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Need some advice!!

Discussion in 'Prozinc / PZI' started by Stewie's Mom ID, Feb 13, 2019.

  1. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Feb 6, 2019
    Please advise! I am new to bg testing this week and my Cat Stewie has had a rough landing since last Sunday when I joined this wonderful site. Stewie was really low on bg this past Sunday. He went from a 34/ 41 (I tested 2x in a row), then finally up to 81. I have a Spreadsheet up now thanks to Chris and China. He has been very bouncy since then as you can see by my spreadsheet.

    Anyway this am he was at 449. then at +6 he was 70. Now at PMPS he is at 195. I just fed him and he
    just had some diahrrea which hasn't been happening and he is stressed from the ear pokes. I know I was guided not to shoot under 200 so I guess tonight will be considered another "fur shot". Its so close to the 200 mark that I dont know if maybe he could take 1 unit tonight. He is getting 2 units every 12 hours but he is so bouncy that this has scared the heck out of me. I can't imagine how he must be feeling going up and down. Luckily he is still having his appetite so far. Since he finished eating about 20 mins ago. I guess I should not shoot? Help please!! It would also throw his schedule off once again.
     
  2. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Aug 1, 2015
    Hi there and welcome to prozinc! Give me a minute to look at your spreadsheet and I'll be right back...
     
  3. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Aug 1, 2015
    Okay, a couple of questions: how are you about waking up during the night? And how are you and DH feeling about testing these days?

    I do think you can shoot tonight, but how much will depend on how confident you are that you can get a test later this evening. Sometime around +4 maybe?
     
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  4. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Feb 6, 2019
    I have my grandkids early and he hides when they are here so I will have to shoot in am before they come I guess. On top of that, he got out the back door with the dogs so I am waiting for him to get back in. He's hiding. He's skittish that way. :(
     
  5. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Feb 6, 2019
    He's in little stinker. He was hiding in the house. I am still have a hard time with bg testing so I think I better wait till am as he finished eating over an hour ago.
     
  6. Chris & China (GA)

    Chris & China (GA) Well-Known Member

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  7. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Feb 6, 2019
    Thank you very much!
     
  8. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Feb 6, 2019
    This am Stewie was really high with a bg of 536 with no insulin last night. Since he was bg 70 at +6 yesterday and only up to 195 at +12, so I didn't shoot. I have my young grandkids all day and his m.o. is to hide and thats just what he's doing so I cant get another test in until this evening. I hope his numbers come down. He has had 2 meals so far. Hopefully he will come out for a meal. I have phone meeting with Stewie's Dr. Tomorrow. I hope he hits 200s+ tonight. Luckily, knock on wood, he wasn't acting sick. I decided not to shoot last night cause I was scared something would happen when we were sleeping.
     
  9. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Hi Stewie's mom. Is there a name you'd like us to call you? Or just Stewie's Mom? Whatever you're comfortable with is fine.

    As for dosing, it looks like 2u is still a little too much since it's giving you such uneven cycles. It's not good to skip doses if there's any way to avoid it, so I think I would recommend that you drop the dose down to 1.75u and see if that helps to give you two shootable numbers. As you get more comfortable with testing, you'll be able to shoot on these higher blue numbers and be able to keep him in healthy numbers more often. For now though, let's just aim for two shootable numbers.

    1.75u doesn't have a line on the syringe, so you'll need to eyeball it. It's more important that you be consistent from one shot to the next, than it is to be precisely accurate. So I would suggest taking a syringe and pulling up some colored water (you can use food coloring, juice, cooled tea....anything that you'll be able to see clearly in the syringe). Then you and DH can work together to make your best estimate at 1.75u and use that practice syringe kind of like your ruler. Then when you draw a real syringe with the insulin you can compare the two to be sure you're dosing the right amount.

    As for the hiding, is there a way to put Stewie in an unused bathroom or a bedroom where he can be quiet and away from the grandkids, but you'd still be able to get him when you need to?
     
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  10. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Hi Djamila. My name is Pam. Thank you for looking at the post Djamila!
    He was only 114 tonight so I definitely cant shoot tonight. So tomorrow morning what ever his number is should I give him 1.75? I ordered new syringes that are 1/2 doses that should help with eyeballing but no matter his reading tomorrow am I to give him 1.75? I will try your suggestion on 1.75. I will get a +6 tomorrow as well. He is so bouncy. He played with a cat toy for a bit tonight so I guess he was feeling ok? I feel worried but I have a phone meeting with my vet tomorrow. Thank you very much. I'm lost.
     
  11. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Hi Pam! Nice to meet you! I'm going to revise my suggestion based on your PS tonight. Why don't you give him 1.5u tomorrow. He's going to be high in the morning. Don't worry about that. We're going to try to even him out, but it's going to take a little trial and error. Also, your vet is likely to freak out a little if you tell him you're adjusting the dose based on the advice of some crazy cat ladies on the internet. :smuggrin: Just nod and smile and don't worry about it. We've all been through it. :cat::)
     
  12. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Oh Djamila, Thank you, Thank you! I will do.just that. I know you are very experienced as I am not. It's so nice to meet you too. Thank you! I will post his numbers in the am and give him 1.5 units after his bg. I am waiting the arrival of the new syringes I ordered with 1/2 units. Thank you for seeing this post tonight. I appreciate all your help! Pam :bighug::bighug::). Have a good rest of your night.
     
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  13. Chris & China (GA)

    Chris & China (GA) Well-Known Member

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    We all get very good with the "smile and nod" technique when dealing with our vets.
    [​IMG]
     
  14. Barbara & Uncle (GA)

    Barbara & Uncle (GA) Well-Known Member

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    purrfect!!!
     
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  15. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Feb 6, 2019
    Hahaha! Yes! I gave Stewie 1.5 units (as close as we could tell anyway) this morning. Stewie tested a bg of 503 just as you predicted last night Djamila. Well see what comes today with my call. Luckily she is a super nice doctor who has seen my pets for a long time. Hopefully she doesn't have a problem. Stewie is clearly bouncing so I am going with your advice anywsy Djamila! I hope my half unit syringes come soon. Thank you for all your help. :). I will try hard for a +6 today.
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2019
    Reason for edit: Forgot something
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  16. Barbara & Uncle (GA)

    Barbara & Uncle (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Good luck with your vet today. I'm one of the few lucky ones who has a vet that really respects the FDMB and admits that she doesn't know as much about feline diabetes as I do at this point. I think she said she only got 4 hours of education about it in school! I'll say one thing, she insisted on home testing right from the start. She got on my case Nice but firm) when she found out I had been giving Uncle insulin for a month without testing :nailbiting:). I respected that and her honesty about the little amount of training she had.
    Hope Stewie is feeling good today :bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
  17. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Yes. My vet is so sweet also. She wanted me to home test as well and she gave me an email with a link to fdmb site for help with advice and testing tips. I respect her and she is great with my dogs too. Thanks for your post. Stewie seems to be feeling good today. :bighug::bighug:
     
  18. Barbara & Uncle (GA)

    Barbara & Uncle (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Wow, I didn't realize that. Sounds great!
     
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  19. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    The phone call with my vet went very well today. I told her I gave him 1.5 Units this am after a BG of 503 this am.Stewie tested at 179BG at +5.5. She is on board with everything we talked about on this thread. She almost thought maybe he should be on one unit with all the bouncing and we are going to talk again this evening. I called in 179 so that's what we will talk about later this afternoon. We both agreed the all wet food diet making a huge difference. Overall, she is thrilled I am testing 3x a day on most days and confident we will get him there at a good number at some point. Thanks for all your support and help here. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
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  20. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    That's so great that your vet connected you with FDMB! Gold star for her!!!

    I wouldn't drop below 1.5u at this point, but let's see that the PMPS looks like and go from there. If it's high enough to shoot, I would stick with the 1.5u. The 179 is a little too high, but right now our goal is to even him out, and then we'll start trying to get the numbers lower.

    Of course if the PMPS is too low to shoot again, then we can think about lowering a little more, but my hunch is 1u wouldn't be enough for him right now.
     
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  21. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Stewie is 181 PMPS so no shoot tonight. I think the 1.5 is good and so does she. We will see what he is in the am. He's acting happy. Thank you very much for being here! We are all on board with Stewie's treatment and that's a good place to be. :) My vet and I have another phone meeting set up for next Friday unless otherwise needed . I will call his numbers in to her office daily again next week. I will be relieved when 1/2 unit U40s arrive. :smuggrin::bighug::bighug:
     
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  22. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Here's the thing - skipping those evening doses is leaving Stewie in some really high and dangerous numbers. You need to give the second dose. If you're not comfortable giving the dose on a high blue and then testing to make sure he stays safe, then you need to lower the dose a little more to 1.25u so that you will get an evening number you can shoot on. Only dosing once/day is leaving him in those reds and blacks, and those damage their organs over the long-term and aren't sustainable.
     
  23. Barbara & Uncle (GA)

    Barbara & Uncle (GA) Well-Known Member

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    I agree with Djamila. It was great that you adhered to the "no shot under 200" guideline in the beginning for safety, but I think it's time to figure out a way to get both insulin shots in as well.
    Great idea to either lower the dose a bit or hold the current dose and be ready to test and steer with food if necessary.
    How is the testing going?
     
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  24. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    I am somewhat confused as I was told not to shoot under 200. That is what's been happening at night with his BG numbers and now I am supposed to give him a shot? So then if he is in low 190s maybe I should give him 1 unit at night and 1.5 in the am? I had to work today so was not able to do a +5-6. I understand your reasoning. We could try that.
     
  25. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    The rule to not shoot under 200 is when you're first starting, and we don't have enough data to know how a cat responds. While we are still a little short on data with Stewie, we do have enough data to know that skipping the shot at night is sending him way too high. Hence the encouragement to give him something when he's in those high blues. And along with that, to get a before-bed test in so you know if he's in a good trajectory for overnight.
     
  26. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Ok. He is due for his insulin at 7:20ish PM tonight. I will do his BG at 7 tonight, then feed him.
    Should I do the 1 unit if he is in the 190's or high 180's and 1.5 is he is in the 200's? How do you feel about that idea? :). What would you suggest the cut off number to be for a no shot? Thank you.
     
  27. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    The new syringes came! I hope they are correct ones. 15503613012551515540066412377019.jpg
     
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  28. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    I think that sounds like a good plan. :)
     
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  29. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Thank you. Can you tellme if those syringes are the correct ones if you can see the photo? Thank you very much. :bighug:
     
  30. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    I can't see if they have half-unit marks, but the rest of the details look correct. :)
     
  31. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Thank you. I don't see where it says it on the box either. I'm scared I got wrong box but it does say it goes up to 12 units. I'll have my DH check it out when he gets home. Thank you again :)
     
  32. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Well Stewie bg at AMPS was 108 this am. Maybe we should go.to 1 unit tonight? He is so unpredictable. Poor guy.
     
  33. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Yes, and please try to get more tests in. I'm worried about how low he's going without us being able to see it...:confused:
     
  34. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    What are you thinking about times to test. He wants to eat again already. He ate about 2 hrs ago. I will feed and do at test at Noonish. He's acting ok.
     
  35. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Aim for tests anytime between +4 and +7 if you can. Two tests a couple of hours apart would be great so we can start to get a sense of the curve.
     
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  36. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Okay. I will update his chart as the day progresses. He finished eating at 10:15. Will give 2nd test of day at 1pm. That will be a +6.
     
  37. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    I did a +6 and will am for. +8 in a couple hours.
     
  38. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    You may already know this, but just in case....it's okay for them to eat during the cycle, and we just go ahead and do tests. They don't have to go two hours without food before a mid-cycle test - just before AMPS and PMPS.
     
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  39. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    No. I thought they always had to go 2+ hours without eating. I waited about 3 hours from his last meal to get his +6. He just ate again right after +6. Do you want me to get a plus 8 or 9 then a PMPS? After that, I think a 1 unit tonight hopefully. Thank you for taking your valuable time to guide me for now. :):)
     
  40. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Ah! Don't worry about getting another test in during this cycle. I thought you gave him a shot this morning. My mistake. Yes, I think 1u tonight is a good idea, and then could you get in a before-bed test? How many hours are there between your PMPS and when you usually go to sleep?
     
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  41. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Okay, here is my plan. I will give him 1 unit after his PMPS and feed him at 7pm (+12). Then I will get a test at 9:30 (+14.5). Well see how he is in am. Looking back at last Sunday notes, you suggested the 1 unit initially. . You had a good premonition about Stewie.
     
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  42. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    We go to bed about 9:45.
     
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  43. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    425 this am. I gave 1 unit.
     
  44. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    He's 458 tonight. Maybe 1 isn't enough? Or give it 6 cycles? Need to give insulin in 10 mins. @Djamila ?
     
  45. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Just a minute...let me look at the spreadsheet...
     
  46. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Stay at 1 u tonight. You need to get a test or two in the middle part of the cycle (+4 to +7) to properly assess the dose.
     
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  47. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Hmmm....it could be that it's not enough, but without a mid-cycle test today we can't really be sure. I would stay at 1u tonight, and then try to get a test before bed again like you did last night. Then let's see what happens in the morning.
     
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  48. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Oops. Cross posted with Kris :). At least we are on the same page! :):):)
     
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  49. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Ok. I will try for one 1 test before bed and I will do a mid cycle tomorrow. I gave him 1 unit. Aren't I supposed to do a cycle of a specific unit 6 times before switching his dose up again. Maybe we need to try to do 1.25 if I can gauge it. If he continues to stay high. I wasn't home to do the mid cycle today. Thank you for your time and help. :)
     
  50. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    I will do that tomorrow. I wasn't home today
    Thank you for your help as well
    :)
     
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  51. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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  52. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Stewie 331 at +2.5 tonight after 1 unit.
     
  53. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Stewie 496 this am. I will give 1 unit and maybe we consider a bump up tonight since it's to early to talk with anyone. @Djamila and @Kris & Teasel :(
     
  54. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Yes, stick with the 1u this morning, and get a mid-cycle test. Then my hunch is we'll want to go back up to 1.25u tonight, but let's see if he gets into a nice low blue or green today before making any decisions.
     
  55. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Ok
    I gave him 1 unit this am. I will get a mid cycle and post it. Then maybe 1.25 tonight. Thank you so much!!! Sorry for all this drama! Thanks for always being here....
     
  56. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    No need to apologize! We have all been in the beginning phases and received just as much help. That's why we stuck around and pay it forward now. :bighug: In no time you'll be giving other people advice!
     
  57. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    @Djamila Stewie is 504 tonight. I think we need to go up on insulin. 1.25 or 1.5. Either way. I have to eyeball it. I should shoot him by the next 15 mins. Thanks. Pam. Let me know.
     
  58. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Okay, I decided on 1.25. Well see in the am on his numbers. :)
     
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  59. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    Good choice. It’s generally best to increase by only 0.25 u at a time at this low dose level.
     
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  60. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Thank you! I felt good about that decision. I eyeballed it and had my DH 2nd the opinion. We'll see what he does in the am. I will get a +6 tomorrow as well. :)
     
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  61. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    It’s very satisfying to reach a point where you can make a reasonable decision on your own. Very useful when you might not get a fast response here.
     
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  62. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Yes. Thank you! I almost feel like I'm starting to get the hang of this. ;):). Still a work in progress on ear pokes though. Poor Stewie!:bighug::bighug:
     
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  63. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Stewie was 494 this am. I think he is stabilizing from the bounce and maybe need to go to 1.5 tonight? I will get a +6 today but he seems to be staying really high looking at his numbers on the chart.
     
  64. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Usually you want to hold a dose for 3-4 cycles before the next increase. I understand the concern though given how high he is. If it's possible to get two tests during the day today - a couple hours apart, that would be great. Let's see where he is later today. If he's still staying in the pinks, I would say go ahead and go to 1.5u tonight, but only if you can get a test tonight at +3 or later. You don't want to raise the dose and then not monitor the cycle.
     
  65. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    I will get a mid cycle today and see if I can get 2 tests. I dont know if I will be able to do that. I think I should keep at 1.25 maybe for the next couple days and see what happens? That way, I am not constantly switching doses up. Wouldn't that possibly send him into another bounce cycle? I am still new at this but that is what I was wondering.
     
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  66. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Ok, he's 304 at +4, I can get a +6 as well.
     
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  67. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    189bg at +6. He's keeping away from me now..lol
     
  68. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    So far, so good. Keep 1.25 u for tonight, numbers permitting. You might be able to go to 1.5 u tomorrow AM, numbers permitting.
     
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  69. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Sounds like a plan! Thanks :)
     
  70. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Stewie's +12 BG is 419. That's some improvement I think. 1.25 will be given at 7:30pm. We'll see how he is in am. 4 pokes is enough for him today. :)
     
  71. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    Great job getting the extra test in today! The more tests become a regular part of your lives, the easier it will be on all of you. It stops being something that causes him to hide or that causes you stress and just becomes part of the routine. It's probably hard to imagine that right now, but you really will get there.
     
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  72. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Thank you. I will be glad to get to the "routine test stage". :)
     
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  73. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Stewie at 399 this am "in the pink". I am eyeballing the 1.25 so it's probably a little over but whatever is happening, I think it's maybe working? I'm cautiously optimistic we are on a downturn. Going to call ADW and see if they have .25 marking needles as I'm sure I got the wrong ones since they don't show 1/2 units. They are smaller unit ones so they are easier to eyeball. :)
     
  74. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

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    The half unit marks will be very obvious if the syringes have them. They don't make syringes with quarter unit marks. That has to be eyeballed. Even if you don't need them a cheap pair of drugstore reading glasses in a fairly high magnification can help a lot.
     
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  75. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Thanks. I thought I ordered 1/2 unit markings but it doesn't have them. It's a 12 unit syringe. I will try your suggestion. I already wear glassed..lol
     
  76. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

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    Stewie is 413 AMPS. I bumped him to 1.5 units. Have meeting with my vet today. :)
     
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  77. Djamila

    Djamila Well-Known Member

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    How did the meeting with the vet go?
     
  78. Stewie's Mom ID

    Stewie's Mom ID Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2019
    Thank you for asking. It went well and we are on the same page with 1.5 units for now. She's great and we will have weekly meetings going forward so I am super happy about that. :). Have a good day!
     
    Rachel and Kris & Teasel like this.

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