Mason - prozinc dosing

Discussion in 'Prozinc / PZI' started by christobevii3, May 2, 2017.

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  1. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    Hello,

    Our cat Mason was diagnosed with diabetes in September after losing a lot of weight. He was obsessed with dry food and despite getting a grain free high quality food it did not help. He went from 18lbs to 7lbs (large main coon).

    We had no luck with two vets recommending science diet and going from vetsulin to now prozinc. After having familiarity with diabetes through my parents I figured it was the WD or MD food being high carb as an issue and stress. So after reading here switched him from his science diet food that they dosed for a 9-10lb cat with 4.0 units to 2 cans of fancy feast in the morning and 2 at night with 3.0 units. I am seeing instant results and guessing I need to lower the dosing slowly for him.

    I have a basic sheet with alphatrak of what I started testing if anyone whishes to assist.

    Thank you
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2017
  2. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    Try to get those amps and pmps numbers each time
     
  3. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    I'll work on it. Just started really testing so kinda have a scatter plot right now. Since he is at 157 should I be backing down to like 1 unit instead of 3 to be safe?
     
  4. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    Definitely... Is it a human meter?
     
  5. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    I would say if it's 150-200 do 1, 200-250 do 2, and 250+ do 3. Once you have more data we can come up with a more detailed percise scale.
     
  6. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    No, it is the pet alphatrak
     
  7. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    Since he's obsessed with dry try some lower carb foods... But offer wet fancy feast classic as well.

    My favorite dry food is Young Again Zero carb food available at Youngagainpetfood.com. They will send you a free sample of the food if you call or email.

    Others that are low carb are Evo cat and kitten in the purple bag. There's also a new food out by Dr. Elsley's available on their website.
     
  8. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    Ok. I might be even a little bit more conservative at those lower numbers then until you have more data at that low number. At 150's maybe do 0.75
     
  9. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    He's doing fine with the wet food, i meant he would just sit and eat endlessly with dry food available. He isn't giving too much issue waiting until feeding times with the wet food.
     
  10. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Good for you testing BG at home. It's key! It'll get easier with time. The food change is a big factor in controlling BG.
     
  11. Yong

    Yong Well-Known Member

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    Grats on starting to home test :cat:, it takes one stress factor away :) (I think). If you could setup your signature and put your spreadsheet link there as well, will be super helpful: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/editing-your-signature-profile-and-preferences.130340/

    With better numbers, I'm also giving you this because it's better to be prepared: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/how-to-treat-hypos-they-can-kill-print-this-out.15887/

    One last thing, sorry to nit pick, but the template SS you are using is for a human meter. I'd recommend switching to the AT2 template, you can find that here too: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/
     
  12. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    Thanks, updated signature and charts to alpha trak sheet.

    Did 1.0 unit at 6:30pm and at 8:30pm it is 400. I'll check again at 10:30pm. Hoping in the morning to see in the 200's and to keep it around there and not have to go back up.

    Thanks again.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2017
  13. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    At 10:30pm 4 hours post shot/feeding at 404, so not much difference from 2 hours at 400. Might look at a 1.5 to 2 unit shot in the morning depending on the reading
     
  14. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    We recommend increasing by no more than 0.25 u at a time, especially at this low dose level.
     
  15. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    He's been pulled from 4 units twice a day with science diet WD dry to 3 units wet. This isn't a recent case of injections but 5 months of vetsulin with no results and a month of Prozinc at 2 units at 2 weeks and 4 units at 2 weeks before a switch to wet food and 3 units with results.

    I can check at lunch (6 hours) easily so does the .25 u still apply?
     
  16. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    The 0.25 u recommendation is one we'd give to anyone on here unless they had a very high dose kitty (10+ units per dose). The reason is that it's very easy to go right past a good dose if you increase by larger increments. Also, many cats respond to very small changes in dose.

    Checking at +6 is great if you can manage. The AM and PM tests every day before feeding and giving insulin are extremely important to judge whether a planned dose is safe to give. Your switch to wet food and a dose of 3 u BID has produced results but you need more data to be able to judge the dose well. I see you dropped to 1 u this evening. Was that in reaction to the blue numbers today? The reds this evening could be bouncing from the blues or a sign that 1 u is too low a dose.
     
  17. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    Yes, earlier in the thread they said to do 0.75 or 1.0. I did 1.0 since he seems to be high. I was going to pull back to 1.75 to 2.0 before asking. He's been at 400-600 for 6 months prior so this is all unknown and great at the same time. 18lb cat dropping to 7lbs during our wedding and having to be kept with the vet for 5 days during was not great, and to not see him improve much beyond getting to 9-10lbs with bad numbers, excessive urination, and hunger after.
     
  18. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    That high number looks to be a bounce. He's not used to being in the blues so his body is overreact. It will pass.
     
  19. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    He read 448 AMPS this morning so went with 1.5 shot. It would be hard to do 0.25 increments on the syringes I have since they're only marked in whole units.
     
  20. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Yes, it can be difficult. If it turns out that you need to dose in smaller fractions, syringes with half unit marks will be very useful.
     
  21. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Hi Mason's owner! (Chris? Christo?) Welcome to the board, and welcome to Prozinc! It looks like you've made some good choices with changing him to lower carb food, and getting into a regular routine with testing, so great job with that part!

    One difference between vetsulin and prozinc is that Prozinc seems to work best with more consistency and more subtle changes. Kris gave you some good advice about making shifts of .25u at a time. They can be difficult on the u-40 syringes, but you can take some time to play around with it a bit, drawing up some water at different increments and training your eye where the syringe lands for a .5 dose, where it lands for a .25, .75, etc. You can get pretty consistent after just a little bit of practice, and it will really help you manage this.

    It does look like Mason is bouncing right now, so I would suggest holding at the dose you are for a few cycles. 1.5u is probably too low, but holding the dose for another three cycles or so will help that to settle out a bit, and then you can move up to 1.75, and so on to find a good dose (at lease a good dose for now - it does change over time).

    Please post as much and as often as you'd like with any questions!
     
  22. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    373 at +6. So stay at 1.5 dosage for another day then you think?
     
  23. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Ugh. That is not a pretty number for a +6. The problem is, it can be caused by a few different things, and we don't know which one it is yet.

    Do you happen to have a spreadsheet from his vetsulin days? Or any home data from that time? Even if it's just a scatter of numbers/doses?

    And tell me if I have this correct:
    - 5 months vetsulin (approx doses?)
    - Started Prozinc at 2u
    - 2 weeks - 2u BID
    - 2 weeks - 4u BID
     
  24. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    I agree. It's hard to know why you have a BG this high. It could be bouncing from yesterday's blues. As you accumulate more data on your SS it'll become a great dosing reference.
     
  25. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    No data from the prozinc and just started testing recently.
    Vetsulin started at 1u, 2u, 3u, and 4u. His fructose test didn't improve during.
    Switched vets
    Prozinc 2u for a couple weeks didn't improve, 4u and didn't improve.
    Diet switched to fancy feast classic last week at 3u and now at 1u last night and 1.5u as of today.

    He does seem to take a few days to respond to changes and it is raining so maybe that got him worked up. His urination habit is much more normal in the past week though, more energy, and doing well compared to the last 6 months. For reference when the vet was testing for the prozinc curves and a week of vetsulin it was in the mid 400's to low 600's. So for as bad as a 373 is right now it is still improved from the past 6 months.
     
  26. Yong

    Yong Well-Known Member

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    Hi Chris, just looking at the data you have for Mason, my initial thoughts are 3.0U was too much right now and like the others have said, he is bouncing from the blues, which can take up to 6 cycles (3 days) to clear so I would also say to stick with the 1.5U until the bounce clears to see how it is really working for him. We all know the frustration of seeing our fur baby's improve, especially since you don't seem to have seen any significant improvements since his diagnosis. We can definitely work with you so you'll see more of your happy boy come through. A good sign already is the normal urination and increased energy :). Just going to re-iterate those AMPS and PMPS are the minimum recommendation for testing, ideally with him not eaten anything for 2 hours prior. Keep asking questions and collecting data, we're a support group for Mason and YOU :bighug:

    Also, could you look at the signature information link again? It's helpful for those of us with bad memories when you start a new thread. It's the light grey text after each of our posts along with the SS link :cat:
     
  27. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    I agree with sticking with 1.5 for a few more doses. You may need to do a steady schedule of small increases, but giving the changes time to settle before moving the dose again is usually the best way to know if a dose is working or not with prozinc.

    Let's see what shows up as you get the AM and PM pre-shot tests, and mid-cycles whenever you can.

    You're really doing a great job!
     
    Yong likes this.
  28. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    Yep, I think sticking with the dose for a few days is a good plan.
     
  29. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    501 PMPS, so climbed up quite a bit at 1.5 units. Should I look at adding another 1/2 unit or let it go until the morning? Check in 2 hours and 4 hours?
     
  30. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Still bouncing I think so don't change the dose just yet. Let's see if he'll settle in the next cycle or two.
     
  31. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Yowza! I wouldn't add any more tonight, and would still say to do 1.5 for the AM cycle, but it does look likely that despite the bounce-factor, you aren't going to want to hang out in low doses for too long.

    What are you thinking about testing right now, and what does your schedule allow? Are you feeling confident with getting tests? Is Mason tolerating them well? I'm asking because there are a couple approaches to raising the dose that depend on testing/monitoring.
     
  32. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    I feed at 6:30am and 6:30pm. M-F I can test at 12:30. So not too much besides 6 hours mid day and 2 hour and 4 hour at night. The weekend I'll be able to do testing throughout the day.
     
  33. Yong

    Yong Well-Known Member

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    Do you have ketone test strips?
     
  34. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    No I do not
     
  35. Yong

    Yong Well-Known Member

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    Might want to grab some next time you go to the store. They can happen at any BG level but are more prone to it at higher numbers. Don't want you to be scared, I just like trying to be prepared :)
     
  36. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    They have those just at walmart right? I can probably run in a bit. Will be difficult to get a sample being a fluffy main coon.

    Also, he threw up what looks about half his wet food so probably ate too fast being more hungry with the higher BG. How much food would you look at for the fancy feast classics? They're chart says a can per 3.5lbs so roughly 4 cans total in a day. Is that right for a cat looking at being 12-14lbs?
     
  37. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Okay, so let's see what numbers he gives you tonight and tomorrow.

    Here are the tricky parts:
    1. We aren't sure when his nadir is yet. Typical with prozinc is +5-+7, but cats can vary and have earlier or later nadirs, so while we likely are getting a good picture of the drop (or lack thereof) we aren't sure yet.
    2. His numbers might be inflated from the 119 (or if he went even lower), so he might not really be as high as he looks like he is.
    3. We can't be sure if the numbers you have from the 3u and 4u doses are really what they seem: sometimes if a dose is too high, the cat will stay in high flat numbers.
    4. It's also just as possible, that the 3u and 4u doses were too low, and that's why you see the numbers you saw.

    So problem #1 you will resolve this weekend if you can do a curve at home. Problem 2 will resolve after a few cycles at the same dose. Problems 3 and 4 can only be resolved through systematic small changes in dose and continued monitoring.

    The protocol for prozinc says to change and hold a dose change for a minimum of three cycles. And it recommends dose changes of 0.25u, with monitoring whenever you change the dose (that's why I was asking about testing). So it might actually be best for you to do your dose changes during the PM cycle (or on weekends) since it looks like you can monitor a little better during the evening cycles, but that will also depend on making sure his nadir is in a normal place.

    If those are really his numbers (not just bounces), then you might need to do the slightly larger increases, but I wouldn't recommend it yet since you don't have much data at this point. I would say hold the 1.5 through tomorrow morning and get data. Then I would say to increase by 0.25 at a time, hold for three cycles, keep testing, and keep increasing every third cycle.

    So 1.75 - 3 cycles
    2.0 - 3 cycles
    2.25 - 3 cycles, etc.

    I would also strongly recommend that you keep posting to keep eyes on Mason's progress because if he gets an active cycle, that will change all of this. And if he doesn't get an active cycle, then everyone can put heads together to consider if the larger increases might be okay to consider. Usually if you do a 0.5u increase it just causes bouncing and messes everything up -- that's why we always push for the 0.25u increases.
     
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  38. Yong

    Yong Well-Known Member

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    Pick up a long handled spoon, metal or silicon to catch pee. Clearly label it Mason's Spoon lol. Maury is half Maine Coon and I don't have any issue catching it from behind his pantaloons and fluffy tail :). My weight goal for him is also closer to the 14lb mark. The formula I used suggests 260.4 calories per day, so he gets 1/3 can of Friskies 4x a day. Think it's roughly 62 - 65 calories from just the wet food.

    Forgot, yes ketone test strips are available at WalMart :D
     
  39. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    541 at +2 hours so not too much movement from 501. For figuring the peak insulin drop after injection I'm pretty sure it is around 6 hours for mason and not 7 but a curve will tell later.
     
  40. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    502 at +4 so that is an improvement... He's starving though from throwing up food earlier. I can tell up going to get woken up extra early tomorrow...
     
  41. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Is there a reason you aren't feeding him more?

    ETA: It looks like you're feeding him twice/day. Most of us find out kitties do better on a few smaller meals so they aren't 'scarfing and barfing,' and it also helps them not feel so much hunger (which as you know is common with higher numbers).

    It's entirely up to you, but I think it would be fine to give him some more food, and would actually encourage it since he threw up much of it earlier.
     
  42. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    Should i? I think he threw up half and caught him eating it. He's not worse than prior to switching to low carb diet, slightly better. He tries to eat my spatulas in the sink if you don't get everything off or lick all the pans clean. So he isn't fully bad but he's jumping up.

    I'm doing 2 cans twice a day targeting 12-14 lbs where vet feeding was 8-10lbs so may be adjusting to the amount. The wet food has a lot more volume. I probably can't do much about feeding more times without a timed feeder.
     
  43. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Does he need to lose weight? If not, we generally suggest feeding as much as they want until the numbers get regulated. They can't properly get nutrients from food while their BG is too high, so they really do feel like they're starving. If it was my kitty, I'd feed him again. Maybe a tablespoon, wait 5-10 minutes, another tablespoon, etc. That way he gets to eat, but you keep him from throwing it all up again. I'd probably give him another can.....just very slowly!
     
  44. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    If he's hungry it's OK to feed him.... Just not two hours before preshot testing so the numbers are not food influenced. Most here feed several small meals a day.
     
  45. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    Gave him and the other cat another can last night. He ate 2/3rds and she ate 1/3. This morning was a 287 so major sign of improvement so far.
     
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  46. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    I agree with the comments about feeding him more at this point. Smaller meals as often as you can manage should help avert the "scarf and barf" thing. I like the yellow this AM. It tells me two things: 1. this is a good dose for now and 2. he didn't bounce very long. :)
     
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  47. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    That's a great number this morning! Hooray!
     
  48. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    308 at +6 hours so still rising some but not horribly
     
  49. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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  50. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Did you give a shot yet? If not, I think you could increase to 1.75u tonight and for the next few cycles. If you've already dosed, don't worry about it - tomorrow will be fine.
     
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  51. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    Yes I did. I'm testing, giving food, and shooting relatively close to each other. I'll test again at 4 hours to see how it looks. If he's basically flat at 4 hours like previous day it might be a decent number in the morning.
     
  52. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Sorry for the late post. I got home late this evening. If you get a +3 or +4 that looks typical tonight, I think you could do the increase in the morning (assuming also a typical AMPS) and be safe. Always up to you though if you are comfortable with that.
     
  53. Yong

    Yong Well-Known Member

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    I agree with Djamila but as we say, you hold the syringe :bighug:. Increasing is easier than decreasing :confused::smuggrin:
     
  54. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    448 +4 so 30 point move and 50 point drop from prior day. I think keeping it the same in the AM if the AMPS is less than 287 makes sense. He is moving in the right direction on 1.5u. I'm guessing +6 he'd be at 428 and in the AMPS looking for a 250-270 number. If that is where he is at I'll hold, if above i'll consider a 1.75u
     
  55. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    400 AMPS so moved up to 1.75u
     
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  56. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Good move. Increasing the dose in small increments and tracking with systematic BG testing is the way to get ahead. You're doing well! :)
     
  57. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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  58. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    If 3 cycles at 1.75 u don't bring the BG down then you can increase to 2 u for three cycles.
     
  59. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    Yep, I think the increase was good and if needed...you can definitely go up to 2 next!
     
  60. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    332 PMPS so that is a good sign. The shot though felt like some came out but is hard to tell since he has so much hair. Hopefully most of it went in though.
     
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  61. Yong

    Yong Well-Known Member

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    Just never re-shoot :). I started parting Maury's fur to expose the skin line so I could see the needle go in better. He actually hasn't meowed the past couple days when getting his shot (antijinx)
     
  62. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    425 +4 so betting the shot didn't take like I thought or half didn't. Mason is acting more "needy" like he wants food too
     
  63. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    You might want to make a note on your spreadsheet that this dose might have been a fur shot. That way when looking for patterns you can know to disregard this cycle.
     
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  64. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    You can feed any time except two hours before the next shot. If he's hungry let him eat.
     
  65. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    482 AMPS, so yeah definitely had a bad shot last night. As for the feeding more last night? He had already had 4 cans of food for the day so probably just related to the shot.
     
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  66. Yong

    Yong Well-Known Member

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    In the U section for last night, change it to FS = fur shot. I still don't think the 482 AMPS is terrible from last nights PMPS 382. May have gotten a little bit in him, which is why we say never to re-shoot ;). Does Mason need to gain any weight?
     
  67. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    301 at +5 hours so definite improvement. I'll try to catch every other hour or so
     
  68. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    187 +7.5 so looking good.
     
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  69. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Oh, that's great to see! I always think that anytime you get a 50% drop, it's a good cycle! It looks like Mason might be hitting nadir on the later part of the normal range. Any chance tomorrow you could aim for a +6 and a +8 to check that? (It's okay if your schedule doesn't allow it - but at some point...)
     
  70. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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  71. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    146 +10, might be looking at cutting the dose back to 1.0 tonight... I have to pickup my wife at the airport at 11pm so won't be around to monitor until 12:30am or so. see how it is in another hour and a half. If it hasn't risen any I can feed and check after an hour or two to see if a small dose or just skip?
     
  72. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Going from 482 to 146 is a pretty big drop. You may end up with a bounce to a high number in the next two hours, in which case the regular dose will be fine, but I agree if you're still in low numbers You'll need to reduce. Mason's numbers have been high enough that I would avoid skipping if at all possible.

    Depending on how much time you have to play with, if Mason is still low at shot time, you can stall without feeding for 20 minutes and test again to see if the number is rising or still falling.

    When is the airport time in relation to your usual shot time?
     
  73. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    Shot 6:30pm, leaving for airport probably at 9pm and will return at 12:30am
     
  74. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Hmmm....that is tricky. I understand the thinking about wanting to reduce a little since you'll be gone from +2.5 to +6. He's still in really safe numbers, so let's see what the PMPS shows. If he ends up at a normal number for him (over 300), I think the 1.75u would still be very safe, but if he's lower, then a bit of a reduction might help you feel better about leaving.
     
  75. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    143 PMPS. I went ahead and fed him, maybe go to 1 unit or even a half?
     
  76. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    That is a really curious cycle. I hate skipping doses, especially since his normal numbers are so high. But with this little data, we would usually say to skip on that low of a number. From the +10 shot, it doesn't even look like he's started rising yet from the cycle. Even though it's going to leave him in high numbers later, I just can't comfortably recommend shooting. If you are comfortable with it and want to, you certainly can shoot either of those doses, but make sure you get a +2 test before you leave for the airport, and leave him with food to eat.
     
  77. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    Ok, went 0.5u and will check in 2 hours and if needed 3 before i leave.
     
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  78. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2013
    I agree, I would recommend skipping at that level, considering how little data we have on him at this point.
     
  79. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    271 at +1. I'll check again at either +2 or +3 when leaving but i think the 0.5 shot will be ok
     
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  80. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2013
    Sounds good! Let us know how he looks!
     
  81. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2015
    That's the thing with those wonky pre-shots: It's usually fine to stick with the regular dose....except for when it isn't. And at the beginning, it's really up to the comfort and skill of the human in charge in case things do go south. The +1 can be a food spike, so it's good you're planning to get a later test to be safe.

    Today's AM cycle lasted a bit too long, but it is so good to see Mason getting down to those lower numbers! You're doing a great job!
     
  82. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    323 at +2 so definitely in the safe. Flight is delayed so I'll check at +3 for sure.
     
  83. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2015
    Sorry the flight is delayed! Late night for you guys!

    It looks like the insulin from the AM shot lasted 13-14 hours which is curious, especially after a fur shot last night. What is your day looking like tomorrow? I'm inclined to suggest that you stick with the 1.75u dose again, but monitor. Of course, that completely depends on him giving you a decent AMPS. :) How long ago did he start eating just the FF? Is he eating anything else?
     
  84. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    Fany feast only was started on april 27th. I'll be around tomorrow so I'll have more ability to check than I did today. I'll see what it is in the morning and make an estimate between 0.5 tonight and 1.75 prior.
     
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  85. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2015
    So about nine days ago...looks like the diet change is sitting well with him!

    Here's what I'm thinking: Sometimes a long cycle (lasting more than 12 hours, or a very late nadir) is just one of those things and doesn't mean anything. The next cycles will all be completely normal. Other times a long cycle is an indication that the dose is too high.

    The numbers you've been getting (reds and blacks with little change at nadir) would indicate that today's cycle is just random. However, the recent change from high carb to low carb food is a significant factor and can, in some cats, lead to rapid drops in BG numbers, which might indicate that today's cycle is not random and does mean that the dose is too high.

    Lacking a crystal ball, I don't know which one it is. Only time will tell. You're still in higher numbers, so assuming a regular AMPS, if you decide to reduce in the morning, I wouldn't drop too far. The more time he spends below 200, the more chance his pancreas has to heal.
     
  86. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    345 at +3 so food jump should probably calm down next hour and peak around 350-60.
     
  87. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    359 at +4 so really predictable pattern even with the lower dose. Wife's flight is delayed 4 hours and switching planes now. Probably going to just go to bed in a couple hours, have her get a hotel, and get her in the morning.
     
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  88. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    381 AMPS so went with 1.5 units. Wife's flight was delayed so much that I have to pick her up from the hotel in a few hours. I won't be able to track things today like I thought until later.
     
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  89. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    The 1.75 u left him a little low last night before his PM shot so I like 1.5 u for today.
     
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  90. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    370 at +8. Probably could have stayed at 1.75u then. Will see at PMPS
     
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  91. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Probably bouncing from those blues. Once that stops , 1.75 u might be too high again. You want a dose that gives you two shootable PSs.
     
  92. Yong

    Yong Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2017
    I was going to say something along the lines of what Kris said. Hard to say how this 1.5U is effecting Mason because it's probably a bounce cycle :cat:
     
  93. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    So stick with 1.5u if it isn't in the 400's then tonight?
     
  94. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    That is what I suggest. Sliding scale dosing can be used once you've honed in on the good dose range and want to fine tune things. You're still working toward establishing what that range is.
     
  95. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    439 at +10 so still rising.
     
  96. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    464 PMPS but still went with 1.5u. See how it is at +2 and +4 and tomorrow. Decide maybe tomorrow night if still in the 400's.
     
  97. Yong

    Yong Well-Known Member

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    Jan 11, 2017
    Just to clarify, a bounce can take up to 6 cycles (3 days) to clear :)
     
  98. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    May 2, 2017
    Didn't realize that, thank you for informing me.
     
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  99. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

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    May 2, 2017
    464 +2 so good sign!
     
  100. christobevii3

    christobevii3 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2017
    369 at +3, looking good
     
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