New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty!

Hello all... My name is Stephanie and we have recently had our kitty BooBoo diagnosed with feline diabetes. We thought we were going to have to have her put to sleep because of the high host to get her stabilized and maintained with the proper care she needed, but alas, we were able to find a low cost clinic in our area that made it more affordable for us to care for our kitty, therefore allowing us to be able to save her! So it has now been about 3 weeks. When 1st diagnosed, she was at 563. Last week on Thursday, she was at 250 and yesterday she was at 50. The vet told me to not give her the night time shot last night and to wait til about 2-3pm today. I was giving her 10 units twice a day up util yesterday, and although the vet said to give her 10 units today, I only gave her 8, 1 unit per pound and she is at 8 lbs. I was afraid to give her to much since she was just at 50. I wanted to join this website because I desperately need some help. Right now we do not have an at home test kit, but will be purchasing one as soon as we can afford it. I need help! Is 10 units a day to much or too little and did I make a mistake only giving her 8 today, and should I go back to 10 units tomorrow once a day? HELP!!!

Thanx,
Stephanie

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Hi and Welcome to you and BooBoo.

I'm sorry to be blunt but 10 units is way too high of a starting dose no matter what type of insulin you're using, whether it be a slow or fast acting one.

What type of insulin are you using? What type of food is BooBoo eating now? Did the vet say anything about changing diet?

The cheapest and safest way to take care of your kitty is by hometesting your cat's BG (blood glucose number) using a glucometer. You can get one at any pharmacy, on line or even request a newbie kit since you mentioned that finances are tight.

This link will take you to the newbie kits:
viewtopic.php?f=14&t=19528

I know it's hard to listen to strangers on the internet over a vet, but we've been dealing with FD (Feline Diabetes) for years and are in the trenches with this every day, where vets are like GPs who must know about all kinds of animals and diseases.

I hope you can tell us more about BooBoo and please ask tons of questions.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

50? how many hours past the shot?

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Hello and welcome. Gosh really glad you found us.
I completely agree with jennifer ( Tucker's mom )

It is really important to find out what type of insulin and what type of syringe you are using to figure out whether that is a true 10 units or not.

I am really concerned at that whopping dose considering how much your kitty has dropped.

I have xposted to ask more eyes of experience come and offer their assistance as well.
Hometesting will save your kitty....please have a look through the faqs and find out more.
http://binkyspage.tripod.com/faq.html

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

maybe I'm not saying it right. maybe it's 1 unit. I'm not sure. I'm using Humulin N insulin. I have the syringes that are 100 units. They told me to pull the plunger up to the 10 spot, so that's why I said 10 units. We did change her diet to Hills M/D prescription. Maybe I am glad I only gabe her 8 or .8 or what not! Thanks for your reply too!!!

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Welcome to the site!

I know dealing with this disease can be intimidating and overwhelming, but coming to this site is the best thing you could ever do for BooBoo!

As for glucose monitors, I use the Relion one from Walmart - $9! Strips are about $20 for 50, lancets like $5 for 100. Very reasonable as far as meters go. You don't need to spend the big bucks on an animal specific one, not to mention the strips have to be ordered and there are days when you'll go through a lot of strips and need to have easy access to more.

Hometesting is super important, so while it might seem daunting, it's so worthwhile learning to do. There are videos you can watch that really help you get the hang of it, plus many folks here who can walk you through it.

My next question for you would be what kind of diet is BooBoo on? A low carb canned food only diet can be hugely instrumental in helping get a diabetic cat regulated or even into remission.

And I do think that 10 units is a crazy high dose. What kind of insulin are you using?

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

10 on a u100 is equal to 4 units. I don't know about the insulin you're using, but I'm sure someone will be along who does.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

It was like 6 hours after the shot that they tested her...

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Hi Stephanie and BooBoo

First off WHOA 10 units that is a lot of insulin for a kitty, true some do need that much but they usually have some underlying health issues. Most cats here become fairly well regulated and even into remission on just 1 to 2 units. Unlike dogs, cats are not dosed by weight when it comes to insulin.

If you could tell us a little more about yourself and your kitty we can probably help you better. First off how did you get to 10u and what insulin are you using?

50 is a non-diabetic number so not sure why your vet would have you giving her any insulin at that point. My Max is diet controlled and he normally runs in the 50s and 60s.

What is BooBoo eating? Diet plays a huge part of helping cats with diabetes, many cats go into remission after a short course of insulin with a diet change from dry food to low carb/high protein wet canned diet. However we caution not to change diet before you are home testing, as this chnage alone can drop a cat's BGs as much as 100pts.

As far as a home testing kit and affording it, Lori and TomTom runs a newbie kit program here and all they ask is that you paid for the shipping which I believe is around $5. This would get you off to a running start at least, as it includes everything you need to get started testing BooBoo at home. Not only does this give you a better idea of how the insulin is working in his body but also will reduce your vet costs as you can do the expensive curves at home and just send the results to your vet, rathr than dragging poor BooBoo to the vet all the time. This also gives you much truer numbers, as all cats (even those that love theri vet) are stressed out at the Vet's office. So if the vet is dosing off the numbers he/she sees in office the dose could be too high at home where kitty is all relaxed in his own enviroment.

I'm sure others will be along shortly with more questions and more links to information. Just know this is a very easy disease to manage. In fact so easy that I adopted my current Sugarcat from this very board.

Just Breathe, we are here to help you help BooBoo

Mel, Max & The Fur Gang

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Thank you sooo much for the Walmart tip. We have plenty of those where we live!

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Awesome i will check out the newbie kit!!!

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Here's a primer that was written by some long time members about Humulin insulins:

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=303

I would hold off on insulin until we figure out if it's 1U or 10 units that you're using. Just to be safe.

The WalMart Relion meter is a great one, price is good and you'll find hometesting every day is much cheaper than going to the vet even once per month.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Kristen, this is wrong - I think you are thinking of u-40 insulin conversion.

N is u-100 so a unit is a unit on the syring.

Pam & Layla

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Pam - you're right, I was going off the prozinc we use, which is u40. Didn't mean to give wrong info!

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Yikes! Humulin N is a hard insulin to be giving a cat. It is short acting, hits hard and doesn't last a full 12 hours usually. And Humulin is a U100 insulin so 10 on a U100 syringes IS 10 UNITS that is way too high of a starting dose. Better insulins which are longer lasting would be PZI for animals or Levermir and Lantus which are human insulins that work extremely well for felines.

How is BooBoo acting in general?

Mel, Max & The Fur Gang

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

She has always been a kind of quiet kitty and sticks to her self, so it's kinda hard to know what's going on with her. The only way i realized that there was something wrong with her in the 1st place is because I noticed how much she was urinating and it was like listening to a human in a litter box! Anyway, yesterday morning when I gave her her shot, she seemed really sleepy and it's prob cause she was too low, and 6 hours after her shot was when the vet tested her and got a 50 reading. How do I go about changing the insulin if Humulin N is not a good one? She has started drinking kind of a lot of water again. I did wait a total of 30 hours before giving her 8 units instead of the 10 the vet told me too at 2:30pm today.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

I'd ask the vet for a script for Lantus (Glargine), it's much gentler and better for new kitties.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Well depending on where you are located, if you are in Canada you can just go buy the insulin you want, here in the US you will need your vet to write you a script for it. But that isn't the critical part right now.

You are probably correct in thinking that yesterday she was really sleepy from going too low, and with the dose she is on right now unless she just happens to be a high dose cat she is probably right now in what is called rebound. Where her body is trying to protect itself from too much insulin by dumping stored sugars. So she is going through wild blood glucose swings.

You are going to want to read this and print it out so it is handy should you need it. http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1122 This is the signs of her going to low and how to treat should it start happening. Without being able to home test, we're going to have to go off how she is acting in general.

Do you have some kind of Karo syrup, pancake syrup, honey or dry cat food in the house?

Also how has her overall appetite been? Is she eating well?

Mel, Max & The Fur Gang

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Stephanie, I would strongly suggest you get thee to a Walmart and buy a meter.....Reli-On is cheap, is a good meter also. Don't forget to buy some lancets, some test strips and some KetoStix (they test the urine for ketones). I would not wait to get a meter in the mail. I am also amazed that Boo-Boo is alive with a dose of 20 units of N a day. Food needs to be fed a good 1/2 hr. before using N because it is a fast acting insulin with a short duration. I am also amazed at the adivce that vet has given you as far as dosing.

Please, get a meter, test, and post back as to numbers you are getting. Insulin is not based on weight of cat. Canned food should be fed, no dry but.......if you are feeding dry right now, DO NOT take it away. It may have been keeping her from hypoing. Please print and stick this where you can see it. viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1122

By right, she should only have been started on 1 unit b.i.d. (2x a day) and there are much better insulins out there for cats rather than N insulin.

Please keep us updated on how she is doing and hopefully you will be able to get her on Lantus, or Prozinc.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

She wasn't eating too well earlier, but right when it was about the time to give the insulin at 2:30pm today, she all of a sudden became extremely hungry, ate very well, and then ate more after I gave the shot of 8 units as opposed to the 10 I was giving. I had not given her a shot for 30 hours at that point, and since she was so low yesterday, it just felt more comfortable to me than the whole 10, however I have noticed now she is drinking alot of water again or it seems like that too me. When should I give the next shot and how much? I think we are going to go get the meter thing from Walmart that was suggested so we can know better what the heck we are doing here, cause I am driving myself bonkers over her with worry!!!

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

btw, the 1st insulin syringes given to us did say 1 unit and the top number said 10, and these new syringes are the same thing same size but smaller needle but they say 10 and top says 100. Maybe I can take a pic and post it so we can all know what i am talking about...

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Heck, Stephanie, I think we'd all feel better if you got that meter ASAP and started testing her nailbite_smile Please, do not give her insulin again, at least not even 8 units, till you are testing. We usually shoot 12 hrs. apart, a.m. and p.m.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Wonderful idea because that is the only real way we are going to know what is truly going on with her, and if you don't have it in the house grab some Karo syrup while you are there.

I use the Relion mini myself, great meter, and cheap. AWhole set up ran me I think $35 with tax.

When you get it let us know and we will talk you through testing.

You also might want to post your general location as we may have someone close to you, that can at least help with finding a better vet later on. Her current one scares me.

Mel, Max & The Fur Gang

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Please take the picture of the syringe, that would be helpful.

N wears of quickly, but there also is a thing called rebound, either way, if her BGs shot up she would be thirsty like she was.

I would not give more than 1U of insulin even when you start hometesting. 1U is the normal starting dose, even though some vets give a dose based on weight, Tucker's starting dose on N was 4U but we quickly learned that was way too high.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

http://diabetesindogs.wikia.com/wiki/U100_Syringes Scroll down and look at the pics.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Thanx for all the info! I am definitely going to Walmart tonight! We love our kitty and want her to do well, and I don't want to freak out that I'm going to kill her every time I give her a shot! It's been 2 hours and 15 min. since the shot I gave and am wondering if it is okay to leave now for a few hours to run errands, have dinner for my hubby's bday and get that Relion home test kit. She seems to be okay at this point...

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

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So 1U is a very very small amount right? My hubby pointed out that the difference in the syringes is that the one that says 1 is actually 1cc and the others are measured in units, ie. 1cc=10 units... that was my confusion.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

A 1cc syringe has 100 units in it....the first little line on that syringe is 2 full units.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

The store of glycogen(glucagon) the liver has to save a cat from a hypo but sends them into a rebound, can deplete. If you gave her 8 units of N less than 3 hrs. ago, I wouldn't go anywhere. Her liver may not have enough to bounce her back up and save her.

As for syringes, majority of us use a 3/10cc insulin syringe----holds 30 units of insulin, each little line being 1 unit. You do not need to use a 1 cc syringe which holds 100 units. Easier to see the lines on a 3/10 cc syringe also. Unless the kitty is an acromegaly cat, most cats need between .5 and 3 units of insulin b.i.d.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

When can we leave? We need to get the glucose meter...

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

How long would it take you to get to Walmart and back? Is there anyone that can stay at home while you are out? Or anyone that can pick up the meter/strips on their way home?

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

We live out in the boonies so it takes us a while to get to Walmart and back. prob like 2 hours with drive time. She just seems to have perked up a bit. I made a new little bed for her where she likes to lay down and she just got up to go lay on it. She seems to be okay and has been okay with the 10 units twice a day that I was giving her for about 1 week and a half. We really don't know anyone out where we live, as all our friends and most of our family live about 70 miles from us... It has now been almost 3 1/2 hours since her shot...

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Next question is whether the pharmacy is still open. They keep the test strips behind the counter and I'm not sure how many strips are in the Reli-On box. I would call and make sure on the hours for the pharmacy because you will need strips plus lancets and I would go and leave hubby home to watch. Remember also, if you ever need to use karo, or honey, do not syringe it down. you could aspirate BooBoo..........rub it on the gums and keep doing it if you end up in a hypo situation. We are worried because we are still confused if you gave 1 unit only or 8 units. Frankly, I think we are all amazed BooBoo is still with you with that high dose the vet has had you giving her.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

The best way for us to tell you if it is safe to leave her for any lenght of time is to have someone get the meter for you and get that first test done so we can see where she is at right now.

Mel, Max & The Fur Gang

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

When too much insulin is given the blood glucose drops rapidly and hypoglycemia (low blood sugar) results. This can trigger the body to release glucagon (and other hormones) and the result is that glucose is dumped into the blood. This can lead to hyperglycemia (high blood sugar). So, you have hyperglycemia induced by hypoglycemia, or the Somogyi effect. (Somogyi was a scientist who did research on glucose production by liver during times of stress.)

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

can you narrow down where in the antelope valley?

i'm a little familiar with the area as we race in rosamond at willow springs but live a ways away but i think we've got some members out that way. i know of one in lancaster for instance and another one i'm thinking of but will have to see for sure where she is too out that way.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

I just found Mendi and Bubba(GA) in Palmdale.....old profile had said Antelope Valley.......so pm'ing her.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Thanx guys for all the help. I just called my prayer line and had them pray with me for her health to be okay while we leave. She seems okay for now, so I'm just gonna leave it in God's hands for now cause I am literally driving myself bonkers and go do what we need to do as I am disabled myself and need my hubby's help with the driving and such and I am the one who has been dealing with this so I know what we need to get which means we both have to go...

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

jan and buddy are in lancaster. i sent her a pm.

gonna send gail & houdini one too. she's up that way but i think actually a ways east of there. (getting old and memory is fading )

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

I am actually east of lancaster too...

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Stephanie,

I'm in Santa Clarita. I'm not one to give advice on insulin dosage since AJ was on something completely different and has been in remission for over a year, but I can certainly help you on home testing and diet. PM me your phone number if you want to talk about it. Obviously, the guys in Palmdale and Lancaster are closer to you, but I'm here if you need me.

Becky and AJ

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Just saying welcome... and "In God's hands" is a perfect place to be.... I'll be praying, cause those doing the advice giving are good.... But praying is always a help... BooBoo Kitty is lucky to have you, and you managed to find us... I'm so glad you did.. (((Hugging you gently))))... AND as I was told on my first post here... Don't forget to breathe...

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Stephanie - You are heading in the right direction in helping your cat. You've come to the right place and clearly you are interested in learning how to get your cat healthy and you are taking the immediate steps to do that. Congratulations. This can be the hardest step. I'll strongly echo everyone else in that it's a little scary to hear that any vet has advised such a huge dose of a hard-hitting insulin. Hopefully you've had some phone chats with those who have offered to call - let us know your plan as to when and how much you plan on dosing moving forward... Keep asking questions here, there are many who will help you, advise you and support you.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Hi Stephanie,

Also, no matter how late it is, even on the west coast, you will always find folks that will be on here to help you with any rough spots if you need to ask questions about your kitty and how the insulin is affecting her.

Hopefully she will be fine when you return. Please post when you get home if you are able to. Everyone here that is concerned about that insulin dose, will be anxious to know how BooBoo Kitty is feeling. And you too!

Happy Birthday to your hubby! I sure would make it a quick dinner though, and I hope you are back home as soon as possible. Cats can seem okay one minute, and then be hypo-ing the next.

Jean and Charcoal (GA) (I am on the East Coast, but sometimes I am up very late like others, maybe till 3 or 4 am. Then other folks here are up at all hours of the night a lot of the time)

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Morning Stephanie

How is Ms BooBoo this morning?

Where you able to get a meter last night and if so have been able to test yet?

Just checking in on you and BooBoo.

Mel, Max & The Fur Gang

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Hi Mel,

Hope BooBoo Kitty is okay. Please let us know how she is, Stephanie.

Sending prayers,
Jean and Charcoal (GA)

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Just now seeing this .... I hope all is well. I'm in the general area if I can be of help.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

I know of no insulin syringes that hold only 10 units filled completely up. The
smallest hold 30 units of U-100 insulin (Humulin).

The syringes you were first given...are you SURE they are insulin syringes.

They should say right on the syringes somewhere "for U-100 insulin".

It's possible your vet gave you something else and that's the source of confusion
for the dose.

ALSO...did you get the insulin from the vet, or from the pharmacy.

Some vets have been known to dilute Humulin down to U-10.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

This makes a HUGE difference in calculating the actual dose you are given.

I find it hard to believe that ANY vet would start a cat on 10 units. Just insane.

Please get your insulin bottle and syringes and post here all the information
that is on it.

Also, please get the original syringes and post here the information written
on the syringes.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Is there anyone that was able to touch base with her via pm's? Have been constantly checking for news on BooBoo and wondering if someone was helping her off the board. Would love to read some updated news.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

We now have the testing kit and I need to know how to go about testing her... Sorry I was away for a while and did not mean to worry anyone... Thanks for all the kindness and help too!

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

The syringes are Ultra Comfort insulin Syringe 1cc 29 Gauge x 1/2" Length

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

here is one video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zE12-4fVn8

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Stephanie, maybe start a new thread at the top.......BooBooKitty.....need help testing .......that way we can keep up again instead of the first thread becoming2 /3 pages longs.

Now, what meter did you buy? Did you remember to pick up Ketostix? remember.....a U-100 1cc syringe means it holds 100 units of insulin so each tiny line is 2 full units.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Please answer the WHOLE question. Do the syringes say "for U-100 insulin" on them,
or do they say "for U-40 insulin".

ALSO...did you get the insulin from the vet, or from the pharmacy.
Some vets have been known to dilute Humulin down to U-10.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This makes a HUGE difference in calculating the actual dose you are given.

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Just tested her, got a reading of 337. What do u all recommend for her dose now? She hasn't had any insulin since yesterday at 2:30pm so anout 24 hours now...

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

Yes they say for use with U-100 insulin only. 100 units or less... i got the insulin from a vet...

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

I bought the Relion Micro. I did forget the Ketostix tho... I will go get them as soon as possible tho...

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

NO !!! in a 1cc syringe each little line is TWO units of U-100 insulin.

0,2,4,6,8,10(first numbered line).

We need to take this to the other thread she has posted and establish:

What dilution of insulin she is using....it is possible the vet diluted it
to U-50 or even U-10 (it has happened).

 

Re: New to website and have a newly diagnosed diabetic kitty

My bad......thanks for catching that Karen. I knew it had 100 units but was thinking it was 1 line meant 1 unit, not 2. So used to using only 3/10 cc syringes.