I'd be very hopeful.

In addition to the ultrasound, the cardiologist can prescribe medication to reduce the possibility of Alley throwing more clots in the future. Jess has always advocated very highly for board-certified cardiologists; you can find them on this site here. Again, tell them that your cat has a suspected ATE (saddle thrombus) and see if they can fit you in that day.


> [lots of stuff about exactly what happened with Alley goes here]

This isn't what happened with Gwyn but, as I said, Gwyn tends to present with atypical symptoms. Gwyn had had a couple of previous strokes at the time, both of which had affected her left side and her ability to walk. She fully recovered from those. When the thrombus occured, I first thought it was another of her 'weird neurological meltdowns' (which is what I had taken to calling them, in the absence of any diagnosis from the host of specialists we'd taken Gwyn to). It wasn't until a couple hours in that I realised that Gwyn wasn't just having trouble walking, but that she *couldn't* walk -- couldn't even stand.


> Did your cat have a couple of days where she could walk but very badly or was it all at once?
> Did the vet give her anything for the strombus?

It hit Gwyn around 2am. I had a huge debate with myself over whether to bring her in to the emergency vet, or wait until 7.30am when my regular vet opened. Given Gwyn's extremely complicated medical history at that point, I opted to wait. Our vet fit us in immediately and ran a bunch of tests, but didn't manage to reach a diagnosis. So there was some generic treatment stuff (I don't remember what, but I'd guess fluids, steroids, painkillers, etc), but nothing specific to help dissolve the clot. It's possible that if this had been diagnosed that night, there might have been some treatment available and Gwyn might have recovered quicker; I don't know.


> Alley has seen several vets but the er vet that was there in the middle of the night was not very helpful
> at all and just seemed to tell me..that she is not going to get better and I should put her down!! That
> really upset me...because Alley has come back from everything..a coma, heart attack where shee died,
> diabeties etc and that vet was just RUDE. She actually told me I was grasping at straws!!

I've had that, and most of the time it turned out that the vet was wrong: Gwyn *did* manage to recover. Of course, you have to balance that with the possibility that the vet *isn't* wrong and what kind of quality of life Alley will have if the vet's right. For every person, striking that balance comes out at a different place.


> All the other vet at this specialty vet..have been great!! I am going to send a letter about that night.
> The other 2 vet vets she saw didn't say there was a way to check for strombus..is there??

Honestly, I don't know. As I said, we didn't actually know it was a clot until 18 months later, when the cardiologist went over Gwyn's history and took all sorts of assorted weirdnesses (both ailments and behaviours) and wove it into a cohesive whole. And when I went and did research on what he said, it was like getting hit in the head with a board: everything he pulled together *was* symptomatic of the specific heart problems Gwyn had, *and* he predicted some of the difficulties Gwyn faced in the future (a need for lower amounts of sub-Q fluids, risks of anesthesia, possibility of future strokes, etc).


> He said that he just thought it... could have been a serzure, a disc problem or the aniema. They
> said the only way to check for a disc is an MRI....which they would not opertate on her..so that
> is not something to do. They said that an xray would not show a clot..is that right??

I don't *think* a clot would show up on an x-ray, though again, Jess would be the best person to answer that. At least one of the other folks in this thread has suggested that it might be a disc problem, so that seems like that could be a possibility and that the paleness and coldness of the hind limbs is a coincidence. An extended seizure *can* cause neurological problems, but were you with Alley before all this started? If you're around when a seizure occurs, it's usually pretty obvious. I know nothing about anemia in cats, so I can't comment on that possibility.


> When I got her home last night after about 2 hrs...she did get up and walk about 10 steps but VERY
> wobbley and to the side..then she fell down and hasn't walked since. She is still able to move around
> in a circle.

The fact that she could stand and walk on her own is *very* encouraging. Does she have movement in her tail??

When Gwyn had her strokes, she could only move in a forward direction by walking semi-sideways and with her body curled around to the right; that sounds kinda similar to Alley being able to go in circles.


> I will do the massage on her legs. Her legs are very boney and almost fell like there isn't any
> muscle there anymore. Will the phosphous binder help that get better?

I honestly have no idea. I don't think we ever used phosphorus on Gwyn.


> I have been an absolute mess since this has happened!! It is soo hard to watch her not be able to
> walk, but she is alert and seems fine otherwise.

That was pretty much always my criteria: as long as Gwyn was alert, had her own personality, wasn't unhappy and wasn't in pain, I figured everything else was something we would either deal with or work around.


> It has helped a lot to read this and know not to give up yet...and that there is a chance she
> could get her legs back as several people have said on here!! I have stopped crying for a few hrs now .

I wasn't at all sure that Gwyn would ever walk again, but we were lucky and she did. (The picture of her in my icon was taken during the saddle thrombus paralysis; she started walking about ten days later.)


> The bed you made...way it just foam on the side..or all over and built up on the sides to help
> keep them upright?

The bed I made was just a foam pad to put beneath her, no sides at all. (If you get an egg-crate mattress, the cones go upward, to prevent too much pressure residing on any one spot. You still need to rotate Alley, though.) To prop Gwyn up to eat and drink, I have a small, very under-stuffed pillow that was easy to moosh into whatever shape I needed.

In my post in the other thread, I mentioned lying Gwyn on her side on a towel in the litterbox, so she could do her business without pressure on her abdomen. I should note that, by this time, we weren't using a normal size litterbox. We were using a litterbox that was actually made for miniature dogs here. Benefits prior to the thrombus (after two other strokes) included a very wide lowered lip across the front, so that Gwyn was able to get inside much more easily, and a wider footprint so that she could take a wide stance to keep herself balanced, yet not step in used litter. The benefit of this box after the saddle thrombus was that we could easily lay her on her side in the box, leaving her butt over the side of the towel, and yet still not have to prop her against the hard side of the litterbox.

(I'll say ahead of time that pressure sores were a terrible concern to me. I've worked in nursing homes and seen how bad they can be and how difficult they can make life -- and a cat has less positions that you can prop a body into so that the sores can heal. And human diabetics sometimes have problems healing sores like that, and Gwyn was immune-suppressed -- I was absolutely *terrified* of pressure sores. I don't know how reasonable a fear it was, but I definitely had it ... )


> Also did your cat have cold back feet and pale? I was not told that a clot could go away...or
> that they could get their legs back!!

I don't remember Gwyn's legs being cold or pale -- but at the time, I didn't know to check for these things, so I might well have missed that if it occured.

I can't think of anything else to add at the moment, except {{hugs)) to you, and please give Alley some ear scritches from me --

Jean and her Gwyn

 

> Should this be b-1 or b-12. Can I get this at the Health food store??

That's the methyl form of B-12. You may be able to find it at a health food store or a more organically-focussed grocery store. Make sure to read the ingredients; the much more common version contains cyanocobalamin as it's main ingredient. You want the type of methylcobalamin as it's main ingredient. IIRC, the one that Hillary uses doesn't have any odd 'filler' ingredients that might cause problems in some cats (can't remember whether it's xylitol, sorbitol or mannitol that you need to worry about; I just try to avoid all of them).


ETA: And "bupe" is buprenex, a very effective painkiller. (My favorite painkiller of all-time for the myriad of problems that Gwyn had.)

 

How can I post a reply..like you did after every pharagraph? I seem to have to qoute everytime.

 

Thank you everyone for all the Great info!! I am sooo frustruated with the info I recieved at the vet..so this has helped a lot and I will go over everything with her regular vet on Mon. If anyone doesn't mind talking on the phone about ...Please send me a pm and what time zone you are in..with your phone number...as my acess is very limited to the computer right now!! And...also I can talk much faster than I can type which would allow a much better response time for me and more time w/Alley. I also have Verizon ...if that helps anyone with mins etc.

 

To Everyone.......Can they tell if there is a clot from an xray? I am confused on this...it sounds like they can, but then some have said they can't. How was a clot found from those who experienced Thrombus?

 

> How can I post a reply..like you did after every pharagraph? I seem to have to qoute everytime.

It's just a habit from my mailing list days. I frequently want to respond to different points of a post, and it's easier for me to keep track of what I'm doing if I address each point separately. I think it's also easier for the reader to understand what I'm responding to.

If you use this board's quote function, you can edit the bits that you want to quote, but adding a close-quote marker [/quote] after the first point you want to respond to, and then putting an open-quote marker

 

I have always been told a clot is an emergency. So if you think that is what is happening, going to the ER now would be important.
I just cant believe if you had her at the vets they would not have checked for it as one of the first things.

The 2 times this has happened to Latte, its the first thing they checked for. They did a lot of wierd tests to her (kinda hanging her strangely and tapping different areas). They rule out clot, do bw to rule out things such as potassium (latte also has multiple health conditions, incl crf), they *try* to rule out neuro stuff...but always had a hard time. The xrays are then what revealed the spine issue and it came clear as a bell.

Do you have an er near you? Your kitty could be in pain from whatever this is. At least they can give you something to help with that. Also to rule out a clot.

I hope you guys are doing ok.

Thinking of you.

 

after the first point you want to respond to, and then putting an open-quote marker

 

>This is the frustrating thing....Alley was at the ER Vet and stayed overnight!! And they were saying that there is no way to tell for sure if it is a clot!! He was moving her legs around and said that she didn't seem to be in any pain. They said that to check for a disc problem, I would need to do an MRI and that they wouldn't operate on her...sooo there is reason to do it. But your saying that an xray showed a spine problem.

Alley does not seem to be in any pain. I have been moving her legs around so that they don't get stiff. She is eating and alert .

Did Latte ever have a clot or was it a spine issue both times? Did they give her any medicine that helped bring her lags back or did it just happen in time?
I can't wait to talk to her regular vet tomorrow and they should also have a cardiologist there also.
Thank you for all your help!!!!