*update* Smokey 5/15 - AM-343 | PM-355

Hi everyone! I've missed you!

I haven't been around in awhile mostly because my husband had to get Pilonidal Surgery 2 weeks ago and then he got an infection from his surgery (we found out today) so we are starting all over again with the healing process!

Mr. Smokey has not been doing well! I cannot understand why he has greens, blues, yellows, purples, reds and blacks ALL over the place! He is still drinking water like it is going out of style! I just cannot find any consistency with his BG and it's been almost 2 months now!

I haven't been able to do much testing due to caring for my husband during the days and nights but I have made sure to do all of my pre-shot tests.

We have an appointment tomorrow at the vet for a Fructosomine and a re-check of his T-4. My vet has recommended a Fructosomine since my poor boy is all over the map with his spot checks and still drinks so much water.

If a kitty has a UTI will that make his BG go all over the map? I also wonder about my Lantus Vial...my 28 days were up on 4/28 and I'm still using it (from the fridge). There is no discoloration and no floaties so I've continued to use it.

 

Sorry about your husband. You sure do have a lot to manage!

I too would love to know what the prevailing theory is on how long the vials last. I've read a few different things and I'm not quite sure what the most recent thinking is. I'll be approaching a month on mine too.

 

I really want to urge you to get more than a pre-shot test especially when you are shooting green numbers. I gotta tell you, shooting a 40 is not something I would do and I will shoot low. Seeing a +10 of 214 and a PMPS of 56 tells you that you shot a dropping number. Without a +1 and a +2 you have no idea whether Smokey was in the 20s within a few hours. I know you have a lot on your hands right now. But please, you need to consider Smokey's safety if you are going to shoot low. The reason his numbers are all over the place is because he is most likely dropping low and you're not taking dose reductions. That 40 was really too low to shoot and he should have gotten a dose reduction.

 

Hi Denne and Smokey.....Sorry to hear about your DH's medical issues. Sounds like you have alot to deal with these days. You are taking care of your DH and Smokey....who is taking care of you. Hope you are able to get Smokey's numbers under control soon.

Hugs,
Tena and Curry

 

ouch! best of recovery to your husband, and hope you get Smokey's numbers under better control!

 

Hi Denne,
I too am so sorry you have all of this on your plate. It's a lot. But have to concur with Sienne. Of course you don't mean to do any harm but shooting a dropping number is very dangerous under any circumstances...especially when you aren't really monitoring.(Yeesh I would never shoot a 40 either).
I know how much you love Smokey and so far you've been lucky. Giving insulin to a cat who's numbers are so low can result in damage that can be irreversible and I know that you don't want that. Better to not shoot at all when you see something like that, or wait until Smokey's numbers are well on the RISE(if you have time). k? :smile:

 

Thanks everyone!

Since I've shot a 40 before, I don't worry as much shooting that particular # again keeping a close watch and my hypo kit available. I will never shoot a number lower than that but since I've had Smokey for 14 years, this is his second time being Diabetic as I brought him to remission once before so I am extremely familiar with his behavior when he goes too low. His Nadir has usually been his pre-shot number (the majority of the time) and after his PMPS and food, his BG quickly starts rising within 2 hours.

When I got the one other 40, I decreased his dose and his numbers and behavior did not support that dose decrease so I went back to the last dose amount (of 2units). Hopefully, this Fructosomine will give me some more answers as a whole! Can't wait to see his T-4 score today also!!

Happy Monday!

 

However, you are not as familiar with Lantus as you are with Vetsulin. The method of action of Lantus is different. It's a long-acting insulin. Vetsulin is not like Lantus and you will get into trouble if you use the same dosing strategy for Lantus as you used with Vetsulin. For example, a hypo on Lantus can last 16 hours. With Lantus, you are also basing dose on nadir, not on the pre-shot numbers. There's not enough evidence that I can see on Smokey's SS to definitively conclude that he has a late nadir.

 

denne, i don't know where to start... i'm sorry you've had so much to deal with. hope your husband is doing better.

i'm not surprised smokey is not doing well after looking at his spreadsheet. lantus and vetsulin are not the same. they work differently. much differently! vetsulin is in and out. lantus is a cumulative insulin. what happens one cycle can effect what will happen over the next 3 days.

i strongly urge to reconsider the points sienne has brought up. i've been studying spreadsheets for quite awhile now. there's just as much (if not more) evidence that smokey is NOT a late nadir cat. the verdict is still out on that one.

there's also not enough data collected to support shooting the 40s. i've been doing this on and off for not quite 5 years now, my cat experiences huge food spikes after eating even a small piece of freeze dried chicken, and i would not shoot a ps number in the 40s. there's only been a very few people i know who can shoot 40s successfully... and safely.

i can appreciate "knowing thy cat". i've brought my own cat into remission not just once, but twice. are you aware a kitty can be running low... VERY low... say low 30s... and not exhibit ANY symptoms what-so-ever? my cat has slept peacefully through the low 30s... and she's not the only one. if i was relying on her behavior alone to detect the low i NEVER would have caught it.

please get those nadir checks and post often. i know it's not easy when switching from one insulin to another, but we can help you learn how lantus works. together we'll get smokey off that roller coaster...

 

Denne, We are sending healing vines to your DH and thinking good thoughts for his speedy recovery. You certainly have a lot to deal with right now and I can imagine how stressful it is. But please consider carefully the advice you received today. Smokey will do fine when you can get a better idea of his cycles and learn how Lantus works. We are all here for support.

Hang in there, sending hugs to you and your family,

Ella & Rusty

 

best of luck with the T4 today!

 

Jill and Sienne,

I cannot find a nadir for smokey. I've said several times in past posts that his highest readings are around his 6 hour mark and then I've been told that he may be a late nadir kitty and also that I should take the lowest number of the day and consider that as his nadir. I tested and tested in the beginning and I found that he gets higher throughout the day instead of lower. I was also told to decrease him (which I did), then I was told that I needed to increase him again. The information has been so conflicting that it has been hard for me to keep up. I have never considered lantus to be the same dosing as Vetsulin and if I did, I wouldn't be part of this forum. I really do understand the differences.

The only thing that remains the same in all this is that smokey drinks so much water. A cereal bowl of water a day. He does not drink water when his BG is around 200 or lower so I have to consider that as well.

I work full time as does my husband so I can't get blood as much as others so I also have to consider his behavior as well.

Emails can often be read in a tone other than what was intended so please don't read this with emotion!! I don't know how else to say it and I don't want it to come across any other way. :smile:

 

I hope Smokey doesnt do to you what Binks did to me...

every time I thought I had a handle on his nadir...he'd change the game on me...

+4 became +9, then +7...i finally gave up, but was off work on an injury and had the luxury of just being able to test any time he was low...

so it was really fairly easy to keep up with...
certainly not everyone has that kind of schedule freedom...

 

Well you guys do look like brothers so you never know Binks!! :lol:

 

Hi Denne',

I posted in your condo yesterday, but I think I waited too long to submit and it just disappeared!

I totally understand your frustration about all the information flying at you at once. I can barely keep up with reading what's in my condo, let alone reading all the sticky's over and over again so I understand them. I know sometimes I am a broken question machine asking question after question and sometimes the same questions again and again. I do find that everyone here is very patient with me and will find the time to answer my questions the best they can.

I've also found this second time around that Guinness's spreadsheet doesn't seem as cut and dry as far as nadir, etc. as it did the first time we were here. It's driving me crazy :roll:

I guess I'm saying all this to let you know you are not alone! I'm always wondering where you are and how Smokey is doing. I know things at home are crazy for you with your husband's illness and all. I hope you can find the time to post more. We miss visiting your condo! Have a good night and good luck with that 2nd T4!

 

Let us know how Smokey's T4 comes back! Inquiring minds wanna know

 

No offense taken!

Personally, I don't find fructosamine tests all that informative compared to the testing that you're doing. All the test does is give you an average -- it can't tell you if there were very low or very high numbers vs. a flat curve. Only home testing will tell you that.

Both Jill and I were concerned with shooting as low as you've been shooting. Ultimately. it's your call.