INTERSTITIAL (IDIOPATHIC) CYSTITIS In My KETCHIE (female)

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (The Main Forum)' started by Jean and Charcoal, Feb 16, 2010.

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  1. Jean and Charcoal

    Jean and Charcoal Well-Known Member

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    I have been posting about Ketchie (my 14 year old tortie) on the Community forum, but I wanted to know if anyone has any advice or can tell me what you do for your own cats that have this mystifying illness???

    Last year I lost my 5 year old Proto when he blocked, after he had been through a year of terrible suffering from this disease.

    My Ketchie must have been in and out of the litter boxes (I have 9) at least 40 times this morning and my heart was in my throat, watching her suffering. Blood in her urine also. She is not on any antibiotics.

    I took her to my other vet (this afternoon) that dispenses Buprenex, because I only had about two doses left for her. My other vet has her on Metacam for five days, starting last Friday, but so far she has seemed the same. Both vet offices are consulting back and forth about Ketchie. confused_cat

    Today the other vet gave her 150 mls. of fluids, and she said we can try to flush out her bladder.

    Any suggestions or advice are appreciated, and especially prayers.

    Thanks! :dizcat
    Jean and Charcoal (GA)
     
  2. Larry and Kitties

    Larry and Kitties Well-Known Member

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    I would guess that the following has been done:
    a. X-rays/ultrasound of bladder to look for stones and abnormalities in the bladder.
    b. Looking at the urine sediment for abnormalities
    c. A urine culture to rule out infection.

    Other wise you are doing all that I know. My Patches used to have bloody urine. It was likely caused by my Smokey chasing her since it always occurred after "strange sounds" between the two.
     
  3. Jean and Charcoal

    Jean and Charcoal Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Larry for responding.

    No x-ray or ultra sound. Can't afford it really.

    Vet did a sterile urine sample Friday and saw just a few red blood cells, but nothing major or infectious.

    Ketchie is another very high strung cat, that gets very upset at weird noises, or the other two cats that chase her sometimes. Even her own brother, Schooner, who is not well, will chase her and they never did that before. So much of this disease is brought on by stress.

    She seems to be a little more settled at the moment.

    Thanks!
    Jean
     
  4. Jean and Charcoal

    Jean and Charcoal Well-Known Member

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    Picture I took yesterday of my Ketchie girl.

    [​IMG]
     
  5. JJ & Gwyn

    JJ & Gwyn Member

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    When my Gwyn had similar problems a couple years ago, my vet had us switch one of her arthritis meds from Cosequin to Dasuquin. From what I remember, it had stuff in it that helped protect the bladder lining better. I also had her on chlorpheniramine, to make it easier for her to urinate, as well as buprenex.

    We also added extra water to food; made extra bowls of water available elsewhere (on both ends of the house, both upstairs and downstairs) so that water was never far away; made sure the bowls were cleaned thoroughly and the water changed regularly; and added cat fountains.

    ((hugs)) to both of you --

    Jean and her Gwyn
     
  6. Cheryl and Winnie

    Cheryl and Winnie Well-Known Member

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    we had good luck with cosequin(small mammal cap BID) . Winnie was allergic to fish so we could not use the cat form of cosequin or dasq. It really keep the flares to a minimum for her.
    Best thing for flares: subQ fluids and bup.

    posted below on it's own thread about a webinar on the topic... the site may have info from the webinar.


    ps. was the sterile sample cultured?? If not, I would highly recommend doing that if possible.
     
  7. Jean and Charcoal

    Jean and Charcoal Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Thanks for the info Jean and Cheryl.

    I am going to start putting some glucosamine into Ketchie's wet food. I had asked the vet about that and she thought it was a good idea.

    The sample of urine, they made us wait while they did the sedimentation thing, but I guess that is not the same as being cultured? Let me know if you could.

    I will check out the webinar thing. Thanks.

    :)
     
  8. Hope + (((Baby)))GA

    Hope + (((Baby)))GA Senior Member Moderator

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    Jean, your vet did not do a culture.....that days several days to culture and see what, if anything, grows. Also, you state that Ketchie is high strung.

    Stress plays a large role in the development of feline idiopathic interstitial cystitis. Multimodal environmental modification is effective in reducing stress in cats.



    Indoor housing and stress have been linked to many problems in cats, including behavioral problems, inappropriate urination and urine marking, diabetes, hyperthyroidism, dental disease, obesity, separation anxiety disorders and urolithiasis (crystal or stone formation within the urine). Feline idiopathic interstitial cystitis is a urinary tract disorder in cats which also has been linked to indoor housing and increased stress levels.

    Feline Idiopathic Cystitis and Feline Interstitial Cystitis Defined
    Feline idiopathic cystitis is defined by pathological inflammatory changes which occur within the bladder and urethra of affected cats for which the cause is unknown. A portion of cats suffering from idiopathic cystitis exhibit changes within the bladder known as interstitial cystitis and these cats have been found to be particularly susceptible to stressful situations. In these cats, physiological changes in adrenocortical function consistent with a stress response have been documented, along with changes in behavior attributable to stress, such as a decrease in the overall activity level and an increase in hiding activity. It is thought that increased sensitivity to stress may be genetic in origin, thereby causing some cats to be genetically predisposed to developing feline interstitial cystitis.

    Types of Stress Which Contribute to Feline Interstitial Cystitis
    Determining what type of environment might become stressful for any given cat can be difficult to predict and stressors can vary considerably from one cat to another. Some situations which may become stressful for cats include:

    being housed indoors, which may lead to monotony and predictability within the cat's environment, causing boredom
    multi-cat households, where inter-cat aggression can become stressful
    changes in household routines, such as new members in the family, loss of a family member, addition of new pets, loss of existing pets, changes in work or school schedules for family members, changes in environment such as redecorating or renovating a part of the home
    visualizing other pets or wildlife outdoors through windows or doors
    Symptoms Associated with Feline Interstitial Cystitis
    Symptoms associated with feline interstitial cystitis are those common to most cases of feline lower urinary tract disease (FLUTD). These symptoms include:

    pain while urinating
    bloody urine
    urinating in inappropriate locations (i.e. outside the litter box)
    frequent attempts to urinate, often producing only very small quantities of urine with each attempt
    Multimodal Environmental Modification (MEMO) to Treat Feline Idiopathic Interstitial Cystitis
    Multimodal environmental modification (MEMO) is accomplished by making changes within the cat's environment which are designed to decrease the likelihood of the cat experiencing stress. MEMO includes making changes in the cat's physical environment and diet as well as instituting changes in the way the cat interacts with family members and other pets within the household. The Indoor Cat Initiative is an online resource created to help provide information for cat owners about enriching the lives of indoor cats through the use of multimodal environmental modification.
     
  9. Larry and Kitties

    Larry and Kitties Well-Known Member

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    I'm surprised why your vet recommended the change since the manufacturer's (Nutramax) website says that the FCHG49® glucosamine and TRH122® chondroitin sulfate is good for bladder health and that is the stuff that is in both Cosequin to Dasuquin.

     
  10. JJ & Gwyn

    JJ & Gwyn Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    I said:
    > When my Gwyn had similar problems a couple years ago, my vet had us
    > switch one of her arthritis meds from Cosequin to Dasuquin. From what
    > I remember, it had stuff in it that helped protect the bladder lining better.

    and Larry replied:
    > I'm surprised why your vet recommended the change since the manufacturer's
    > (Nutramax) website says that the FCHG49 glucosamine and TRH122
    > chondroitin sulfate is good for bladder health and that is the stuff that is in
    > both Cosequin to Dasuquin.

    From what I recall, the vet said Cosequin was good for this, but Dasuquin would probably be better, though I can't remember why. Maybe Dasuquin had more of the helpful stuff, or it might have been anti-inflammatories? -- I honestly don't remember. Gwyn had had her lower quarters paralysed for six weeks at the time so, while we were concerned about treating the cystitis, I didn't retain the details like I normally do. (We were more concerned about the not-walking / not-standing / getting her food+water + to-litterbox / preventing bedsores / etc.) But my notes from the period clearly indicate that we switched from Cosequin to Dasuquin to help cystitis at this time.
     
  11. Patticass & Tyler (GA)

    Patticass & Tyler (GA) Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Jean - ask your vet to look into a drug called propantheline. It was recommended years ago for Justin when he was having idiopathic cystitis and nothing was helping. My vet consulted with UC Davis who recommended we try it. It helped him quite a bit.
     
  12. Larry and Kitties

    Larry and Kitties Well-Known Member

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  13. Jean and Charcoal

    Jean and Charcoal Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Phooey!!! I just wrote a big long post and hit the interview and bam! It is gone!

    Okay, here we go again.... thank you Hope for all the good info that you posted. I really had not thought that a culture was done, but wanted to find out from others about that.

    Ketchie started in March of 2008 with IIC. She had gone 2 years with no trouble.

    Here is why, I believe:

    1. I now only have 5 cats.

    2. I lost 5 cats last year.

    3. Pecking order has changed. Gracie was the 'Queen' for 14 years!

    4. Jibber now thinks he is 'head cat'.

    5. May-Belle thinks she is 'head female cat'. (she and Jibber LOVE each other and play so much and chase each other, so no problem with those two at the moment)

    6. Schooner used to be nice to his sister, Ketchie. No more. He hisses at her.

    7. Ketchie thinks she is 'human'. She really acts as if she is 'above the others'.

    8. The last two big snowstorms have caused weird noises, and knocks at the door from neighbors who normally don't act like I exist.

    9. I have Ketchie in a bedroom most of the days lately, with the classical radio station on, which seems to help her.

    10. To go from 10 cats to 5 cats in less then a year, can really cause problems. I only have one floor, but before I lost so many, Ketchie just seemed fine, and no one really bothered her.

    So, with the changes, the STRESS became worse, and with her being predisposed to IIC, it reared its nasty head again.

    Vet said she would sell a bag of fluids and the needles, tubing etc. for 30 dollars. I really can't afford much more right now, but does anyone know if that is expensive? She said I could bring her in to the vet's once a week and she would do fluids for 10 dollars. I hate to stress Ketchie out though by dragging her to the vet's once a week.

    I intend to watch that Webinar webcasts starting later today or tonight.

    Thanks everyone for all the other info.

    Oh, Larry, I have Amitryptiline here for this use, when Proto was on it. I think it was partially the reason he went downhill over the 9 months he was on it. Side effects are not good, and he gained too much weight on it. I asked the vet yesterday about it, but she didn't seem to think I should use it in Ketchie. She gets more stressed out when I try to get a pill into her, and right now, I am lucky to get the Bupe into her.

    Patti, I will ask about that med you suggested. Thanks.

    :)
     
  14. Larry and Kitties

    Larry and Kitties Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    $30 for a bag of fluids with line and needles is a little high. You can buy a box of 12 bags for that price. Lines run about $5 each and needles about $5/100.
     
  15. Jean and Charcoal

    Jean and Charcoal Well-Known Member

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    Larry, is there anywhere special that you recommend to buy them?

    Thanks,
    Jean :)
     
  16. Larry and Kitties

    Larry and Kitties Well-Known Member

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  17. Venita

    Venita Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Jean,

    I have one bag of lactated ringer's I can send you, as well as an admin set and ten Terumo 20 gauge needles. If LRS is the fluids you need, send me a PM with you mailing address and I will get this stuff out in the mail or UPS to you ASAP.

    Let me know if there are any special delivery instructions, like "leave on porch if no one home."

    Venita
     
  18. Jean and Charcoal

    Jean and Charcoal Well-Known Member

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  19. Dana & Lily (GA)

    Dana & Lily (GA) Member

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    Sorry Jean that Ketchie isn't feeling good and is stressed. I have no advice to give, but just wanted to comment how gorgeous she is. I have a soft spot for Torties. My Lily (GA) was a Tortie....I miss her so much. Take care and hope all sorts itself out.
     
  20. Jean and Charcoal

    Jean and Charcoal Well-Known Member

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    Thanks so much, Dana! Torties, at least the two that I have had, are really loveable and big talkers. :)

    Take care,
    Your Lily was gorgeous too! :)
     
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