Ninja's is in the green!!

Discussion in 'Lantus / Levemir / Biosimilars' started by Albert & Ninja, Jan 14, 2018.

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  1. Albert & Ninja

    Albert & Ninja New Member

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    Dec 22, 2017
    Hello everyone. I hope you all are doing well tonight!

    I announce with much happiness that Ninja has hit his first green and blue streak since last year! I'm sure this is the best he's felt since being diagnosed so I am filled with joy over this. Now I am seeking advice from more experienced caretakers on whether to reduce the dose or not as this is uncharted territory for both of us from here on out.

    A recap of my changes this week are:
    I bought a ReliOn Prime and I must say I am pleased with it. I have read that it reads lows, lower than other meters. It functions very well in terms of soaking up the blood, you need a little more but it is not ridiculous. I recommend it to others who might be wondering. 100 strips for $17.88 will definitely help most if not all of you with an AlphaTrak 2 paying $1.00 a strip. Todays last two readings were done with the Prime so on the AT2 they would be a little higher with the AT2 likely showing in the 60 - 70 range for the last two tests. If anything a little safety space is good. I'd rather be 10 - 15 points too high than too low once under the 100 mark.

    I switched to traditional syringes and I feel much more comfortable that Ninja is actually getting X units of insulin and I think the pen's mechanism can allow more or less depending on how hard you squeeze the button when you inject.

    I opted for an increase of .5 units, increasing his dose to 5.5 units because he had been on 6 units for several days last year and had no adverse effects. In addition I had seen other members do this and seen good luck with their higher unit kitties. He had a blue and a green last year when on 6 units for a couple days and I dropped to 2 units the next day due to inexperience. This was during my pre-forum days. Over the last two days his BG has dropped. I am probably going to drop down to 5.25 units due to the green +8 52 being such a drastic drop from his PMPS of 469. I monitored him closely during this low. I fed a small snack at +10 when it had not gone up by much and he was hungry and asking me for food.

    In hindsight I realize I should have given him 5 units when moving to the syringes to monitor numbers and make sure they were the same. My main worry tonight is that when switching to syringes from the pen that there has been a difference in dose over the past few days and that the pen was potentially not giving him an accurate 5 units due to me not priming it. I have read everywhere that priming was not necessary and personally I believe this because when the tip goes on the pen liquid drips out and that means the air is out of the needle. Is it a good idea to drop him to 5.25 units or should I hold the line where I am?

    Sorry for this being long but I want the information out there for others who might run across this on Google!
     

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  2. Myagi (GA) and Heidi

    Myagi (GA) and Heidi Well-Known Member

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    Oct 30, 2017
    No advise here, sorry. But big hugs and congrats on hanging in there and seeing green! I'm sure Ninja is as happy as you! :bighug::bighug::D:D:D:bighug::bighug:
     
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  3. PussCatPrince - GA

    PussCatPrince - GA Well-Known Member

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    Nov 25, 2017
    I'm no help at all but I can post :bighug::D:D:bighug: to celebrate this happy cat moment with you.
     
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  4. Chris & China (GA)

    Chris & China (GA) Well-Known Member

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    May 10, 2013
    You may want to put a definite line in your spreadsheet to show that you're now using a human meter instead of the AT

    If you look at China's spreadsheet between 1/9 and 1/10 you'll see an example of a "break line" where you can put H U M A N in (as well as change the color)

    The advice we'd give you depends on the dosing method you want to follow. Tight Regulation has a different reduction point (under 50 on a human meter) than Start Low, Go Slow does (under 90 on any meter)
     
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  5. Sandy and Black Kitty

    Sandy and Black Kitty Well-Known Member

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    Dec 31, 2009
    Hello again :cool:

    Glad you switched to a human meter and syringes. Please create a break on the ss, indicating the switch to a human meter (similar to what you did after 01/03 regarding the food). That will help folks here properly evaluate the numbers.

    Its also great that you have been consistently shooting every 12 hours for 6 consecutive cycles. Well done!

    Regarding changes is dose, whether up or down - for safety sake I strongly recommend you follow the guidelines found in the TR protocol

    Please read it carefully and don't hesitate to ask questions.:cool:


     
  6. Albert & Ninja

    Albert & Ninja New Member

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    Dec 22, 2017
    I think I should be following SLGS. If his AMPS is "Below 150 mg/dl (8.3 mmol/L), don't give insulin." I will likely hold off on the shot for a few hours. This is what I'm feeling right now due to such a drastic drop.

    Is it bad if I still give somewhat of a shot a few hours after if levels spike a bit? I would assume just dose at that given time the next day and/or work your way back to original time by two 15 minute increments a day or 1 30 minute increment.
     
  7. Albert & Ninja

    Albert & Ninja New Member

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    Dec 22, 2017
    I am curious, how much different are the readings? What judgements do you all make when you read a chart with that break through it for the change to a human meter?
     
  8. Chris & China (GA)

    Chris & China (GA) Well-Known Member

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    May 10, 2013
    It starts out like that, but as you learn more about your cat and how he responds to food/insulin, you gradually work your way down to shooting anything over 90 on SLGS.

    If your schedule can bear it, you can either stall, don't feed and see if he comes up to an "acceptable" number fairly quickly OR you can feed at the normal time and wait 2 hours, test again and shoot at that point if he's high enough

    If you're doing SLGS, he's earned a reduction, so you'd drop back to 5.25 at the next shot time (but even doing that won't guarantee he won't drop too low again....the depot can continue to effect the numbers for up to 6 cycles)
     
  9. Albert & Ninja

    Albert & Ninja New Member

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    Dec 22, 2017
    Overall I would like to do TR but I am worried about lows because he and I haven't dealt with him being this low or knowing how he will respond. I'll be up till about 4 so I will probably feed and monitor.

    I fed a small snack for his +10 so I'm confused how he only went up by such a small amount in an hour. The usual behavior after food is at least a 70 point increase.
     
  10. Sandy and Black Kitty

    Sandy and Black Kitty Well-Known Member

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    Dec 31, 2009
    The AT reads higher with a variance in the neighborhood of 20-ish points or so. For myself, I think in human meter numbers. Evaluating an AT ss requires my mind translate it first and I am always concerned about losing something in the translation.
    Speaking for myself regarding the information in your ss prior to 01/11/18 all I can say is I think Ninja may be over dose. Now that you have built a foundation of consistently shooting every 12 hours these past 6 cycles, are using a human meter and syringes it's time to evaluate the dose based on the nadir.


    Expect the unexpected. Ninja is changing.
    What time zone are you in? How long until the next shot?
     
  11. Albert & Ninja

    Albert & Ninja New Member

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    Dec 22, 2017
    I am in the central time zone. His shot was due at 12:45, about 11 minutes ago. I just served him his usual amount of food because he was asking me for it. Going to test him after he's done eating and if he hasn't risen, take the girlfriend home and come back and get a +1 or +2 and go from there.
     
  12. Sandy and Black Kitty

    Sandy and Black Kitty Well-Known Member

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    Dec 31, 2009
    I see AMPS came around and you skipped. I would have done the same. My recommendation is that you think of it as a fur shot and get a a few tests in during the current cycle.This will give you valuable data.

    When PMPS rolls around I would dial the dose back to 5u and then moving forward make your dosing decisions based on either the TR protocol or SLGS.

    That's my $0.02. See what others have to say.
     
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  13. Chris & China (GA)

    Chris & China (GA) Well-Known Member

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    May 10, 2013
    Your decisions on shooting (or not) should be based on Pre-Shot numbers....which means he shouldn't eat for at least 2 hours before shot times, then you Test/Feed/Shoot

    Since you've already fed him, any test you get for the next couple of hours will be "food influenced".

    That's why I said IF you feed, you'd have to wait 2 hours before testing again (and possibly shooting) which can throw you quite a bit off schedule.

    At this point, I'd just call it a furshot, gather some data and start over again at your usual PMPS time
     
  14. Albert & Ninja

    Albert & Ninja New Member

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    Dec 22, 2017
    I understand what you meant now. I will be waiting at least two hours if I do shoot. But I will try and check each hour regardless. My schedule can handle it at the moment. I've got nothing but time for my little man.

    I wanted to not feed but with the weight he has lost and being weaker now than when he started insulin I don't like to withhold food from him. If he is genuinely hungry and not just playing me I feel he should eat.
     
  15. Myagi (GA) and Heidi

    Myagi (GA) and Heidi Well-Known Member

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    Oct 30, 2017
    I felt the same way. Think of it this way, Ninja gets to eat 20 out of 24 hours daily! :joyful: you are definitely not withholding or starving by the two hour food lift before his shots ;)
     
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