? Has not eaten today

We started out with problems getting Boozle to eat. He went from not eating, to eating small bits. We changed his food, just to see if the problem was that he just didn't like it. We also started giving him a small dose of Bupe in the evenings. He had a little left over from when he had his teeth pulled. I figured if he was experiencing pain, due to whatever infection he was fighting, that would help him eat. He had a few days where he was eating better. Not quite where we want him to be, but progress. Now he isn't eating at all today. No Bupe last night because we ran out. His numbers have been lower, but we had to stall last night and wound up giving him half of his insulin. This morning he would not eat, so we continued with a half dose (.5). We've tried putting liver in his food, changing the flavor, and warming it up. We are just past +6 and he still hasn't eaten. He tried a little earlier and his legs kept slipping so he got mad and gave up. I tried spoon feeding and he wasn't interested in that, either.

What I am curious about is -- Frank was always ravenous. Down to his last day, he always ate like a pig. This not eating thing, for Boozle, is new. Is this normal for them to have issues when they develop diabetes, when they are eating an established diet? And if he doesn't eat at all today, should we withhold insulin this evening?

 

How long has it been since his dental? He may still be in pain. You can try giving him 1/4 tablet of Pepcid A/C, in case he is nauseous.

 

Tina, I suggest you change the title of this thread to let members know that Boozle is NOT eating. I think this is more serious than the present title might indicate.
Are you testing his urine for ketones? You can get Ketostiks at any pharmacy and try to test his urine for ketones when he pees. I am no expert but when I see that a cat is not eating, the specter of DKA enters my mind.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...oacidosis-dka-and-blood-ketone-meters.135952/
Can you try offering plain baby food meat/soup (no seasonings), or the liver shake
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/the-liver-shake-for-sick-cats.30432/
or even syringe feeding if necessary
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/syringe-assisted-feeding-video-and-tips.144367/
@Kris & Teasel could you weight in please?
Please let us know what is happening with Boozle

 

How long has he not been eating? If he's been getting less than 50% of his normal calories for longer than a day or two, a call to the vet is warranted. Not eating can cause serious issues like hepatic lipidosis which can quickly become life threatening (this is not to scare you, just to make sure you are aware of the risks). In the meantime, you can try a 1/4 of a Pepcid tablet (original strength) and see if that helps. I see a note in your spreadsheet about Cerenia.. do you still have that, and is he taking it now? If he is, you may want to ask for some cyproheptadine to stimulate his appetite as well. As far as assist feeding, you can try scooping a little onto your finger and pushing it back into his cheek pocket or the roof of his mouth. That may work better than spoon feeding. Spot always does better with finger feeding than syringe or spoon feeding..

Not eating is not really considered normal for diabetes (usually diabetic kitties will be more hungry) but can be indicative of things that can come along with diabetes, such as pancreatitis.

As far as withholding insulin.. I would not. 0.5 only took him down to 153 so I think you are safe to give at least that much. His numbers have looked really good the last few days... I would hate for him to lose that momentum!

 

Chicken flavored baby food has always worked for me, my old 22 yr. old kitty when very very sick that was all I could get her to eat. Vets recommend this for sick kitties, but not long term due to it does not have complete nutrition, but works short term to get something in their tummy. Hope things get better.

 

He left for the vet about thirty minutes ago. He did not seem to be in a state to make me think it was an emergency. We were going to pick up pain reliever/appetite stimulant and I thought maybe he could go and they could lay eyes on him, to be safe.

He hasn't been eating more than one portion of Sheba per day, most days less than that. It's really starting to look like pancreatitis, which was suspected. He was given a long acting antibiotic and is supposed to go back in a week to have labs drawn again to see where he is at.

Not testing for ketones, yet. I think everyone got ketone strips for Christmas, because we went a few places and they didn't have any. We are looking for those again tonight. He doesn't have acetone breath and he isn't drinking or peeing a bunch. Sugar has been decent the past few days, too.

We asked about his mouth and the doc said it could be bothering him, but he did not suspect that was why he wasn't eating. He thinks it is related to the infection.

 

They ran some tests, and it isn't looking too good for Boozle. His creatinine levels have doubled since we picked him up last week. Seems his kidneys are shutting down. She said some cats bounce back, but given his quick and severe weight loss and the rate at which toxins are building up, she does not think this is going to be the case. She said she didn't think he was in pain, but probably miserable not being able to eat and not feeling well. We'll probably be bringing him home to say our goodbyes. Some days are better than others. :/

 

So sorry to hear...hoping he may beat the odds and recover. We are pulling for Boozle.

 

Oh no... I'm so sorry to hear that

 

Are they giving him fluids?

 

They did. They gave him fluids, an anti-nausea shot, and sent him home with the cyproheptadine and bupe. He was on fluids last week while he was staying with the vet, but we had not given him any since we picked him up last Wednesday.

I wasn't there, so this is second-hand reporting, but he said she said between the issues with his mouth and having diabetes, she didn't have much hope for him. Said she seemed more concerned with the diabetes, but we've got him in some decent numbers over the past few days. So *shrug*. I am not so sure what to think. He has been sickly for a while, but if I am being honest I have been emotionally exhausted. We just had to have a kitten put down because one of our fosters developed FIP. I don't want him to suffer, but I am afraid if we have him euthanized right now, I'll look back and feel like it was mainly an emotionally driven decision. So . . . just trying to process everything at the moment.

 

He ate his normal amount this evening, which is still not enough, but it's an indication he is feeling somewhat better.

 

Great to hear.

 

I’m sorry you lost your kitten. I can tell you MANY of us here understand your emotional exhaustion. I feel like I spend so much of my energy worrying... but at the end of the day as long as he has more good days than bad I’ll do what I must to get him to the next good day.

It sounds like you and your vet are doing all you can right now. I’m a little surprised that the diabetes is her main concern though considering his numbers. Pancreatitis is a *****, but if you can keep him eating, you can get him through! Crossing my fingers things start looking up!

 

If he's having good numbers, I wouldn't worry so much about the diabetes - keep on as you have been.

Have they done a comparison, between his kidney levels on the blood panel/test and an actual urine sample? I'm going through something similar with my cat Mao and my vet said the best thing is to compare the blood to the urine. He had to pee while at the vet, but unsure if they let him "give it" or if they used a catheter or something.

If the kidney values are high but the urine is concentrated, it means they could be overloaded so subQ fluids or even IV fluids as an inpatient are critical and can help. BUT if the values are high and the urine is very diluted then it points strongly to kidney disease or a shut down because they're not filtering much if anything.

Since he's not eating much at all I'd imagine he's not drinking much either - have you noted his water bowl habits, or...?

Did they check his mouth after the dental, see how he's healing physically? Sometimes where they put in the sutures can cause trouble - the extra suture length coming out from the knots tied in them, and placement too if he wants to "chew" - it can keep some parts swollen and painful.

I'd try Cerenia or Pepcid and ask about the blood vs. urine sample - and the mouth check. Which antibiotic was he on and is he still on it? Some of the stronger ones can cause tummy upset. When Mao was on Clavamox (which is a form of Amoxicillin) it bothered his stomach long before it hit his bowels. He needed a 1mL 2x a day.

I'd get him to get breakfast, then give him .5 mL and wait - then for lunch when he usually eats a lot more, I'd give 1 mL. Then for dinner when he eats the same amount as breakfast (when not feeling good) I'd give the other .5 mL to make the daily total a combined 2 mL.

More info would be helpful, if you're up to it - god love you and your baby.

PS - is he a licker? Could can blend his food into a pudding or more soup like consistency to see he'd do better on that, water amounts added help how thick, etc. Will he eat out of your hand, lick your finger...? Might need to experiment.

 

I was surprised that the diabetes was the main concern too. He isn't well regulated yet, but he isn't doing to shabby, now that we've changed the injection site and switched to a lower carb food. That area is full of ignorant people, though, so maybe she is just used to seeing diabetes poorly managed.

They did a lot of testing last week, but Brian picked him up, so I will have to ask him if the urine concentration was brought up. The mouth infection was well kept-up with because we've had so many issues with it. It's antibiotic resistant so, it's been more about managing it at this point. He has two teeth left and needless to say, he hasn't been well enough to have those removed. Vet said he was sure that there was some irritation there, but even when his mouth was at its worst, he never quit eating, so he doesn't think that is it. He says it could just be an infection like a UTI or Pancreatitis, but there is a strong chance he is in kidney failure.

He has drank some today, but mostly rested. I think he has been to the bowl 3-4 times. We are mixing his food with water too.


I do know that his creatinine levels were 2.7 when they tested him Wednesday last week and they were 4.9 this evening. He has lost almost a full pound this week too. He has been wobbly since before we took him in, which she said was a sign that the toxins could be in his central nervous system. Maybe we need to pick up some fluids and give it one last go before we decide to throw in the towel. I will say that this is not our regular vet. He was out today. He is pretty good about doing whatever he can to help us get these guys well. When he says we are done, we know we are done. Perhaps it would do us some good to wait and get with him before we make any decisions we can't take back.

 

Antibiotic RESISTANT? Oooh boy that's a whole new can of worms - it could've potentially went to the kidneys. Did they ID the bacteria, or is it a virus?

Its possible on the toxin level but what was his white blood cell count, last...? It could be the infection, the build up of bad kidneys or it could be sepsis too. Or a little of one or all, plus not eating much and being weak and sick feeling in general.

Yeah if Boozle was my baby, I'd wait for your usual vet - hopefully he's back and soon? Have him review everything. Have you tried syringe feeding? It's so up in the air.. *sigh* So hard to say what might happen, but if you can syringe feed even a little bit (with added water) it might make Boozle feel a bit better, until the next vet visit. Or give treats - just spoil the heck out of him in any way you can, he'd appreciate that and I'm sure it would do you and your Brian good too.

 

I just graduated in May. Much of the stuff with his teeth happened while I was still in school, and Brian took care of most of it. Unfortunately that means that I wasn't there to ask those sort of questions. I can ask him these questions, but his memory is so bad, he can hide his own easter eggs, so I will probably need to write these questions down and contact the vet.

He has now lost control of his bladder. :/ He just went to the litter box, so he isn't avoiding it. He is peeing while he is sleeping. I was syringe feeding, but that got tedious and he wasn't getting much for the struggle, so I just started scooping it out and putting it in his mouth. Much quicker and easier for him. He actually ate some on his own, too.

 

I just went through this with Chuck yesterday.
Peeing in his sleep, not eating when he's usually a pig, weak, lazy, drinking insane amounts of water. His urine was dilute with pretty high protein in it. He was breathing fast, hard and labored.
His kidneys got worse so much faster than we expected.
I think your right that it's probably kidney related and not good.
I'm sorry your kitty is so sick.

 

That's pretty much where we are tonight. He didn't drink much all day, but he is soaking it up tonight.

Hugs for your kitty, too.

 

I had to send him to the rainbow bridge yesterday afternoon.

 

I'm sorry. I know that was hard. Not letting them suffer really is the last kindness we can do for them.

 

So sorry to hear about Chuck. It is good you were with him at the end and I am sure it brought him comfort. Too many really sick kitties lately, very sad. We are thinking of you.

 

Sorry you’re going through this. Here’s a great site with lots of info concerning kidney disease
https://www.felinecrf.org/
Unless there’s heart problems, daily fluids can help a lot. If you can, post a copy of the bloodwork results. Maybe someone here can help you interpret them.

 

We are still chugging along this afternoon. He seems to be feeling better (which is a relative term, but I will take it, for now) Sugar looks decent and he is back to eating his normal amount, which was not enough. Vet said he wanted to see him eating at least a can a day, so I managed to get the rest in him by sticking it in the roof of his mouth. He's annoyed but doing well with it. His vet will be in early PM, so he is going back for eval and fluids. It has only been a week, and I think we are both feeling like we haven't done enough or tried hard enough, so we are going to give him a little longer and try a little harder. Maybe it is all for naught, but at the end of this road, we have to feel good about the decision. We have not really tried assisted feeding or giving fluids at home, so I am thinking we try that for a short time and if his body doesn't respond, then maybe we can feel comfortable with letting him go.

 

I appreciate all of the feedback and support. It's been a hard week or so. It's nice to be with people who get it.

 

This is what I was going to ask you about!

 

I can tell you from personal experience that giving subQ fluids at home is less daunting than you think.

 

Yeah, Frank had to have them every other day and it really wasn't a big deal. We've had such bad luck lately that it seems like we have been running a hospice for cats, rather than a rescue. I guess it isn't even really bad luck, since most of these guys are up there, like 18-22 year-olds. We just need to have better attitudes, rather then letting it make us feel hopeless and feeling sorry for ourselves.

We picked up fluids tonight. We took him in and let them do it tonight and we will start tomorrow. I think she said 100ml, at least, per day. Good news is he is eating on his own today. He took down 2/3 of what I left him, which is more than he has eaten in one sitting. So -- that is something. We continued the cerenia and added cypoheptadine. Maybe that is doing the trick.

 

If you are running a rescue for cats, hats off to you. If they are older and some are sick, at least they had you to try for them. Don't beat yourself up, so many poor homeless kitties, only so much you can do. Seriously, if they are warm and fed that may be better than they would have had. Anyone that tries to help animals in unfortunate circumstances is a hero in my book, and there are a lot of them here.