sorry I asked

sorry I asked.

 

Re: diabetic food, non diabetic cat

Hi,

I personally have 11 cats only one of which is diabetic, and even if I was to lose my diabetic tomorrow I would never go back to feeding any of my cats dry food. And these are the reasons why:

1) It is a myth that dry food helps their teeth, its is no better than humans eating potato chips and cookies for their teeth. All my cats have lovely teeth, to keep them that way, once a week they all get raw chicken wings to gnaw on.

2) Dry food depletes the water in their bodies, cats are basically desert animals so they have a very low thirst drive, they are hard wired to get their fluids through their food. Thus dry food leads to other problems later in life, such as UTIs, blockages etc.

3) On canned food all of my cats have increased energy, and some of the most beautiful coats around. They are sleek, shiny, and soft. Their muscle tone of off the charts. Even my one guy that I thought would always be a rough coated cat, is now like petting a cloud.

Now that said, you don't need to keep feeding the prescription expensive cat food. Everyone here eats exactly what my diabetic (who is diet controlled) eats, Just plain old-fashioned Friskies pate style canned food. There are plenty of fine commerical cat food out there that is actually better quality ingredients than the prescription stuff with is mostly liver, and frankly none of mine would even touch.

If Max is just hard-wired to be a thin lanky cat, then he will remain a thin lanky cat. I have several that are just like that, mostly because that is just the way their breeds are built. Mine are all allowed to eat as much or as little as they wish. My Maxwell (diabetic) is a big guy, he's tall & long, he weighs in at 15.8lbs which is perfect for him, he is one end of the scales here, then there is my Tre'Vona who tips the scale at a mere 8lbs, she is long legged, lanky, and slim, always has been and I believe she always will be, it is just the way she is built. Maxwell appears to have a lot of Maine Coon or Norwegian Forest cat in him, while Tre'Vona is Aby/Egyptian Mau cross. I also have 3 siamese, they tend to stay on the slim side.

If Max is built to be a slim guy, let him stay that way, as long as he is healthy at that weight. He will be better for it, just as it is unhealthy for us humans to pack on pounds, it is unhealthy for a cat to do the same thing. Remember these are animals that are built to the ultimate hunter, they are meant to lean and muscular. Ther health suffers when we let them get chubby.

Just my 2 cents,

Mel, Maxwell and the Fur Gang

 

Re: diabetic food, non diabetic cat

When I switched the entire pride of 11 over to low carb canned, the obese cats lost weight without even trying and are in terrific condition.

I'd avoid the dry!

 

Re: diabetic food, non diabetic cat

Read Dr. Lisa Pierson's website http://catinfo.org to learn what's best to feed any and all cats.

You've fallen victim to the pet food industry propaganda about dry food and teeth and their claim that because they have "nutritionists" developing their foods that it's are best for cats. It is not, not even close.

Oscar's little buddy needs a species appropriate diet before he falls victim to diabetes and urinary tract problems too.

Please read the first couple ingredients on the dry food. It will be some type of grain, most likely corn gluten meal. I've never seen a cat pull down a stalk of corn to get at the ear. They want the mice which eat the grain - that's the only kind of grains cats eat, that which the mouse processed first :lol:

 

Re: diabetic food, non diabetic cat

I only feed canned, wet food. Dry diabetic diets are for the birds. Now, if you switch to wet, please be advised that you will most likely need to REDUCE your cat's insulin because the food will have such a lower carb content. Diabetic dry foods have about 5-8 times the carbs of canned food. Here is a nice list of low carb foods:

The Expensive Side

Merrick BG
Beef*
Chicken*
Turkey*

Wellness
Beef & Chicken*
Chicken*
Turkey*

Merrick
Cowboy Cookout*

Evo
EVO 95% Beef*
EVO 95% Chicken & Turkey*
EVO 95% Duck
EVO 95% Venison*

Nature’s Variety
Raw beef*
Raw Chicken & Turkey*


The Cheaper Side

Fancy Feast Classic only
Chicken
Beef & Liver
Turkey and Giblets
Beef
Beef & Chicken
Chopped Grill

Special Kitty (Walmart)
Mixed Grill
Prime Entrée
Super Supper
Turkey & Giblets

Sophisticat (Petsmart)
Beef & Liver
Beef Stew
Country Style
Elegant Entrée
Mixed Grill
Turkey & Giblets

Sophisticat Adult Supreme (Petsmart)
Supreme Beef & Chicken
Supreme Beef
Supreme Gourmet Chicken
Supreme Turkey & Giblets

Friskie’s Classic Pate
Country Style Dinner*
Liver & Chicken Dinner
Poultry Platter
Supreme Supper
Turkey & Giblets

Friskie’s Special Diet
Beef & Chicken*
Beef & Liver*


* also lower in phosphorous (<250 mg) (important for kitties with chronic kidney disease)


Good luck!!!

 

Folks, I think we were a bit too vehement with LolaDoggie and may not see more posts.

 

That is sad. We were only trying to help from our experience.

 

i didn't see the original question but fwiw i don't see anything awful in the replies. maybe they are just having a sensitive day or something if their cat was just diagnosed because god knows this diagnosis can be very upsetting, and perhaps they will come back.

 

Thank you for that, Rebecca--as a still-newbie myself I've been feeling a little uncomfortable with the level of vehemence recently but chose to stay because the site is still gold.

 

Having been in the financial service industry since 1991, and starting to email people in 1998, I have been told on several occasions this:

when you are writing as opposed to speaking, someone can't interpret the intonation of your written word. You might not mean to be harsh [or whatever], but the receiver may interpret it that way.

I was a little frustrated when I came here because I felt people were harping on me, and I think a couple of posts I made in response showed it. But those people who told me to get Ccedric off the dry have the right to come back to me now and say "I told you so!" because they were right! The people who post here love their pets and what to share their experience with someone who's reaching out for help. If you want to help your pet and your self, some times you have to weed through and really see the message.

:YMHUG:

 

Even with weeding through and seeing the message, it wastes a lot of much-needed energy to deal with some of the attitudes here. It's y'all's sandbox, and it's not for a newcomer to piss in it, so to speak, but as someone who was once registered here and left, I will never again ask questions here. I do sometimes still come here to read, because I sometimes get useful information from other people's threads, but I have problems getting past certain attitudes toward pets that are so different from mine but so prevalent here, and I don't have the time or energy to argue about it or defend myself or explain why I am or am not going to do something recommended. I wish there were less of a "mommy" culture here (I am not my cat's parent) and a "you must do everything possible for your pet" attitude, but I do appreciate that you people do care and are trying to help. Just that it's not a particularly accepting place for people whose pets are important in their lives but not so central as they are for some of you. I get that the people who care the most about their (and other people's) cats are the very ones who are willing to put in the most energy toward helping, so it's a bit of an insoluble puzzle for me. I don't mean that you should all feel toward your pets as I do toward mine. But there seems to be real low tolerance for people who don't want to, or can't, spend much time or money on a pet's illness. Some of us just want to do the best we can with what we feel able, not to reach the peak of absolute best possible care as if it was the most important thing in the world.

 

Perhaps folks might consider describing how changes worked for them, rather than stating "here's how it must be ..."

One reason I don't post Spitzer in Lantus any more is that I can't fit all that testing into my schedule & the general forum response was to not bother if I couldn't.

 

Sorry that a newbie felt ganged up on. It is hard when you are writing to tone it down so people aren't scared or overwhelmed.

Although I have 5 diabetic cats on Lantus (and two in remission), I don't post in the Lantus forum because I can't keep 7 spreadsheets updated to the board every day.

I do test and I feed low carb. But, I have a life besides my cats - like a full time job, a house to manage, a yard to keep up. Some things just have to give

Claudia

 

Wanted to chime in here as I have fell on both sides of this fence. I felt a bit bullied and hammered on both when I first arrived (only by a very few particular people, most where GREAT) and in recent history (strangely including one original and then several more).
All in the name of advising me.
HOWEVER I know for a fact I sometimes come across a bit dry and direct talking to a newbie.
Here is what I think happens.
Particularly on health.
We have been here a LONNNNNNG time some of us. And sometimes, usually, post daily. To newbies. And for SOME of us (Sue and Oliver...a saint) it can become somewhat.....a monotonous routine. We want to help...but we find ourselves giving the very same first time advice over and over and over for a lonnnnng time. So maybe we are a bit burned out?
It is certainly not a purposeful tone. Everyone here really really wants to help. If there were only more folks hanging out on health (I'm speaking to you uber long time Lantus Daily Posters) many others could feel ok taking a break.
I know I feel guilty having not been here much lately but I know I feel burnout on giving the SAME instructions everyday.
We really need more help....Lantus Land??????

 

all things considered i am still new, there are many people who here who have dedicated more time and energy to fdmb than i have, and many people here who have poured their energy into me.

i can only add what my experience was as a person who was new: things moved very very quickly when my cat was first diagnosed, and i knew i needed help. i felt very confused by the health board. by the nature of the board it is designed to help all fd cats with all health issues, not just insulin specific. i do sympathize that there is a sense of obligation, and that since this board covers a wide range of topics, there isn't a way to cover everything, but one thing i do think would alleviate some of that is cleaning up the stickies at the top of the page.

but i think what happened to me is i got lost in the beginning. i wanted a solid faq, and i saw some of that in the posts- the faq sticky had a little of it (it was just too many links for me to read as i was trying to absorb all that was happening- A1.1. has 13 hyperlinks alone- i felt whelmed). i knew by reading the posts that people were clearly passionate and clearly cared- i just didn't know what to do or expect or what happened next.

there is some great advice to be had here, and yes, many of you are saying it many times over (how many times can each of us say we've typed "buy neosporin pain releif" . all of us have given and received great advice, it's important, but we do sometimes get caught in the fdmb bubble.

there have been some fantastic check lists i've seen about what to buy when you are first diagnosed that have just been written in response to "i don't know what to do" posts- they have been awesome! and they make me wish someone had handed that to me when we first got a dx. i think something that would be great would be to clean up some of the stickies at the top so when a new user comes to this page, it's easier to find that information, and it doesn't feel as intimidating. it took me a while to actually sign up in an account, and then actually post.

perhaps clean up a single page faq that makes things easy to digest for people coming to this for the first time will help reduce that intimidation. that way it's one document rather than 10 people (even though we are all often saying the same thing).

hats off to fdmb, it's a really great community that is willing to grow, listen, and make changes.


edit for duplicate copy paste

 

I could NOT agree more about clearing up the stickies...there are obscenely too many. Bye Bye Stickies Please.
and yes, the FAQ page could be cleaned up a bit too I guess.
There may be peeps like me....i cannot be reading encyclopedia's of stuff. it's just not my nature. but if it were, it would NOT be at a time like this when i just want the basics and some support.
Rebecca....can i help in anyway to clean it up...
no one needs to know anymore about why and how folks get banned do they ;-)

 

i would be glad to help as well.

people here have helped me, and it would be a great chance to pay it forward.

 

confused_cat Maybe the stickies can also be condensed by "subject"...? I think the problem is, there is so much information available, that it can be difficult to know where exactly to start because it can be very overwhelming and it's easier just to ask. I have a a section of bookmarks just for links that I was given as a newbie that were helpful to me so that I can pass them on when the situation calls for it. :lol:

So for example, everything regarding "feeding" (shopping lists, the carb calculator, food chart, etc.) could be put there, with a brief description/summary of what the link is about. We can do this for each major "topic" that is typically asked about.

Another cool idea/option is to assemble a pdf type document (printable is a bonus!) with a table of contents and FAQ that covers all the basics (super basic formatting, technical writing style where it's in simple but complete sentences) with links to where information can be read more in depth.

A lot of the information is readily available elsewhere, but in that initial state of confusion/panic its hard to determine where to start.

If there is anything I can do to help with anything (rewriting/reformatting/updating links/adding links) please let me know.

 

I'm sorry about the catalyst of this discussion, but it may prove a benefit to the site and to other newbies.

I too agree on a cleanup of the stickies. Would it be possible to create sub-forums: newly diagnosed; food; other medical problems, ……... The Health form is a great place to start, but there is so, so much to sort through to find info.

Another idea is to make the links go back to the Feline Diabetes home page. Rebecca needs more traffic there and linking back to that page would clean out the stickies and create more traffic. Maybe one stickie with the FAQ links that we could copy from and paste into posts for newbies.

ETA actually, the Announcements need to really sorted out too.

 

I'm brand new here and have nothing negative to say at all. Being male, i usually spend my time on forums for motorcycles/cars/trucks etc. Man, those dudes are ruthless!!

I have seen a bit of the "my pet is like a child" mentality and while i only somewhat feel like that toward Tony, my mom had cats her whole life and they were her babies, so i understand. Although, i guess having spent over 4 grand on my cat so far this year... i may have a little touch of it too

Anyway, on every other forum i visit - before anyone answers a newbie's question, they always suggest to the newb that they should use the search function first. I haven't seen that here at all - but maybe it's because you (we?) are quite literally dealing with life and death some times.... it's not just a question about a part for a vehicle...

My Cat is on caninsulin - many of you have suggested Lantus. I might stick with Caninsulin because i've heard of many remissions using it too. While some of you may not agree with that, you've still helped me to learn the differences between the 2 insulin’s and have given me tips on what i need to look out for!

Anyway - you guys have been nothing but awesome, have made me feel like i can do this for my cat when i thought i couldn't/wouldn't, and have probably helped me save my cats life. I was quite literally FLOORED when i saw the kindness here... i mean, newb kits for FREE?!!? where the heck else will you get that kind of treatment.

Some people just need thicker skin!

BTW - please don't clear all of the stickies!! i read through almost every one before i even registered as a member here.

 

This issue (tone and content) comes up from time to time. Given that I was one newbie who left, I guess I have a right to put in my two cents.

Personally, I think that yes, we all have to think of what we say and how we say it at all times but especially with newbies because we do get a little high on ourselves and forget what it was like. Explaining our positions, not just stating them as fact, would go a long way. And occassionally addressing the newbie's situation.

However, nothing I saw in the responses were all that out of line. People who post to a forum like this need to be aware that they may or may not like the tone they will find but they should be willing to look at the info regardless or they lose out on a great opportunity.

my two cents...

 

Please come over here to continue with this discussion - that post is doing it too.

Or maybe we need to start a new thread?

 

Okay I'm finally going to stick my two copper pieces in on this. And it really boils down to this:

We can please all of the people, some of the time. Some of the people all of the time, but there is no way we are going to please all of the people all of the time.

We will always have those who are thin skinned, those that merely want to whine and have someone feel sorry for them, or those that are just plain drama queens/kings, and those that just plain want someone to validate their point or opinion and when we don't will get mad and storm off. Lord knows in the year that I have been here there have been several times that I've wanted to walk away from it all, myself. But I didn't because I love my cats, and I found more understanding, compassion and knowledge here than anywhere else. I also was smart enough to realize just because someone was telling me something, didn't mean I had to follow it, if that was the case I would still be listening to my vet on every point. I also have seen those that may come on fairly strong to be the first to roll up their sleeves, throw on another pot of coffee and calmly stay up to walk someone through a hypo, even if that is just staying with that person while cross-posting to the appropriate ISG to get more experienced eyes. I for one, will not give dosing advice on health, even though I have one diabetic cat, and am adopting another, because I don't feel like I have enough miles under my belt to do so, but I sure as heck will run to community or an ISG screaming for help if it is hypo, or when a specific question on dosing comes up, gently nudge that person to seek the proper ISG to help. I will scroll to the bottom and see who is on line and send a PM to ask for assistance.

And when I have spare time, I will wander around to the different forums and read stickies, even if I have never used a particular insulin, or had a cat with Cushings, etc, just so I have some basic knowledge of what may or may not come through Health. Not so I can dispense advice, but so I know where to send a poster to find the info they need. But that is just me, and I don't expect anyone else to do so, but I'm a facts and figures kind of girl, and I like to read and research, which is very likely when I found this board and saw how vast the info was here and how little my vet seemed to know that I put my hiney back into school. Not only did I want answers but I wanted the ability to weigh the information for myself. (And yes, I have been throughly slammed a couple of times for being where I "shouldn't" have been and asking a question, because I wasn't "part of that group") Luckily for me, I have a very thick skin and can take a punch.

Mel, Maxwell and The Fur Gang

 

This has come up time and time again. When the posts are too vehement, too opinionated, it not only scares people away, it creates a closed culture where open discussion is discouraged. That is not helpful or even fair.

Newbies are trying to figure it out, balance what the vet has told them with what we tell them. Yes, we have tons of experience taking care of our diabetic cats. We have so much knowledge to share. But we need to tread a little softer. To make suggestions, not edicts. To remember that written communication can come off as more strident than spoken communication. We need to remember that every cat IS different.

Yes, dry food is not good for diabetics, but not everyone wants, or needs to change. My lovely Maggie would not, under any circumstances, eat wet food. But she managed to honeymoon twice while eating dry food. The attacks, like I was a bad person, could be brutal. So I learned early on NOT to mention it. I choose to stay here, learn a lot, and I'm still here though Maggie died of heart disease years ago.

This can be a great place. We have good hearts. We have a great amount of knowledge that we want to share. We need as a group to learn tact.

Edited to add that I saw nothing nasty or bad in the replies, though I didn't read the original post. My comments are in general, not directed at anyone!

 

Thank you for that, Rebecca--as a still-newbie myself I've been feeling a little uncomfortable with the level of vehemence recently but chose to stay because the site is still gold.>>

Yes I felt the same way. Suzie is gone so I don't and she was a big on wet food so it wasn't a problem.


Some on this board I am sure they don't see me as a fit "mother: because I do feed my cats some dry food. One of my ferals eats all dry food. She creams for hours if she doesn't get it. She has some other "mental" issue to but I love her and I do my best for her. It is hard she is a true feral that has to live inside.

I have had arguments with people here with it defending others that said they feed dry food. I get tired of seeing the bullying on this issue People get mean about it here. They bully. I believe they are telling themselves they are doing it for the cats. However, that doesn't get your message across and in the long run the one that pays is the cat. I don't even want to post this because I really don't want to get into a heated debate. Perhaps I shouldn't not sure it matters but there are a few brave people that spoke up. I shouldn't even be coming here any more now that Suzie is gone. I am not sure why I do anymore. . . well one reason is I want to see how Ginger the cat makes out : )

Give the advice let them take it or not take it. . . if not you loose them all together and the only one that really loses is the original posters cat. . . ,.

 

I have re-read this thread a couple of times .... and all I see is helpful information, given freely. I was once told in the beginning that regardless of what information was offered, I had the cat!

We had someone leave pzi recently because we could not all agree, we had TOO many opinions, there should be one answer ..... but we all know ECID and there just isn't one answer.

I have been very fortunate that when my Payne was going into/in/just out of DKA, I had many, many kind and caring people helping me. With all the advice I was able to keep her alive, much to the disbelief of many, many vets. Where would I have gotten that? where????

The written word is difficult sometimes but the hearts are always there, for the newbies, for those in need. We treat our cats like part of our families, which they are .... some don't, and then we come across as??? many of us don't take vacations, don't visit much, do our schedules around shooting times and are mostly poor because we are paying full price, out of our pockets to give our sugar cats the best. If at time we come across tired or we've said it a million times, we are sorry, not intended.

But, to imply that we don't care .... I think that is? not nice and isn't that what we are railing against? Most newbies come here to try and get answers, which are usually different than what their vet is saying. They are stressed, we try and hand-hold as much as possible. But to say otherwise, I totally disagree!!

Nancy and Payne
(still alive thanks to so many here .....)

 

So true Mel. People like you who give their time and energy to helping others on this forum should be applauded not criticized like I am seeing in some posts here and particularly in the lantus forum discussion linked by BJM here.

I didn't see anything wrong with what any of you said to the original poster.

That said, like Jen mentioned this issue comes up from time to time. Which is why Janet wrote her "Suggestions to Advice Givers" post.

This post was originally written back in November 2006 to address this same issue. It is available right at the bottom of the Stickies listed above.

Suggestions to Advice Givers

 

And for those that didn't see the original post, the original post was asking our opinion on feeding a civie dry food AFTER her current diabetic passed away as she wanted a diet that was less expensive than the prescription diet that she was now feeding and that would keep that same civie's teeth in good shape without having to have dentals done....I gave just that my opinion, and stated my own reasons why.

And quite frankly, getting jumped on now because of what was said, by folks who neither read nor responded to the original post before the original poster changed it...is one of those times that makes me want to leave and not try anymore to help. To take what information I have learned this last year and call it quits.

But I also know that today just isn't a good day for me, I'm tired and I'm cranky, and why? Because I sat up last night and held hands until help arrived for a scared newbie with a hypoing cat....And personally that makes up for all the lost sleep and the rest of the trival BS.

Mel, Maxwell and The Fur Gang

Edited to add, in the original responses...Max was the OP's CIVIE, Oscar was her diabetic....this was not someone new to dealing with a diabetic, and at least for my part I didn't answer her in regards to her diabetic cat, I answered in regards to my civies.

 

The response from lantus for a drop by to health to help newbie's

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=46066

 

I saw that thread where you and some others were helping that person in crisis. KUDOS TO ALL OF YOU FOR BEING GENEROUS BEANS TO A STRANGER!
When I was having a problem with the spreadsheet set up, someone PM'd me and told I could call her at home and gave me her phone number. She didn't know me from Adam! All I could think of was WOW! The people here are really caring & generous.

As for another person's comment about their pet's placement in their life (ie pet is important, to a point), I get that too. My dad is that way. It's not wrong, it's just a different line of thinking or whatever you want to call it. When I called my dad to tell him about Cedric's diagnosis (I think I called him the day he was diagnosed), Dad was commenting on the lines of "he could be put down" but stopped, knowing probably that I would yell or hang up on him and not speak to him until I sw him 2 weeks later! :lol: Sometimes I wonder what he would do if his weimeriner, Dakota, was in this situation. Maybe I already got my answer...

:YMHUG: to everyone!

 

Here's what I feel I should have done differently in answer to the OP.

I should have asked questions to initiate a dialog instead of making statements. In fact, that's something we could do more of as a whole when answering newbies or at least answer the questions the OP asks.

This thread though is good example of when we get it right! It has constructive criticism that is not aimed to belittle anyone, as has happened in the past when this kind of beast rears its ugly head.

On the other hand, I don't like having to tiptoe around when posting to people, even newbies, in case someone might take something too personal or the wrong way. Communication is a 2 way street and if someone doesn't like how they were spoken to, it's up to them how they deal with that. No one here should be made to feel responsible for this person leaving.

 

I'm not the longest member... but I've been around a while....

Thank You For This Year!

Please grant me words of wisdom, to calm and clear the air
Of this great site, that taught me that strangers really care.
When I hit search that fateful night almost a year ago
I first received a hug, from someone I did not know.

They told me that the chances were great that he’d be fine
They told me just to take a breath, and then asked me to define
Just what the vet had told me, and what the vet said he should eat.
I answered all their questions, I didn’t skip a beat.

I said Charlie was to take a pill, and no one put me down.
No one said that I was wrong, and no one showed a frown.
They said to just keep coming back, and keep them all updated.
Thus I‘ve come back so many times, I went to sleep elated.

I came back with each small victory… and even in defeat.
I came back and you were patient and helped me stand on my two feet.
I learned so much from all of you, I learned to “shoot” my cat
And even though I fought it, home testing followed that.

Then very, very slowly, I started saying “Hi” to someone new on line.
I’d welcome them and tell them that “things would be just fine”.
Then someone, very sweetly sent an e-mail just to me.
She nicely pointed out that I -- could not “give that guarantee.”

Her words were very gentle, said in the nicest way
I knew that she was oh so right, for it was not good for me to say.
For even though we try so hard to help each well loved cat
We cannot give a guarantee that all will work, if we do this and then do that.

Though ‘Every Cat Is Different’, we’re pretty much the same.
For most of us are here because, we care when even one more name
Is followed by a (GA), and each one of us sheds tears
And each and every one of us will feel the loss for years.

This site is such special site, and all who take the time
To give a newbie some advice, and me a silly rhyme.
Thank you all for all you’ve done, to help “sweet” Chuck and me.
Please know that I am grateful, that with your help, he’s still with me!

(((Hugs)))
©2005 Carol Notermann (& Charlie too!)

Charlie left for Rainbow Bridge in the early morning hours of 8-5-09... I will miss him forever.

 

Ruth, this IS the thread. The first 5 or 6 posts were in response to the OP, but she deleted her post and inserted 'I'm sorry I asked"
I also never got to read her question....I also did'nt see much wrong with any of the responses.
But I took the reminder to slow down and engage the Newbie.

 

Okay, so maybe people can be a bit adamant here. However, there is a lot of information, and that is what is needed for a newbie like me. It's been 3 weeks since the diagnosis, since reading and posting here I put my 11 year old on wet food with home BG testing and he's been OTJ for a week now (fingers crossed!). Before that the vet basically said 3 units ProZinc BID, and my vet didn't think much of home testing or of changing his diet from dry food. Tomorrow we go back to the vet first thing in the morning, I plan to show him how I test and take my spreadsheet with me. Without the support, and perhaps what some people may consider bullying, I would probably have a much sicker cat, and would definitely be a much less informed cat owner. So thanks for the 'bullying', it really helped us.