New here and completely confused

Hey All! My name is Eric and my cat's name is Melvin. He is an 8 year old teacup himalayan (not overweight). I noticed about a month ago he was drinking and urinating more than I have ever seen. Googled it and after seeing the results it could be, I took him to the vet. They did full blood work and let me know the next day it is diabetes. They wanted to change his diet for the first week to a low carb. We did that, but he was still in the 400s. Started him on 2u of Vetsulin every 12 hours. On the days I couldn't get him to eat before the insulin they advised me to not give it to him. I missed a couple of mornings due to him not eating.

I brought him back to the vet for another reading (I know now I can do this at home) and he was in the high 500s. Vet advised to put him on 3u twice a day for the next few days to see what happens. He started acting like him normal self again! It was great seeing him like this. Friday morning he ate his fancy feast classic and I gave him his 3u. 2 hours after he couldn't stand, he couldn't do anything and I am pretty sure he was in a hypoglycemia state. I put some maple syrup on his gums and within a few minutes he was okay. Vet advised to drop the dosage to 2u after this (without even getting a reading). Friday night I gave him 2u after he ate and he just slept all night. Gave him 2u twice yesterday after his meals and now he's breathing hard and not doing much at all. I skipped his insulin this morning due to not eating but I am unsure of what to do now.

He's responsive, but he just wants to lay down and not do much. His breathing seems to be a little harder and faster and I looked this up and it may be low blood pressure. I gave him a little maple syrup and he seems to be doing better, but I am so confused.

Is it time for me to start doing home level tests? I am completely new to this. I am terrified of using the at home meters (not sure why). I am unsure of what his insulin should be for what his levels are (if I do the readings myself).

Please help. I am sure this post is all over the place and I apologize.

 

Hi Eric--

Oh, my.

Gotta say, with those symptoms, I would take Melvin to a vet to get checked out-- it will probably be an emergency vet as it is Sunday, but I don't think I'd wait until tomorrow. The fast, labored breathing does sound like heart/blood pressure issues. I don't have any experience with that myself, perhaps others here can tell you more and whether it can wait until tomorrow, but I'd be pretty worried and want to get it checked out asap if it were my cat.

We can definitely help with the feline diabetes treatment, once you get there, but I'm not sure that's the primary issue right now-- he's had no insulin since last night, correct? but he's having the breathing symptoms today? It's interesting that he seemed to perk up after the maple syrup this morning, but it seems unlikely that it's a low blood glucose issue more than 12hrs post-shot (but, please don't give any more insulin until you have started home testing-- it definitely sounds like he was getting too much!) How is his appetite today in general?

Perhaps others can weigh in with more specific suggestions regarding the breathing issues, I'm sorry I can't be more help. to you and your Melvin, I hope he is feeling better soon!

 

Thank you for your reply. Yea, the breathing is starting to worry me. He hasn't eat much other than a small amount of royalcain dry food and a couple of treats (to try and induce him to eat), but it's not working.

 

Ah, I see a note that he wasn't eating this morning so you skipped insulin. Definitely time for a vet visit.

I've also been thinking a bit more about his symptoms this morning, particularly the response to maple syrup, and wondering if it's possible that he is actually having a hypo event. If Melvin has been getting too much insulin for a while and has been having frequent (unnoticed) hypo events, the counter-regulatory mechanisms that have been keeping him safe (basically, liver dumping out glucose to raise BG in response to hypo) may have been exhausted by this morning, so I guess it's possible that he is in a hypo state right now. Try the maple syrup again (since he's not eating) to see if it perks him up, but yes, vet.

No matter what, I think he needs to go to a vet-- even if it is hypo, it's a symptomatic one and you are not home-testing yet, so it's not something we'd recommend trying to treat at home.

 

I am at the emergency vet clinic now. Ill update this thread when I know more.

 

Please do. Sending good thoughts Melvin's way-- hope it's just a minor and easily-resolved issue!

 

His levels are at 556! I don't understand this.

 

What would the proper dosage of insulin be for that level? I do not trust this animal clinic vet as she keeps trying to get me to test for stuff that's not related and I've already tested on Wednesday.

 

Did they do a blood pressure test? They put a little cuff on the back leg, just like human Dr's.

My suggestion is go to Walmart. Pick up a relion micro meter, extra test strips, 28 gauge lancets, and some neosporin ointment. Start at square 1. You are going to have to start testing at home for sure. Shooting blind is dangerous and leaving too many questions about what is going on.

 

What do they want you to test for? On the one hand, I find the hard breathing to be a very worrying sign and would want them to test for any serious conditions that might be indicated; on the other hand (I am cynical), not all ER vet clinics take a, shall we say, minimalist approach to ordering expensive tests.

As Janet says, we can help with the blood glucose testing aspects of things, you don't need the ER vet (or your regular vet) for that, I'm just worried about other issues...

For anyone who is watching this thread, could the breathing just be caused by the high BG???? I haven't heard of that happening, but I'm throwing that out there just in case someone has knowledge of such a thing.

 

Did the emergency vet check him for ketones?

 

I second the ketone test, especially with the skipped shot and inappetance this morning. More on ketones and ketoacidosis here-- general testing is something else you can easily do at home, but since ketones are an automatic vet visit and he's already there, it'd be good to get a reading now.

 

Ack. Just re-read the link I sent, and breathing very fast is on the list of symptoms.

Do NOT leave the ER without a ketone test, please!!!!! If it's this, it could get very serious, very fast.

 

Yes ketones were negative.

 

His breathing has seemed to level out. Vet said it was probably due to the missed insulin and not eating on top of stress. Plus I didn't help with the situation with the syrup (due to thinking it was like last time with the same symptoms. I am so bad at this. :\

I think its time to do home testing like you all have mentioned so I can get him regulated and the proper dosage in him every time.

 

Phew!!!!

Doesn't solve the mystery, but it's good that it's not that-- DKA is no joke.

 

So glad to hear that the breathing has leveled out and the vet seems to think it's minor.

Do not beat yourself up-- you just didn't have information to go on about the blood sugar, and if it had been a hypo, the syrup could have saved his life (as it probably did on the other hypo you witnessed).

We can totally help with the home testing-- it's a lot easier than you are probably thinking now, once you get going with it, and it really is the best way to keep Melvin safe while administering insulin. After a little while, you won't be able to believe that you were shooting insulin without doing it!

 

Also, the Vet increased by 1 whole unit where as on here it is recommended increasing by 0.25U or 0.5. Somewhere in between 2 - 3U could have been his ideal dose . Home testing is the best tool in our FD kitty care belt!

Sieden just made and posted a video today on the Main Health forum showing how to do a BG test on her kitty. http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...to-get-a-blood-sample-starring-peanut.175369/

I'm sure most of us would go crazy if we continually administered insulin and did not have a way to check our baby's BG numbers. We would be Hawk like 24/7 . I was that way when I first started

To help keep track of your numbers, we use spreadsheets: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/

 

My moms cat Toby has fast breathing issues but he is not diabetic. Not to scare you but her cat has a heart condition.
Smoky has also had fast breathing issues. Once he fell off the back of a chair and he is very underweight so it knocked the wind out of him, but luckily the fast breathing resolved itself. The one other time was due to high BG's over 600 for an extended period of time. He improved a great deal once I switched him from vetsulin to prozinc.

Smokys original vet also increased him a whole unit at a time. I'm so glad I found this site and the folks on here helped me thru a hypo episode due to my vet putting him on too high of a starting dose.

 

Did Melvin get a shot of insulin while at the vet's? What was the dosage?

 

If his dose has been too high, his physiologic protective mechanism will mobilize stored glucose into his bloodstream to prop himself up. Problem is, this mechanism can overreact and send blood glucose into the stratosphere.

 

Not insulin at the animal hospital yesterday. They advised to give him one when I got home and I did. His breathing issues perked back up late last night and I laid with him all night until 7am and brought him into my normal vet. They don't think he is accepting the Vetsulin. They are keeping him and have him on an IV and checking his levels every 2 hours and giving him the proper dosage of insulin. They said they would call me every couple of hours to give me an update. I am so upset.

 

Oh, poor little guy!

Some people have reported that Vetsulin doesn't seem to "agree with" their cat-- they've noted behavioral declines during the max action of the shot and that kind of thing, with their cats just seeming miserable on this particular insulin.

If they give you a choice of alternate insulins to try, Lantus is one that seems to work well for a lot of cats, and we have a lot of very experienced users on this site, so there'd be tons of help to get Melvin feeling better. Levemir is less common, but similar enough to Lantus that there is a single forum for all the "L" insulin users. ProZinc is another insulin that seems to do well with cats, and we have a smaller, but active, community of ProZinc users here too.

I think it's good that he's at your regular vet, who knows him, and is getting a lot of attention today. Hopefully they will get this figured out!

 

I sure hope so! The Vet is going to change his insulin to ProZinc today while he is there. He stated it would be a little more expensive than the Vetsulin, but that doesn't matter as long as it works.

 

Yep. You just want to get him feeling better! I hope the ProZinc is a better match for him.

 

Received a call from the vet and its good news so far. They have him on fluids and a catheter in. They started him on ProZinc and he's already in the high 300s from 546 this morning. The vet said he's so much more alert. His breathing has settled and is seeing great signs already after such a short time. Next call will be in an hour or two. This is such a huge relief. Hoping to see improvements the rest of the way. Thank you again!

 

You wouldn't happen to know if he's allergic to pork, would you?

 

I can't imagine how cute a teacup Himalayan must be!! More pix please!

 

I'm glad your little guy is feeling better and hoping you can bring him home soon.

 

I was thinking the same! Any teacup kitty must be adorable!

 

I agree with this!! Feel like a vulture waiting for "aweeee" pictures. @melvin glad you are here. The best place to be with FD!

 

Not that I know of, sorry!

And I was mistaken. He is currently on just fast acting insulin? Not sure what that means, but the vet is using it to get his levels down and he is finally in the 200s!! Vet said he wants to sit down with me and figure out what insulin will work for him. He's trying to get him to eat now.

 

Me too! Thank you for the words.

 

Pics as requested.

Sorry if they are large.

Sleeping in his water bowl as a kitten. He's not the brightest.


My beer holder sometimes


He was so tiny as a kitten.




Always looks grumpy, but the nicest cat I have ever met/owned.

 

Those pics are hilarious and he has the coolest expressions on his face. Thanks for sharing them.

 

Melvin also made it on "animals that look like celebrities" on the Jay Leno show. Just his picture, not actually on the show.

 

Thank you! He's helped me through so many rough times. Can't wait to have him back.

 

It still counts as being a celebrity in my book.

 

I saw that Jay Leno!! Lol coolbeans. He is adorable. And you meant that you' ve ever been 'owned by' its ok we get it

 

Hahaha yes! He totally owns me.

I was never a cat person until he came in my life.

 

I'm glad to hear that Melvin is doing better. I hope that the ProZinc is a match and that you can start home testing when he gets home. Set up your spreadsheet while you wait and then you'll be ready for everyone to help you once he gets there. You can get all of the testing supplies at Wal-Mart, the Relion Confirm is what I use and you can buy the lancets and test strips for it too. I want to say that the machine is about 15.00 to 20.00 then a box of lancets that will last you forever is about 10.00 and a box of 50 test strips is 25.00 or you can just buy a box of 100 strips for 35.00 which is better because you will go through that many so just go ahead and get the 100. You DO NOT need the AlphaTrak so don't waste your money.

 

OMG, Melvin is a sweetie! I love that photo of him in his water bowl.

 

He's adorable! Look at him with his handsome lion cut!

 

Thank you! I plan on going to walmart this afternoon or tomorrow to get this.

How much insulin do I know to give him once I get his levels?

 

The vet will prescribe a dose. Sometimes they start at too high a dose so I suggest you post here for feedback. Also let us know what insulin because they have different characteristics and we can give advice.

Give some thought to setting up the spreadsheet we use here. It's what we look at first when we offer feedback.

 

Make sure to get the 28 gauge lancets. Hopefully, the Vet won't start you on too high of a dose. Seems to be an increasing occurrence . Think he's getting put on Prozinc instead of Vetsulin now

 

Hope his vet gets Melvin's insulin sorted out and he starts to feel better soon!

 

Sitting at the vet and it's not good. His levels were all over the place and he won't eat. He got his levels to 122 and he wouldn't eat. He put a little food into and his levels went to 395 and now theyre at 225 with no insulin since 12:40pm est.

Vet wants to run more blood work to see if it's pancreatitis. He has a feeling it is since he's not eating and dizzy. Bringing him back into tomorrow morning to see if they can get it controlled. If not, he said by Thursday he wanted to talk options. I know what that means.


Did not want to hear this.

 

Hope the blood work gives them an idea of what's going on and you won't need to discuss those other options. Sending healing vines

 

I can't see everything that your vet is seeing, of course, but you should know: pancreatitis is a manageable condition, and so is feline diabetes. Melvin has had a rough couple weeks, and an extremely rough weekend, no question, but very very few cats can be even close to regulated in that short a time. Dogs, I've heard, are much easier-- perhaps your vet has had a lot of experience with canine diabetes?

The not eating is probably the biggest issue right now. Hoping he perks up a bit once he gets home to more comfortable surroundings, and that you get some good news from the bloodwork.

 

Sorry to hear he's not feeling well. One of my non diabetic cats had a bout of pancratitis earlier this year. He was lucky and able to fully recover in about a week.

 

I agree with what's been said. Melvin is nowhere near that unmentionable precipice. Pancreatitis can be treated, along with a variety of other things that can arise in an inappetant diabetic kitty.

 

The options he's going to give you may just be hospitalization and a temporary feeding tube to get his calories up. Pancratitis is treatable. In the meantime get him to eat anything he can to avoid development of fatty liver.

 

I'm really hoping that you start getting some good news. Keep your head up though and listen to the people here, they know a lot. The fight isn't over so don't throw in the towel. Let us know what happens when you find out.

 

I'm sorry to hear Melvin is having such a hard time. I'm hoping they will be able to send him home with you soon.

 

Thank you all! Sorry I have been quiet, but I have been trying to spend time with him and process these feelings. Melvin's breathing looked terrible last night. Anytime he heard something or wasn't asleep, his sides were moving so quickly and hard. He didn't eat last night, but he did have a couple of treats. He did drink water. He didn't seem to be in any pain, just confused and very tired.

This morning when I dropped him back off at the vet, the blood work came back and negative for pancreatitis. The vet does think he has hepatitis. I have been trying to read up on this, but with work this has been hard. Anyone have experience with this?

This is emotionally draining me. It's also getting very expensive, but I will not give up.

 

Do you mean hepatitis or hepatic lipidosis? Different things I think. Not eating can cause hepatic lipidosis and sometimes a feeding tube is the ticket to recovery. This isn't as bad as you might think and has saved many kitty lives.

 

Vet said hepatitis, but I could have heard it wrong.

Small video of his breathing from last night: https://streamable.com/s7drc

 

Wait! I just saw this thread: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/picky-eater-and-food-allergies.175486/

Melvin used to get depo shots every 3-5 months for a cough that he had and this was the only thing fixing it. Could the depo shot be causing all these issues? I know I am reaching for anything.

 

The signs of cushings disease is exactly how I noticed Melvin. Should I call and ask them to check if this is it?

 

*I am not a professional/expert. I just did a lot of research and kept some of the links*

Which signs, specifically? Cushing's and diabetes share some initial symptoms, along with other health issues. I may be wrong but from my understanding Cushing's cats are high-dose cats, 2-3U is not a high dose, along with Acro / IAA kitties. There is a test called IGF-1 (Insulin-like Growth Factor-1) and in U.S. if results are >100 then considered testing positive.

*I am not a professional/expert. I just did a lot of research and kept some of the links*

 

The only signs I noticed for Melvin was he was drinking LOTS of water and the litter box was just water. He was still eating normally at the time.

Thank you for the information. I am waiting to hear back from the vet around 2pm est with updates. Hoping for good ones.

 

Any news?

 

Waiting to pick him up from the vet now. They haven't been telling me much on the phone since my normal vet is out today.

His levels were at 250ish this morning with no insulin since yesterday at 12:30pm est. He's on antibiotics and apparently his breathing is manageable when he's not excited. I'm really not liking not knowing what is going on. It's really concerning me.

 

Think positive, they're letting him go home rather than keeping him in hospital.

Sending healing vines...

 

Melvin died.

 

Oh no . So sorry for your loss, Eric
May fond memories of your beloved Melvin warm your heart always

 

I'm so very sorry for your loss. Fly Free Sweet Melvin, Land Softly

 

Oh my goodness Eric I am so saddened by this news and just shocked. Melvin was a beautiful boy who knew how much you loved him. Please take solace in knowing you did everything you could for him and more! I hope you are surrounded by friends or family. I'm truly sorry for your loss

 

I'm very sorry for your loss. He will always be with you in spirit.

May you fly free Melvin.

 

I'm so sorry that you've lost Melvin.

 

Oh no!!!! I'm utterly shocked by this news. I am so sorry... You did everything possible for your beautiful sweet boy, it is just heartbreaking when sometimes that just isn't enough.

Fly free, little Melvin. RIP.

 

My words can never be enough to mend your heart but I'm sorry for your loss, RIP little Melvin

 

Thank you all for your help and support. They couldn't control his breathing and I had to make the decision. I hate that my last memory of him was breathing like that and I couldn't even hold him. I'm so heartbroken.