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Sooty’s Numbers and Dosing Help

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (The Main Forum)' started by amy keay, Nov 9, 2019 at 5:13 PM.

  1. amy keay

    amy keay Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2018
    Hi

    I know it’s late but if anyone is online and able to help I’d be grateful.
    been monitoring sootys levels for the last few days as he was getting odd numbers and been testing regularly (please look at the spreadsheet for info)
    He seems to be dropping quickly tonight and I can’t go to sleep until I know he’s on the way back up !
    Just given him some Felix in jelly and going to test again in 30 mins
    Shall I reduce dose again tomorrow ?
    I’ve noticed he has been drinking a lot more than usual tonight also which I would have thought would equate to high numbers but we have low numbers ! I know cats can drop lower at night too so I’m tempted to stick to the 1.25 tomorrow morning (based on his amps reading) and maybe 1u tomorrow night ?
    Any thoughts ?

    thanks
    Amy
     
  2. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2018
    @amy keay Hi Amy sorry no one saw this, one suggestion you might want to add to your signature that you are from the UK, what's it's like 12:30 am there now.
    I had to go back and look at your first post to find out.
    I will tag a few members to see if they can give you there thoughts
    @MrWorfMen's Mom
    @Sienne and Gabby (GA)
    @Marje and Gracie
    @Bron and Sheba (GA)
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2019 at 6:19 PM
  3. Bron and Sheba (GA)

    Bron and Sheba (GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2015
    Hi Amy
    I didn’t get a tag alert but just happened to see this.
    I can’t advise on caninsulin dosing because I have never used it. But I will tag
    @MrWorfMen's Mom in case she didn’t get the tag alert either.
     
    Diane Tyler's Mom likes this.
  4. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2015
    Actually tonight's cycle is good. That 94 is safe and ideal but you don't want him going much lower. If you can monitor tomorrow, and pre-shot is high enough to give insulin in the AM, I'd stick to the 1.25u. He may bounce a bit after that beautiful green but that is normal and not of concern. I'm sure the water drinking is just that Sooty is still in higher numbers than ideal for a good part of the cycles but he seems to be improving.
     
  5. Sienne and Gabby (GA)

    Sienne and Gabby (GA) Senior Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    I'm glad Linda was here!! I'm less experienced with the short acting insulins.

    I wouldn't worry about the water. It's likely due to the higher pre-shot numbers and that Sooty isn't regulated yet. Getting that next test will be helpful so you can see if numbers are beginning to head back up or if food is wearing off and numbers are dropping. If you can't stay awake to steer the curve with food, you can alway abort the cycle with high carb.
     
  6. amy keay

    amy keay Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2018
    Hi thanks for the replies
    As it looked as though we were going back up I had to get some sleep.
    The AMPS is back in the 23.8 so he’s going to have 1.25u in 30 mins.

    Another thing from last night, as I was getting the lower numbers I was feeding him. he had a bit of a munch at +2 and agin at +3 and again at +4 to ensure he wouldn’t drop any lower.
    if I hadn’t given that food would he have dropped too low ?

    Will monitor today at the +2 and +4 and see if what we’re getting. It’s the night time levels that are worrying me a little as I’d hate for him to drop too low at night when I’m not awake !

     
    MrWorfMen's Mom and Kate & Toby like this.
  7. Kate & Toby

    Kate & Toby Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2019
    Amy what times of the day do you shoot? Can you adjust slightly so you can get some extra tests in the evening after you've shot but before you go to bed? The guys here always recommend a pre nightime test to give you an idea where the cycle is heading, but if you are shooting late in the evening you wont get the chance.
     
    Bron and Sheba (GA) likes this.
  8. amy keay

    amy keay Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2018
    Hi
    I shoot at about 6.30pm so it gives me at least a 3 hour window post shot to test before I go to bed
     
  9. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2009
    You're doing well, Amy. Yes it's at night that Sooty might be going a little low, and that may be one reason he's high again in the morning (or it could just be that the action of Caninsulin - it might be time to try the Prozinc soon).

    By the way, don't hesitate to post here at any time of night if you need help - you mentioned earlier that you "know it's late" but remember that most people here are in the US or Canada, and are wide awake during our night time! If it's really urgent you can start a new thread and say "urgent help needed" in the title.
     
  10. Bron and Sheba (GA)

    Bron and Sheba (GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2015
    Amy, if the before bed test is the same or lower than the preshot, it will probably be an active cycle, so it would be a good idea to set the alarm to get up and test around +5 or +6 depending on how low the number is. If it is a low blue or green you would need to get up sooner.
     
  11. amy keay

    amy keay Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2018
    Sorry I don’t understand your message (sorry I’m probably being a bit thick and haven’t had much sleep !)

    the before bed test (+3 evening shot) has been in the greens hence why I try to get him to eat something. It’s never been the same or even slighter lower than the preshot result (its normally come down quite a lot)
     
  12. amy keay

    amy keay Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2018
    Should I be testing at the +5 +6 mark at night too ? Last night at the +5 mark he appeared to be going back up so I was happy enough to go to bed
     
  13. amy keay

    amy keay Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2018
    Do you think I could switch to the ProZinc today ? or is it the wrong time ?
    I’m worried that the caninsulin is too fast acting for him and if the ProZinc potentially might be better.
     
  14. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2009
    I don't think there's a particularly wrong or right time to switch... just make sure the last dose of the old insulin isn't working any more and start on a low dose of the new one. You'd need to monitor and get some data to see how things are going so a day when you're at home would be best. You may not see an immediate improvement, it will still be a matter of tweaking the dose, but Prozinc is gentler and hopefully would be better for Sooty.
    Maybe start a thread asking for any other thoughts on switching?
     
    Bron and Sheba (GA) likes this.
  15. Bron and Sheba (GA)

    Bron and Sheba (GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2015
    Amy, probably what I said is more for the longer acting insulins not caninsulin, because caninsulin will drop by +3.
    Disregard what I said and for caninsulin you need to test until the numbers start to rise again.
     
  16. Kate & Toby

    Kate & Toby Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2019
    Hi Amy, we made the switch from Caninsulin to Prozinc(albeit weve switched again), the Caninsulin was in and out of Toby so quickly that he never had a chance to enjoy some lower numbers and so was pretty much high all the time except for a short burst early on. We made the switch and it was much better, prozinc is a good insulin. Toby would nadir (go his lowest) at about +5 and then gently rise back up to our next shot.
    Your vet should be familiar with prozinc as it's very widely used in the UK (I have no idea why they always start cats on Caninsulin which is a dog insulin).
    In terms of making the switch, you need to be around to monitor, so if you work all week maybe a saturday am shot so you can monitor all day and then sunday. You shouldn't notice any adverse effects if you start the prozinc on a low dose to see how he gets on. Remember the dosing people on here love data so the more you have the more they can help. Dosing with prozinc is made by the lowest number in the cycle and every cat processes the insulin differently so it's important to test throughout the cycle a few times to establish how sooty is processing and so you can see when the nadir is.
    Hope you have a good day, and Sooty is still loving his new foods xx
     
    MrWorfMen's Mom likes this.
  17. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2015
    Leaving food out for Sooty when you are not home or sleeping will allow him to have food available to munch on if he needs it. Most cats will head for the food bowl if they sense their BG is dropping. A lot of folks use an automated feeder so you can time snacks as you've been doing. It takes a lot of the worry about lows out of the picture.

    As for when to switch insulins.....that is entirely up to you. I agree with Kate that a good time would be when you can monitor for a cycle or two. ProZinc tends to cause a gentler drop in BG and last longer through the 12 hour cycle. Not difficult to use and works well for a lot of cats.
     
    amy keay likes this.
  18. amy keay

    amy keay Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2018
    Hi

    I’ve decided to skip the change of insulin for tonight as I need to monitor closely for the first few cycles as has been mentioned. id rather switch in the morning also so I can monitor his demeanour and mood (he sleeps at night)
    I’ll continue with the 1.25u tonight of Caninsulin and get a +2 and +4 bg level. I leave food out routinely for him but he tends to sleep upstairs at night so I’ll leave a plate of food out for him there in case he needs to munch

    x
     
    Diana&Tom and MrWorfMen's Mom like this.
  19. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2009
    How are you and Sooty doing, Amy?
     
  20. amy keay

    amy keay Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2018
    Hi Diana
    Thank you for thinking of us ! Sooty is doing ok. I'm testing bg regularly and the last few days we've been getting pre shot numbers back in the 20's (22 +).
    I've upped his shot to 1.5u again and he seems to be coping well (I was worried with high numbers we could be in uti territory!).
    Thinking of starting on the prozinc tomorrow if I can stop being so nervous about it

    Hope you are well and thanks again for the message.
    Amy and Sooty xx
     
    Kate & Toby likes this.
  21. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2009
    Sounds like you're doing a great job, Amy :)
    Try not to be nervous about starting Prozinc - it should have a gentler action than Caninsulin so if anything it should even out the curve a bit more... let us know when you start, and ask any questions, there are usually a few dosing experts around either on this main health forum or the Prozinc one.
    Best of luck!
     
  22. Kate & Toby

    Kate & Toby Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2019
    Hey Amy, sounds like you guys are doing so well. It's the weekend now, so if ever there was a time to switch.... really dont be nervous, it's the same action as Caninsulin, just gentler, and made for kitties.

    How are the new foods going down?

    Take care xx
     

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