Diabetic cat hasn't eaten since breakfast yesterday - Help??

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (The Main Forum)' started by Justyn, Oct 3, 2016.

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  1. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

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    Heard From Jenna on FB. She is willing to help. I told her Justyn had sent her an e-mail and gave her the link for this thread. Don't give up @Justyn
     
  2. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

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    I think Jenna (DCIN) is now in touch with Justyn.

    Sending lots of prayers and healing energy for Socks and many many :bighug: :bighug: :bighug: for Justyn
     
  3. Ollie

    Ollie New Member

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    :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
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  4. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Bless you Mary Ann for helping get Socks the care he needs.:bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug: Fingers and toes all crossed and prayers said for Socks.
     
  5. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

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    The last update Jenna gave me about 1/2 hour ago was

    "She is at the vet now and trying to get a ride to a 24-hr vet"
     
  6. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

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    Just to let everyone following this thread know that DCIN will be setting up a fund raiser on their FB page for Socks and other kitties. With Socks, they now have 3 kitties in DKA that they are helping out with.
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2016
  7. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:

    Will keep watching for updates.
     
  8. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    So... update... Sock's was at the vet all day, and I got the call that he really hadn't improved much and vet urged to take him to an ER... Absolutely out of the question with finances... BUT to my absolute disbelief, THE AMAZING PEOPLE of Diabetic Cats in Need (DCIN) has not only accepted me as a case, but Socks is right now in a 24hr care - because of them! I am truly blessed as after the vet had called me to explain he hadn't gotten much better at all.. I am SO thankful for everyone on this forum who helped me get socks the care he needed. I wish I had known sooner about DCIN, as I couldnt afford the care last night but may have with them. I can't thank you all enough and will keep you all posted about how Socks is doing!
     
  9. Marje and Gracie

    Marje and Gracie Well-Known Member

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    I am just now seeing this as well and i’m glad you got him into 24 hour care. With ketones that high, you cannot treat it at home. He absolutely must be in the hospital and receive IV fluids, fast acting insulins, meds for nausea, etc.

    Sending many vines and prayers for your boy.
     
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  10. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for the update. I am SO glad you were able to get a hold of Jenna and DCIN. They are indeed a godsend. Now Socks will have a real fighting chance of recovering from this DKA.

    Sending tons and tons of prayers and healing energy.:bighug: :bighug: :bighug: :bighug: :bighug:
     
  11. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    So happy he is receiving care. Yes DCIN is indeed amazing. Please keep up updated. We all worry as if he was ours too.
     
  12. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    I am so overwhelmed still by the generosity of DCIN.. I would not have my sweet babe alive if it weren't for them.. Going to visit later tonight to see how he's doing but I can't begin to describe the level of expertise at this 24hr ER vet vs the local humane society I had been taking him to for his prior DKA.... I know he truly is in good hands, and this is the first time I've been able to breathe and relax since Sunday night... Eternally grateful for all that told me about DCIN and grateful for DCIN of course...
     
  13. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

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    Thank you so much for the update on Socks. The ER vet is definitely the best place to treat DKA and I am so glad DCIN was able to step in and help. They are truly an amazing organization.

    Sending more prayers and healing energy for Socks and lots of :bighug: :bighug: :bighug: :bighug: for you.
     
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  14. Squalliesmom

    Squalliesmom Well-Known Member

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    Sending prayers and healing thoughts for Socks, and (((hugs))) for you. Hurray for DCIN!!! :bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
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  15. yukon25

    yukon25 Member

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    Me and the cats are praying for you and Socks.
     
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  16. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

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    For everyone following this posting DCIN now has Sock's fundraiser posted on their FB page if anyone can help. They are currently trying to get funds for 3 DKA kitties.
     
  17. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Thank you SO, SO very much... I have been so overwhelmed today and somehow wasn't notified of your updates! But I appreciate your help and kindness and caring!

    &

    Yes I am so glad we didn't have to try anything to cause more harm to him as we would have possibly to avoid putting him down.. As I love him so much, I didn't want to be giving him the bare minimum and just truly wished I listened to the advise of DCIN when suggested last night - as he may have been able to have this care even sooner.

    This is the biggest blessing I may have ever had. DCIN saved my sweet boy, Socks. Thank you all for all the prayers, as in combination of mine may have made this even an option for our little family. We are going to visit Socks tonight and will post updates... Cannot be more thankful for finding Feline Diabetes to have found DCIN, otherwise there would have been no way I would have known. Thank you all so very much..
     
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  18. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Sending more prayers and :bighug::bighug::bighug:.


    Mogs
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  19. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    Prayers and hugs to your family. :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
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  20. Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey

    Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey Well-Known Member

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    {{{Justyn}}}

    I'm so glad DCIN accepted you and Socks is getting the necessary care. You have a lot of people pulling for Socks here. Our vines are very powerful (it's a slang term for vibes). My kitty Cinco was in really, really bad shape with DKA early in his FD battle, and he pulled through. Socks can, too. Hang in there!
    :bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
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  21. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Thank you everyone..

    Just got home from visiting Socks.. he's looking quite more awake, cognitive, and relaxed. Can't help but think I am so lucky to see him like this as it could have been so much worse, and the vet agreed he's quite doing better. Unfortunately, his blood tests had come back a bit odd.. Kidney levels were a bit elevated (not much) - but vet thinking just could be dehydration. Also, he was low on Phosphorus (I'm pretty sure that's what it was) - but vet said she would just start giving some slowly but nothing she made too much concern about. We are blessed to be able to have an Ultrasound tomorrow so will find out more about the kidneys but vet is thinking possible pancreatitis so will see with the Ultrasound. Glad to see his head up and eyes moving around though and praying for some good results and a speedy recovery!
     
  22. Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey

    Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey Well-Known Member

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    Are you sure it isn't the potassium that's low? That's what often happens when kitties get very dedydrated, and they have to go slowly in bringing it up so as not to go too far.

    I'm delighted to hear he's looking so much better. Maybe you'll be able to get a good night's sleep tonight!
     
  23. donnalea

    donnalea Member

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    Sending prayers for socks and his parents.
     
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  24. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    I agree but yes confirmed with the vet this morning that the Phosphorus levels were a bit low.. And I truly got a good night's sleep for the first time in several days... Feel like a new person and called the vet this morning, Sock's is definitely doing better, head is up and moving around, eyes are open he's absolutely cognitive! Can't wait to see him after work! Miss him already but so glad to see him doing better.
     
  25. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Great update about Socks!

    Try to get as much quality rest as possible while Socks is being taken care of at the hospital, Justyn.


    Mogs
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  26. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    upload_2016-10-5_10-24-16.png Socks right after getting to ER vet

    upload_2016-10-5_10-24-40.png Socks a few hours later after ER vet, he was stickin his leg up so i could pet his belly so he truly was even feeling better last night.
     
  27. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    Wonderful to hear how well he is doing. Good luck with ultrasound. Wonderful pictures.
     
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  28. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Yes i am truly taking advantage of the peace that DCIN has given us... To not be worrying constantly, knowing he's in good care (instead of bringing him home/half-a$$ing it) makes all the difference..
     
  29. Capoo

    Capoo Member

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    Jan 15, 2016
    And that's great that you have some time for yourself: you can improve your knowledge of diabetes, of DKA, so that it will never happen again.
    By the way, have you spoken to the vet about the insulin you're currently using and its dosage?
     
  30. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    I'm so glad that things are moving forward for you and Socks. Crossing fingers that it continues.
     
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  31. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Yes I completely agree.. We have a phone meeting with their Internal Medicine to all discuss why this could have happened, etc. Yes the vet has his notebook that I'd recorded every dose, BG reading, and food intake SINCE diagnosis - they loved it. But they have been keeping him on a short acting insulin to keep his BG lower as with the Prozinc it was maintaining around 400-500, but theyve gotten him down to 200s with short acting. We'll find out more with internal medicine!
     
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  32. Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey

    Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey Well-Known Member

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    I am so delighted to see that Socks is doing better. Once he is home again, keep in mind that he will be at risk for ketones for some time, so you'll need to check him daily, at least. Hopefully you'll get his insulin dosage sorted out and get him into better numbers regularly, so it won't be as much of a risk.

    I'm glad you got some good sleep. If you're not in good shape, you won't be able to care for Socks properly when he comes home. I hope your DF (Dear Fiance) still has his job (even though his boss is a jerk).

    Sending lots of healing vines and prayers!
     
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  33. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Trust me when I say I've learned my lesson.. Checking for ketones is so easy.. it would be no problem at all... And I am sleeping so good and finally relaxed at work... it's hard though because I miss him so much and just anxious for him to get better.. We have an internal med consultation so I'm hoping that helps clarify with this happened and how we can prevent this.. ER vet said earlier it's looking like he will definitely need another day there as he is still very weak and numbers are a bit crazy.,
     
  34. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    If he needs to stay so be it. The healthier he is when he comes home is better.

    What happened with fiance job? So hope it's not lost.
     
  35. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Yes i completely agree... Just so upset as Socks has no interest in food still...

    But actually, his manager had a meeting with him and b*tched at him about lots of other things (including being gone) but luckily he still has a job, and that's all we can ask for... Would have been a very upsetting day otherwise. This manager of him spent more time picking on him about using the bathroom? unbelievable - we know we need to find him a new job... we are lucky he still has it though,
     
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  36. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    Glad to hear he still has a job. The bathroom, seriously?????? When you gotta go you gotta go!! I'd have a real problem then since my BP med has a diuretic property.

    If he should need off again, I'd call in sick and not say why.
     
  37. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Exactly, completely agreed. Absolutely craziness
     
  38. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Don't let them try to send Socks home too early (a classic cause of relapse that we see here - too often for comfort). Socks really needs to be stable and eating properly before they consider discharging him to your care. (More about this below.)

    It might be helpful for you to read over the posts by member Meya14 on the following thread about Taro, a small kitty with similar sounding issues during his recent treatment for ketones (especially the part about 'brittle' diabetics and their very specific food and insulin requirements). Meya is extremely knowledgeable about ketones and DKA.

    http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/vets-cant-stabilize-glucose-levels.165787/

    Socks may very well need fairly aggressive anti-nausea support. Unless for some very unsual reason they're contraindicated, the vets should be giving him Cerenia AND ondansetron. The Cerenia acts fairly quickly but wears off quickly. The ondansetron can take a day or two to reach clinically effective levels but seems, at least in my experience, to exert a more powerful and longer-lasting anti-nausea benefit.

    Appetite stimulants can also help. Cyproheptadine is gentler than mirtazapine and it does not carry the risk of inducing serotonin syndrome. It is easier to dose cyproheptadine more accurately. It does need to be given 2-3 times a day (some cats will take it ground up in a little food; ditto with the ondansetron - dosed twice a day).

    NB - if there is any chance Socks might be constipated that can also cause nausea - and if that's a factor you need to address the constipation side of things before the standard anti-nausea treatments will have any chance of working. A few doses of metoclopramide (Reglan) can help restore regular gut motility in these circumstances. (NB: Metoclopramide has an unpleasant side effect profile so cannot be used long term. Also, other than getting things moving again metoclopramide provides little or no effectiveness in reducing a cat's feelings of nausea because cats don't have many of the receptors upon which it works - source: IDEXX treatment guidelines for pancreatitis.)

    Make arrangements with the vets to issue you with prescriptions for anti-nausea and appetite stimulant meds to take home with you so that you'll have the tools to hand to help Socks at home promptly should the need arise.


    Mogs
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    Last edited: Oct 8, 2016
  39. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Oh! The wonders of a world in thrall to predatory, Randian laissez-faire capitalism ...

    You should check out the Guardian's investigation into the utterly appalling, draconian treatment of warehouse staff at Sports Direct in the UK. Amazon aren't all that hectic in the way they treat their staff either.


    Mogs
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    Last edited: Oct 6, 2016
  40. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Hi Justyn,

    Checking in to see how things are going with Socks today.

    Sending more prayers and :bighug::bighug::bighug:.


    Mogs
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  41. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Yes, luckily they are not pushing for him to come home- more so hoping he will be eating today and will maybe be ready to come home tomorrow evening! Socks is on anti-nausea, stomach/gi proctectant, and appetite stimulant - appetite stimulant was just started this morning. I belive they said it was Cypropheptadine. They did US and do not show any hold-up of bowels! So that's good... But i will definitely make sure to have those to give to him when we can take him home!!!!
     
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  42. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Sep 9, 2016
    Here is the latest update from our Internal Med Vet:

    Socks didnt want food again today so far but she has started the appetitie stimulant and said she hadnt started prior as goal was to get him to eat on his own so would like to see him eating tonight, if not, they may think about ng tube if refuses dinner at 12am. Ketones have mostly resolved as far as they see but could still be some lingering. Hydration almost back to normal but still giving a little. Phosphorus back to normal- no supplement needed. Vet mentioned how is Potassium had been low and still is so they are supplementing - you guys were right but i swear they only mentioned the phos levels. Liver enzyme levels and kidney levels have gone back to normal!!! Something called like 'billierueben" had gone up but would if cat is sick/ in stress but they are keeping an eye on that. And another level that is causing some concern is elevated so they would like to recheck both tomorrow. Still waiting on pancreas test to confirm pancreatitis but thats the only thing they see so far besides the original DKA. But said he def needs to stay today through tmr but may be able to come home tomorrow if he starts eating!!! Urinalysis came back with no immediate signs of infection but are still treating as such as they will do a culture to confirm. But hes doing better!!! More spunky! So hopefully with the appetite stimulant and this day of fluids/meds, he'll be back to a stable condition to come home!! I will be meeting with nurse tonight to discuss more!
     
  43. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the update!!! So very glad Socks is at the best place possible for his treatment. These people are doing all the right things and Socks is starting to improve, Sending more healing energy to help Socks start eating on his own.

    And lots of :bighug: :bighug: :bighug: for you.
     
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  44. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Thank you for the kind words!! And i truly have SO much appreciation for the weight taken off my shoulder, as his hospital staff have been very friendly and knowledgeable through his stay. Can't wait to have my baby home and start re-evaluating to understand why this happened and prevent it in the future!
     
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  45. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Encouraging update, Justyn.



    Are they giving Socks anti-nausea treatment? If he is nauseated the appy stimulant probably won't be very effective without the anti-nausea meds.

    Sending more prayers and :bighug::bighug::bighug:.


    Mogs
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  46. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    So glad Socks is improving fast. You may never know what caused this episode. Some cats have them some don't. Socks will/could be susceptible quite easily to them again. I'm sure the team at the hospital will go over things to watch and monitor for and when you need to seek their help. And of course you have this community also to advise or yell at you if we think you need to get to the vet.
     
  47. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Yes yes absolutely have had him on anti-nausea since bringing him into ER.
     
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  48. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Yes exactly and god I am so thankful for this community of humans that care so much about the well-being of others and their fur families.. It is such a comfort to have you all here to discuss!
     
  49. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

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    The minute you posted about Socks you instantly gained a big assortment of aunties and uncles for your kitty and a huge family for you!! :bighug: :bighug: :bighug:
     
  50. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    When you next go in to visit Socks, Justyn, try to see if he will eat a little bit from your hand.

    You need to make sure he's eating before you take him home.


    Mogs
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  51. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Awww it truly does feel like i've gained an extended family!! And that's a good idea, I will see if the vet would let me try to feed him tonight after ive spent some time with him to see if that helps! And vet agrees he cannot go home until he has his steady appetite back. I am so fortunate to be able to be giving him the care he really needs as otherwise, i could have never done this for him. my heart is so swollen with appreciation and thanks for all of you who have been helping us along this difficult time! Including emotional support for mama! (;
     
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  52. Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey

    Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey Well-Known Member

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    The news sounds very encouraging. FDMB vines (vibes) are very powerful. Once we get them cranked up, they can work miracles! We'll keep them coming, along with all the emotional support you need. Many of us have been there, and those that haven't know how easily they could have been in your shoes. :bighug:
     
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  53. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    If you take in something that smells of you and home (a t-shirt, for example) and put it in the cage, it might help.
     
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  54. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Just got home from a wonderfully long visit with Socks! The nurse was able to unhook him from his iv for almost two hours so we were able to spend some time with him, snuggle, and ultimately were trying to get him relaxed to get him to eat... But unfortunately, socks had no appetite, no want to eat... Vet advised she has him on an appetite stimulant that lasts about 3 days but takes about 24 hours for full effect? So vet said they will try to feed a few more times but if he doesnt eat breakfast around 9am, they will call to go over options such as a nasal tube.. He has been just shaking any food out of his mouth, so cheek feeding hasnt worked.. Very much hoping he eats tonight.. As they said hes been very relaxed at night when lights are off and its quiet. Besides not eating, he's otherwise so much more relaxed, awake, and cognitive.. Definitely seems like he wants to be home!! Very much hoping he doesnt need the tube but its just been so long since he's eaten, besides the few tablespoons last night.. I will keep you guys posted.. We surely wish there was something we could do, very bummed that we couldnt get him to eat...
     
  55. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    If you can make a point of phoning in to the vets in the morning to find out from the vets the names of the appetite stimulant and the anti-nausea medication(s) Socks is receiving and then post the details here we might be able to give you more info on them.

    Here is an article by Lisa Pierson DVM on feeding tubes.

    Sending appy-stimulating vibes and lots of scritches to Socks.

    :bighug:


    Mogs
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    Last edited: Oct 6, 2016
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  56. Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey

    Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey Well-Known Member

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    Sounds to me like they gave me Mirtazapine. I always had more luck with Cyproheptadine. I'm sure they are giving him calories through his IV, so try not to worry too much about the not eating. That's what they did with my Harvey. Feeding tubes are not fun, but they are manageable, and they can save his life. It's a great sign that he's alert and engaged. Hang in there!
     
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  57. Sandi & Whisper

    Sandi & Whisper Member

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    I agree completely. I think that it is somewhat natural to have an almost visceral reaction to the thought of a feeding tube, but I would completely welcome that at this point if I were you. It would be one less thing to worry about so that you can focus on something else, and it truly can save his life!

    Other than that, I can't tell you how happy this report makes me!

    Best,
    Sandi.
     
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  58. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Yes I believe it was mirtazapine.. Ive heard good things about the short acting but hadnt been given the option. And yes i am open to the ng tube as long as thats the next best option! Im sure we will manage but just want him better and back to feeling good!
     
  59. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    My experience with a feeding tube - yours might be very different: I had a non-diabetic cat years ago that stopped eating and ended up with a surgically inserted feeding tube through her side into her stomach. I treated her at home. There was a length of external tube kept under a surgical wrap with a short end piece with valve exposed on her back where she couldn't reach it. I had to mix up a watery sludge of food to slowly syringe into the open valve multiple times a day for three weeks. It sounds awful but it wasn't as bad as you might think. Yes, it was time-consuming and frustrating when the valve clogged with food and had to be rinsed but I did it. She handled it very well and recovered.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2016
  60. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Hi there, and wow that definitely sounds like a lot, but nothing out of the craziness that we couldn't handle! I believe they were thinking of an Nasal tube rather at least to start to see if it will get him going! I will try anything to get him better - DCIN even suggested to see if we can take him home to see if he can get relaxed and maybe eat then! So we're going to talk to the vet today and see what they think! I miss my little guy and I am so blessed that he's on a road of recovery, although it may be a bit difficult im sure he'll forget all about this nonsense once he's back at home in his favorite boxes in front of the fireplace.. and the only reason that's a possibility is because of the wonderful humans of DCIN... cannot feel more thankful for them giving us this chance of recovery.
     
  61. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Sep 9, 2016
    But I did confirm they have they are giving him the long-acting appetite stimulant, ALONG with Cerenia. So he's on a double-whammy, and anti-nausea and stomach protectants, but still gagged at the smell of food last night... Just so confused..
     
  62. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Sep 9, 2016
    Hello everyone, so i just got off the phone with the vet, and she's confirmed Socks' appetite still has not increased... They say they may be ok with letting us take him home but as the days keep continuing that he doesn't eat, as if he doesn't eat tonight or tomorrow, he is definitely starting to be in risk for fatty liver - so vet reccomends placing a tube. However, they are giving me the option between the nasal tube and esophegeal tube, but wanted to run them by you all first. The advised that the nasal tubes are a bit hard to manage at home and normally don't send patient's home with them, but advised we can definitely try. Otherwise, she more reccomends the esophageal tube, as she advised he would/should be able to come home tomorrow and we would still try offering only normal food first, but then feed through the tube if needed. I'm unsure about the pros/cons of each, do any of you have a suggestion for what you think he would benefit from more? I'd like to get him home, but having the tube as a back-up seems like the safest thing as a back-up... Obviously concerned it will upset/annoy him, but getting him home may be the best thing for him as other levels have still been looking good.
     
  63. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Please help... I'd like them to start something soon but don't know what to do...
     
  64. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2014
    The the esophageal tube would be much easier to manage at home and more comfortable for Socks. I will tag @Critter Mom and see if she is around. I believe she used a the esophageal tube.
     
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  65. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    I've described my experience with a feeding tube. I can see where a nasogastric tube would be hard to manage at home. How does an esophageal tube work? Does it go down the throat? Would Socks be able to pull it out easily?
     
  66. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    That's exactly what i'm leaning towards, and they advised with the ng-tubes, since it's a liquid diet, they may have issues like diarrhea. I'm trying to figure out as soon as possible so they can get the procedure going!
     
  67. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    It would go through the side of his neck and is wrapped in a bandage, vet said only 2 cats in her 9 year career have been really bothered by it play with it, but most cats respond well as its not in their face like the ng tube, as he could sneeze the e-tube out as he's been sniffy as it is already...
     
  68. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2014

    Although I have not used it myself, from posts from other members...and I can't remember all who have used it....the esophageal tube would be easier to work with and is not as bothersome as the nasal tube. Just imagine if it were yourself...a tube through your nose and down your throat, or a tube in the side and into the stomach. With the esophageal tube you syringe food into the tube opeing on the side rather than having to deal with the head area. You would have to be extra careful about keeping the esophageal tube area clean, but hopefully it wouldn't be for too long a period of time. Hope this helps and others who have used the tuve can give their opinions soom
     
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  69. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    I agree... I'm thinking about posting a 911 thread or just telling my vet to go ahead with the e-tube. everything I'm hearing is leaning more towards that for a steady recovery....
     
  70. Sandi & Whisper

    Sandi & Whisper Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2015
    I would agree with the e tube. There is also a special collar/wrap that you can buy that looked really handy that I thought would be good if we ever need one again. I will see if I can find it and will post it later.

    Sandi.
     
  71. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Yes... haven't seen any feedback for rooting for the nasal tube as I think it would bug him more especially, and it's not meant for more than a few days, and as he hasn't eaten, we're unsure if that would be the solution - and to have to come back for a e-tube... I'm leaning towards e-tube... just concerned if he pukes, does that cause any issue with the tube? I'm sure the vet had considered but just unsure....
     
  72. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    This seems to be neck version of what my cat had years ago. Maybe that's the preferred technique now. If my experience is any indication, it's doable at home and Socks will likely tolerate it. My cat didn't vomit but the vet at the time warned me to syringe feed small amounts and very slowly. As she recovered, she began eating on her own while I continued tube feeding. Once she was eating better, I phased out the tube feedings and it was eventually removed. Be prepared for it to take some time.
     
  73. Sandi & Whisper

    Sandi & Whisper Member

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    Oct 2, 2015
  74. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Gotcha, and yes, I just got off the phone with vet and was advised the pros/cons... Asked them to start getting paperwork together for e-tube... As i haven't seen any reason not to place the e-tube vs the nasal tube as we have to place a tube really... I just want my guy to have the best chance of the easiest recovery for himself!
     
  75. Larry and Kitties

    Larry and Kitties Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    I also opt for the e-tube. They are well tolerated. Some cats have had the same e-tube for over 6 months. A nasoesophageal tube is for short-term use only and are not well tolerated by many cats. The diameter is also smaller so that limits what can be fed through the tube. The advantage of the nasoesophageal tube is that only local anesthesia and maybe sedation is required vie general anesthesia for the e-tube.
     
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  76. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Exactly, the placement process has seemed like the only benefit to it so far for us, as the vet thinks he'd benefit more from e-tube with more-normal-consistency food rather than liquid... and definitely it's longevity in comparison to the nasal tube..
     
  77. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Read the links above and was reminded that my cat had a PEG tube.
     
  78. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Read the info... unfortunately still difficult to confirm.. i'd like to bring him home without any tubes to see if he would eat, but as i spent time with him yesterday for 2 hours - he had no interest in food, even gagged at the smell, when it was just me and him... so worried another 24 hrs without eating is really not what he needs....
     
  79. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2014

    He may eat better at home but please don't risk it by bringing him home without a feeding tube. Once you leave, if he is not eating at home, then you would have to go back and have it done anyway. If Socks starts to eat well at home for a few days, then you can ask about having the tube out. With everything Socks has been through the last while, you certainly don;t want to be worried about fatty liver disease on top of everything else.
     
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  80. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2014
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Justyn - please, please, please ask your vet ASAP about treating Socks with ONDANSETRON.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Cerenia helps more with vomiting and some nausea. Ondansetron is an anti-nausea med used in humans for nausea caused by chemotherapy. Ondansetron is usually very effective and well-tolerated in cats. (It saved Saoirse's life when she was treated with it.) It is recommended by IDEXX Laboratories as a treatment for nausea. (See their Pancreatitis treatment guidelines for their recommendations on nausea treatments.)

    My vet prescribed 2mg ondansetron twice a day for a 10lb cat. (@Marje and Gracie - do you know the maximum dose a cat can be given for ondansetron per day?)

    I've not used an e-tube. One of my cats developed hepatic lipidosis and the vet treating her at the time put in a nasogastric tube temporarily. She told me they are not as effective as e-tubes in terms of delivering sufficient nutrition and that e-tubes are easier to manage in a home nursing situation. (Unfortunately she delayed the procedure to put in the e-tube and I lost my girl as a consequence.)

    Sending more prayers for Socks to eat.

    :bighug:


    Mogs
    .
     
  81. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Yes.... and things are just very complicated because it's impossible to know what's exactly best for him... DCIN was thinking getting him home without a tube may be worth a shot, but as the ER vets wouldn't be able to place e-tube tomorrow (as not emergency service so it would have to wait until monday) - i feel only safe option is to get tube as he has had no interest in food as the day has continued... but if we can get him stable after the e-tube, DCIN thinks getting him home is going to be the best thing for him with less stress... Vet is partially disagreeing but says they will try to do e-tube as soon as they can in hopes of us being able to get him home today... so, so stressed... i haven't eaten a normal meal probably as long as socks hasnt... i just dont know what to do and am pulled in so many directions.. just want him to get better...
     
  82. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Wow, absolute yes to all of that and exactly why ive asked the dcin to allow us to go ahead with the e-tube, and as they understand my concern and worry, theyve allowed the vet to start the procedure so he should be under right now. The issue is the er vet doesnt place e-tubes on weekends so that was also another factor. I will try everything to get him to eat on his own, but having the tube as a back up is a god send.. I am so fortuante for these ladies at dcin...
     
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  83. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    I will ask vet as soon as possible but i know he is already in for surgery. Luckily were getting e-tube as a precaution but i hope to bring him home tonight..
     
  84. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2014
    Sending more prayers for all to go well.

    :bighug:


    Mogs
    .
     
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  85. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2014
    Sending prayers and healing energy that the surgery goes well and Socks is able to come home today!!

    :bighug: :bighug:
     
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  86. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Thank you all, so so so much... I would have had NO idea about which tube but at least have a bit of confidence with none of you opposing as it just may be what he truly needs at this point.. sucks that it DID have to get to his point..
     
  87. Larry and Kitties

    Larry and Kitties Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    Just make sure that your make sure the bandages around the neck are changed regularly and the insertion site cleaned and inspected for infection. Sometimes the insertion site gets infected and the tube can be pulled out.
    My Mario had an e-tube inserted and I put off changing the bandage too long. When I finally came back from getting bandaging supplies he pulled the e-tube out.

    I recommend you join Yahoo's assisted feeding group
    https://beta.groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Feline-Assisted-Feeding/info
    for info on tube feeding
     
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  88. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Oh wow, absolutely understandable.. I will ensure to read up on everything and do everything as to-the-book as possible...
     
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  89. Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey

    Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2011
    My Kisa had an e-tube. The hint I have is to only give a little food at a time, and wait a while to make sure he doesn't throw it back up. I made the mistake of giving too much and not waiting long enough, and Kisa did vomit. That did not cause any problems with the tube. You do need to make sure it stays clear, again by not putting too much in it at one time, and making sure the consistency of the food isn't too thick. Another benefit is you can put liquid meds or crushed pills into it, as well as water (which you use to flush the tube). I think this was the best choice, and I'm glad you went ahead with it.

    Another hint - be careful if they give you MaxCal as the food you will be giving him. It's very high in calories, but also very rich, so it could cause tummy upset. Definitely go slow with that. Hill's a/d is lower in cals and not as rich, but is a better consistency - doesn't take as much water to get it thin enough to use.

    We're praying for Socks. You're doing all the right things, Justyn. Deep breaths. You can do this!
     
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  90. Tuxedo Mom

    Tuxedo Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2014

    I agree with using the Hill's a/d. I used it for a few weeks for oral syringe feeding one of my kitties and it was very easy to work with. A little higher in carbs, about 12% but still in an acceptable range at this point.
     
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  91. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Sep 9, 2016
    Oh gotcha, thanks for sharing as im definitely concerned about his vomitting... but glad to hear that didnt mess up the tube.. i will be very careful... and im sure they'll want to keep him on a low carb food.. still have to learn so much about the tube as i know nothing... if anyone has any articles/resources for e-tubes that would be appreciated! Thanks for the support...
     
  92. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    only issue with that is we tried giving to socks last night and made him gag... i really dont think he likes the smell/taste.. worried it'll make him nauseas.. ill definitely check with the vet what food options i have.... the food i had him on is almost the same consistency of the a/d so ill check with vet if that would work...
     
  93. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2014
    They need to keep Socks on a food that will allow him to get the right amount of insulin to keep him clear of ketones, Justyn. Work closely with the vet on the food side of things.

    Be sure to ask about the ondansetron.


    Mogs
    .
     
  94. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Gotcha, and absolutely will do. and yes will do that too.
     
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  95. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2015
    Just another "fan" sending more good vines and prayers for Socks! I'm following Socks journey from the sidelines as I can't add anything to the wonderful advice you are getting from others! Chin up Justyn, and please look after yourself because Socks is going to need you in good shape when he comes home. :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
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  96. Justyn

    Justyn Member

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2016
    Thank you for the kind words... it's so hard, i can't even relax as i've had so much anxiety even about bringing him home and not being able to give him as good of care as they are.. but i know im just beating myself up..just cant seem to stop the worries..
     
  97. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2014
    You won't be alone with this, Justyn; you've got FDMB in your corner.

    :bighug::bighug::bighug:


    Mogs
    .
     
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  98. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Sep 9, 2016
    thank you... im just so worried about all of these complications im seeing with the feeding tube..
     
  99. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2015
    With anything new and unknown with my kitty, I find my imagination gets carried away and things are never as hard as I initially imagined them to be. When I get myself tied up in knots about kitty stuff, I always remind myself of this. Like testing and giving injections..... have confidence in yourself and Socks will have confidence in you and you'll do just fine! :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
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  100. Justyn

    Justyn Member

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    Sep 9, 2016
    yes, exactly how it was with the overwhelming diagnosis of Diabetes... so i sure hope so!
     
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