Two months of insulin and still no improvement

Discussion in 'Lantus / Basaglar (glargine) and Levemir (detemir)' started by Sleafy, Nov 7, 2018.

  1. Sleafy

    Sleafy New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2018
    Mira was diagnosed with diabetes in early September and she started on Lantus September 17th. I started out pretty well with the glucose curved but recently I've been getting so stressed about doing them and she's been so unhappy lately that I haven't done a full curve since October 21st. I've tested her a few times, and her numbers are all over the place. Is there something wrong with my insulin? Can anyone make sense of these crazy numbers?

    Note: Units are in mmol/L

    https://ibb.co/mcnWkA
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    As for Oct 14th, I'm pretty sure that was a furshot. Otherwise, I've been good at injecting her with whatever unit is indicated at the bottom of the chart for that day.

    Mood-wise, Mira has been grumpy about the glucose curves, hungry all the time (noisily! Meowing at 6am! The time change confused her system a lot), and peeing a lot (might have slightly decreased lately, but I also switched litter to world's best and it is a lot better than the clay variety).
     
  2. John Irene and TITAN

    John Irene and TITAN Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2018
    This looks pretty difficult for you. But I can recommend that you get "on board" with the systems here, and they WILL HELP. So that means doing the right sort of spreadsheet, and keeping on with the home BG testing. The people here are wonderful and I think they saved our Titans life. Hang in there, and things will get better. Start by studying all the videos on BG testing
    What time of day are you doing the injections ?
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2018
    Joanne&TinySole likes this.
  3. Wendy&Neko

    Wendy&Neko Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2012
    John is right, we can more easily help you if you can get your test data into the format most people here are using. Spreadsheet instructions are here: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/

    That spreadsheet will also convert the numbers used by most of the world to those used by the US, which is the common language of blood sugars here, as the site is hosted in the US. We also work in terms of + times, which is number of hours after the shot. That helps since people here are from all over the world, and shoot at different times of day.

    What food are you feeding Mira? How many times of day are you feeding her? What symptoms led to the diabetes diagnosis? Sorry for all the questions, but they can impact the blood sugar numbers.
     
  4. Sleafy

    Sleafy New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2018

    I'll work on converting my spreadsheet to the FDMB version.

    For now, to answer your other questions, I am feeding Mira a mix of Boreal dry (about 1/4 cup/day) and 5.5oz Boreal wet or PC extra meaty wet food. I'm in Canada so I'm not sure if these brands exist outside of Canada. I usually feed her half a can (2.75oz) in the morning with her shot of insulin at 7:30 am, a snack of one scoop if I'm home around 11, another scoop or two (if I wasn't home at 11) around 5, half a can (2.75oz) with her second shot of insulin at 7:30 pm, and 2 scoops at night around 9 or 10.

    Mira's symptoms were increased urination, thirst, and appetite and weight loss (3 lbs in one year). She also has some dry skin and a bit of fur loss on her shoulder.
     
  5. Sleafy

    Sleafy New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2018
    I'm doing injections at 7:30am and pm. I'm going to do the spreadsheet tomorrow.
     
    John Irene and TITAN likes this.
  6. Wendy&Neko

    Wendy&Neko Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2012
    I too am in Canada. The sooner you can get rid of the dry food from your cat’s diet, the better. It’s too high in carbs for a diabetic. Your feeding schedule is fine, but wet food all around would be better. Most of the foods listed in this list are also available in Canada. Ideally you want food that is under 10% carbs. https://catinfo.org/docs/CatFoodProteinFatCarbPhosphorusChart.pdf
     
  7. Sleafy

    Sleafy New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2018
    Okay here is Mira's chart in the FDMB format.
     
  8. Wendy&Neko

    Wendy&Neko Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2012
    I am having an issue opening the document. Not sure if the URL was copied correctly as the message says something about not being able to open that URL.
     
  9. Sleafy

    Sleafy New Member

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    Oct 1, 2018
  10. Chris & China

    Chris & China Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2013
    You're not testing often enough for us to really know how she's doing. We understand you're doing what your vet told you to do, but here, we test every day....every cycle.....it's the only way to truly know what's going on.

    You also need to get at least a "before bed" test on the PM cycle. Most cats go lower at night, so it's important for her safety. Also, without testing on the PM cycle, you're only getting half the data ….and the answers you want may be in the data you're not getting!

    It looks like your vet has had you increase her dose in whole unit increments. That's too much, too fast. We do increases in .25 unit increments because when it comes to insulin, a tiny amount too much or too little can make a huge difference in how your kitty is doing.

    I'd like to suggest you start testing before every shot...and then on the AM cycle get at least 1 test somewhere mid-cycle (+5 to +7) and at least a "before bed" test on the PM cycle. If you can get more tests, that's even better!

    If it's not possible to get a mid-cycle on the AM cycle (due to work), it's even more important to get tests on the PM cycle so you can get a better picture of how low the dose is taking her.

    Lantus dosing is always based on how low it takes them, not the Pre-shot number. We test at Pre-shot to make sure it's safe to give insulin at all.
     
  11. Sleafy

    Sleafy New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2018
    I know the system FDMB suggests and I'm sure it has better results, but I just don't have the time or resources to do everything "by the book." Test strips are $3 per, even at twice a day that's $180 a month, plus another $80 on food, $140 if I go 100% wet food. Plus Mira hates all the tests, she's not a touchy cat to begin with and being handled and poked makes her avoid us even more.

    My first concern is making sure she's happy, and while that's easily accomplished with the yummy wet food she loves so much, I just can't stomach causing her so much discomfort with daily testing. Her numbers have never dipped low enough for her to be in danger of insulin shock either.

    It's just a really stressful time for both of us and her numbers seem to be getting worse, I'm wondering if maybe the insulin is off? Or she's rejecting it? I just don't know what to do at this point.
     
  12. Wendy&Neko

    Wendy&Neko Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2012
    What test strips are you using? Human blood glucose meters work perfectly fine and their test strips are way cheaper. I live near the border so got my test strips from the US. Looking at eBay is also a good place for test strips.

    Lots of people feed low carb Friskies or Fancy Feast from grocery stores. Food doesn’t have to break the bank. I made my own raw food and paid less than $2 a day on food.

    I can’t say anything about the insulin dose based on the limited data. If you feed a low carb treat each time you test, pretty soon kitty comes running for their tests. Mine would purr through them.
     

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