How long before you saw an improvement?

Hi guys,

Yoshi is on 2 units 2x per day. He was diagnosed almost a week ago. Part of the reason I brought him in was that his back legs were unstable. He seemed to be doing well, and started walking on his toes instead of the heels. Hes active in the am before I give him his shot. Well, not super active, but on the bed and meowing and being semi normal. After I give him the shot hes a little tired.

He's been moving a bit slower yesterday and today.

The vet has him scheduled to come in in 2 weeks to check his levels. I'm not home testing yet. Was going to after the vet.

I guess I'm asking how long before you saw a steady improvement? Do they kind of show down a bit after the insulin kicks in?

 

I'm at work so I can't watch his every move.

 

Honestly, most of the improvement I saw was in the numbers. My cat didn't have the weakened legs, but it sounds like you're already seeing the improvement there. Gypsy didn't have a lot of physical symptoms (other than a UTI) so what I looked for in her was to see what her BG levels were to see if she was getting better or not.

I'm not sure what the moving slower is about. I think once you start home testing, it'll be easier to see what's going on. It's possible the insulin is bringing him down pretty low and making him feel lethargic. I know you want to start home testing after the vet, but the sooner you start the better. That way, he won't be going super low for 2 weeks (if that's even what is happening).

 

Hi Rachel,

Thank you. I am thinking of monitoring sooner, but I see there are so many meters available. I'm overwhelmed again. Yoshi is not a fan of his ears being touched, so I need something quick that doesn't take a lot of blood and hopefully no scary sounds.

Does anyone have any suggestions?

I want to cry again

 

You can work on doing some desensitization exercises with him, we can help explain. Popular meter choice is a human meter by Walmart, ReliOn Confirm or Micro. The pet meter, AlphaTrak 2 might take a little smaller sample but the test strips are about $1 each. They have options to turn off the beeps too.

Maury's walking was the trigger for me to get him checked as well. Unfortunately, he still is walking on his hocks more than I had hoped by now. Only see minor improvements. Even his front paws are still full contact with the ground, not on his toes yet.

I do wonder about the lethargic state, especially with him being on 2U and not being home tested. I hope he's not going too low. Like Rachel said.

 

No, no, don't cry!!!! I don't want to be cause of that. The relion does take a small sample of blood. It's not very much at all. And no scary sounds!

My suggestion: research meters some and go buy one and the lancets and strips. Then come home and learn to test by testing yourself. Work on those desensitization exercises with Yoshi. And when you go to the vet, ask them to show you how they test. That might help some.

 

No, you weren't the cause. I'm just overwhelmed with all the options, and probably still getting used to his diagnosis.

 

I'm not an emotional person but I had a couple cry sessions in the first week of his diagnosis

 

One step at a time then. How about focus on what meter you want to get first? No worry about testing or anything else..just getting the meter so you have it when you're ready. Some folks use the AT2 from their vet...the strips are more expensive, and a human meter works just as well, but if you prefer that one, that's fine.

I used the relion confirm from WalMart. Some people prefer the micro because I think it takes a little less blood. Good options with cheap strips (and always open when you need more!). You could look into those different options OR go by a pharmacy or walmart...and ask a pharmacist about it. They should be able to talk you through the pros and cons of any of them.

 

I actually think the Micro is just a smaller meter. The test strip box always says Confirm/Micro. New member, Lucy, posted this chart:

 

Frank is newly diagnosed as well. He's not a friendly guy, but I've cut his treats completely out, so now the only way he gets a "treat" (which is really just the glycobalance dry food) is when we're testing at home. It wasn't difficult for me at all. I put him on the floor and kind of straddle him, prick his ear (no scary noise with the Relion lancet), make sure there's a decent drop of blood, insert the test strip into the Relion Prime, and test. The whole process takes about 60 seconds, honestly. It's so easy! I feel so much more in control of what's going on now, since I can see his progress at intervals during the day. The bit of control really helped me come to terms with the diagnosis, and gave me confidence that it is absolutely something that I can and will handle for him. I was even able to guess he'd be in the 400s at his visit today (which he was) and kind of thought they'd increase his dose (which they are).

As for the meter, the options are overwhelming, so like Rachel said above, just pick one. Look at the meter cost and the test strip costs, and that will help you go in the right direction. (I'm new to this testing thing, but probably go through about 4-8 strips a day, so consider that when you price the cost out.) If you're unsure on home testing, practice on yourself first, and you'll see how easy it is. Or get the meter and take it in to the vet with you next time you go, and have them show you how to use it.

My vet had me back today (diagnosis was last Wednesday)...I'm surprised yours is waiting that long. I had immediate noticeable improvement with Frank, but he was also in the middle of a DKA episode when I took him in, so that could explain the immediate improvement. But regardless, good luck with kitty. The amount of info is overwhelming, so just focus on one thing at a time!

 

I noticed that Jones slept a lot in the beginning after his food and shot. He had moments of being Jonesy but then he just would curl up and sleep. He had other medical issues and extreme weight loss to start with and I was really upset. In the end, he is better - he is gaining weight, eating well, comes for cuddles and.....sleeps. I think sometimes they need that down time for their body to repair and take in that energy that their body has been starved of for so long. Just like when you have a cold. I found the less I worried...just came and gave a quick check and a pet or two, the better I felt because I could confirm he was fine and he felt better as he could continue his nap in the sun by the window.

 

I have a call into the vet. I'm thinking of running to Walmart to get a kit but still researching which is best - less blood no sounds

 

He was running really high at the vet last week. Like 575. She took the average of fluctoseamine or whatever and said that he was averaging 600s. So I can't imagine him being low although I'm not feeding as much pee the vet. They are trying to get him to lose 2 pounds

 

*per

 

I use the AlphaTrak II pet meter and really like it. It's fast and takes the tiniest blood size and I like that I'm getting the same readings as the vet... it's the same one they use. The downside is the cost of the strips at about a dollar each. (I get them on adwdiabetes.com with a $5 off coupon code and it comes to $48 for 50.) It can add up when you do 4-8 tests a day. Before she went into remission I was spending $150/month on test strips... HOWEVER, once I started testing I no longer had to bring my cat to the vet for anything, so I figured it was a wash as I would easily spend that on doing a monthly curve at the vet. You can turn off the sounds, and I always poke the lancet by hand rather than use a device. Most cats don't like the device. You can buy a starter kit on amazon for a decent price, but you'll need more strips than the 20 or so that come with it.

That being said, if cost were a big issue for me I would have instead gotten the Relion Micro... again for it's small required blood sample and relatively inexpensive strips. the downside being the readings weren't the same as my vet as human readers are configured for human blood and therefore run significantly lower than pet meters, esp. at higher numbers.

whichever meter you get, make sure you buy 28 gauge lancets. the size 30 are way too tiny to get a blood sample esp. in the beginning. I buy ones from adwdiabetes.com that come 100 for $1.19. Can't beat that price.

 

Thank you. You can only get the alpha track at the vet, I assume? Or online? I don't really want to wait. I got home and he was kind of weak and starving so I gave him some wet food

 

If you have amazon prime you can get a starter kit same day. https://www.amazon.com/AlphaTRAK-Bl...phatrak 2 blood glucose monitoring system kit

 

To answer your original question... I started seeing improvements within about two weeks or so, but then after another few weeks she started to decline in energy and grooming again. At the time I wasn't testing. I called my vet and she suggested I up her dose to 2 units. i was nervous about doing that blind, so six weeks into diagnosis I finally started testing. I wish I had started from day one. It took about 10 days to really get the hang of testing... it was frustrating in the beginning, but so so so worth it. I know I wouldn't have been able to get her numbers down as quickly as she did had I not been testing.

 

I just ordered it. I'm getting it tomo. I couldnt get it same day. He seems less freaked out after he ate. Waiting for vet to see if I should give him his evening shot or not.

Thank you to everyone who responded to this thread. I'm really scared to home test, and I wanted to wait for the vet, but I don't want to be in a constant state of panic not home testing until I see the vet in 2 weeks.

 

Thank you. I just ordered the meter. I absolutely loathe the idea of testing him, but I can't be in a constant state of panic not knowing how he's doing. Now I know why you all home test.

 

Uh oh I don't know what size lancet came with the kit. I have to check. Thanks for all your advice

 

If you are nervous that the dose may be too high, give just 1 unit... that's the typical starting dose. 2 units is a little high for just starting. better to err on the side of caution since you aren't testing tonight.

 

Thank you!!

 

it was the encouragement of the folks on this board that gave me the confidence to try it... and you know what? It really is no big deal. I use a cosmetic cotton pad behind the ear and just freehand poke the sweet spot which is the area on the very outside edge of the ear. if your cat is squirmy that flick the drop onto the back of your fingernail and test from there rather than holding the meter up to her ear. it literally takes a min from start to finish.

 

You are like a wiz at this!!! I thought 2 was too high too, but vet said he's a big guy 15lbs. I also questioned not testing for 3 weeks. She said it was fine. I think I'm going to switch vets. The place is insanely expensive as well.

 

That fingernail trick is brilliant! It won't harm the results?

 

28 comes with the kit. it's a perfect size... you don't have to buy their brand lancets when you need more. I buy very cheap ones. https://www.adwdiabetes.com/product/trueplus-sterile-lancets-28g-100ct_8013.htm

 

nope.

 

I'm officially not a fan of this vet. The vet tech called and said to continue with the two units and to keep giving him the gabapentin for his back legs. The problem w that is when I give it to him he gets sleepy and I can't tell if it's his gluecose or pain meds. The vet tech told me I didn't have to start home testing and that if that's the route I want to take that I should email the doctor. Which I am. Like now

 

One more thing to add to your testing kit is a tube of neosporin ointment with pain relief. You can put a bit on his ears afterwards.

I know you're nervous but let me tell you, most of the time my cat doesn't react at all.... Not sure she always feels it. Sometimes she will wiggle her ear for a second, but that's it. She purrs through the process and loves the extra attention.

 

I don't get vets that are anti test. My vet said basically some do test, most don't but that it's up to me. When I told her the next month I decided to test she was thrilled. A dr would never advise a parent to give their diabetic child insulin without testing....not sure why some vets expect pet owners to shoot blind.

 

Janet, do those lancets fit in the AT2 lancet device?

 

Glad you ordered a meter! I think with the AT 2 you can use Freestyle Lite strips too to make it a bit cheaper.. @Kris & Teasel can tell you more about that one.

It's so scare at first, and then you realize...the cat is really fine. You're the one who is most upset! Gypsy came running at test time and just sat patiently waiting...she'd only fuss if I took too long!

I'd watch a few YouTube videos tonight of testing...that will help get your confidence up. You can do this!

 

I use Freestyle Lite test strips in my AT2 as well . The important thing if you go that route is to do comparison tests between AT strips and FSL strips. @Tuxedo Mom uses them in her AT meter as well. Second thing is to keep the AT strips code when using FS strips. Don't use the FS test codes as they are for humans. I'm not as good as explaining lol.

 

They look to be the same size and it says they fit most devices so probably, but I haven't tried them in the device. I started freehand poking after week 2 and found that worked better for me.

 

I freehand poke as well, I just use the device to hold the lancet

 

Hi @Stressedcatmom! How are you doing today? Did the meter arrive? Anything we can do to help?

 

You guys are geniuses. I never thought to free hand poke, lol. Started that today with much better results!

 

Yes it's much easier to aim

 

Gabapentin can cause lethargy.

 

Hi guys. It arrived. I'm staring at it now. I'm catching up on all your posts. I think I'm going to try tonight so I'm sure I'll be posting in a panic. So you test right before the shot? And I read something somewhere that they can't eat before you test? How long do you wait after they eat to test?

 

What do you mean freehand poke? He's doing much better btw, which is why I'm waiting to start till tonight.

 

What time/time zone will you be testing?
1. Two hours before that time, pick up all food so they don't eat during the two hour window before the test.
2. Test - start a little early since it may take a couple of tries.
3. Post here if you need dose advice.
4. Feed - cats need to eat before they get insulin
5. Shoot.
6. Pour yourself a glass of wine/cup of tea.

 

His shot is scheduled for 730 central time. I know about the food before the insulin, but I usually give him a wet food snack around 5 or so cuz he's starving

Thank you!!!

 

Freehand poke means that you take the little plastic lancet - the sharp part - and just use it in your hand, instead of using the little pen-like tool.

So use this (after you twist the round part off to expose the sharp part):

Don't use this:

 

You guys are the best. How hard do you poke? I don't want to go through his ear

 

I'm trying to make him be friends with it. He got up and walked away :/

 

The reason is that the pen thing makes it hard to get the lancet aimed correctly for the edge of the ear. It's too easy to mis-align and hit the vein (not a big deal, but it will make a lot of blood), or to hit your finger instead of the ear. Also, the pen makes a click noise that scares some cats. If you just use the bare lancet it's silent and let's you aim more precisely.

 

I will for sure try to freehand. At the vet when he was diagnosed it made a noise that scared us both

 

Ideally, you poke just enough to get blood, but I pierce is ears fairly often. It doesn't seem to make much difference to him either way. It's a good idea to put a little cotton ball or cotton cosmetic square on the opposite side of his ear in case you do go through to protect yourself. I wouldn't worry about going through for awhile. Right now just get comfortable with testing, you can refine your aim as time goes on.

 

You might try doing a test or two on yourself this afternoon so that you are confident with how the meter works, and getting it all managed before you try it on your cat. Just remember that while it does hurt our fingers, most cats aren't hurt at all by the testing, so don't let how it feels to you make you worry about how it will feel to your kitty.

I usually insert the strip part way - not enough to set off the meter, just enough so I can push it in with one hand while I'm holding Sam's ear with the other hand. Then I poke his ear and get the bead of blood, then push in the strip and put it up to the blood.

If Sam's getting wiggly, I'll scoop the blood onto my fingernail so he can be free, and then test from there.

 

My luck if I test myself I'll find out I have cat diabetes

 

PS Yoshi is beautiful! So elegant!!

 

Thank you. I love him so much.

 

I'm going to the ballet tonight, so I'll be gone during your test/shoot time. Hopefully some others will be around for you, and if not, you can post on the main forum. There are always people out there who can help!

 

Thank you! Have fun tonight!!

 

Oops, one more thing: If you can, warm up his ear before you test. Some people put a little uncooked rise in the toe of a small sock, and then heat it in the microwave and hold it up to his ear. Other people just make sure their own hands are nice and warm first, and then rub their cats ear. Just something to get the blood flowing in their ears more. If I don't do that first, I can't get any blood at all from Sam. We do live in a colder climate, and I keep the house a bit cool, so if you're someplace warm this may be less important.

 

*rice, not rise. Ah typos....

 

I heard that you put a little Vaseline on the ear prior to make the blood bead up?

 

Some people do put a dab of vaseline or neosporin on to make the blood bead up. I did with the neosporin and found the beading very helpful.

I should be around at 7:30...I'm in Central Time also, so I'll try to look in on you around then.

Until then, I do agree with Djamila about testing yourself first to make sure you know how it works. Then maybe try to get a look at his ears with a flashlight to see where the sweet spot is. And watch a few videos about testing. All that really helped me! And most of all, try not to be stressed! It's not the end of the world and if you can't get it the first time, walk away for a few minutes and then try again. It's tough, but you both get used to it pretty fast.

 

If I test myself will I mess up the meter? Like with setting day time etc? Is it necessary to set all of this before every test or can I just bypass it.

Thank you!! I still can't believe what a great site this is with such great people!

 

No, you won't mess up the meter by testing yourself. It might not give an accurate reading of your human BG, that's all. All the meter settings stay where you set them as you use the meter - no need to reset. The only exception is the cat code number. Always check the cat code when you open a new vial because it might be different from the previous vial's. you'd have to put the new code into the meter.

Your kitty is a very handsome boy!

 

Love his expression in that picture lol. Also, just another input, I "freehand" poke but I do hold the lancet with the device, just don't use the click feature . Setting the time and date might be helpful until you get your spreadsheet up and going, so you have another record of date and time.

 

Don't be nervous.... You've got this.

 

No, the meter stored the date and it changes automatically. You can ignore it.

 

Thank you

 

Thanks :/ I'm going to try and rest in 15 min

 

He totally knows I'm up to something. What do you mean click feature?

 

I'm going in!

 

When you're done, push a closed lancet all the way into the lancet device and you'll feel a trigger set. Push the button, that's the click feature. If I set the trigger, I click it before I poke kitty so the lancet is just being held with my device.

 

He's at 346. I'm shaking. I did it freehand and he meowed when I pricked him. Then it was a bit of the struggle to get the blood to the meter.

 

At least I feel more comfortable knowing the insulin is helping him, and that he really does need it. I wonder if I poked too hard?

 

Does using the lancet help from over-poking? I forgot the neosporin. I'm going to run out and get some tonight.

 

GREAT JOB!!!! You did it!!! It's terrifying the first time, but you see that it isn't nearly as scary as you think. It'll get better each time too. Gypsy always meowed when I pricked her ear, but she never tried to run...she knew a treat was coming. I think it was her reminding me to give it.

I used the lancet device to hold the lancet, but never to prick...just to make it easier for me to freehand.

You got blood...I wouldn't worry about poking too hard. You'll get more used to it, but he really is fine. Did you give him a yummy treat after? Don't forget a treat for yourself too...you deserve a glass of wine!

 

I need 2000 glasses of wine! I gave him his wet food dinner immediately. Now the insulin.

Thank you Rachel and thanks to you all for being here for me!

Jen

 

Yes you did great, Jen!
Maury still meows when I poke most of the time but he stays put like Gypsy did for that treat .

Poking just how you did is probably the best way to not over-poke. Even on the lowest setting, I thought it would go too far in his ear. Never tried poking via click lol.

 

He's been on insulin like a week and he's at 346. Which is still high. He averaged in the upper 600's at the vet with the fluctocamene or whatever test. I hope the vet doesn't up his insulin.

 

The fructosamine is just an average of his glucose over the last several weeks...it's really not all that helpful. 346 is high, but not bad...remember that if the vet ups his insulin, you don't have to go with it. You can make decisions based on your tests at home. We'll be glad to help with that.

 

His glucose test at the vet was like 575, so he's gone down. I just hope he keeps going down...but not too far of course.

 

Did we give you the spreadsheet link yet? http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/
Will be super helpful if you do ask for dosing advice here

 

Someone mentioned it to me. I hate spreadsheets, but I'll try to set that up tomorrow. I'm going to head out in a bit for said wine.

 

lol. We have people here that can set it up for you. All you would have to do is enter numbers in proper place. Enjoy the wine

 

If he's squirming put the drop in the back of your nail and test from there.

 

Congrats on your first in home test! It gets easier! Frank is now at the point that he knows what's going to happen, but stays put with a bribe of dry kibble during the test. Then immediately after I give him is wet food (when testing right before his shot) and follow the test up with insulin. I don't know how your meter compares to mine, but we still get high numbers, even after increasing the dose on Friday. I know...I'm ready for numbers to drop right away, too. But think of how long some of these members have been here, and they're still working on getting it managed.
Wine tonight for sure! I haven't had a drink since Franks diagnosis....but I am tonight!

 

Jen! Great job!!! Congratulations on getting your first test done! I hope you enjoyed the rest of your evening!

 

Thank you. I actually stayed in (sans wine) and tested him again just now because I got scared. I had a minor freak out in the main health forum but he's at 243 +4.5. Crisis averted (I think)

 

Lol...I just went and peeked. That was a pretty mild freak out! In answer to your question, ideally you're looking for blue and green numbers in the middle of the cycle. I just realized that won't make sense until you have a spreadsheet....Blue numbers are between 100-199, and green numbers are 50-99 for a human meter. (Sorry, I'm not sure on the alphatrak since I don't have one - but it's on the spreadsheet) Getting to those numbers takes some time, so try to be patient. It's often said here that this is a marathon, not a sprint. I have to remind myself of that almost every day.

Most of the time if you test before +2, the number will be higher than the pre-shot because food makes the number go up. Because of that, I don't test before +2, and usually not before +3, but there are lots of people who do test even in those first hours. Just know if you do, and get a higher number, that that's normal. Generally cats on prozinc hit the nadir (lowest point) somewhere between +4 and +6, so you tested at a great time tonight. It will take a little while to figure out when Yoshi hits nadir - it's possible to be earlier or later than that, but for now you can guess sometime in that range.

Many of us give our cats food all day long (except for the two hours before a shot). If Yoshi seems hungry, it's fine to give him more food as long as it's low-carb. Especially before they're regulated, many kitties need some extra food, so unless Yoshi is overweight, you can generally feed as much as he wants.

 

Thank you. It was more of a freak out in my flooded head. He was hugging the meter and I thought it was a sign he was low. The vet wants him to lose two pounds, so he's on 3 cans of FF per day. I think he's at 15 now and she wants him at 12 or 13.

So nadir is the lowest and then the glucose rises after that? Is that kind of when the shot starts to wear off, after the nadir?

 

Hmm...I've always thought about it as the dose starting to slowly wear off, but I'm not sure if that's physiologically correct or not. Hopefully someone with more expertise on the science of this can weigh in on that. Typically, if you test throughout the cycle, the numbers should make sort of a smile shaped curve - higher number at pre-shot, slowly reducing until the nadir, and then slowly rising until the next pre-shot. Of course, there are many many variations in that, with some cats hitting nadir early or late, and some cats dropping or rising sharply at different times...but the smile-shaped curve is the most 'normal' pattern.

 

Sometimes you need to bring out the big guns - I vote for a martini! Good for you!

 

Prozinc nadir usually hits between +5 to +7. I know it's not much different than what Djamila said but if you test at +4 and then +5 is lower, it's still normal. The green for pet meter is 68 - 99, so just the lower ends change @Djamila . I looked at the template lol

 

I've been doing this today, as Frank has decided enough is enough. Great tip!!! Plus then I don't have to worry about him shaking his head and the drop flying off before I get the strip in the meter.

 

What kind soul would set up the spreadsheet?

 

@Marje and Gracie often volunteers her time to do this...and she's an SS guru!

 

There's no rush. I'm writing things down and I didn't test yesterday because I didn't have the neosporin. I'm at work now and I always worry about him while I'm gone since I can't leave food down because he's on his diet.

 

I can't recall - is Yoshi an only cat? If so you could break his daily food ration into multiple small meals that you put into an automatic feeder. That way he could have regular snacks without eating more than his weight loss ration.

 

No, I have another. His name is Seine. My concern is I won't know who eats what... I read somewhere that you can freeze the food and it will thaw as the day goes. Seems like a good idea. I put a can in the freezer last night and, of course forgot about it when I left this am.

 

Yes, people do freeze portions. And you're right - unless they each have their own microchipped feeder you won 't know who ate what.