URGENT help needed, fearing hypoglicemia

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (The Main Forum)' started by Georgiana & Perlutz, Feb 14, 2019.

  1. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Hi,

    Perlutz’s BG was 5.2 this morning (using AlphaTrak) and my bf still gave him his insulin :arghh: (he didn’t realize, wasn’t done with bad intent) and now I’m obviouslly fearing the worst. This was 30 min ago. As soon as he told me, I gave Perlutz about 10 high carb treats. I thought I shouldn’t give more to keep his interest in them so I can give some more in a lil while. I have honey handy, I have some wet food with sauce, higher in carbs. I will stay home with Perlutz today to keep an eye on him but he is not very easy to test, not on my own:( And I don’t even drive so in case of emergency, it’s not as easy as jumping in the car with him. If anything happens, I will get him to the vet even if I have to hitchhike or whatever.

    Do you have any advice on how to avoid him going into hypo, please?

    I hope my message makes sense, I’m in panic mode already

    Thanks!
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
  2. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Hi,
    Take a deep breath.........as long as you are testing the BSL you are in control.
    Can you take Perlutz's BSL at@1.....that is one hour after the insulin was given and tell us what it is please?
    I will stay with you until this is sorted out, or get someone else to help, so don't worry you are not alone.
    Bron
     
  3. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

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    In your shoes I would call the vet to explain and if necessary get a taxi there... you can try to get some high-carb food into him and have honey handy, etc but if he's difficult to test and you're not confident about doing so, it sounds as if you may have no idea how low he's going and what the best course of action is. As you realise, 1.5u of Caninsulin is enough on a bg of 5.5 to cause hypo and it's always better to be safe than sorry.

    Just finished typing the above and seen Bron's reassuring message - but the worry is IF you are able to test. You didn't sound very confident about that but do you think you can? If so, great - if not, I'd take my cat to the vet...
     
  4. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Yes, what you say makes sense Diana.........especially is she isn't confident testing.
    A very good idea to ring the vet
     
  5. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Hi Bron,

    I will take his BSL soon, at +1 and I will test hourly after as well. Just hoping he will let me do it.

    On Saturday his AMPS was 8.1 and after thorough consideration and talking to his vet, we gave his normal shot and he dropped at 3.6 at +5 and he didn't show any signs of hypo, he was just laying/sleeping in his basket as normal. I'm fearing it might drop even lower today :(

    Thank you for being here for us!

    Georgiana
     
  6. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Yes I saw that on the SS.
    I was concerned you didn't test again after the drop to 3.6. Always test again when you get a low number to check it is not droppping further and is rising. Also give some High Carb food with a low number like that.
    Diana has made a very good point.....if you can't test, you would be wise to go to the vet so that they can monitor him.
    Let's see how you go with the +1and what it is.
    Areyou going to be around. @Diana&Tom
     
  7. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    I've tested him on my own before and I've managed with no issues. But the last few days he's been more finicky.

    His vet is closed for another hour. There is his old vet that I could take him to now, but I don't trust them anymore and their methods are a bit barbaric imo.
     
  8. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

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    Georgiana, if you really think you can manage a few tests this morning, fine - Bron said she may be around (I won't be for much longer - 8am UK time and I have to go to work). But do think about this - if he dropped to 3.6 after an AMPS of 8.5, he could go lower on an AMPS of 5.5 and you really don't want him going lower than the 3.6. I don't want to alarm you - on the contrary, I want you to stay calm - but it wouldn't be good advice if I said ok just see what you can do and let's hope he'll be fine... of course, we hope he will be, but this is worrying territory so we can only say it as it is.

    Maybe get another test in at +1 and see what's happening then - by that time the vet should be open and you can make a decision about what you feel is best.

    All paws crossed...
     
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  9. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    His +1 is 8.1
     
  10. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    That rise could be from the high carb treats you gave when you found out.
    I would give a teaspoon of your higher carb food now to build up the BSL for the onset of the caninsulin and test again in 1 hour.
    What do you think @Diana&Tom ?
     
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  11. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

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    Yes. The treats are probably very high-carb so you're probably seeing a food spike. A little high-carb food now would be better for the reason Bron says. Caninsulin can take effect very fast and drop very quickly so it's important to stay on top of this and be prepared.
    For future reference, you should never really give Caninsulin on a bg lower than 11. An experienced caregiver who has been doing this for a while and knows how their cat typically responds might do so, but when you're starting out you should be wary.
     
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  12. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Hi Diana,

    I just did a +1, it was pretty straight forward. He's very finicky for his PMPS as he's hungry, but now that he's been fed and he's just chilling, it was easy.

    I really appreciate you saying it as it is, I understand the severity of the situation and wouldn't like anyone to sugar coat it for me.

    I will keep an eye on him and continue to test. If he drops, we will go to the vet.

    Boyfriend will be told off massively when he comes back home. He had the best intentions, Valentine's Day and all he thought he'd let me sleep a little bit more as I've been feeling unwell yesterday. But he messed up big time :mad:
     
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  13. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    @Diana&Tom
    I am not a caninsulin user. Do you think it would be a good idea to get a +1.5 to catch the beginning of the drop?
     
  14. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

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    OK great, I feel happier now to hear you're ok with testing, you did sound panicky in your first post! Keep a very close eye and if at all worried ring the vet.
     
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  15. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

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    It depends... all those treats may be helping, and TBH I don't have time to keep referring to the ss to see previous responses... I think see what +2 is and if that shows a big drop, take more action which might include more food, honey, vet call...
     
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  16. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Diana.......I know you are getting ready for work!
     
  17. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    @Bron and Sheba I did give him some high carb and he ate it happily.

    @Diana&Tom I have been told by the vet that it is safe to give him at 8.1 if we are home and able to keep an eye on him. We wouldn't have done it on a week day. We've also been told that if his BSL are low, to give 0.5 units rather than nothing. But honestly, I think we need a different insulin. It's been one month since diagnosis and we're getting nowhere... We have a scheduled vet app next Tuesday and we were supposed to discuss a change.

    Thank you both for being here for us:bighug:
     
  18. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

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    Hmmm I don't think it's good advice to say it's ok to give a shot of C on a bg of 8. And to give .5u if bg is low - what's "low"? Too vague. Have you read the beginners guide some of us here put together? It might be helpful. And yes a different insulin may well be better. A month isn't that long in the scheme of things but C is really made for dogs who have a different metabolism and many owners here find their cat does better on something else.
     
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  19. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    I have read the beginners guide, even have it printed for easier reference. However, in the heat of the moment, we (stupidly) still went with the vet's advice. We called his vet here in UK and even the vet back home that was seeing him years before we moved to the UK. They said the same thing so we went with their advice and we got lucky that one time as in he was okay at the end of the day.

    But after seeing that lime green on his SS, I said that's it, no more insulin below 11. However, my boyfriend, although he loves Perlutz nearly as much as I do, has done this stupid thing today...

    His BSL are all over the show, and the more I read, the more I don't understand why we have been given Caninsulin in the first place! We haven't been told there are others, explained how others work, nothing! We've been sent home with Caninsulin and Hill W/D :facepalm: Last vet visit (different vet from disgnosis), nearly 2 weeks ago, we agreed on trying Canisulin for 2 more weeks, do a curve this coming Sunday and then discuss options at the next app on Tuesday. Really hoping we will be given a different one.
     
  20. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

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    Sigh... vets all over the world don't seem to get much training in FD so go by old school ideas that aren't always the best. You may be lucky and get a more clued-up one but they're hard to find.
    I suggest getting a coloured marker pen and using it to highlight the areas of the beginners guide that you want to remember, then you have a quick reference.
    As for hoping you will be given a different insulin, you may well have to be pro active and ask outright for another one. Show the vet your ss and say look, numbers are all over the place, it can't be good for my cat, I'd like to try another one. TBH if you've been reading here for a while you probably know more about FD than your vet anyway.

    @Bron and Sheba if you could stick around for a bit that would be great, I really have to go now but will check in again later.
     
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  21. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Looking at the SS I would like to make a few comments.
    Are you able to get a +2 after the preshots to see if it is going to be an active cycle.? I know you work but getting a +2 will give you a heads up as to what might be going to happen and you can leave some higher carb food out, if necessary
    Also getting a before bed test is a good idea as cats often drop lower at night.
    When you get a low number always test again to see that the BSL is rising.
    68 (3.7) on the Alphatrak is the take action number, meaning you need to give some higher carb food to raise the BSL.
    Use your remarks column to write in what you have fed and if you are giving any higher carb food.
    Prozinc and Lantus are both good insulins which are available in the U.K.
    Diana has given you good advice about using Caninsulin.
    Yes, Diana I will stick around......8 pm Thursday night here in Australia. Thanks for all your help:bighug:
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
  22. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Must be almost time for a +2
     
  23. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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  24. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Just seeing 8.2 on the SS.
    I would give another heaped teaspoon of high carb food to Perlutz now
     
  25. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    We have been doing some +2 or +3 in the evening, but not in the morning Monday-Friday (I had to go to work earlier than usual last 2 weeks). I could do +1 in the morning from now on on most mornings, but a +2 might be tricky to manage with work.
     
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  26. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Did you give some more high carb food?
     
  27. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Yes, 8.2... Will do a +3 in about 30 min. He is okay at the moment, just quiet, in his basket. Will give him some more high carb food, hopefully he'll eat some more.

    Thanks for staying with us Bron!
     
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  28. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Don't give him too much food as we may need to feed him later and we don't want him to get full, but we want to keep ahead of him dropping too much as well.
    You are doing well.
     
  29. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    He was happily eating some more but I did take it away after he had about a tbsp. Just like you said, he might be too full or just lose interest later.

    He's grooming himself now, still sitting in his basket under the heater. Seems alright, but I'm worried for later on :(

    Since I will be home today, I will update his speadsheet with what he ate. I do have notes for what he ate and how much water he drank, how he was feeling etc. I just kept these on a little notebook.

    I did enquire about ProZinc during last 2 vet visits but I didn't argue with his decision to continue on Caninsulin for 2 more weeks. Inside me I was screaming "no, give us something else" but I didn't say anything out of fear he will think I'm being a smart ass or suggesting I know better than him etc. so I kept quiet...
     
  30. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    If we keep testing and feeding him some higher carb food, hopefully we will be able to control the curve...or drop.
    We still have honey to add if needed.
    If you write the notes in the SS we can see them. When we help someone we always look at the SS and the notes as it helps us get information.
    Is he usually good eater?
    Keep persisting with the vet...they can be frustrating not wanting to change the insulin......but Prozinc or Lantus are both longer acting gentler insulins and most cats do very well on them. The RVC in the U.K. Said that they were the two insulins which gave the best results for cats going into remission. ......tell the vet that. Here is the link to the paper....but dont get caught up reading it and forget the +3;)
    http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...the-uk-about-their-remission-research.206096/
     
  31. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    I see 6.5 (117) on the SS. Still a safe number.. I would give another teaspoon of high carb again now and test again at 3.5 to see if it's dropping further. Can you post when you have fed please Georgiana?
     
  32. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    He is starting to drop, his +3 was 6.5. Gave him 1 treat after testing, high carb treat (he's not touching the low carb Thrive or Cosma treats). He is getting a little annoyed with me pricking his ears...

    He has his appetite back the past 2 weeks, eating very well. He had 2 weeks before though when it was hard to get him to eat, some days we'd have to change the flavour 2-3 times before he'd eat anything. But now he's okay.

    The vet we're seeing now is not the same who gave us the Caninsulin. He was fully booked and I knew there was definitely something wrong after 4 days of drinking a lot of water so I took Perlutz somewhere else, considered the other good vet in town, not wanting to wait few more days. So the one we're seeing now said if he was the one diagnosing Perlutz, he would have given us a choice between ProZinc and Caninsulin as some people cannot afford ProZinc. I did bring up the fact that RVC recommends Caninsulin should not be given to newly diagnosed and he seemed to agree. So I was surprised when he asked to stay on Caninsulin for 2 more weeks and see how it goes.

    Will definitely stress that we wish to change insulins during our next appointment. Hopefully he will be fully on board after seeing Perlutz's SS.
     
  33. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Georgiana have you fed him some more HC food? I need you to get back to me each time you post the BSL and I answer so I know where we are please. Thanks:)
    Did you see the suggestion to test @3.5?
     
  34. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Sorry, it seems my internet is sluggish today. Yes, have seen your suggestion. I have just given him a bit more food, he ate it. Will test again in 5 min at +3.5. We have an office building next to us and they’re having a noisy fire evacuation :banghead: hoping he won’t be too agitated because of the noise...

    Again, thank you so much for walking me through all of this Bron!
     
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  35. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    I’m very happy to help. :)Waiting to hear back and not knowing if someone has seen the message can be worrying. Just press the like button then I know you have seen it.
    Hope the fire next door is ok.
    Can you post the BSLs on here as well as the SS please?
     
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  36. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Just tested again at +3.5 and it dropped to 5.8. I'm not sure how to post +3.5 in the SS?
     
  37. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Don’t worry about the SS at the moment.
    Can you mix a drop of honey in with a teaspoon of High carb and see if he’ll eat it please?
     
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  38. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    And the fire evacuation was just a drill, they're all back in now:) Phew!
     
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  39. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Yes, will do that. Like a pea sized honey drop? Will that be enough?
     
  40. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Yes just a drop this time
     
  41. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Gave him exactly as you said. He ate more than half of what I've given. Licked all the sauce though, so he got most if not all of the honey.

    I think I'm starting to get panicky...

    Will test again at +4 in few minutes.
     
  42. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    He’s still in safe numbers so try not to worry. We are testing often and so far managing well. We have to expect some drop in the numbers.
    Post as soon as you get the +4
    You are doing really well :bighug:
     
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  43. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    He's out of his basket, currently at the water bowl. Might be a tricky one for the +4.
     
  44. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Give him a small treat as you test.
     
  45. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Hi +4 went a bit up again at 6.4
     
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  46. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Well done getting the +4
    We might leave off giving food this time but test again at +4.5.
    How does that sound?
    Do you still have plenty of test strips?
     
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  47. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Yes, we're good for strips and lancets.

    Will test again at 4.5.

    Thank you :cat:
     
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  48. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    See you at +4.5:)
     
  49. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

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    Just popping in briefly and pleased to see you two doing well! All those treats are doing their job! Just shows how much they can affect bg - if they can counteract insulin given on such a low amps, they are definitely only to be used for such purposes and not too much at other times when the goal is to keep bg down!
     
  50. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    @Diana&Tom thanks for looking in on us. Georgina is doing well managing this and Perlutz is cooperating!
     
  51. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Did you get the +4.5?
     
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  52. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Thank you for checking on us Diana :bighug: Those treats are from before diagnostic and he sometimes gets one after testing, but not all the time. Still trying to find some low carb treats that he will have :bookworm: .

    @Bron and Sheba @Diana&Tom Thank you both for your kind words and trust, however, I failed miserably at taking a +4.5. He's been good, not happy about it and trying to hide his ears from me slightly :( but there was nothing coming out, even after "squeezing". I will give him a rest and just do a +5, which is soon otherwise I fear he might not be cooperating at all.
     
  53. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Ok. Go for the +5
    Have you tried warming the ear with some rice in a sock warmed in the microwave for just a few seconds. Test before use and hold on the ear for a minute to warm it.
     
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  54. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    He is in his basket under the heater so the ears are very warm! Going for +5 in few min, gonna give him a brush and cuddle before.
     
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  55. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    We struggled but managed a +5 and it’s 8.3
     
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  56. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Well done!!
    That is a good result!
    So no more feeding but I think you need to get a +6 to make sure he is rising on his own and it is still not the HC food talking.
    Are you happy to do that?
    Give Perlutz a big cuddle from me and tell him I think he has been super today!
    And give yourself a pat on the back too! You did very well in a stressful situation. Don't be too hard on your bf.....
    Can you have a look at what I have written below ........is that a true account of the food given?

    Ok so this is what has happened up until now. Using alphatrack meter.
    +12 preshot 5.2 (94) 1.5 units Caninsulin given
    +1 8.1 (146) given 1 teaspoon high carb
    +2 8.2. (148) given 1 teaspoon high carb
    +3 6.5. (117) given 1 teaspoon H.C
    +3.5 5.8. (104) given 1 teaspoon HC and small drop honey
    +4 6.4. (115) not fed
    + 5 8.3 not fed
    Getting a +6 to see that Perlutz is on the rise on his own and it is not the food which is still influencing the numbers.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
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  57. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Georgiana I am going to ask @Bobbie And Bubba if she can check in an hour to see what the +6 is. It is getting pretty late here in Aus. It has been lovely getting to know you today........I hope you manage to get the insulin changed over soon
    Have you thought of getting an auto feeder for Perlutz so you can leave food out for him which opens at set times? Do you think he would use it? All the best with Perlutz...he is a gorgeous boy.
    Bron
     
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  58. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    I'm relieved to see 8.3 and I will definitely do a +6 as well. I will test as long as I have to, I need to know we're out of the woods. Perlutz has been a super brave lil boy today! His daddy will have a lot of making up to do!

    +12 preshot 5.5 (99) 1.5 units Caninsulin given
    panicked and fed 5-10 high carb treats
    +1 8.1 (146) given 1 teaspoon high carb
    it was more than a teaspoon, I'd say at least a tablespoon
    +2 8.2. (148) given 1 teaspoon high carb
    +3 6.5. (117) given 1 teaspoon H.C
    +3.5 5.8. (104) given 1 teaspoon HC and small drop honey
    +4 6.4. (115) not fed
    + 5 8.3 not fed
    he got 1 treat after each testing plus 2 treats while trying for a +4.5
     
  59. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    I noticed you have AMPS AS 5.2 in the SS but 5.5 in the thread here
     
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  60. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Thank you SO MUCH for everything Bron!

    We do have an automatic feeder but he's never really been eating out of it while we're out at work. I don't think it's because he doesn't like it, it seems he just can't be arsed to :D prefers to sleep all day. I do come home at 13:00 on my lunch break to give him a bit of food on most days. I have some questions about feeding him as well, food, time etc but I'll create a new thread for that. I did ask the vet, but got the standard RC or Hills recommendations :banghead: from 3 vets!

    Good night! :bighug:
     
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  61. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Ok so if the treats were HC, the +5 was probably food influenced so definitely get a +6 and if you are at all concerned get a +7
    Bobbie is very experienced and will help you.....hoping she sees the tag.
    I'll call in tomorrow and tell you how to do the 1/2 hours in the SS
     
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  62. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

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    Gosh, yes, you're right! I double checked on the meter and it was indeed 5.2. I was in full blown panic mode when I created the thread :facepalm:
     
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  63. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Can you test when you come home at 1 pm? That would be a valuable test.
    I'll stick around until someone can take over. We always try and get someone to take over
     
  64. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

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    Ok :D just change the number on the thread. To do that just hit the edit button then save afterwards
     
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  65. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    I can do some testing at 13 ish from now on. After all the practice I got today, I shouldn't have any issues :cool: And to think I used to feel sick at the sight of blood lol

    I'll do a +6 in few min!

    Oh and I corrected to 5.2 in my original post.
     
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  66. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    +6 done and it was 10.6
     
  67. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2015
    Something happened to the site and it has been down for a while....
    +6 10.6 (191)
    I think he should be ok now.
    You might like to get a test in a couple of hours to see what he is doing, but I don't think he should drop again now.
    He might bounce after that low preshot this morning, so don't worry if he goes up high.
    See you tomorrow. I'm off to bed!
    Hope you enjoy the rest of Valentines Day :)
     
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  68. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    I will test again in 2 hours :)

    Again, thank you so much for all your help! Sorry to have kept you up so long :( Good night! :bighug:
     
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  69. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2009
    Popping in again and it does look as if all will be well, although I agree with Bron, it won't hurt to carry on testing when you can just to be sure there isn't a sudden drop. I'm very glad that you were aware of the potemtial problem straightaway this morning, as if you hadn't been, we could be looking at a different scenario. And looking on the positive side, this is unlikely to happen again - or if it does, you'll have had practise dealing with it and will know exactly what to do.

    Moving forward, there is definitely a case to insist on another insulin. Your poor kitty's numbers are so up and down. This may be partly due to how he responds to the insulin on any given day; any other factors such as stress, infection, etc; but also he may be producing some insulin himself - when you see an unexpectedly low number that is always a possibility (but then so is unexpected longer than usual duration from the last shot, so it's not always possible to say!)

    Do keep your ss updated so we can see how the day has panned out, and of course carry on posting with any more queries/updates. Good luck!
     
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  70. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2015
    What a morning! And a good catch on your part. It looks like things are under control right now. :bighug:
     
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  71. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    Hi Diana, so sweet of you to come and check on us, thank you!

    I've just done a +6 and it came up at 15.8 so we are lucky to be out of the woods, phew! But yes, I need to practice my speech for Tuesday at the vet and be adamant on a new insulin!

    Do you know of anything I can put on his years? I feel like they've been quite abused today, I had few fails with no blood coming out on top of everything :facepalm:
    I've only ever seen the USA Neosporin but it's not available for us in UK :(

    Hope you have a nice day! :bighug:
     
  72. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2015
    Do you have an triple antibiotic cream with pain reliever? Or calendula gel? I like the calendula gel best.
     
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  73. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    Yes, what a day! I'm so happy Perlutz put up with everything and that he's safe now, such a relief! :cat:
     
  74. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    I don't have any cream with antibiotic and I don't think I can buy any OTC in UK :( I'll run to the shops later for some Calendula gel, I hope he'll be ok with it. :)
     
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  75. Diana&Tom

    Diana&Tom Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2009
    Not sure how easy it is to get this OTC but Amazon will probably have it.
     
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  76. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2015
    Hi Georgiana, good morning.... well morning for me!
    Have just been looking at your SS.
    Can you add in the remarks column that you fed high carb food for the hours that you did in the AM cycle please. It is good to have a record of what you did on that cycle for you and others to see.
    To add the 1/2 hour reading you did, you go to the square it goes in and add after the hour number what it was. For example add in the +3 column .... 5.8@3.5
    You will then need to go over to the US page and manually change the numbers in that square as it won’t do it itself once anything other than a number is added. Does that make sense.?
    Also on the 9th Feb Perlutz dropped to 36 and that earned him a reduction which you obviously didn’t realise you needed to take. So his new dose should have been 1.25 units which you will have to eyeball on the syringe. He could well be dropping low on many of the cycles and you wouldn’t know as there are no tests.
    I am going to tag @Kris & Teasel as she is experiencing in caninsulin and see what she thinks.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2019
    Reason for edit: corrected auto correct
  77. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    I recommend dropping the dose to 1.25 u, especially after all the recent drama. Ideally you want a bit more of a safety cushion at nadir with Caninsulin because of its strong action. Your goal should be nadirs in the 5 to 6 mmol/L range, no lower. The inflated PSs suggest he might be dropping too low for comfort overnight or on days where you don't have test data.
     
  78. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    Hi Bron,

    I've just added some more data to the SS (yesterday both Perlutz and I were so exhausted that we took a well deserved afternoon nap cuddling on the sofa).
    Also added the +3.5 in both world and US tabs.

    The reduction you say he earned on 9th of Feb...do you mean a reduction in the PM shoot only or all the time? Upon diagnosis, he was put on 2 units but we've decided to lower this to 1.5 on 5th Feb and his 2nd vet approved and said it's what he would've recommended too.

    I don't want to sound like a broken record, but again, thank you for all your help!!
     
  79. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2015
    Very happy to help. :)
    The reduction that @Kris & Teasel and I both recommended was for you to take now and continue with the reduction until
    Perlutz either earns another reduction or needs an increase.
    A cat earns a reduction when they drop under 3.7 (68) when you are using the alphatrak meter. So with your next dose reduce the dose to 1.25 units.
    If you keep it at the current dose you risk Perlutz having a hypo. Don’t wait to reduce, do it at the next shot.
    Were you able to get home at lunch to check the bsl?
    Keep asking questions.
     
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  80. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    Hi Kris,

    We have a vet appointment on Tuesday and we're thinking to push for ProZinc as Caninsulin doesn't seem to help :( Do you think we should still change to 1.25 until then? If so, we'll have to really eyeball this as our syringes don't have half units marks and nowhere to buy them offline.

    EDIT: @Bron and Sheba already answered this, we're going to lower to 1.25 as of today's PM shoot.
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2019
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  81. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    Noted, we'll lower to 1.25 from tonight then! You mentioned that he might earn an increase...when would that be?

    It's 11:20 AM here, will do a test soon.

    He's been drinking more water again since Wednesday and yesterday and today he has been just lying around the water bowl sometimes. Not drinking, but sitting next to it and it worries me. He has been so much livelier last week and this week he's like...down:(
     
  82. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2015
    Cats can earn an increase if they stay continually in higher numbers without dropping into any green numbers. Once you change over to Prozinc I would recommend you start posting over on the Prozinc page and start one of the protocols. There are experienced Prozinc users over there who will help you very step if the way.
    Have you ever tested for ketones or has the vet mentioned them? FD cats can be prone to them especially when they are in high numbers. I would buy a bottle of Ketostix from the pharmacy and test Perlutz ‘s urine. It is a simple test and good to rule out ketones .......ketones can lead on to an illness called DKA which is very serious. But if caught early can be sorted out. I’m not saying Perlutz has them but it is a good idea for all unregulated cats to be tested a couple of times a week.
    Not sure why he is drinking more. He is in high numbers for a good part of the day and that will make him pee more and want to drink more.
    Am glad you are going to ask to swap insulins on Tuesday.
     
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  83. Bron and Sheba

    Bron and Sheba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2015
    I see 17.4 (313) at +5. Looks like he is still bouncing from the low Preshot yesterday am.
     
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  84. Georgiana & Perlutz

    Georgiana & Perlutz Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2019
    Well the 1st vet didn't mention testing for ketones but I've read about it here so I am sort of testing for ketones. I am saying sort of because I haven't managed to get a proper pee sample so I'm just dunking the stick in the litter box after he has a wee and so far we've had negative results. I did mention this to the 2nd vet and he said although not ideal, it's best to test like this than not test at all. Also have the Diastix but not using them much as we are testing with the meter.

    He is drinking more again but there's not much action in the litter box, doesn't pee that much. I will change his litter box again later today just to have a better idea and maybe try again with the foil, maybe I can get a proper sample.
     
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