Magic - OTJ

@Djamila

I have Djamila to thank for helping me get on the right spreadsheet! I SHOULDA read the directions which clearly stated...to read the directions fully before embarking...on your spreadsheet.

It appears now that Maji did have a HYPO episode on 3.19. I was wondering why the vet seemed so concerned and the FDMB did not. NOW I understand...it was not hypo if using the human meter. Poor Maji... I feel so bad all day she was in this deep sleep that I had never seen before. Thankfully she came up at the end of the day.

OK I got all the data over! Maji was 104 this morning and so hungry she almost nibbled my fingers off as I gave her treats Maji looks good we are on our 4th day off insulin - otj testing phase. (please let me know if I am supposed to be on the OTJ thread, I don't feel we are really OTJ unless she passes the threshold of two weeks).

 

OK Maji threw up her bkfst and these were new cans! She of course came begging for food and I wondered why and nearly stepped in it.

Gave a new bkfst. I need to get Ketone strips up at Walgreens...I have not been up yet. This may seem like a dumb question but: @Kris & Teasel Do I need to be worried about Ketones if she is not on insulin?

Secondly, she is acting great and playful...so not acting sick at all. Is it possible that she is so hungry she is eating much too fast?
She is wolfing her food down like a ...well...wolf

Should I give her smaller portions??
(hers are not huge), but she inhales her food. Could this be why she throws up...eating too much too fast?

 

Ketones aren't a worry if her numbers are low like they are. It's lack of insulin or too low a dose that can be a contributing factor in ketone development.

She could be a victim of "scarf and barf". Maybe try even smaller but more numerous meals?

 

Thank you so very much @Kris & Teasel

Yea... I think you are right it’s scarf and barf happens every time she’s extraordinarily hungry. Hubby asked today “ how do you know the difference Maji acts like she’s starving all the time”. I know y’all will understand... I can just tell...I just know her actions...

I will be more careful with the feedings...THANK YOU

 

Hooray for the spreadsheet! And don't worry, she was only a little bit hypo . I'm so glad that all got sorted out now!

You could also get a timed feeder to spread her meals out into smaller portions.

 

Thank you very much Djamila!!! And for helping me feel better about the hypo incident

 

Isn't this forum a life saver?! I remember how confused and worried I was in the early days because nothing seemed to be working and I didn't know what to do. I spent too many months, yes months, trying to make my vet's methods work to no avail ...

 

@Kris & Teasel yes yes.. it really is! It really gets you up to speed quick... also just knowing someone is out there understanding is huge! The support means so much! The knowledge here is amazing and it’s really interesting to study this... you learn a lot of times (not always) that some of this could be prevented. In some cases not and genetics alone is a factor (Maji being part Siamese is a factor). If I was young again and could go back and redo I would love to have become a vet that specialized in diabetes... instead I’m in tech LOL - there is so much to learn and so much yet to learn... great peeps here!!!

 

Dang it...I came up to type AMPS in and she got into the treat bag AGAIN, tore or bit it open...found it on the floor
...I must put these away before coming up here
I hope her numbers are not all messed up tonight

@Djamila OK - well, scarf and barf after "treat raid" happens again, not trying to be TMI but they came out whole...so she just ate too much AGAIN.

Fed her a zero carb food FF Fish and Shrimp feast flaked...and leaving it at that
I don't think her numbers will be affected at this point

 

What kind of treats? If it's low/no carb, freeze dried meat it shouldn't make much difference. It's the carbs that really complicate things.

 

I am not sure of the carbs....I know that is not good, but I don't believe they are high as it is Feline Natural freeze dried beef and hoki <- just wondering if this is what made her throw up the last time?

The high end pet food store gave me several samples...the chicken and lamb one of these she LOVES. This was another sample of the same type...and with onesie twosie treats for ears...I figured I was o.k,

AFTER glucose test treat-raids...not o.k. but thanks to her gorging...she kinda took care of the problem. I need to be more diligent

I DO BELIEVE that magic is over-sensitive to carbs... the PINK in her Spreadsheet? that was when I fed her Friskies Salmon Pate...I stopped feeding her that because I believe the RICE in it was too high
I felt the carbs are too much for her system. I try and get her under 5 carbs if possible 2 is good carbs for her and a few zero carbs thrown in for good measure. She is CARB highly sensitive

 

Is it this one? https://www.k9natural.com/product/freeze-dried-beef-hoki/

You could write to the company and ask them for the carb percent. Towards the top of Dr. Lisa's chart (not the version in my signature) there is wording for how to ask for the info we need (not the guaranteed analysis numbers) so you will know if this is low enough for Maji. I'd love to hear their answer too as the ingredients look good, but the GA numbers leave a lot of room for carbs which makes me curious.

 

YEP that is the one - will do...you guys do a lot for me...
OK I checked on Lisa's list, as best as I can tell on page 21 it says FRISKIES (under the CLASSIC PATES) Salmon , 3 carbs. I felt Magic had a sort of high BG to that one as she jumped into the pinks (could be coincidence however).

@Djamila
Anyway here on this list it is listed higher: http://www.biggervet.com/cat/lowcarb/

FRISKIES class salmon pate 8 carbs.

Vet said to me to get magic 6 carbs and under. So it kinda (for me anyway) made sense that the 8 carb seemed to have affected her.

just wanted to offer this other list in case...

 

found this https://www.petsbest.com/blog/how-to-stop-your-cat-from-throwing-up-after-eating/

ironically I did acquire her as a stray...she was starving when she was a kitten, no mommy at all for days and days...
apparently she is hungry as I don't overfeed anymore and she has not forgotten her humble beginnings in life.

 

A thing for scarf and barf you can try is raising the food dish. Some people put it on a shoebox or something like that...the position of it seems to help avoid scarf and barf.

 

I like that idea!!! Ima try it!!! thank you!!!

 

Hi guys, nothing new to report 101 PMPS, 118 AMPS, waited 20 mins before 2nd half bkfst! Forgot to raise dish..hubby thought that was a great idea!

I’m thinking that Maji is kinda sliding into remission here (scared to even say it for fear of jinxing it). As I understand it we need to go two solid weeks of good numbers. I will continue to test twice a day for the remainder of two weeks, then I will go another two weeks testing once per day. After that couple times a week - I do not want her ever going up to 411 ever again...as they say
“once a diabetic...always a diabetic “

 

Well, she threw up her food yesterday morning and so I got rid of all the surplus snacks and extras - I went with the brand new ones that I ordered that she had no problems with. The Ziwipeak Lamb & Mackerel and the Feline Natural Freeze Dried Chicken & Lamb

Stopped the Beef & Hoki, everything's great..no throwing up anymore. I think the beef and hoki just did not settle well with her even if just used as treats for testing. There is, of course, more than 1 treat with testing!!!

96 PMPS and 120 AMPS - we are on day 8 otj trial

 

Love seeing the green PS number!

 

Thank you so much!!!
She bounces around in the lower range... nothing different except exercise and sunshine... on the weekends

 

Not quite up yet, but I was looking at @Kris & Teasel Teasel’s spreadsheet, while I don’t know anything about levemir insulin, it really looks like Teasel is coming down consistently and no more pinks and a lot a blues ?

 

He did about the same on Lantus but didn’t feel great on it. His numbers now are good by Teasel standards but would horrify many who want the kitty to have tightly controlled BG. He’s an extremely bouncy cat and I’ve been working at this over 2 years.

 

Magic is looking good with those pretty blues and greens too!

 

Thank you Rachel . I gave a little more of the carb food (low carb fancy feast) than I normally do last night ...I’m kinda curious how (when I get up) how Maji will test out

She’s sitting on the corner of my bed waiting...soon she will start pushing me for food - then it will be testing-time!

 

ya know...as much as I try so hard to be good at this testing with these teeny tiny cat ears that are black...and yes I poke all along where there is no nerves...sometimes it barely barely barely starts to just a teeny bleed and I think ok I think I can get that...I NEVER CAN and waste a strip. Finally if I am having a hard time...and Maji is starting to get where she's DONE. I just prick closer to the vein area...I know that seems harsh but one prick and it's done and over.

I think I may have to go that route instead of the very edges as her ears are somethin' else to get to bleed. Nevertheless, for me I enjoy taking care of her and this is part of it. AMPS 112 and with a little extra carb food to boot!!!

 

You have to do what works. Have you tried warming her ear before poking?

 

yep...my rice ball thing and it seems to help...perhaps I have not been doing this long enough for the capillaries to increase? Either way...I'm doing it.

Heck Ima buy a meter and do myself as well...hubby also. I think it is awesome to know your blood glucose it is so indicative of other ailments and things.

A guy at work much younger than me told me that he has diabetes and just (came down with it - not a proper term I forgot how he said it).

He takes a pill now and is on a special diet (rabbit-food he calls it). But he had no idea...a little tired...eyes did not seem to be working as well and thirsty more than usual...no idea and wham...they told him.

 

Diabetes is a very serious disease and I think some humans don't appreciate that. Some think I'll just take a pill and I'll be OK or give myself a little shot of insulin and all will be well. So many complications can arise.

 

Baby’s left ear just won’t work very well! I heat & rub until I’m gonna rub her bald. I inevitability end up ruining a strip. That poor right ear gets the business.. lol. I do keep at that left ear though.

 

I know right? One ear always works better....

 

You gotta figure out what works for you both! Warming the ear should help but also just time...they need tome for capillaries to increase so it bleeds easily. I often did 2 pricks right next to each other...and also put some neosporin gel on first so the blood would bead up and not soak into fur!

 

And adding extra water to the food. The better hydrated they are, the better they bleed! Sam's left ear bleeds better than his right ear. But it also might be the angle - it's easier for me to get the left ear, so if he's being wiggly, that one gets hit a little more often.

 

yeah...mine starts to wiggle when I'm taking too long AND the treats ain't comin' fast enuff yep water is crucial with Maji. I had NO IDEA in the past that she was constantly constipated.
I always commented that her previous belly was like a hard basketball. Once we did got her off the dry food (2 years ago) and gave her a glycerin baby suppository thing...I highly recommend...AND consistently more water...no problems after and never had to do the glycerin thingy again...not yet anyway

 

...one more update: since I got rid of the old treats the BEEF & HOKI treat and only feeding the ZiwiPeak lamb & mackerel and the Feline Natural chicken & lamb both air or freeze dried (treats-only)
ALL throwing up has stopped in the A.M.

That is the only thing I changed - and she was throwing up every morning for a little while.

Not saying anything is wrong with beef & hoki...and Maji liked those too...but she can't handle it for some reason.

 

Everyone has their things! Elektra can’t handle bonito flakes. Vomits every time...the other 2 are fine but she can’t even get a little of it so I stopped using them.

 

Teasel doesn't tolerate the gravy from high carb food so I can't use it if he drops low.

 

I have recently introduced ( maybe not slow enough) dr elseys chicken clean protein dry as her treat. Gives her some diapoo but first thing she’s actually wanted since the temptations days! Wouldn’t ya know... what to do, just a few at a time. Easy does it...

 

PMPS 153 I was surprized at that one, she was getting awfully irritated with me trying to get blood out of her ear. Not sure if that had any bearing AND I was a 1/2 hour earlier than normal...again...not sure without insulin if that matters.

Hoping it is down tomorrow and just an anomaly <crossing fingers>

 

Smokey has had a couple days that are higher than I would like. 150’s, 130’s. So I don’t think one high reading is anything to worry about. It could be a one time thing. I’ve been paying more attention to his litter box and I’ve noticed a definite link so I don’t worry. If there’s no poo it’s going to be a little higher. One day he threw up and I got a high number that day too. I just test some other time during the day on those days to make sure it’s settled down and so far the high numbers are short lived.

 

I did not know that - I went and checked litter boxes and nothing. Hubby said he cleaned litter boxes 2:30pm today - he cleans them once per day - so ima check tomorrow morning !

Thank you so VERY MUCH for writing in and giving me something to think about - other than worrying...

 

@Smokey and Jessica thank you & It really helped to view his spreadsheet...

 

The poo thing is real. Keeping 'em regular makes a difference.

 

There is this thread going over in Lantus right now which I think lists every cure for constipation I've ever heard. Oh, the things we discuss around here!

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/bubba-3-27-amps-87-forrest-update.193202/

 

...Praise the Lawd! AMPS 104 - AND we had a good sized poop in the kitty box this morning.

I feel like we won lotto or somethin' LOL

 

What a small thing to make us happy!! Lol it doesn’t take much! Kitty poop.

 

Awesome!!!
It’s so weird how much poo effects numbers. One of these days I need to start keeping track of which food I give. I keep a box of ff seafood and ff beef and poultry open and just randomly grab a can so he has veriety. There’s some combination that has made him go twice and one of those days I got a 59! I haven’t been able to repeat it, but we’re still going.

 

Haha yeah we discuss the best things around here...poop and vomit etc...

 

Lemme know if you get that one figured out! I would be seriously interested in knowing...

 

96 this morning...I know @Djamila likes when Maji pops a green one occasionally on this OTJ trial...

 

Go Magic, go!

 

Love those greens! Yes!

 

I do love those greens!!!

 

Well this is my last day we have reached 14 days on the OTJ trial.

I will be turning in the spreadsheet to the vet (I have been periodically all along). Vet tech called about Magic's dental appt on WEDs said they wanted to do a glucose test tomorrow. I told them no need, I 've been doing them twice a day

and that I would give them the spreadsheet tomorrow and WEDS Maji has a dental cleaning. They may pull the back uppers if there is anything wrong with them. She doesn't have any bottom BACK lower teeth as those were pulled 2 years ago.

All her front teeth are great.

I will begin writing in the OTJ Honeymooners now.

 

Congratulations!!!

Really folks just post there to keep track of the OTJ kitties, you can keep writing here!

 

thank you!

Maji is a on a strict diet. And we have to maintain that...no matter what...I do not want to go back into diabetes if I can help it. She's just one extra meal or high carbo load meal away for falling back in.

thank you Djamila! You have been wonderful to us

 

Amen to that! That's how Sam fell out of remission. Do not trust any food packaging ever. Always write to the company and get the real numbers - not the guaranteed analysis on the package!

It's been great to have you here and I hope you'll stick around! You've been doing a wonderful job of supporting other folks as well - and that's how this board keeps going!

 

This is the newer slimmer Maji.

Dieting has been good to her...

 

Congrats on Maji being OTJ!

 

Congrats and great job! Make sure they don't send Maji home with compounded liquid meds that contain sugar.

 

Kristen! (just peeked at your spreadsheet)

 

CONGRATS! That OTJ is a beautiful thing!

Please do stick around if you can...new folks love hearing from old folks and seeing how their cats did...it's inspiring!

 

I did not think of that! Thank you!!!!

 

I'm pretty sure it happened to me after Sweet Pea's dental. They sent me home with liquid gabapentin which smelled really sweet.

 

THANK YOU!!! I will be looking out for that and ask questions about any other items!

Thanks for the heads-up I would not have thought of that....

 

I just wanted to THANK EVERYONE and this site for helping Maji achieve remission (thus far ~ keeping fingers crossed)! I would not have known or learned the things that I have without this site!

Just looking at spreadsheets was extremely useful for seeing how insulin and glucose fluctuates as well as ALL OF THE ARTICLES & THE FOOD LISTS!

Too much to mention, just a TREMENDOUS RESOURCE and TREMENDOUS PEOPLE who dedicate their time and efforts in maintaining this site and keeping up with all the questions and support!

Thank you...I'm kinda nervous about the dental appt tomorrow.

 

Good luck with the dental. I understand the nervousness.

 

I hope the dental goes well! Let us know.

 

Congratulations! And Well Done to you and Maji!

 

Thank you !

Majis trying to get me up to feed and I can’t feed because she has her dental this morning

 

Fasting them is the worst. Stay strong! Keep us posted on how she does with the dental. And hugs to you. It's so hard to leave our babies there!

 

Thank you for understanding... Djamila

I will

 

One for each of you ...

 

Oh my heart would break! Fasting is awful. Sending hugs and vines for you both!

 

We'll want to know how she does. Teasel's sister is going in for her dental this month on the 26th - very long postponement from last June. I've been agonizing over it.

 

@Rachel @Kris & Teasel

Thank you guys! It was so hard this morning AND she knew she knew something was up and she wasn’t happy about it

We tried to not give any indication whatsoever- but she knew!

Cats are really intuitive!

They told me Maji is the first one in for surgery ...

Ima take off work as soon as I can pick her up and go home with her...

 

I called and she is out of surgery - had one extraction apparently- and did really well - she is waking up but they said they keep them there and make sure everything’s ok - I’m at work but can’t wait to leave when I can go get her

 

Good news! We want another report when you have her back home.

 

I love u guys thank you for caring

 

So glad!! Keep us posted please...can’t wait to hear she’s home!!

We care so much about all the kitties and beans on here. We get pretty attached.

 

She's home...I waited a bit to see how she would do.

SHE WAS STARVING hungry and they told me to only feed her a little bit at first and not to overdo it. She inhaled her food and after an hour I am giving her a bit more of her regular stuff.

I had to give her antibiotic which is Clindamycin and she has bupe (something for pain) which I have not given her yet.

They said one of the teeth in the back had parts missing off of it...and so they took it out...

the rest of the teeth were good after they cleaned off the tartar.

She LOVES being home...and she really wants to eat...so I am going slow and not overdoing it...and that's hard with Maji because she just begs for more food...but I can't do that...

Thank you - you guys for asking and your concern...nobody really understands...but you guys do!

Vet wants me testing at a MINIMUM several times a week to make sure she doesn't fall back into diabetes....

I want to say it saved me around 150.00 to have all my testing results because they did not need to do another blood test again and so this whole dental thing went from a range of 585.00 to 750.00 to only 400 + plus a few bucks...
so that really helped!!!

thank you again!!!
K & Maji

 

So glad to hear she's home! I give my kitty Tigress bupe fairly often. It's a good, safe pain medication option for cats.

The antibiotic can cause tummy upset or diarrhea (as all ABs can...not just the one you're using) so keep an eye on things. You can give a probiotic to help and I think you can give plain yogurt with no sugar added...if she'll eat it. Just something to keep an eye out for, she might be fine!

Let us know how she does over the next few days. Hoping she heals quickly! I'm sure she must feel better with that one tooth gone.

 

@Rachel thank you! She’s super affectionate and slightly drunk I think... I noticed her claws are clipped really close ... I wonder is she scaratched someone? I mean they really clipped em which is great cuz I don’t have to... she also had a patch of fur shaved off her front leg... inhaled the food

I hope she doesn’t get constipated from the buprenex?

 

Bupe can cause constipation (any pain killer can). Is she prone to it? I give my kitty some powdered egg yolk to help keep things moving when she takes the bupe.

 

My vet does that too - clipping the nails shorter than I do, but it's nice so I don't have to do it for awhile. And same price range too. maybe we have the same vet?!? Sam takes bupe fairly often, and hasn't had trouble with constipation. Although he does take a very small dose, and of course ECID.

I'm so glad Maji is home and has a good appetite. Sounds like she's happy to be home.

 

Woo hoo!! Celebrating here for Magi! So proud of you both!! Don’t be a stranger & check back in periodically! Happy Happy day for you!

 

Man she seemed great and then I gave her Bupe and she seems lethargic... dunno don’t really like it I guess....

 

Thank you so much!!!!

 

That bupe can really knock a cat out! Rufus was either asleep or reallypurry on it Glad eveything went well for Maji! Rufus was starving when he got home from dental too! And was acting drunk! He was SO excited to see me when I picked him up. Melted my heart.

 

Love to hear this...! I love when she is super affectionate but not when she’s a bump on a log

Oh so loved to see her so I can really relate to what you are saying!!

Thank you!

 

You can reduce the bupe dose if you find she zones out too much on the prescribed amount. I had to do that for Teasel when I used it on him.

 

Thank you...I did not think about that LOL - but I shoulda!

 

My vet prescribed 0.15 and I usually give 0.075 (so half of the syringe). It seems to help with the pain without making him act like he's on an opioid.

 

Yep, I've done half a syringe before...depends on her level of pain for me. It doesn't make Tigress act like a zombie, but it used to knock Elektra out!

 

Hi everyone things are going well finally tested Magic after a week of antibiotics- boy she does not like those... finally off antibiotics and did first test in a while, came out good 118. Started 2 days ago on wet ZIWIpeak rabbit, tried venison one this morning. Just checking in @Kris & Teasel was curious if Teasel’s sister was gonna have her dental soon? If I remember correctly? - you guys were WONDERFUL in helping us through that!!!! I will say that (forgot who said it). But the dental procedure REALLY HELPED!! I think that she’s better now than before... even glucose-wise I’m noticing that I don’t have to give the zero carb food 1/2 at feeding... and numbers low USING LOW CARB FOOD mind you, she’s still diabetic always.

But the dental HAD an effect!!!

 

Teasel's sister has a dental booked for this month on April 26th. I'm already stressing about it.

 

I know...I know it’s scary BUT good can come out of it - i was surprised!!! Would love to hear about her... when the time comes . It really helped me that you guys were there...

 

Baby had her dental in October & i was worried too. They removed 1 tooth & were able to clean up the rest. She was in remission & i was worried it would cause her bg to go up again but it didn’t. Just the anesthesic alone is enough especially if they’re older! All went well & her breath smells wonderful!!!

 

So cool!

 

tested tonight been on ziwipeak wet food rabbit and lamb & venison 3 days... PMPS 89

trying feline natural chicken and lamb AND will test after a few days on that.

so far so good...very hungry tonight

 

Got some info from New Zealand on the FELINE NATURAL that we’re trying, while it was not a scientific study response - I’m testing this food on Maji as I consider Maji super sensitive to CARBS she’s like a barometer for CARBS, a CARB magnet - they said this is from FELINE NATURAL:

“Yes you are correct, there would be some carbohydrates present in our Feline Natural diet sourced predominately from the flaxseed flakes component. Flaxseed flakes are added to our Feline Natural diets as a source of fibre for cats to maintain and encourage healthy bowl movements and good digestion, but this makes up less than 1% of the food.

If you have any further questions, please don't hesitate to contact us.

Warm regards
The Feline Natural Team “

Maji tested ZIWIpeak’s rabbit & lamb AND Venison earlier this week and those she loved both and seem to be a good! her BG was 89 last night after 3 days on those.

Now testing Feline Natural Chicken & Lamb I haven’t found that one on a food list anywhere yet, someone correct me and point me if it’s out there? Chewy had in their questions and answers 3% carbs

Now Maji loves this as well as ZIWIpeak! So we will see what the BG is after a few days to see if it stays low enuff