Help for Molly #4

Thread from high numbers Molly # 1, 2, 3

 

I see the pink this AM. Give her 1 u according to the plan discussed last night. Make sure you get a before bed test tonight to have that bit of data. You can leave food out for her today and maybe research automatic pet feeders. One of those could be very useful. This one is popular among FDMB members who use a feeder. It would allow you to feed her overnight too.
https://www.amazon.ca/PetSafe-PFD11...=1550581927&sr=8-2&keywords=pet safe 5 feeder

 

Oh my I gave her 1.25 units this morning

 

Not a problem. With that high-ish pink PS she'll be fine. Leave some food out for her.

We probably weren't crystal clear on dosing for today. The drop to 1 u was for the lower PS last night. I'm glad you got that evening +2 test. All these numbers help us figure out Molly's responses to insulin. In the days ahead we'll want to decide on a dose the can be given both AM and PM because Lantus works better if the dosing doesn't change frequently.

Good luck at your new job!

 

I had to give her puffer last night. She was coughing maybe that’s why she’s higher this morning?
Thank you I’m excited on the new job.

 

Good evening ladies Molly is 6.7 do I give her insulin? @Kris & Teasel @MrWorfMen's Mom

 

Can you stall for 20 minutes and retest without feeding Molly? Want to see if her BG is rising or not on its own.

 

Ok so at 620?

 

Yes that's fine. I'll be here.

 

That's exciting!

 

5.7 husband gave her a little kibble when he got home.

 

How long ago did she have the kibble? We need to know if that BG is food influenced because she is even lower now than she was.

 

5pm so about an hour/ half ago

 

Ok so both the 6.7 and 5.7 are food influenced, it's higher carb food and she is down lower than she's ever been to our knowledge. My vote is to skip tonight.
@Kris & Teasel - do you agree?

 

Sorry he was home from work before me tonight. He spoils her way too much! Wouldn’t her BG be going up instead of down?

 

I agree that skipping tonight is the best choice. It will probably be best to drop the dose to 1 u tomorrow AM, numbers permitting.

 

One would expect it to go up rather than down after munching on those yummy kibble bits but she hasn't which makes one wonder what her BG would be if she had NOT had the kibble.

 

Ok that was my next question about tomorrow morning.

 

Oh boy don’t scare me

 

Exciting times but we have to stay on top of things especially with you away all day at work. I hope it went well on your first day.

 

I agree that taking the dose down to 1.0u tomorrow AM would be a good idea, BG numbers permitting.

 

I came home at lunch too. Tested her I was worried about her.

 

She's fine! Imagine if you had stayed at that high dose the vet had recommended?

 

First day was great today! Thank you
But I did travel in to see if Molly was ok. Did a test my husband was working out of town today. I traveled in to see how she was doing.

 

Ya I know I’ve been thinking about that high dose! Wow

 

Sorry Adrienne. I did not mean to scare you......those lower numbers are a very good sign and we'll help you keep that little cutie safe!
I noticed the test mid day. Is this something you can do easily or was just today due to worry?

 

It’s ok I just wonder why it’s lower. I know you ladies will keep our baby safe. There are days I can travel in. Depending on weather. Today the weather and roads were good. I can travel in tomorrow depending on weather. Tuesday and Thursdays I can’t. I only take half hour lunch those days.

 

It sometimes takes some time before you see the changes that occur as the higher carb food is lessened. It likely that Molly's BG is just starting to show us what a difference the lower carb diet can make for her. That's why Kris and I suggested making the food transition gradually and watching the dose as we go. Did Molly eat as usual today......other than the "extra" treat from DH?

 

She had kibble this morning only a little and FF. She hasn’t had any SO wet for a few days now. She had freeze dried treats. At lunch only a few kibbles and a FF. I put her remaining kibble up before I left at lunch time. Then DH lol put the remaining kibble down for her. I gave her FF tonight after her testing. She’s been playing and running around. I’m going to put more FF down before bedtime. A few kibbles

 

As I thought. The food change is starting to have a tangible effect now. For the next couple of days, keep the same quantity of kibble as you are now giving Molly so we can see how she does on the lower 1.0u dose without any further diet change for a couple of days. You're doing great Adrienne and Molly is definitely making progress.
Please take a BG reading before bed tonight just so we can see what she is up to without her shot tonight.

 

Thanks I’m feeling better about everything. I see Molly is too. I’ll test her in an hour. I really appreciate what you ladies are have done to help me.

 

And we like seeing the progress you’re making.

 

So 1 unit this morning?

 

Yes. Let's see how she does with that. When you have to be away at work all day extra caution is needed. You're still learning her responses to Lantus with her new feeding routine.

@MrWorfMen's Mom recommended keeping her food the same as you've been doing for the next few days while you try out the 1 u dose. That's a good plan.

 

Given the low PMPS and the skipped shot last night, that AMPS is not bad at all. Let's see what she does with the 1u dose.

 

Ok I’m going to drive in for lunch today, I’ll test her while I’m home

 

Those pinks are bounce numbers. Nice yellow PMPS! Were you less nervous about leaving her today?

Stick with the 1 u for now and keep her feeding routine the same.

 

Yes, less nervous about leaving her. I work out of town now. Not as close as I use to be. Hubby will be home tomorrow at lunch, so he can feed her FF .

Ok will keep everything the same for now

 

Do I give her insulin this morning? @Kris & Teasel @MrWorfMen's Mom

Had a hard time getting on here this morning

 

She’s an half hour late with dose? Do I give her insulin?

 

I think you can go ahead and give her the 1u. Hubbie is going to test mid cycle today correct? Feed her the same as yesterday this morning and have hubbie give her some FF at lunch time. You can also leave a tiny bit of food out for her to nibble on in the meantime.

 

Yes, give her 1 u. The half hour won't be a problem. You can give her evening shot 15 minutes closer to the 12 hour mark, even 30 minutes.

I had a problem getting on this AM too.

 

He won’t test her

 

I think they are doing some site maintenance early in the morning. I've had some problems getting on in the AM before too.

 

Here's a heads up for some homework this Saturday or Sunday. I assume you're off one or both of those days. It would help us going forward if you do a full curve at this 1 u dose and feeding her in the same way as you have been. A curve often involves a BG test every 2 hours between AMPS and PMPS. I think good data can be gathered with every 3 hours as well. So - you'd do this:
AMPS - no food for the 2 hours beforehand
+3 - normal snacks before and after (whatever your usual routine is)
+6 " "
+9 " "
PMPS ( no food for the 2 hours beforehand)

If you're game to try testing every 2 hours that's even better data-wise: AMPS / +2 / +4 / +6 / +8 / +10 / PMPS. No food in the 2 hours before AM and PMPS.

 

Ok so have Hubbie feed Molly the FF and leave a tiny bit more food out for her to nibble in the PM. Is Hubbie reluctant to test? It would be very helpful if he could learn to test her. Maybe work on him this weekend?

 

I can try but I don’t think he wants to learn.

 

Do what you can. It's so much easier if there are two people to test, etc. Less worry all around.

 

Well if he'll come home at lunch to feed her, then it sounds like he participates in her care and testing is just another part of her care now. As Molly's BG improves, it would really be helpful if he could grab a test on those days when he comes home to feed her. Maybe a special dinner to bribe him???

 

Lol he said no with his work schedule. Some days he’s gone at camp or working 15hr days.

 

Some day ...

 

He was almost in tears when he seen me test her the first time.

 

AHHHHH! Was he upset thinking it was bothering Molly or is he hypersensitive to needles or blood or both?

 

He obviously loves that little girl!

 

He thinks it bothers her, and feels bad for her.

 

Yes, he loves her very much

 

It’s been a busy day I just updated the SS.

 

I was late again with the dosage last night. 645 so I can give her insulin at 630 this morning? Is that how it works?

 

Yes, you can do that. I see your data. The curve on the weekend will give us a good idea of where to go next. Let us know which day you'll do it.

 

I’ll do my curve tomorrow. Every two hours?

 

Yes every 2 hours for 12 hours would be great! And usual no food for 2 hours prior to pre-shot tests still applies. Feed Molly as you normally would.

 

If you're up for that it would be ideal. If you find she gets cranky with testing that often, aim for +2, +4, +6 at the minimum, along with the PSs of course.

 

8.2 this morning do I give her insulin?

 

Can you stall without feeding her for 30 minutes to see if she is rising on her own or still dropping?

 

Sure! I had to feed her some FF or she won’t sit still. No kibble!

 

Well the FF will alter the picture a bit too. How much did you bribe her with?

 

Couple tbsps she’s not looking for the kibble, which is surprising I’m going to test her now.

 

Here are my two cents:

• Lantus tends to be slowish in onset and she's had some food so her BG should be OK in a couple of hours if you give 1 u now.
• This is a curve day so an ideal time to "test the limits" and see how she does.
• You're still learning how Lantus works in Molly with her new diet but it's quite possible to give a full dose on a PS of 8.2 especially when you're home to monitor.
• It's better to find out right now how she responds when you give a full dose on a lower than usual PS so you can adjust the dose (if necessary) before you go back to work Monday.
• You might actually see dark green numbers if you give the full 1 u dose and that's what you want for her. The first exposure to them is scary but better to see them when you can keep a close eye on her.

 

You were going to do a curve today.... is that still in the plan? If so, I think you can shoot the 1u and see what she does.

Oh I see Kris is thinking along the same lines.

 

Ok it jumped quite a bit!

 

That would be a big food bump from LC so I think Molly must have been back on her way up on her own anyway.

 

Ok I’ll test her in a couple hours again. I gave her a few kibble not much after the second test.
I’m scared to see the green!

 

The first green can be scary but you get used to them. You are monitoring today anyway so there's nothing to be scared about. There is a some cushion built into the numbers we use around here so dark green numbers are very safe.

 

Did you give her 1 u this AM? She's doing OK so far but you forgot to put the dose on your SS.

 

Yes, sorry went back to bed forgot to put the dose in. SS is updated

 

Yesterday's BG numbers seem "normal" and not bounce inflated so I think they give you a decent picture of what the 1 u dose can do. It seems to be a safe dose for Molly while you're at work if she continues responding to it in a similar way in the days ahead. Fluctuations in response can happen but she has a lot of room to drop.

Eventually you want to nudge her BG range down so that her low numbers are in the 5 to 7 range more of the hours after the dose. That can be approached slowly and cautiously. @MrWorfMen's Mom ?

 

I agree the 1u dose looks good for now. I don't want to sound like a broken record but getting a BG test in before bed would round out the picture more. I think this dose also allows for a bit of room for continuing to reduce the kibble, just a little at a time. Getting Molly off the kibble will no doubt bring those numbers down a little more.

 

Ok she’s on 1/4 cup of kibble now. How much do I cut back?
I wanted to do a bedtime test, hubby was upset with all the testing yesterday!
What do I test her today at?

 

If you can talk to hubby at the right time in the gentlest possible way about the good you're doing for Molly with that extra testing it might help. You won't be testing that often every day. I can tell you from personal experience that one of the complications of diabetes, diabetic ketoacidosis, is very scary to deal with, very expensive to treat in hospital and can be life threatening for the kitty. I'm not saying this to scare you but the consequences of unregulated BG can be serious in the short term or the long term. The BG testing truly is "short term pain for long term gain". And that short term pain is much more for the human than the kitty - guaranteed.

 

DH is obviously very fond of that little girl but I agree with Kris......he needs to understand the testing will keep her safe and get her healthier.
I'd test her at +3 and if she's not dropped much, I'd test again around +8. If she has dropped a fair bit, then do a +5.
If she is down to 1/4 cup per day, then I'd measure the 1/4 cup and remove a small tsp or so each day from the total allowance. So today remove 1 tsp, next day 2 tsp etc. until you get down to 1/8 cup. Then repeat removing tsp per day until you've removed the kibble totally. Little reductions should make it easier on Molly while avoiding any sudden changes to BG.

 

Maybe measure out the 1/4 cup and remove a set number of kibbles daily. You can decide how many makes up a small reduction. Do that daily until there's no more kibble. Stick to the 1 u dose during this reduction time.

For today maybe try for one BG in the +5 to +7 range and one before bed (along with PSs of course).

 

@MrWorfMen's Mom great minds think alike!

 

Yes DH loves his little girl. But I will talk to him about the bedtime testing.
She has ate quite a bit of the kibble this morning. But she has come along way from a full dish of kibble every day. Now to only 1/4 cup a day of kibble. I noticed she has gained weight. Looks better!

 

Are you putting down all the kibble at once to allow her to graze or do you dole it out over the course of the day? If the former, then try doling it out. Give her half in the morning and half at night. You can leave down what she doesn't eat right away but it might make for a little more consistent intake of kibble and keep her from loading up on it all in a short period of time.

 

This morning I put all the 1/4 cup down. But when I’m working I divide the 1/4 cup half in the morning and half at night.

 

Hubby was up early this morning. Gave Molly kibble before I tested her AMPS.

 

You really need to reel that overly sympathetic hubbie of yours in. Read him the riot act for me! HAHAHAHAHA!

 

Bad hubby!

 

He knows what he did was wrong. He went to work couple hours later he texted me. Wanted to know what Molly’s sugars were. So I had a feeling he fed her and sure enough he did. So she’s had more than enough kibble today.

 

Very bad!

 

Do I give her insulin this morning? @Kris & Teasel @MrWorfMen's Mom

 

I decided not to give Molly insulin this morning. As you can tell by her numbers on the SS. She only had a few kibble this morning and some FF. Hopefully she’ll be ok while I’m at work today.

 

She's doing well, Adrienne. Don't worry. Occasionally we won't see your first post and you have to do what you're comfortable with. I see she continued to drop up until +2. Did she have that kibble and FF before the +1 and +2 tests? If she had eaten and continued to drop a little that's very interesting.

 

Yes she had kibble before the +1 and +2 tests, I’m a little confused about that. Where yesterday she was pink. But she had all the 1/4 cup of kibble in the morning yesterday. Will she be ok? Without a shot this morning? I don’t leave for another 40 min

 

Their patterns can be confusing at times. That's why we like to see that BG test data from key times in the cycle. Continuing to drop a little after eating can be a good sign that her pancreas *might* be working a little bit. It's too soon to tell for sure though.

A diabetic kitty's pancreas can work a little from time to time and, for some, that increases and leads them into remission. They're still diabetic but are a diet controlled diabetic. Feeding only low carb wet food is critical in that situation. It would be wonderful if Molly got there but it takes time to see if that's in the cards.

 

The kibble can still mess with her BG depending on when and how much she gets. That's why @MrWorfMen's Mom and I have been recommending a slow elimination of it. You have enough data on your SS now to see the BIG change in her BG numbers and insulin dose that food has caused.

 

Ok so no insulin this morning? She’s late now fir that.
It would be great if she did go into remission. I’ll be coming home for lunch today. Nothing to worry about while I’m gone?

 

Two choices: no insulin or try 0.5 u if you feel brave because you can go home at lunch. If she's an hour late or so it's not a problem. You can back up the time over the next few shots.

 

I’ll pass on the insulin for this morning. I wouldn’t feel comfortable leaving her. But I’m still coming home for lunch.

 

It's always your choice, Adrienne. You can try giving insulin on a lower PS on a day off sometime.