? Monitoring Hypo Kitty Overnight (SUCCESS = REMISSION! THANK YOU FOR THE AMAZING HELP!)

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (The Main Forum)' started by Sherri, Sep 3, 2015.

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  1. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Okay, I am overtesting because he has been under 5.5 since he stabilized overnight during our hypo incident Thursday. I've just been monitoring to see if there has been any rise in his sugars (the vet told me to do this over the next week and said before meals was good (and if normal in a weeks time we could consider him in remission). The two meals a day with lantus also came from the vet.

    So to get this straight I shall test before each meal in the morning and return to let's say 3 meals a day (which is what I was doing previous to the diagnosis). YES?
     
  2. julie & punkin (ga)

    julie & punkin (ga) Well-Known Member

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    sure. go for it!
     
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  3. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    "Normal range in a cat not getting insulin is considered under 120, primarily in the 50-80ish range. Divide by 18 to get your mmol numbers. 120/18 = 6.66 mmol, so everything under that is considered."

    Considered.......normal right?

    Also, may I do the test in the evening as opposed to before the meal in the morning (just curious because of morning routines for work it would be easier in the evening when I get home before he eats). But again, it's what's best for him not me! ;)
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2015
  4. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Just an update that it has been 1 week since Shamus required his last insulin shot. We are home testing once a day before morning meal and still seeing mid 3's for our BG testing! YAY!!! One more week to keep checking daily and then it's officialy OTJ! I believe we are well on our way! Also, just a note that Shamus has also officially (along with his non-diabetic brother) been transitioned to 100% low carb Friskies Pate diet and loving ALL flavours! I put a tablespoon of water over the food now with each serving too! I've learned so much here from all of you! <3
     
  5. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Oh Sherri, I could not be happier for you and Shamus! That is the most wonderful news! I'm counting down the days with you. Bring on the party! :bighug::D:bighug: and scritches!
     
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  6. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Thanks Linda!!! Also, I have been educating myself a lot about the food. I know grains are not good. I noticed Friskies has rice in all of it's Pates. Also hearing lots about not too much fish. Would it be best to keep the seafood flavoured ones out of the diet? I notice that the Pates are canned in some "juice" that resembles gravy. Should I avoid letting that be included with the food or is that where the moisture intake comes from? Just curious. I don't by any of the ones that say "in gravy or chunks"...strictly the Pates, it just resembles what I would consider gravy. I know the food charts are not as current so I'm hoping everything still stands as good to serve those Friskies choices. :)
     
  7. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    As long as they say pates you should be fine. I feed my non-diabetics Fancy Feast pates (my diabetic is a kibble addict and won't touch soft food ..... how ironic eh? oh lucky me!:rolleyes:) and the liquid is more like au jus from a nice roast so no worries there! It's Ok to give the kitties seafood/fish flavours periodically but I wouldn't make a steady diet of them due to mercury concerns. It's also my understanding that the fish flavours can have urinary track consequences (crystals I think), more for male cats than females, if served regularly. A treat once a week or so should be fine.
    This is like a great novel! I cannot wait for the next chapter!:bighug::bighug:
     
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  8. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    It is isn't it? :D What do you think about the doc wanting to check his liver enzymes again? Is there anything I can do on my end here at home (e.g., testing ketones in urine) that would give me any information on his liver showing improvements aside from a stressful and expensive visit to the clinic again? I have no problem returning, just wondering.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2015
  9. Squalliesmom

    Squalliesmom Well-Known Member

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    Congratulations! That's wonderful! Fingers and paws crossed for Shamus! :):):)
     
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  10. julie & punkin (ga)

    julie & punkin (ga) Well-Known Member

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    I don't know how you could measure liver enzymes at home - sounds like a blood test to me.

    but so glad to hear Shamus is continuing to do well. I try to minimize fish with my cats, but it's often added into other flavors. You just do the best you can.
     
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  11. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Sorry Sherri but for the liver enzymes you're stuck with the vet. While ketones may accompany liver enzymes being out of whack, each condition can occur in isolation. Given Shamus' current glucose status I doubt ketones are a problem. My girl's liver enzymes were wonky when she was first diagnosed too. I think it's probably fairly common with the diabetes but with remission chances are good they will be back to normal now. Better to know though!
     
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  12. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Hi all! I just wanted to pop in and ask a question to those of you who have been following. Shamus has been steady in I'd say average mid 3 numbers for BG tests every morning. I'm waiting two more days for the official remission party ;)...I just fed him and he vomitted up his food--he didn't finish the rest of the food yet either. My first instinct was to test sugars and he was 4.1. Still a good number from this morning's 3.2 prior to feeding. In two weeks they want to check his liver enzymes again. Should I be concerned about this vomitting incident? He has not vomitted since prior his diagnosis August 20th. Naturally I'm concerned. He used to vomit up his food but prior to the diagnosis I thought he was just eating too fast, but again I haven't seen him vomit up his food at all since we've been back on track.
     
  13. Chris & China

    Chris & China Well-Known Member

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    If it's just one time, I wouldn't worry about it too much

    Was it a "scarf and barf"? A lot of times if they eat too fast, it comes right back up...best to just give them a few minutes and then portion out more food a teaspoon at a time
     
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  14. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    If this is the first and only time he has vomited it could be that he just ate too fast but it does bear watching. His numbers are sounding good. Has he been grooming more now that he is feeling better. Maybe he is about to deliver a hairball! My long hair is famous for vomiting a few times before a hairball gets presented and always puts me on guard. While it's not as common with short hairs, it still happens and our sugars often tend to not groom as well when they are feeling off. I'd keep watch and feed him again a little later and see if it happens again. I wouldn't worry right now but if he's not keeping food down by tomorrow night, then a vet visit would be advisable.
     
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  15. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Thank you! I feel like that's what it was--a "scarf and barf!" He has since returned to the dish which I decided to then only give quarters of the can and a bit of time in between and so far so good! You guys are the best! I notice the size of his urine left in the litter box is still a good amount but I have also been placing a tablespoon of water on his feedings three times a day. He's not drinking profusely or peeing a lot. It is just a large amount.
     
  16. Chris & China

    Chris & China Well-Known Member

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    something you can do to slow him down when he's eating is to spread the food out onto a flat plate instead of a bowl....also, you can put something into the bowl that's BIG and not edible (like a golf ball) that he has to "eat around" to slow him down.

    The have special Slow Feed Pet Bowls you can buy that do the same thing
     
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  17. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Oh awesome! I don't have very deep dishes. I used to use a round cat toy to slow him down when he ate dry. But no more dry for us!!! :)
     
  18. julie & punkin (ga)

    julie & punkin (ga) Well-Known Member

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    I washed a walnut in the shell and put it in punkin's canned food on a plate. It helped a little bit.

    I'd just monitor and see if it happens again.
     
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  19. Merlin

    Merlin Well-Known Member

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    Maybe this could be done with kitties. For my horse, in his feed bucket, I would place clean, large round river rock. So he had to move the rocks around to get to his feed. So maybe if you found small, clean river rock, that may work. Ok may be a stupid idea. I like the golf ball suggestion.
     
  20. Chris & China

    Chris & China Well-Known Member

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    Not a dumb idea at all Cindi!! I've used the "clean rock" idea as well as the golf ball idea....whatever works...as long as it's big enough that they can't swallow the silly thing!....LOL
     
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  21. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Hi, Sherri! Have been reading through your thread; just wanted to say how thrilled I am for you & Shamus!!!
    OTJ part time is just 2 days away, right! WOO-HOO!!!!!! :D:cat:

    Re: The ol' "scarf & barf" - that used to be a major problem with my chow-hound kitty. One thing I do: Place her food dish (a heavy salad-size stoneware plate) atop a shoe box. This way she's not eating with her nose down, close to the floor; so that shoe box helps provide a little less of a "gravity-defying" way to eat! And, like you do, I add some water to her canned food. Both tricks seem to have helped a lot!:) (Nowadays, she just hacks up the occasional hairball.:rolleyes:)
     
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  22. BJM

    BJM Well-Known Member

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    I've been putting a large glass tumbler upside down in the feeding bowl for my civvies. I've got one who gets into competitive eating and pulls a scarf 'n' barf every time she gets anxious and starts chowing down. This seems to slow her down from doing that.
     
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  23. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Hello All! Today is officially 2 weeks OTJ for my Shamus!:D I have been waiting for this day with lots of prayers and always feeling so relieved every time I checked his BG for the last two weeks. At our middle feeding today he had another vomiting episode after he ate a bit. Two days ago I thought it was a "scarf and barf". He has been eating a lot of the chicken flavour as that is what I had left in the pantry (had run out of other flavours). On Tuesday after he got sick I checked his BG and it was 4.1 (all good) and then slowly gave him portions of the chef's dinner flavour and he was fine. Later that night he ate the chicken and was also fine. The next day was all chicken all day but he wasn't as interested in eating it, so went away and came back to it a couple of times but did finish and NO vomiting at any of his three feedings. This morning was our official remission day morning test and his BG was 3.4!:) We danced a happy dance and went for the food. I noticed this chicken flavour was again still not his favourite so I switched him to the Seafood Supreme and he ate that up just fine. For our middle feeding I returned to the chicken flavour. Although he began eating it, it was still not his favourite and he ended up getting sick. I checked his BG and he was 3.9 (all good) and then waited a bit before I cracked a can of chef's dinner (in portions) and he has done just fine with that. I wanted to be "partying" on here, lol, but I'm a lil worried too. He's certainly hungry and eating other flavours fine but I wondered if this could be related to the underlying fatty liver that accompanied the diabetes diagnosis. I read a bit more about it online and he is supposed to go get his enzymes checked in two weeks. Any thoughts or reassurance? We have done so well with everyone's help and just want to keep moving in that direction. Thank you so much! xo
     
  24. BJM

    BJM Well-Known Member

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    The fatty liver may have been due to the diabetes being uncontrolled - fat gets broken down for energy because glucose can't be used. That can really stress the liver. Getting him OTJ means he probably isn't breaking down his own fat
    If you add ounce of lean protein to 5 ounces of cat food, mix well, then portion out, that will help reduce the fat calories and reduce the liver's workload.
     
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  25. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    First of all
    hapydafhf.gif hapydafhf.gif hapydafhf.gif hapydafhf.gif hapydafhf.gif hapydafhf.gif hapydafhf.gif

    We are celebrating here too! That is such wonderful news that Shamus has earned the title of OTJ! Yeah Shamus!:bighug:

    As for the vomiting, I take it he had been eating the chicken without incident over the past two weeks until the other night. If it's only with the chicken flavour causing a problem and all other flavours seem to sit well, then I wouldn't think it's anything to worry about. Could it be that Shamus is equating the taste of the chicken with that one previous bout of vomiting and although eating it reluctantly, it is actually making him nauseated by association with the past? I think we've all overdone something in our lives and developed an aversion at least for a short time and cats will do this too.

    I'd get the liver tests repeated as planned just to be sure but if there were an ongoing problem I'd expect ANY food to be causing the vomiting.
     
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  26. Squeaky and KT (GA)

    Squeaky and KT (GA) Well-Known Member

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    WAY TO GO Shari & Shamus!!! OTJ!! Congratulations! This was a quick turn-around, good job!

    BIG HUGE YARD DANCE!!!!
     
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  27. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    THANK YOU!!!!! Okay, I feel much better to say MY BOY IS OFFICIALLY :otj:!!!!!!!! Wahooooooo!:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::):):):):):):):):):):):) I've been holding my breath a bit as this really feels like a miracle to me!!!!!!! I know remission is something to hope for, we have just been so blessed to get there so quickly! We couldn't have done it without you! Really, I tell everyone about the people here and you are ALL angels to me! Shamus and I just can't say thank you enough for riding this roller coaster with us! I promise to continue to take good care and always monitor my fur baby (and his brother who is also on the same diet so we don't have to go through this again)! I can't THANK YOU ALL ENOUGH!!! I will also be staying in touch with you all as I have come to a increased awareness about how to better care for my kitties through all of this! I have learned SO SO MUCH from all of you! I am sending so much LOVE to EACH and EVERY one of YOU! I am so humbled by this experience and my eyes are filled with tears just taking this all in! You are all such beautiful people and I can only wish for you MANY MANY happy healthy years with the sugar kitties and fur babies you are all so dedicated to!

    Sherri & Shamus (and Oscar kitty too!) :cat::kiss::cat:
    :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
  28. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    HAPPY, HAPPY, HAPPY for YOU!!!:cat::joyful:
     
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  29. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Linda (and all who have been following our journey to success!), I just logged on to report the results of yesterday's blood tests and found your message above! I have such wonderful news! Shamus' liver enzymes are back to NORMAL and all of his other info from the blood panel also continued to show normal! I am down to testing his BG every 3 days for the month and then will go to once a week the month after, and once a month thereafter as the protocol here states. Shamus' weight is also back up so it is time to really monitor that and cut back a small amount to keep it under control. The doc had said his BG showed 6.7 which is higher than what I get at home using a human glucometer (usually in the 3.8 range but understand my montior tests lower than the pet one) but I also believe this could be because he would test higher in the clinic than at home anyway, right? Doc wants me to keep an eye on vomitting (says more than 1-2 times/month is considered abnormal) as inflammatory bowel disease can be something that is common in diabetic kitties--he said the challenge then would be to find a different protein food that is hypoallergenic but also low carb. Quite honestly I think it is "scarf & barf" situations and the fact that he is grooming himself much better than before so the hairballs (which I never see him vomit up but occasionally get the sounds from him for) might be the culprit.

    Any thoughts on the amount of times your cats vomit and what seems "normal"?

    Next steps are to call in weight once a month to the clinic and obviously continue to home monitor (although with a decrease in frequency), and keeping an eye on any vomit situations (which aren't really recurring, just those couple times I mentioned here. I spread the food out over a flat plate now and sometimes put it up on a box to keep his head up and that seems to help too!).

    Shamus is more playful than I have seen him in a long time (initiating his own play even!) and his coat is as shiny, soft and as danderless as it's ever been (along with his civvie brother whom's diet got the switch too!). I am so relieved and so pleased at the same time--sometimes those storms in life redirect us on a better path. THANK YOU ONE AND ALL! I wish you ALL the best on your paths to management with you sugar kitties too! I am here to tell you that you can remain hopeful with a diabetic Dx. A little breathing, a lot of perseverance, a big change in diet and an absolute must at home testing and you'll have your fur babies feeling better than ever! xo
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2015
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  30. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    What a great, joyful, spirit-lifting report!:joyful: Thank YOU for sharing that, Sherri! My best to you & Shamus for continued good health & happy times!
    :bighug: - Robin
     
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  31. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    smiley-happy080.gif Yeah Sherri and Shamus! I'm so glad to hear Shamus' tests all came back good and he is keeping his sugar under control. I could not be happier for you both! smiley-dance013.gif

    Menace, Worf, Myster and I are doing our happy dance here!
    smiley-bounce016.gif

    Please do keep us posted on how things are going. This gives each and every one of us hope that one day our little sugars will do what Shamus did and surprise the daylights out of their Moms and Dads!:bighug:
     
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  32. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    I'd rather use something natural like a river rock than a golf ball. Good idea Cindi!
     
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  33. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    First Congrats to you and Shamus!!! If you haven't all ready, raise his food bowl up ontop of a few books. I have to do that with my civvie cat as he eats and barfs immediately about once a month. Use to be everyone other day before I elevated his dish.
     
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  34. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Thanks all! <3 I have spread the food out over a large plate and do put the plate up on a box. This seems to help for sure! I also put 2 tablespoons of water into each serving of food--which happens 3 times a day. I do notice Shamus still has large pee patties but considering all of the good results, I'm guessing this is attributed to all of the extra water (as once I switched to canned food both of my boys stopped requiring a water dish and adding the water just makes even more water in the system I'm assuming). The frequency of urination is not nearly like it used to be though--just still a large pee patty! Just amazing how things can improve once you #ditchthedry ;)
     
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  35. Wendy&Neko

    Wendy&Neko Well-Known Member

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    Fantastic news Sherri and Shamus! :joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful::joyful: You did a great job Sherri.

    Your vet is right to keep an eye on the vomiting. IBD is also a concern for more than the diabetic cats (my non diabetic civie has it). Here is an article that explains more: http://www.veterinarypracticenews.com/Chronic-Vomiting-in-Cats-isnt-Normal-After-All/
    Paws crossed it's nothing to be worried about. Shamus may be initially grooming more now that he's OTJ.

    ETA: And yes, cats can test higher at the vets. My civie once tested over 11 (200) at the vets and 3.0/55 the next day at home.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2015
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  36. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Had our first official Week 1 BG test--strange to wait "so long" to test, but Shamus is sitting at his steady 3.9! Yay!!!!!!!!! He gets progressively worse for me to check his levels when we aren't doing it as frequently (just transitioned from every 3 days to every week for the next month) and didn't let me sit on him. Like riding a bull! LOL! Surprising how strong our kitties can be. BUT, he DID just let me prick his ear and test while he was laying at the end of the bed directly after our little rodeo...so even better! lol HAPPY (CANADIAN) THANKSGIVING everyone! Wishing you much to be grateful for! xo
     
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  37. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Sherri, I am so happy for yours and Shamus's continued honeymoon.
    That is a good visual! Have you tried low carb treats a "poke treats" ? Mine like the freeze dried chicken and Bonita Flakes. He too hates being tested but when I shake the treat bag, he comes running to the test table.
     
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  38. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    YEAH! Keep those good numbers coming! I really think our kitties become more compliant with regular testing because they know it is helping make them feel better. Unfortunately when they are feeling better all the time, they see no reason to allow the poking! :woot: Would have loved to have been a fly on the wall for the "rodeo"!:cat: HAPPY THANKSGIVING! :bighug:
     
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  39. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Lol! And yes, we use freeze dried chicken. He takes the treat before and after, but the rodeo still ensues! ;) Thanks all!
     
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  40. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Oh! And while I'm here, what about the freeze dried shrimp treats? Has anyone used those. I know we are supposed to stay away from fish, but wondered if the shrimp treats might be ok. And also, just for topic of conversation, does anyone have a "battle of bowls" situation? Seems that even if Shamus has more, and the same flavour, he still likes to kick his brother out his bowl and have his. lol! I try to feed them separately and even move the dish and close the door for poor Oscar who is always looking over his shoulder, but such a funny thing. Shamus will leave his well filled plate and head on over to Oscars every time! lol
     
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  41. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Yes I too have a Battle of the bowls here! My middle "child" (aka the food vacuum) has to check everyone's dishes out for a better offering. It's always the same food but he checks never the less and usually selects one of his sibling's bowls to eat from so they play musical bowls to get their meals!
     
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  42. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Yep, apparently cats are very territorial of their food, if they can see the bottom of the bowl, they go into panic mode, "oh NO, no more food"! And immediately leave their bowl with food in search of more food. Very interesting dynamics these cats..........
     
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  43. Sherri

    Sherri Member

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    Aug 20, 2015
    Shame on me for sleeping in today...too many hours past feeding and both boys vomitted after their feeding :(...lesson learned...bad Momma. I'm guessing that's no coincidence? Most likely the ugly "scarf and barf"? Feeding in small portions right now to help...and we were doing so well...*palm to forehead*
     
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