SPRATS POSSIBLE HYPO

43 AT 4.5+

 

Here is her previous thread. viewtopic.php?f=28&t=35353 Tonight at 185 the shot was 2 units of N. +2 was 162. +4.5 was 43. She has given gravy food.

I can't remember your name. Please tell us. Can you add the 43 to your spreadsheet so people coming on can see it.

You need to do another test 15 minutes from the time you got the 43. Is it about time?

 

64, GOING UP 30-45 MINUTES AFTER 43

 

This is good. It most likely will stay up since you just gave high carb, not syrup - right? But you still want to take another test in 20 minutes or so. The idea is that you want 2 tests headed up, without syrup. We still don't know his nadir, so the insulin could counteract your high carb so we want to be sure.

I will stay on until you are out of the woods. No worries. This is looking better.

 

CORRECT, NO SYRUP. I have given him Friskies with gravy and some dry treats. He has eaten them fine. Even played around chasing a laser. Should I try to keep him "playful" or does he need to rest and save his energy?

 

Sorry, my name is Jennifer Beyer in Joplin, MO. I am a little frazzled. I hate that I caused this again!

 

Hi Jennifer,

Actually you don't want him to play. Sometimes activity lowers blood glucose levels.

I am guessing you will be okay, but let's just watch and make sure.

So - tomorrow. If you get any number around 200, I would wait 30 minutes and test again. You want to make sure it is headed up. Even if you get a higher number than usual, which you could since he had high carb and dry food tonight, if I were you, I would be cautious. I would give one unit, or even .5.

When are you planning to switch to Lantus?

 

Don't beat yourself up. Trying to learn and understand all the stuff you need to know in this short amount of time is HARD!

You are doing fine and Sprats seem to be doing okay too. You knew exactly what to do when you saw the low number.

Sorry, I should have remembered your name. I helped you set up your spreadsheet the other night.

 

I have read some things on Lantus, but wanted to be sure. The difference is is that you don't roll it, is that all? I have the pen and new u100 needles.

 

hey jennifer, how far along are you now? how many hours since shot?

 

+5

 

+5 64?
or have you not tested in the last half hour?
and help me catch up..your using N or lantus?

 

what about water? he drank a little water. not too much. Is that ok?

 

Hey, Lori, thanks for coming. It is looking better but we aren't sure when her nadir is. She is using N.

Jennifer, water is fine. How about another test? Has it been about 20 minutes since the last one?

 

yes, let him eat and drink as he wants.
your using N...that is a fast acting insulin yet?
get the next test and we should talk about tomorow morning ok

 

Just coming on and seeing this...How we doing ladies? Any new numbers yet?

Mel, Max & The Fur Gang

 

are we sure it's N and not Lantus that was shot tonight?

 

The reason I am a little concerned about the nadir is that she got the 186 12 hours after her morning shot. That isn't N's usual pattern. Usually (I know ECID) you would see amps and pmps pretty close in numbers.

I am almost postitive, right,Jennifer? N today. She has Lantus but hasn't started it yet.

 

Just tested at 84.
Yes, it was N. I have not started Lantus yet. I just got it in the mail this afternoon and wasn't sure on the protocol, so I gave the N

 

well N works as a fast or short acting insulin...so there could be some pancreatic action in the mix.

 

That is encouraging. What do you think, Lori and Mel? It sounds good, but I am still concerned with the long duration, low pmps she got today.

 

What does that mean - the pancreatic action?

 

Usually N hits fast - within 3-5 hours after the shot - and then it shoots right back up again. N is not acting that way in Sprats. He went a long way today never going back up into the 300-400 range. So Lori is thinking that Sprat's pancreas may be kicking in to help keep the numbers down. This is a GOOD thing!

 

Just catching up how far past the last shot are we? If it was N then he should be headed up no later than +6, that low of a pmps says to me Sprats may not want to take shots much longer. =)

Mel

 

Whew! I was starting to freak out again. Note, the morning shot was with my u40 syringe. It could have been closer to 2.

 

well jennifer if you can keep the number above 150 by +7 i would imagine your ok...the insulin has pretty much lost it's punch by then.
but let's wait and see how he goes.
glad you got your kit today! enough strips for a night like this?

 

His shot was between 5:30 and 6:00, and it is almost 11:45 so, we are at 84 at 5.5+

 

Yes, thanks for the kit! I am glad for the strips I have gone through quite a bit tonight, unfortunately... I did use the sock this last test because I am by myself. No help, except for you all! <3

 

How long since you got the 84?

 

is he still interested in eatting?
would like to see him well past 100 before you quit
can you also put your #'s in the ss so we can see the pace.
you doing great and this will be a good lesson about hypo and shooting #'s

 

Mel and Lori,

Will you stay with Jennifer? It is way past my bedtime and I would love to leave her in your capable hands.

 

he isn't eating. he is in his bed "bathing". The 84 in the SS is more at 5.5 than 6. Now would be 20 minutes since the 84, so I will try another test...

 

Sorry Sue... thank you so much for sticking around this long...

 

I can stay with her Sue, we are in the same time zone so it is just a little before midnight for me, and Jon's band is gigging tonight soI have until about 3 am before he gets home. I won't sleep anyhow until he gets home.

Mel

 

jenn, was there no shot last nite?
also with no mid cycle's we really don't know if this dose has been too high all along.
tomorow you may likely get a high # as a result of the high carbs and a rebound from the low tonight.
do not react to that # and go down to 1u
now if you see a number under 200... .5 actually.

 

good night sue!

 

89 now - still going up, but not very fast.

 

i'm leaving too. you have mel, and you have strips and high carb food. keep your cat above 150 before you finish with him ok. and not fast is actually better. fast up===fast down.

 

Yes, there was a shot last night. I just fixed the SS.

 

Thank you Lori - and thanks Mel. I feel bad for doing this to you!

 

Nice getting to know you, Jennifer. You are doing great and have good help. I'll check in on you in the morning and as Lori has said, careful with the dose.

Just be sure you don't quit too soon. If you see any downward movement or even the same number range, stay up and test.

 

You know Lori has slow as he is going up... I think we have pancreas action...this late he should be going up faster on N.
It's a good thing. When Muse was on N she went back up quickly after about +5, but then again ECID

Night Lori I got her...sleep tight

Mel

 

What a way to learn home testing huh? Your doing great.

Mel

 

night john-boy.
:lol:
i really thing the pancreas kicked in there too.
so if the number gets above 150 i don't think the pancreas will work sprats down to a hypo.
it may take a little while.
but jenn, this will work out nicely if the pancreas is indeed working.

 

you are right. the warm sock really does work, so far. I have used it the past two times and gotten enough on the first time.

 

I refer to Max's rice sock as my magic weapon....lol Who knew something so simple would be so much help.

Mel

 

he's eating again... as soon as he is finished I will try another test

 

Sounds good to me, I think you are probably out of the woods already but would like to see him just a little higher before we completely relax since it night. But at + 7 on N you should be good is we see 90 or above.

You do know you can use the U100 syringes with the N? Humulin N is a U100 insulin...just notice you said you had used your U40 syringes tonight.

Mel

 

ok, 98

 

I used the U100 syringe tonight. I really don't have any explanation for the 2. It just seemed less than what I gave with the U40. Plus the 499 this AM.

 

Yeah :RAHCAT You shouldn't drop to low now. So Inhale and exhale and relax, ya did good. Give Sprats a couple of extra scritches tonight for putting up with all the ear pokies. Ya both did great!

Perfect timing on getting your newbie kit, sorry you had to have such a crash course on testing.

Mel

 

When you start the Lantus you are going to have to learn not to react to one high preshot number. Lantus works off a shed in other words it builds up under their skin. Dose changes with Lantus are based off the nadir or lowest point.

With the way Sprats is reacting to the N I would start the Lantus at no more than 1u.

MY Max was 485 when he was dxed and put on Lantus, we started him on 1u and even that was more than he needed and he went OTJ in a week.

Mel

 

158 AAAAAH

 

It's above 150, what do you think? Is it ok for me to leave him? What I read on the Lantus, the only difference in giving is that you don't roll it or swirl it around?

 

Yay! You'll be fine now so I'm going to log off for a little bit, but I will check back in here before I actually go to bed which won't be for another couple hours, just encase something comes up...Then I'll check in on you in the morning again.

You don't roll it or shake it. Don't shot air back into the vial/cartridge, instead you draw up just a little extra, tap out any air bubbles and then get to do that dramatic squirt in the air to get the correct dosage. But the stickies explain it all and if in doubt come on and ask.

Mel, Max & The Fur Gang

 

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR ENDURING THIS WITH ME. YOU ALL ARE LIFESAVERS! My life could have been so different a week ago, if I hadn't found you all!!!

 

It means possibly the pancreas is is working a little bit and contributing some
insulin, too.

It that is the case, this is what needs to happen for your cat to go into diabetic
remission....it's a good thing.

 

ohmygod_smile
Jen just want to say You have come to the most awesome place for both you and your kitty. These angels know what its all about. I too was in your place about 9 months ago.After 2 months these people made me a hero to my Trey. You are doing an awesome job and sounds like Sprats will be off the juice in no time at all.Took Trey 2 months .Keep up the good work Hugsssssss to both of you. Lantus is a very good insulin lasting 12 hours and if you keep on your 12 hours it works the best. Trey is still 17lbs but he is so full of play and runs and his fur beautiful He is doing Wonderful..All thanks to FDMB Angels


One thing to remember (((((((((((Breath)))))))))))))))))) oh yes the rice sock is awesome could not have done it without it....


Kath & Trey OTJ 6 months today :lol: :YMHUG: :YMHUG:

 

Thank you all. I just gave a test, after 3 tries and it was 366.
What do you think on the Lantus? this AM?
He is eating now, and his ear is a bloody mess. I don't know why I couldn't get it this morning after so many times last night!

 

good Morning, Jennifer. Glad things went well last night.

How long do you have before you have to give him a dose? I would like to see some Lantus users weigh in. Can you start a new thread and ask about Lantus?

 

his last dose 15 hours ago. It was N, not Lantus. I have to leave for church now. Maybe I should wait?

 

Whatever feels best for you. It wouldn't hurt to wait, but if you start Lantus, you will need to be on a 12/12 schedule, so you will need to wait until the pm shot. That might be a good idea, since you are coming off such a low number yesterday. By tonight, you should be able to get some advice on a starting dose for Lantus. The problem with starting a new insulin at night is that you are not up to monitor.

If you want to wait until tomorrow morning to start Lantus, you could give a drop or two of N this morning, or skip completely.

 

In deference to your schedule, I would start Lantus tonight and skip this morning's shot, or as Sue suggested, waiting until tomorrow to start Lantus is you're around to test then. Lantus really likes consistency and it is a 12-hour insulin (i.e., a long-acting insulin vs. an intermediate-acting insulin such as N). You will want to decide on a shot time that works for your schedule and gives you room to monitor a bit after you shoot.

In addition to the development of a depot (we call it a "shed"), dosing is based on the lowest point of the cycle -- the nadir. As a result, in addition to tests at AMPS and PMPS, spot checks during the cycle are very important.

You indicated that you are using U40 syringes. Lantus is a U100 insulin. You need U100 syringes that have half unit markings since dosing is done in 0.25u increments.

I would also suggest that you venture over to the Lantus board and read the starred, sticky notes at the top of the "Topics" section of the board.

• Tight Regulation Protocol - the dosing protocol we use
• care and handling of Lantus
• new to the Lantus/Lev group - links to our slang dictionary, how to do a curve, etc.
• the insulin depot/shed
• becoming data ready - shooting low to stay low and how to be ready to do so

Are you still feeding dry W/D?

 

Thats a really nice number for coming off a hypo the night before, so fwiw If this was Max I would skip this morning's shot, wait until tonight for when you want to set up your 12-12 schedule, and the check, but unless it is sky high I think I would be fairly consevative and only give 1u and then try to stay up long enough to get a +3 & +6. Nadir on Lantus is usually around +6 to +7, but that is just me, I would like to see what others have for input as well, since Max and I didn't use Lantus that long before he went into remission.

Mel, Max & The Fur Gang

 

Yes I agree with Mel, the number is nice coming off a very low number plus all that gravy high carb.
if you did'nt shoot it will be VERY interesting to see how he look's at +6 which is really +18 since the last shot and she if he lingers in this number or even, god willing, bring himself down a little. Then we will really know you have a Mr. P who's eager to get back to work!

 

What an AWESOME thread Y'all ROCK!

 

:sad: Oh my goodness! It feels like I am doing everything I can to harm my cat! So, I had to leave for church and didn't get the reply. I got the 366 AMPS, fed Friskies again and then gave .5 Lantas. I should have waited until tomorrow to start?? I was careful to only give .5 (because of last night's fiasco) I wanted to be conservative. +3 is 267. I can do the next Lantas dose at +12, but that would put me at 9:00 AM tomorrow morning, and I am gone all day to work. Is this hopeless since I won't be home to check through the day? I had planned on the 12 being 7 and 7 (times of the day). You all probably think I am the dumbest person on earth! I'm really not... Ok, please weigh in and give me your advise what to do the rest of today and tomorrow. Please! I'm so overwhelmed!

 

You are NOT dumb. What's done is done. No sense in fretting. I cant give dosing advice but dont worry everything will be ok.
jeanne

 

i think you could just start tonight at 8:30 tomorow at 8am (if that's possible?) and edge your way down 1/2 at a time.
IMHO but let's see how these #'s go.
and you are not dumb...we were all, each and everyone of us, a newbie once ourselves. you learn. no one expects you to KNOW. ;-)

 

I can do 8:30 tonight and 8:00 tomorrow. Does he still need to have eaten 30 minutes before? How many times should I prick him today? 3+ the .5 Lantas was 267

 

hi jennifer! nice to meet you.

sue put out a call for help in the lantus support group, so i dropped in to see what's been going on. my, you've been through quite a lot and have come through with flying colors! you're doing great!

as far as adjusting the shot time... personally, i like to keep things simple. why make things harder than they have to be? :lol:

give yourself a break. my suggestion would be to skip tonight's shot and restart tomorrow morning at your desired time of 7am. easy-peasy. one skipped shot will not make a difference in the long run.

with lantus, you have a couple of hours to get food on board before the onset of the insulin. however, most of us test, feed, and shoot within a matter of minutes. i'm not one to discourage testing by any means, but i think you can comfortably give sprats a break by holding off testing until +5 or +6. if you're leaving the house before then, leave some food out for him to nibble on.

please post the next number after testing, k?

amps 366
+3 267


good luck and hope to see you posting often!

 

yes you definetly are not feeding 1/2 hour before testing right? and the food can go after the shot. now that you are off the N which acts so quickly you needed food digesting in the tummy proir to the shot, this will be different in that these are slower acting insulins and you can wait to feed after the shot...even by an hour or 2.

 

Thank you Jill. I am greatful for everyone's help. I will hold off tonight and do in the morning. I am pretty much an 8-5:30 worker. I should test how many times today?

 

I am glad to see you got some Lantus answers, Jennifer.

You might post on their support group as well as here. They all use Lantus and will have great dose advice for you. They will want you to read the stickies on the top of the page and they will like seeing your numbers on your spreadsheet. This is the link to the forum: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=9

You are doing fine, dealing with hypos and old and new insulins. This is a steep learning curve and you are doing a great job, learning fast.

 

let's see what that +5 or +6 tells us before committing to a certain number of tests today, k?

just a suggestion...
it might not be a bad idea to start a new thread (this one's getting pretty long) with a subject line something like
1/30 - Sprats - AMPS 366; +3 267

then you can add your +5 or +6 test number to the subject line when you get it. that way, people who are helping you will know where sprats is at a glance.