diabetic cat not eating

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (The Main Forum)' started by muffin, Mar 2, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. muffin

    muffin New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2013
    My cat muffin has been diabetic for about 9months and doing fine up til now.
    3 days ago she stoped eating all her food, now she only takes small bites and walks away from the rest but she still looks hungry. She wants more but dosn't eat it. I have tried all her fav foods and more but she wont eat.
    I have had to stop giving her her shots because her BG drops too low.

    If any one has any info to why this is happening or any food ideas please help.
     
  2. RubenTheCat

    RubenTheCat Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2013
    I'm no expert and would only be guessing.
    I would have her checked out,
    Does she have the 5 P's- peeing, pooing, preening, purring and playing?
    Does she eat her treats?
    Have you tried parm cheese sprinkled on her food?
    There are a few other ways to intice a kitty to eat but that won't tell you why she stopped eating.
    I'll try to see if I can get someone to peek over here
    Hang tight and sending eating vines to kitty.
     
  3. Dyana

    Dyana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    Are you home testing, and what was her last test?

    Does she approach the food and lick her licks or walk away? She might be nauseated and have pancreatitis.
    Have you checked her for ketones? If not, I would go out and buy some ketone test strips now, and test her and rule out ketones.

    Have you tried putting any toppings like crumbled freeze dried all meat treats or parmesean cheese on top of her food?

    What insulin are you using and what dose are you giving?

    Sorry for all the questions, but answering these can help us to help you.
     
  4. Sandy and Brie

    Sandy and Brie Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2012
    It sounds like she may be nauseated. Wanting to eat and walking away from food is a sign of nausea. Have you taken Muffin to the vet? It really sounds like this is your next step and very soon. If cats don't eat for a few days they can develop hepatic lipidosis. Maybe pancreatitis? You may want to consider taking her to the ER since it has been 3 days. I don't think I would wait until Monday. She probably needs some IV fluids at this point at the very least. It's good that you check her sugars. Smart move not giving insulin if she is dropping too low and not eating.
     
  5. muffin

    muffin New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2013
    Thank you all for responding so quick.

    The 5 p's, she is peeing, preening and purring, not playing and i've separated her from my three other cats too keep an eye on her, so ill watch out for her to poop.

    I am a home tester and she red at 2.1 mmol/L two hours ago but thankfuly she is now at 5.2 because she ate 3 of her pick-me-up treets and a bit of her food

    What would cause her to be nauseated?
     
  6. RubenTheCat

    RubenTheCat Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2013
    Again, wait for an expert to answer, but pancreatitus could cause nausua,
    pancreatitus

    have you checked for ketones?
     
  7. muffin

    muffin New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2013
    Sorry. Yes have done keytone test and came up all clear.
    Yes on insulin 0.02 (or 0.2 i dont know how to write it).
     
  8. RubenTheCat

    RubenTheCat Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2013
    wait for an expert about the insulin, I'm not sure and knew to this myself, but ruben had pancreatitus so thats why I left you the link.
    She should go to the vet especially if it is pancreatitus. very painful for them :sad:
     
  9. Another reason for wanting to eat but not eating - dental problems. One of mine stopped eating when he broke a tooth. An abscess could also be causing pain and/or infection. Pancreatitis is a good reason too. Or constipation will also cause not eating if it is severe.
    Carl
     
  10. Wendy&Tiggy(GA)

    Wendy&Tiggy(GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2011
    It could be a lot of things, You need to goto the vet and get him checked out though, ask about anti nausea meds, try the below things to get him to eat, maybe even try syringe feeding. And keep testing his blood to see how it varies over the next few days. Don't give insulin while she is that low, she is in normal cat numbers right now.

    Wendy
     
  11. Blue

    Blue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    That 2.1 is pretty low..... that's a 38 for those wondering about the conversion.
    What insulin are you giving, what dose, and how long after the shot did you test and get the 2.1?
    It's a good thing you tested and caught the 2.1
     
  12. RubenTheCat

    RubenTheCat Member

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2013
    thanx blue, I had know idea the conversion, but had a feeling it was low...
     
  13. BJM

    BJM Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2010
    Feline hepatic lipidosis (FHL) can ocurr in as few as 2 days or as many as 7 (per the Midwest Vet Conference presentation on it. A vet visit is indicated immediately as FHL can kill due to serious metabolic disturbances.

    Do the whites of the eyes or the skin look at all yellow? That would be jaundice. It ocurrs when fat breakdown travels to the liver, swells the liver cells, and the swelling prevents bile from traveling to the bile duct. The bile backs up into the blood stream, causing the yellow color.
     
  14. TMR

    TMR Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2013
    My cat was just diagnosed Friday. This is the first time I have found this website and the first time I have posted here. It says to introduce yourself but I can't figure out how to post a new topic. Anyway, the vet said if the cat (Midnight) doesn't eat much, to give 1/2 the dose of insulin--which is 1 unit of lantus. I don't even know if I can measure 1/2 unit. But they said to call if ?????. I can't remember what they said. Maybe it was if she doesn't eat at all. And she has always eaten dry food. They said I could give her dry or wet food, that it didn't matter. On this website it says it must be wet food. Should I switch? And is it a lot more expensive for wet food? Any recs for a brand of food, or should it be the prescription food from the vet? I spent $500 on my cat Friday! I can't believe how expensive the food and insulin and syringes are!
     
  15. Wendy&Tiggy(GA)

    Wendy&Tiggy(GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2011
    Hello and welcome to the board,

    To post a new thread go to below underneath where it says post reply and click on the forum name ie "return to feline health: the main fdmb forum". Then you will see the main board. At the top it has a button saying "new topic" which you click . (Immediately under the title "FELINE HEALTH: The Main FDMB Forum")

    However to answer your questions...

    1. Cost. Did you get a 10ml vial of lantus? Keep it in the fridge (not the door)and do not shake or roll it, and it will last you up to six months..just keep an eye on it for flakes and cloudiness. Are you in the US? I think the best syringe prices are in Walmart. What kind of syringes are you using right now? You can get ones in Walmart with half unit markings we can recommend which we find easier.

    2. What food are you currently feeding (brand)? You don't need to use the prescription diets. We do recommend a change to wet canned with under 10%carbs but only if you are home testing. You can get a free kit etc from the links on this site. And then you can buy a low cost canned like fancy feast classic pâtés or friskies pâtés.



    Wendy
     
  16. TMR

    TMR Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2013
    I posted my own topic so I could talk about my kitty there. Thanks.
     
  17. Elizabeth and Bertie

    Elizabeth and Bertie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2010
    Hello to you and to Muffin, and welcome to FDMB.

    I'm sorry that Muffin is feeling poorly and hope she is feeling better soon. Keeping fingers and paws crossed for a swift recovery.

    Can I just clarify something? Am I correct in thinking that you are NOT giving insulin at the moment because Muffin isn't eating (and because the insulin drops her too low)? If you got that 2.1 when Muffin wasn't on insulin then that number is fine. It's a normal number for a cat not on insulin...

    What sort of pre-shot numbers have you been getting (BG number before giving insulin)?

    And where are you from? I notice that you use mmol BG readings. Are you in the UK?

    Eliz
     
  18. muffin

    muffin New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2013
    UPDATE: for some reason muffin is eating more food but still only about half then normal.
    Her BG has gone up to a good level, so thats good.

    And no there is no yellow in the whites of her eyes.

    Her teeth and gums look to be fine, she did eat her pick-me-up treets which are round dry biscuit things and she didn't look to be in any discomfort when eating them.

    She is on lantus/glargine 0.02 twice daily.
    But im only going to give her a half dose of insulin tonight after dinner.

    She looks like she is geting bit better but im taking her to her vet in the morning. I what her to have full bloods and a check up. I need to know if there is anything wrong with her or if this is just someting that just happens to diabetic cat on occasion.

    Ill update after the vet.

    Is there any thing i should ask the vet too have a look for?

    Muffin.
     
  19. muffin

    muffin New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2013
    Hi there Elizabeth amd Bertie.

    We live in Australia. I only know of the mmol i dont know any other ways of reading the meter.

    What is too low for her bg to be?
    Her vet says anything under 6.0 is not good and under 2.2 is dangerous. Is that corect?
     
  20. Elizabeth and Bertie

    Elizabeth and Bertie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2010
    For a cat on insulin 2.2 could be a dangerous/hypoglycemic number. But some cats not on insulin (non-diabetics or diabetic cats in remission) do have numbers as low as that.

    The normal BG range is roughly between 2.5 and 7.2.
    For a cat on insulin it is generally considered that it's not wise to aim for a BG nadir (lowest BG of the cycle) of less than 5 unless the person has very good control of their cat's blood glucose. (Although some people with experience and very good control of their cat's BG may allow the nadir to drop lower than that)

    Edited to add:
    Here is some info on 'Regulation' from the FAQ's that you may find helpful:

    "A6.1. There are different definitions of regulation...

    Not treated [blood glucose typically above 300 mg/dl (16.7 mmol/L), poor clinical signs]
    Treated but not regulated [often above 300 (16.7) and rarely near 100 (5.6), poor clinical signs]
    Regulated [generally below 300 (16.7) with glucose nadir near 100 (5.6), good clinical signs, no hypoglycemia]
    Well regulated [generally below 200-250 (11.1-13.9) and often near 100 (5.6), no hypoglycemia]
    Tightly regulated [generally below 150 (8.3) and usually in the 60-120 (3.3-6.7) range, no hypoglycemia, still receiving insulin]
    Normalized [60-120 (3.3-6.7) except perhaps directly after meals -- usually not receiving insulin]

    ... it is possible for a cat who is not getting insulin to have blood glucose as low as 40 mg/dl (2.2 mmol/L) on a home glucometer. If you have a non-diabetic cat, try testing her with the same meter to get a safe comparison figure. "


    The link to the above info is here:
    http://www.felinediabetes.com/fdmb-faq.htm#regulation

    There is also some really good info about cat's blood glucose numbers in a table on this page (you'll need to scroll down the page a bit).
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diabetes_in_cats
     
  21. Dr Schrodinger

    Dr Schrodinger Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2012
    Hi Muffin,

    Does your kitty get hairballs at all? It could be just as simple as that.

    Good luck at the vets. I hope she feels better soon.

    Juliet
     
  22. Wendy&Tiggy(GA)

    Wendy&Tiggy(GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2011
    Can I ask what you mean by "her BG has gone up to a normal level"? I am hoping she is still in the 2 -7mmol/L range?

    Also what brand/ type of food are you feeding? Since you are home testing, is it a low carb canned?

    Thanks
    Wendy
     
  23. muffin

    muffin New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2013
    As it happens this all started after she brang up a hairball and she has brang 3 or 4 small ones since.
    How could a hairball cause this?

    She eats whiskers canned food. Whats a low carb canned food, how do i tell the diff?

    Also i put some parm cheese on her food, she ate almost all of it. That worked heeps well.

    Last bg was just above 16.0 after food so i gave her her full dose of insulin (0.02).
    But thats a shock after being so low for 3-4 days.

    Like i posted befor she looks to be getting a bit better. In the last 8hours she has been eating more food and no insulin so thats why bg was at 16.0 i guess.
    But shes not like herself so too the vet in morning. (its 5am so i meen a bit later in the morning).
     
  24. Dyana

    Dyana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    I've sent a PM (Private Message) to a GraceAndAngie who live in Sydney, and asked her if she can help you find some low carb food that's sold in your area.
     
  25. Wendy&Tiggy(GA)

    Wendy&Tiggy(GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2011
    Let us know how you get on at the vet. You are right that the 16 could be because she is eating more normally.. it could be also why she isnt feeling well since thats on the high side.

    Cats arent designed to eat carbs. The only carbs they get in the wild is the contents of a mouse stomach which really isnt much. So many cats that get a higher carb diet (and thats many of them since many just eat dry or high carb canned) can develop diabetes. So to prevent or control diabetes you want the carbs to be under 10% of calories.

    If the recipe for Whiskas is the same as here in the US and Canada then many of the flavours are too high in carbs - check this list and see which your flavours are http://binkyspage.tripod.com/CanFoodNew.html

    Also I once saw a post from an australian about food and she said
    Wendy
     
  26. GraceAndAngie

    GraceAndAngie Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2013
    Hi Muffin,

    I live in Sydney. Where in Australia are you?

    You don't need to buy expensive proscription food. The list that Wendy quoted below was posted to me by Vyktor's Mum, another Australian who has helped me a lot. That little list is the best guide I've found for Australians. I've also found cat food fresh mince, available near the meat section in the supermarket. That doesn't have any vegetable products in it. A lot of people talk about food spread sheets and lists here (Binky's Page is one of them) but they're not relevant to us because the food is different. Americans use Fancy Feast a lot but this isn't any good in Australia.

    The mince and casserole Whiskers tins are high carb because the gravy has flour in it. The loaf varieties ("jellymeat", "loaf with chicken and beef", "loaf with lamb and kidney" and "loaf with chicken and turkey" and the fish ones) are the only low carb Whiskers.

    The two cheapest options are the whiskers loaf tins and the cat food mince.

    I'm pretty new to home testing and there is a lot to learn but I have had tonnes of help and support here. You have found the right place! If you have any questions about where to get things or what to get, I'm very happy to help. If it's anything trickier than shopping, I offer my support but you're better off with somebody with more experience.

    Which meter are you using? Did you start home testing because you found this site or because your vet suggested it? If it was your vet, you have a very rare vet! Not many are educated about home testing.

    Grace
     
  27. GraceAndAngie

    GraceAndAngie Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2013
    Hi Muffin,

    Insulin is measured in units as an international standard. My syringes have units marked on one side up to 30 units and 0.3 mL/cc marked on the other side. I don't think you are measuring in units because 0.02 units would be impossible to measure and 0.2 units very difficult on an Australian syringe (we can't get them with 0.5 markings).

    Below is a photo my syringe at 2 units. It's really important to know what dose you are giving your cat so that people can help you.
     

    Attached Files:

  28. muffin

    muffin New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2013
    UPDATE:
    My poor little Muffin was very vary constipated but last night thankfuly she did a big rock hard poop (sorry if thats tmi). But still she didnt eat all of her dinner but for breakfast she did eat all of it. So hopefuly thats it. She does look better and more active.

    Yes that pic of the syringe, thats the dose i give muffin 2 units.

    Muffins vet is the one who got me to do home testing (caresens meter) but apart from trying to get me to buy the proscription diet crap she didnt tell me what food too feed muffin only how much.
    So we are going to buy low carb food from now on. Is whiskers loaf a good one to get?

    We live in just outside of adelaide, me, my husband and our 4 rescue cats muffin, snowy, scruffles and smitten.
    Im glad i found this site. Thank you all for you help with muffy.
     
  29. GraceAndAngie

    GraceAndAngie Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2013
    Whiskers loaf is low carb but also a low quality cat food. It's better for your cats than any higher carb cat food but there is better quality available. Is that what you meant?

    People talk about Ziwi Peak as being very good quality - I've never bought it. I can't tell you about Nature's Gifts, Ultimates or Premium Woolworths Select as I've never bought them either. The cat mince that I was buying seemed better quality than Whiskers as it didn't have as much jelly in it and it was all recognisably meat.

    I would keep going with the Whiskers at the moment because your cats already eat it. Once Muffin's diabetes is easier for you (it's a lot to learn at first and can be a bit overwhelming) you could look into other options if you wanted them on something better quality.

    People will be able to give you lots of help if you post her blood glucose readings. To convert it to mg/dL (American meters and is used on the board as a standard) you need to multiply the reading you get in mmol/L (Australian meters) by 18.
     
  30. Wendy&Tiggy(GA)

    Wendy&Tiggy(GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2011
  31. Wendy&Tiggy(GA)

    Wendy&Tiggy(GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2011
    How is Muffin doing? Do you need help with the spreadsheet?
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page