Fructosamine results and the battle

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (Welcome & Main Forum)' started by MamaJen, Jan 15, 2020.

  1. MamaJen

    MamaJen Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Well Tomtoms uti is all cleared up and his fructosamine test was 324. According to the paper i asked for with the results it's a good range so I'm grateful for that.. however.. I'm getting major resistance on food and any questioning on insulin.. from the resource page I came across a compounding pharmacy that makes bovine PZI insulin and states that it's better for cats.. BOOM came down on the hammer at the mere suggestion.. maybe I need a new vet.. when I mentioned the forumn there was a visible eye roll!! Grrr
     
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  2. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    So your vet is the one giving you the major resistance on food and insulin? Just trying to clarify.

    What does the vet recommend for food and why?

    A vet should be willing to work in a partnership with you. If not, then maybe it is time to seek a new vet.
    Link to vet interview topics is here for you.

    Taking a stab in the dark here. Is your current vet an older man. Thinks he knows everything? God complex?
     
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  3. MamaJen

    MamaJen Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Vet wanted them on dry hills w/d. They don't offer wet and rather you do the prescription diet they say.. nose turned firmly up at the mere suggestion of fancy feast CLASSIC made sure to stress classic.. even tried to show him the chart.. nose firmly in the IM EDUCATED category.. today i was getting the testie no no no at mere suggestion of the bovine PZI from the vet tech.. Doc on the other hand seamed completely ill informed like didnt even know about bovine version..this was over the phone as Tomtom was a drop off today. I tried to show the compounding pharmacy site to the tech to maybe get insight.. they definitely knew the pharmacy but straight up said bovine is NOT for cats at all which UTTERLY contradicted the pharmacy sites statement!
    https://bcpvetpharm.com/products/bcp-pzi-bovine-insulin
    So now I have the sinking feeling they are clueless
     
  4. Larry and Kitties

    Larry and Kitties Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    I have used bovine PZI insulin from BCP in texas in the past. That was the preferred before Lantus (and Levemir) ere approved for human use. At the theme there was PZIVet insulin that was a U40 and a combination of bovine and porcine PZI insulin. The formula was the same as used by humans in the past. BCP was a lot less expensive than PZIVet. Bovine insulin is closer to a cat's insulin than porcine (and later human insulin manufactured when the DNA code for making human insulin is placed into bacteria or yeast cells; the insulin made by this process is then purified and sold as human insulin)
     
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  5. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    So there have been some improvements with Tom Toms UTI cleared up. Positive step forward. Glad to hear that.

    Fructosamine testing is more a piece of the puzzle than everything weighed together to make a decision on treating a cat.
    Have you explained to the vet that now with 2 cats diagnosed as diabetic, you are trying to find a way to make this financially possible with alternatives to his treatment plan?

    More on Reference Ranges for Fructosamine Test and usefulness of the test here.

    The W/d dry food is intended for weight loss, not specifically for diabetes. If your cat's are overweight, that is one food they can use. But your vet should have given you options that will also work well for diabetic cats AND any needed weight loss. Canned foods low in carbs are also lower in calories so can help a cat with weight loss. Plus the canned foods have lots of water which helps a diabetic cat keep hydrated since they are peeing such huge quantities.

    Your vet may only have experience with a few insulins that are available to treat diabetic cats. So for that reason, may have done the :rolleyes: when you brought up another insulin he may have no familiarity with.

    You are the advocate for your cat. You are the one making the decisions.

    Let us know if there is anything else we can help with. Ok to post in this same thread, just change the thread title to something more appropriate.
     
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  6. MamaJen

    MamaJen Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    My vet started us on the human one.. its 130 a vial and seeing that the bovine is half the price and potentially better for them I'm frustrated.
     
  7. MamaJen

    MamaJen Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
     

    Attached Files:

  8. MamaJen

    MamaJen Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Tomtom is a big cat like structure wise and the vet didnt say he was overweight just that he was down 3 lbs from a visit a few yrs back. Newnie is a little pudgy but not much and no mention of needing weight loss. During the visit I mentioned that the 1st ingredient in the prescription food was brewer's rice and how that seemed odd to have a starch and didnt that turn to sugar? I also mentioned that it's been stated that's not very nutritious.. total stink eye..
     
  9. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    Ok, so where do you think you want to go with your vet and treatment for your 2 diabetic cats? How do you want to proceed?

    I can point you to a lot of resources for information, from vet journal articles to the Health Links/FAQS forum and the index there.

    What do you want to know? What did the vet office provide as educational materials? How much exploring have you done yourself? Have you been reading other threads from members here? Other feline diabetes websites?

    Ideas on treating feline diabetes more economically sounds like one of your needs. We have suggestions of some things that have worked for us, to make this more affordable, if you are interested.

    What I'm saying is, there is a lot of information out there. Some people are ok with diving right in and learning. Some people want information more slowly. Which do you prefer?
     
  10. MamaJen

    MamaJen Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2020
    Education info from vet consisted of how to swirl the insulin bottle feed this food (at least they mentioned to slowly swap 0 specifics, I got that and correct amount to feed from hills on the phone) give 2 units every 12 hrs see us in 30 days for retest. I'm totally down for education. If I can get the cost down ok but not at the expense of their chances.. like the thing with the PZI was why would the pharmacy say its closest to cat and the vet tech completely say NO totally not good for cats.. please load me with links! I'm working my way through the pages.. just gets frustrating so many broken links
     
  11. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    So your homework for today consists of 2 things. Home testing and spreadsheet (SS) setup.
    1. You are home testing. That is a good first step. Are you having better success with the home testing? You weren't having much success on Sunday http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/glucose-testing.224183/#post-2508498

    My 2 favorite home testing documents:
    Marje and Gracie's Testing and Shooting Tips
    Ear Testing Psychology
    These can be found right on the message board, over in the Health Links / FAQs about Feline Diabetes Forum, in the Index.

    2. Second, getting a spreadsheet setup to track your BG (blood glucose) readings at home. Then we can follow along and see what is happening. I think of it as more pieces of the puzzle. You'll need separate ones for each of your cats.

    How to do that is here. Setting up a spreadsheet.

    Start with those 2 things first. More later. Don't want to give you information overload.

    p.s. The links within the message board, at least in the Health Links/FAQS Index should be working. The Main Page (when you click on Home on the header at the top of the message board) has known broken links. Unfortunately, not even the moderators here can fix those. The owner of the message board is the only one able to fix those links.
     
  12. Larry and Kitties

    Larry and Kitties Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    I did the same thing in the past. I used BCP bovine insulin
    https://bcpvetpharm.com/products/bcp-pzi-bovine-insulin
    instead of PZIVet (90% bovine and 10% porcine). before the rna human insulin was available the PZIVet formulation was used for humans.
    https://www.drugs.com/vet/pzi-vet.html
    Since then PZIVet was discontinued and for practical use it was replace with ProZinc
     
  13. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    Did you get a chance to do your 'homework' last night?
    Ready for more?

    Hypo stuff next
     

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