Question on strategy next shot

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (The Main Forum)' started by Spacey & Ella, Jan 1, 2010.

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  1. Spacey & Ella

    Spacey & Ella Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    First of all: is this the right thread or does it have to go to the insulin groups?

    Second:
    Spacey has a 4 color day today. The ones I don't like, and she neither.
    Yesterday was a good day, low curve. Today again with the roller coaster.

    What I'm wondering now:
    Should I give more tomorrow morning? Or is that too soon and should I stay on 0.5 unit, giving the body the time to adjust to a lower dosage.

    Could anyone please advise me on this?

    Somehow I feel I should wait 2 more day's or so. But what if that's wrong and I make things worse for her?
    And what if I change and go higher again on the dosage and keep the body very confused about how much insulin is on it's way?
     
  2. Sweetgrass & the Furries

    Sweetgrass & the Furries Senior Member Moderator

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Hi Ella....

    "Question on strategy next shot
    by mier2006 ยป Fri Jan 01, 2010 4:00 pm

    First of all: is this the right thread or does it have to go to the insulin groups?"


    *You can post anywhere you like, but health will see you get the most responses right now. perhaps crosspost this by copying and pasting into the VCN-forum as well.

    "Second:
    Spacey has a 4 color day today. The ones I don't like, and she neither.
    Yesterday was a good day, low curve. Today again with the roller coaster.

    What I'm wondering now:
    Should I give more tomorrow morning? Or is that too soon and should I stay on 0.5 unit, giving the body the time to adjust to a lower dosage."

    *I think 0.5 is a little too much in light of this 200s she stayed in yesterday without any insulin, and seeing the 300 and 400s in response to that shot of 0.5 today.
    You have a high preshot following that green today.....suspect a slightly later nadir happened, around +7 so.
    A little less should balance it out while the pancreas keeps healing and sputtering. That 0.25 of a unit I wrote about previously would be a good next step.

    "Could anyone please advise me on this?

    Somehow I feel I should wait 2 more day's or so. But what if that's wrong and I make things worse for her?
    And what if I change and go higher again on the dosage and keep the body very confused about how much insulin is on it's way?"

    *It is not an exact science and as you make decisions and build your knowledge, it becomes easier to predict patterns and responses.
    However, with a possibly sputtering pancreas, unpredictabilty will have to become your friend :) and using the insulin as a helper to the sputtering pancreas is a good way to think about it.
    Not so much insulin the pancreas stops sputtering ( like possibly what you saw today ) and not too little so levels stay in those 200s.

    Keep offering low carb small snacks throughout the day to encourage the pancreas to work and I would encourage you to try 0.25, continue to work on ketone testing and gather data from there.

    Does that make sense? Do you have any questions?

    I do think you guys would fare better and be a lot happier with a onger lasting insulin. Spacey reacts to little changes with big drops and risies....a longer lasting insulin would even that out.
     
  3. Victoria & Sundance

    Victoria & Sundance Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Caninsulin doesn't last 12 hours so it's not surprising that you got a higher number at that time. The thing is, increasing the dose will only make the nadir lower not make the insulin last longer. Remember not to make dosing decisions on one number. You've lowered the dose for a reason. I would stick with that (or a slightly lower dose - skinny .5) for another few cycles to see if the numbers will calm down. Some cats feel worse when the curve looks like a V than if it's slightly higher but is more like a gentle smile. See if you can get her to exercise - play hard - for a bit, which will help lower the BG. Feed tiny meals to keep that pancreas working but working gently.
     
  4. Michele and Peeps

    Michele and Peeps Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    I agree with what is already posted. If Spacey is having a bad day today the numbers could reflect that. If tomorrow is a good day and you jump up the insulin you won't really know how her numbers look on a good day following a bad day.

    Hang in there!!
     
  5. Spacey & Ella

    Spacey & Ella Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    She did have indeed a high preshot this morning.
    Honestly, below the 1 unit I'm never sure what I give her. It's a lot of guesswork since the syringes have this 1 unit markings. But I tried to give a bit lesser than 0.5 this morning.

    Sounds like jump starting a car. Due to the worries in my head nothing makes much sense now. I will follow what your saying though and watch/test/see what happens.

    I think so too, she's really very reactive to those insulin shots. Jan, 13th is her next vet-appointment. See if I can convince the vet with all the data gathered.
     
  6. Spacey & Ella

    Spacey & Ella Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Thanks all of you.

    Spacey had a high preshot this morning and I was very much tempted to higher her dosage. And then I was reading your answers. Well, okay, I did lower the dosage a bit, or so I hope. :?
    Those syringes the vet gave me have 1 unit markings, so it's pretty much guesswork. 0.25 is impossible to measure I'm afraid. But I know I tried to stay below the imaginative 0.5 marking.

    Till now Spacey seems surprisingly well, even with the higher number. Alert, active.
    I'll leave the low carb food lying around and keep an eye on her. See if we can give her that gentle smile instead of a V... Nice comparison there. :)

    Thanks for your responses again!
     
  7. Victoria & Sundance

    Victoria & Sundance Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    It is hard to stop yourself from raising the dose when you see a high number but you have to sit on your hands a bit and wait it out sometimes. One number (or two) does not make a pattern. It's the pattern and overall cat that we are interested in, right?

    :)
     
  8. Spacey & Ella

    Spacey & Ella Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    And that is sooooo different from what I've heard from the vet and the internist!
    One says: "Check before shooting and when the number is this or that give this or that.. "
    The other: "Check only nadir and adjust accordingly."
    I'm so glad I'm now listening to you folks. :D

    Btw. Spacey is remarkably well today. She has a low curve and feels good. I'm sooo happy. :D
    The other thing: again I have no idea at all whether to give her another shot or not..
    I did, however, prepared the syringes, now I can measure less than 0.5.
    0.25 this evening? Or nothing...
    Whaaa
     
  9. Sweetgrass & the Furries

    Sweetgrass & the Furries Senior Member Moderator

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Well that looks much much better :) Well done.

    If you get a level above 200, I would go ahead and give that shot of no more than 0.25.

    However, if the levels stay in the mid 100s, I would hesitate..and (here is where it gets tricky), and look at dosing on an "as needed" basis.
    Throw the 12/12 out the window and simply shoot on a rising number, that is at least 90 minutes after eating ( to ensure you are not shooting into a food spike that could drop on its own again ) and keep these micro doses you are doing, 0.25 and less if manageable, until you are not able to give doses anymore.

    This is really good news...and I am so happy to hear how well Spacey is doing at this lower and shallower curve.

    You have learned much in a short time, well done you :)
     
  10. Spacey & Ella

    Spacey & Ella Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    She is doing it, not I!
    In the evening she is always a bit worn out. Her numbers were above the 200 (almost 300), so I gave her something around 0.25.
    I put some extra lines on the syringe so I can measure bit better. Of course it's still guesswork, but a bit better. ;)
    I'm so curious about how she is going to do after her dental. But first get her there.
    With your help of course. :D
    It's good to know that I can drop the 12/12. I 'll keep that in mind.
    Thanks again. :p
     
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