Chaos - diagnosed 3.5 weeks ago

Hello!


My name is Valerie and I am mom to a 13 year old Maine Coon (I think) rescue named Chaos. He is truly the love of my life (sorry husband and other 4 cats!) I wanted a cat my entire childhood, but my parents wouldn't allow one. As soon as I got my first apartment the summer before my third year of college, I jumped at the chance to FINALLY get a kitty! He was so tiny that I could hold him with one hand, and he would eventually grow into a pretty huge cat- 18 lbs. Unfortunately, even though he wasn't grossly overweight, I know this contributed to his diagnosis of diabetes 3.5 weeks ago. Since then, I have been dedicating every ounce of energy I have to treating him. I have nightmares about him dying and frequently wake up in the middle of the night to check on him (fortunately, he sleeps right next to me.)

I noticed the changes in him about a year ago. He had been losing weight for a while and was feeling bony (especially his spine.) By January, he was down to 12 lbs. I took him to the vet insisting that something wasn't right, but they did a bunch of tests for diabetes, hyperthyroid, etc. and told me that he was fine. Deep down I knew that he wasn't, but I'm not the doctor, so I waited. About a month ago, he tried to jump onto the bed from the pet stairs (it's not a huge leap!) and failed and slid down to the floor. Combined with how he felt, I knew something was VERY wrong. I weighed him on my scale and found that he was down to 10.5 lbs. (he ended up 11 at the doc the next day) and FREAKED OUT. He went straight back to the vet, where he actually lay in my arms while we waited for the doc. This is not a cat who ever sat still when there was exploring to do! Fortunately (I guess?) the doc found the diabetes this time, but it sounds like she only did a simple glucose test- not fructosamine or whatever other in depth tests there are. She sent us on our way with an order for Lantus insulin- 2 units per day, which I immediately thought was weird to just inject without testing (I have diabetic friends and they would never do that!) So I only gave him 1 unit and ordered a glucose meter. Boy am I glad I did! The vet hadn't warned me that switching him to canned food (Friskies and Fancy Feast classic pates only- he won't touch Merrick, Evo, or any of the higher end stuff) would cause a change, and did it ever! We had a Karo emergency within the first few days. 1/2 unit was too much sometimes, and now he can't even have 1/4 of a unit consistently without going hypo (which I'm sure isn't being helped by the fact that he isn't eating much lately, despite being spoon fed at 6 AM if that's what it takes!)

I took the vet his glucose log (which is VERY detailed because I'm a little insane) yesterday and she instructed me to take him off the insulin and only test him every month. I am so confused at this point. My vet makes me feel like I am a helicopter cat parent for testing him often and being so worried about his levels. She also keeps pushing the "prescription diet," including the dry food (even though she told me that the recommendation for carbs is <7% in that same conversation... it makes me wonder if she knows about nutrition or just pushes the prescription diet because it's easy/profitable. I can't afford to feed all 5 of my cats the prescription canned food, even if I wanted to!) I am here in hopes that you will help me determine if I am crazy or if I need a new vet, and, if so, find some recommendations.

Please know that this site and board have been INDISPENSABLE during this process. Although I haven't posted, I have been lurking and reading, and you have all helped me so much already. So if you are still reading by now, thank you all so much. You are likely helping so many more people than those who post!

-Valerie


3 of the 5:
Bruce Wayne - 5 years old, found as a stray, HATES canned food and is super annoying about the new feeding schedule <3 The only one who hasn't transitioned to canned yet.
Chaos - 13 years old, my baby, adopted from a high kill shelter as a kitten
Apollo - 8 year old flame point Siamese rescue, VERY finicky about food but is obviously not starving!

 

What beautiful kitties. My Oliver was a Maine Coon - they are such sweet hearts. It sounds like you have made great progress, educating yourself without a whole lot of help from your vet.

No, no prescription food. Other than a high price tag, there is nothing prescription about it. The ingredients are no better and are often worse than OTC food. I imagine you have seen this site by a vet in your lurking: www.catinfo.org. Not eating results in lower levels. Rather than no insulin, I'd work on getting some food in this boy. What have you tried? Many cats love warm water mixed in with the pate to make a gravy. Some people have success crumbling the treats on top: PureBites and Bonito Flakes are low carb favorites at my house. Have you tried FortiFlora? It's a probiotic that has the animal digest in dry food, the thing that makes it so irrestible.

What insulin are you using? Have you seen our color coded spreadsheet? It's a great tool that we can access easily.

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/

It sounds like you have already decided about your vet's knowledge level. One thing we say is " would you shoot your child with insulin without checking their blood glucose level first? Well, my cat is my child." A pre shot test is vital and the mid cycle number let's you know how the dose is working. Curves done at home are invaluable. The vet who did the food website has a saying "giving insulin without testing is like driving down the freeway with a bag over your head"

My vet and I did not agree on food. But I liked her and needed her for daily care, so we agreed to disagree and just didn't talk about food.

If you want, share some of your numbers with us. We generally consider a cat regulated if they are in the lower 200s at pre shot and double digits at nadir but not below 50, which is approaching hypo territory. Once they are there, then we start fine tuning the dose until they are in remission: 40-120 off insulin.

 

Hi Sue! Sounds like your Oliver was a lot like my Chaos with the heart problems and diabetes! Thank you for the reply. It's really comforting to know that others understand what I'm going through!

I have been to catinfo.org- even printed out the list and marked all of my food cans with the carb %s so I would know which were best for him depending on his reading! I admit that's a little insane, but it actually helped my stress levels that day!

I have tried adding warm water to the pate, but he still just licks it up and leaves the bulk behind. He does like Pure Bites, so I went out on my lunch break and picked up some chicken and duck (more calories!) in the dog section since it's cheaper per oz. there! I will have to try the bonito and fortiflora as well.

Every weekend that I have tried to do a curve at home, he has gone hypo on Saturday and it got all screwed up! Hypo on 1/4 unit is a very scary thing! I am definitely planning to complete the spreadsheet when I get home this evening- that stuff is right up my alley! I'm also interested to see what his glucose is at 36 hours with no insulin. I hope this wasn't the wrong choice. I am so scared of screwing up his chances for remission!

 

Love the picture and bet Dr. Lisa would too (the vet with the website). Sure looks like you have done your homework!

Depending on the insulin, there are ways to do drops or 0.1 units of insulin if needed. If it isn't one of the depot insulins like Lantus or Levemir, you can "chase" the number, giving insulin as needed off the normal 12/12 schedule.

When you get your spreadsheet up, we can explore some possible options.

 

Hi Valerie, welcome! Chaos is just gorgeous, aren't Maine Coons, the best?! My parents have their second MC now, goodness they are massive.

I love how organised you are with your food - I went shopping a bought a heap today (my Ivana hasn't eaten tinned cat food in years so I had no idea... one of every flavour!) and my mission today is to do as you've done and mark each tin with the carb value. It makes me feel better to be organised, sounds like you're the same

 

She said that she had been giving Lantus, but no more at the advice of the vet.

 

Didn't want you guys to think I disappeared, but Chaos went to the ER last night and is spending a second night there tonight. When I got home from work yesterday, I couldn't get him to eat or go outside (he just likes to run out onto the patio and roll around.) He refused to leave our bed. When I picked him up and put him on the floor, he went right back up the pet stairs to lie down in the bed again. He was so bony feeling that DH and I panicked and drove him 45 min. (really just on the other side of the city but in the tail end of rush hour traffic) to the best emergency vet in town (PVSEC.) After a really painful night not knowing what it was going to be, it turns out he has acute pancreatitis, which was actually the best diagnosis we could hope for- especially since he now has a diabetes specialist.

I will update again as soon as I can- I still want to post my spreadsheet and learn so I can help others like the rest of you do- even if he stays food controlled (which I am not sure will be good enough when he starts eating larger amounts of food again!)

 

Good wishes for you and Chaos.
{{hugs}}

 

Oh Chaos, best wishes to you. Hope you're holding up ok Valerie.

 

Thank you all so much for the kind words, but Chaos passed away on 9/13. He was diagnosed with fatty liver disease and acute/chronic pancreatitis and we were awaiting results of some tests on the fluid they found in his abdomen, but the ER allowed us to bring him home on a trial basis as long as we could give him a few pills (duh at this point!) and feed him a bland diet. But the morning after we brought him home from the ER, he went into shock and we rushed him back to the ER. The ER vet said the fluid in his abdomen was sepsis and he had a very small chance of survival, even with multiple blood transfusions and $10k worth of surgery due to his multiple complications which included the heart condition. I couldn't ask him to fight anymore and made the worst decision of my life. I can't really type any more without crying at work, so that's all for now. Thank you all so much for your help.

 

So sorry to hear Valerie, hugs to you

 

So sorry for your loss

 

Requiem aeternum, Chaos.
{{hugs}}

 

I am so sorry. He is not suffering any longer.
God bless his journey, and yours.