New with dx today..

Hello all! I have 5 indoor cats & one of them was dx diabetic today :sad: His BG came back at 426 & his only symptoms were weight loss & increased water intake so I hope we caught it early. Itty Bitty is 12yo & even though I feed both he's always been partial to dry. However he has recently taken to can but after much research it looks like all the dry will be on it's way out. This is all so overwhelming! The vet convinced me to leave him there for 4 days to try to get him regulated but I'm kinda starting to regret it. They asked I bring in a urine sample so I had him locked up for 4hrs before vet appt (which ended in no sample) so I know he was super stressed which causes a huge spike in BG levels. I know it's hard to say but I really hope I can reverse this with diet changes, I have a needle phobia & can't imagine giving shots several times a day. I plan to call first thing in the morning to see how he handled the night but I really wanna bring him home. Hopefully he won't take the full 4 days & he can return early. I plan to buy a monitor for home as I could always use it on the other cats as well & it will help me better manage this but I'm really struggling on the diet change. I have no clue what direction to go in. I feed them Purina One dry & Friskies senior/special diet for can. The vet was trying to shove SD down my throat today but after researching it I see the friskies is far healthier as far as the carbs are concerned. I think I could do the raw but iffy on whether they will all eat it or not. I'm really leaning towards adding more meat in with the can & maybe adding some broth. What has everyone else used that made the biggest difference in BG levels? Thanks for listening to me ramble & I'm sure I'll have more ?'s when I learn more about his particular situation. Looking forward to getting to know you all!

Welcome! Congratulations on finding the best place in the world to get the answers and support you need in this stressful time. Everyone on this board has been in the exact spot you are standing.

You are on the right track regarding the food. Friskies pates are generally low in carbs. I'm not sure adding meat to the canned is a good idea for long term. You wouldn't want to alter the nutrient balance too much. I feed a home made raw mixed with a little canned. The home made is not just meat, I add a mix of supplements. Here is a link to instructions on making cat food.

In a few hours there will be many more folks online to welcome you and help with your questions. You will never be alone in this sugar dance.

Good morning and welcome to FDMB.

While a diagnosis of diabetes seems frightening and overwhelming, it is one of the easier diseases to manage in a cat. We can help you with learning to take care of your new sugar baby.

The Friskies Special Diet canned food is very good for diabetics. The only flavor that is high in carbs is the Chicken & Gravy. When my cat Witn was alive, she was fed the Friskies SD for years because she was both diabetic and had CRF. She live to the great old age of 19 and while on this food, both her glucose levels and kidney values remained stable.

Giving shots is much easier than you think. Your cat will not even realize that he received a shot. I also recommend that you learn to hometest. I realize that you have a phobia about needles, but it is not that difficult and is necessary for monitoring your baby's health. We can teach you how.

Let us know what insulin you are prescribed and the dose. Lantus, Levemir, PZI and Prozinc are your best choices. The first two are human insulins and if your vet prescribes them, ask for the script for the pens instead of the vials. It is more cost effective that way. You also want to start at a low dose, 1 unit twice a day. Unfortunately too many vets seem to think that insulin is prescribed by weight in cats and that is not true. By starting low and gradually increasing, you will be able to find the best dose that works for your cat.

Begin reading the info on this site, especially regarding diet, hometesting and insulin. Ask any questions you may have, we are here to help you.

Welcome!! Sounds like you are off to a great start!! I know it seems like so much to learn in the beginning but once you get the hang of it it just becomes routine.

You are on the right track with food - ditch the dry all together (for all your cats if possible but def for Itty Bitty) Like Lisa said the special diet is perfect but I think the senior ones are to high in carbs - most any food in gravy will be to high in carbs. The goal is to only use canned food with less than 10% carbs - although most people like to keep it under 8. Here is a link with lists of different foods and there carb content:

http://binkyspage.tripod.com/foodfaq.html

As far as whether your cat will be able to be controlled on food alone - there is a saying on the board you will hear alot ECID (every cat is different). In my case Harry is off insulin and a diet controlled diabetic. We got lucky and he was off insulin within a month - I think his pancreas just needed a reminder to work :smile: Even if Itty Bitty does need to stay on insulin - which lots of cats do- the needles are so thin your Itty Bitty probably won't even notice you are giving a shot. I think its harder on the human than on the kitty :lol:

Sounds like you vet wanted to keep him there to get some curves done (testing every 2 hours to see how the insulin affects him). Most people on this board don't bring there cats to the vet for this because its expensive and and most everyone on here home tests and the numbers from home testing are a better representative of what their numbers are - as you said your kitty is stressed at the vet as are most cats (some can have bg #'s that go up as much as 100 points at the vet). Keep in mind also that as soon as you switch Itty Bitty to an all canned diet her numbers will go down so you will need to change the insulin dose. Is Itty Bitty eating dry at the vet?

I know its alot to take in - even more so if your vet is telling you to do something different than the people here - which is what happened in my case. In my case I felt like I needed to decide who to listen to- her or the peole here - as her ideas and the boards were so different. I decided to listen to the boards advice and like I said Harry was off insulin within a month. I felt like the people on this board had more experience with diabetics than my vet - thats not to say I will not continue to see her but I just felt like she wasn't as knowledgeable as the people here.

Best of Luck!!!
Let us know what the vet said

Sharon

Oops just realized Itty Bitty is a boy and I was calling him a she...sorry

Thank you all for the warm welcome & all the info! This is all so overwhelming but it's really nice to have a place like this to come to so I'm feeling a lil better about it today. I called to check on him & they say today was his 1st day on insulin & he's responding well. They're just gonna play with dosage to regulate him & then we should be able to bring him home. it's gonna cost me around $300 if he stays all 4 days but I thought that was pretty reasonable. I'm not really sure what he's eating at the vet but I'm gonna guess & say dry. She seemed very knowledgable about diabetes & she did tell me it could change with just diet so she was honest about all possibilities however I don't think she's very bright about the food situation. She of course only pushes SD products but she made the comment that feeding my cats can was only making me feel better & not a necessity. Uh wrong! I do have 1 cat that didn't eat for 2 days when we tried to get her on dry for dental health so yes some cats will starve before they eat dry. As she says may only be 10 in the world that will but I definately have 1 of them. So for now I think I'll pull the dry & stick with friskies until I can try some other things before transitioning. I def think giving the shots is just gonna be harder on me than Bitty but I'll just have to suck it up. I'm gonna look later at which monitor I wanna go with & watch/read on the home testing. I really do feel that's the best way to manage all of this. For those of you who do home testing & your cat has been able to go otj how often do you test to keep an eye on it? I read somewhere they say once a week at 1st & then 2x a month when regulated but that doesn't seem like very much to me. Anyways thanks again I really appreciate everything!

Welcome to the family!

I have 13 cats, 11 non-diabetics, 2 diabetics of these two, one is OTJ and has been for over a year now, the other is insulin dependent. When Maxwell first went into remission I tested him for 2 weeks at what would be his normal shot times as well as random spot checks, then the following 2 weeks just at his normal shot times and now a year later he gets tested randomly twice a month, unless he seems off for some reason i.e. not eating as much, sleeping more, etc.

If your cats like Friskies Pate style wet food, just keep feeding that to them, 12 of mine eat that and it was the diet that got Maxwell to OTJ status, Musette (my insulin dependent) is the only exception she eats Fancy Feast as she is highly carb sensitive, and the Friskies tends to run a little higher in carbs.

Mel, Maxwell, Musette & The Fur Gang

Remember if you are going to feed wet but the vet has him on dry the dosage will be different. Any chance you could bring some of the canned you are going to feed to the vet so they can test him on that food. Some cats have been known to go down 100 points from the change from dry to wet.

Home testing is the way to go!! Alot of people on here use the walmart brand Relion meter and supplies(myself included) as the test strips (the most expensive part) are the cheapest but any meter that fits your budget will work.
I spent for the relion confirm meter $9, box of 100 lancets $3, box of 50 strips $20. When buying the lancets remember the higher the gauge number the thinner the needle - I use 30 gauge but alot of people use either 28 or 26, especially in the beginning. Bigger needle=bigger hole=more blood :smile: Whichever size you go with remember it doesn't hurt him but he may not like it in the beginning. You will also want to find a low carb treat you can give him as a reward for being a good boy at test time. I use Wellness pure delights but lots of people use the freeze dried chicken (Harry didn't like them)
When you have a kitty on insulin you need to test before shots and hopefully some other times around +6 (6 hours after shot) - the more tests you do the more info you get the better.
When Harry first went OTJ I tested at least 2x a day now it has been a few weeks and I only test once a day

Poopy and I welcome you and your Bitty to the best place you could be! cat_pet_icon

Poopy was just diagnose diabetic 12/17 so this is all still pretty new to us too. The folks here have been super helpful! And there's tons of great information previously shared, availabe for reading. My vet is not home testing friendly, nor wants me to feed Poopy anything other than what he recommends. Poopy has an appointment with a new vet tomorrow, who is open to home testing. We'll see how it goes.

My other cat, non-diabetic, didn't want to give up her dry food. Partly because I left it out 24/7. Now she eats when Poopy eats and it's the same canned food. It took her a couple of days but she finally figured out if she wanted to eat, canned it was going to be.

I'm one of those wussy people who faint at the sight of needles. I give Poopy his shots. It really is easy peasy. I don't concentrate on the needle, but in caring for my fuzzy love. It's amazing what we can do for our loved ones when they are counting on us. :smile:

I'm still trying to get proficient with the home testing. It's a hit and miss (no pun intended) process right now for us. But I do have faith it will get better. :smile:

Good luck with Bitty and keep us posted. :smile:

Welcome! As others have said, we have all gone through the stress/anxiety/overwhelming feelings initially. It'll lessen.

If your vet can get him regulated in only 4 days, I'd like to meet that vet...It usually takes awhile to determine dosing, etc...

Just remember to breathe...while dealing wi kitty...as well as needles. You'd be amazed at what you can do for one you love

Welcome from a fellow needle-phobe! My cat was diagnosed less than a month ago. I thought I would have to put him down due to my fear of needles. I disucssed that option with the vet but they wanted me to at least try. When we picked him up from the vet they explained how to give the insulin, handed me the syringe and said, "Here you go, give him his insulin". And so I did and what made it all possible was that Brody (the cat) didn't even blink an eye. He didn't even feel it. So yes, it is much worse for us. But since I know I am not hurting him but helping him it is no big deal. There are good videos on You Tube as well.

My vet was pushing the Hills food as well. But after discussing my concerns with them and asking about foods recommended on this board, she did some additional research for me. Now instead of Hills k/d wet and dry (kitty has bladder stone issues) he is on Wellness/EVO/Merricks stuff - all canned. He is doing great. His diabetes has had very little impact on our lives and Brody seems to be thriving on his new diet and insulin. You can do it and the folks here will help you.

what kind of insulin is your cat being given at the vet's?

i feed fancy feast classics - punkin used to have bladder infections regularly and he hasn't had a single one since his diagnosis and the switch to canned food. think of it this way - a cat's ideal food is a mouse. that's something more than 70% water. dry food? no comparison. now that i've learned about the benefits of canned food for cats overall, not just diabetic, i've managed to convince all of my friends to switch over. here's a great website regarding the food, written by a vet who volunteers to give advice here sometimes: http://www.catinfo.org

i don't know anyone else who left their cat for 4 days at a vet's to get regulated. that seems crazy to me. my vet gave me the prescription for Lantus, showed me how to give a shot, and sent us home.

also, as crazy as it is to trust people on the internet, many people have been advising here for years. everyone has or has had a diabetic cat - and we do it 24/7 all year around. if you have a question you can usually get an answer almost immediately here. the middle of the night you might have to wait a short time, but often someone's online to help. we're all volunteers, all paying it forward for what others taught us.

you may be able to get your cat diet controlled - there are no crystal balls and some cats do, some don't. the first thing to do is control the diet and start hometesting so you can see what's going on.

HOWEVER, if your vet has gotten to a dose of insulin based upon giving the cat dry food, and you switch to a low-carb canned food, the insulin dose will then be too high. so if that's the scenario with the vet, let us help you adjust it carefully. we don't want too much insulin.

and welcome! don't be overwhelmed - we'll help you learn it a step at a time. :YMHUG:

Thanks everyone! Per your suggestion I went out & got the meter, lancets, strips to start home testing. Need to read some more posts & watch the you tube videos on it so I can figure it out. Since the vet said he was responding well today & I bought all this stuff I think I'm gonna go ahead & bring him home tomorrow. They're charging me $7.50 every time they do a BG so if I can do it here now no sense in leaving him there. She just said her main concern was getting him under the renal threshhold of 200. Pretty sure with everyone's help here I can give him the same care here & it will be more accurate in his own environment/food. I got the dry pulled up now so we'll see if the other's miss it or not. They're all fatties & could use less carbs but most of them really focus on the can anyways. Bitty was the primary dry eater so he'll be the most effected but he'll just have to get over it :smile: I really wanna try this meter now to get the hang of it, would it be ok if I tried it on one of the others or would that be mean? Can you use different samples in the same machine? I'm not sure what insulin they have him on, is there one specific I should ask for? I noticed some said don't use the H one. Thanks again

First try it on yourself to make sure you can make it work. :mrgreen:

If you want to practice, sure why not try on the non diabetics? First you need something to heat the ear. You can make a rice sack out of a thin sock filled with raw rice and heat it in the microwave. Or you can put hot water in a prescription pill bottle and heat the ear.

Not only will testing at home give you a great sense of control but will save you piles of money. $7 for a test? Wow!

We like mild, long lasting insulins like Lantus, Levemir and ProZinc. They are the easiest to regulate with and offer the best chances for remission. Humulin and Vetsulin are harsher and harder to regulate with.

One of the best ways to test out a new meter is to test yourself. I also have 13 cats only two of which are diabetic...Everyone here gets tested at least once a month...lol. Just so I can make sure they are all still civies (what we call non-diabetics). In fact the way I learned to test was on my jet black cat Onyx, because I figured that if I could test him with all his black fur and long fluffy hair I could test anyone. As it turned out it was a good thing that I did learn to test on dark cat, because while Maxwell was my first adopted diabetic and he has very light white and orange ears, when Musette joined the family she is a blue-cream Himalayan and her ears are fairly dark grey, so learning on Onyx help me feel confident to test Musette.

So if you have one cat that is a real laid back go with the flow kind of cat then learn to test on him or her. That is why I chose Onyx, not only is he black but he is so mellow I knew he would put up with mom's inept first attempts.. :lol:

Mel, Maxwell, Musette & The Fur Gang

i tested myself first thing in the morning before i'd eaten. good information to know! the stab is a little bit shocking - i do my ring finger instead of one i use more.

we use neosporin ointment with pain relief at the end of the day to help punkin's ears heal overnight. we also use a thin slick of vaseline at the start of the day to keep the blood from soaking into the hair and skin after we've poked.

my vet charged $28 for me to bring punkin in for a BG test.

Ok well I did myself, worked great. On the other cat, not so much. I tried both ears & didn't get a lick of blood I'm gonna take it to the vet tomorrow & see if they'll show me where to do it. Hopefully I'm better at the shot thing cause I'm a lil discouraged about this testing. Was hoping to get beginners luck, lol.

It's the rare one who gets blood on the first try. We spent a weekend poking poor Oliver before we got a drop. Things that will help

Large enough lancet (25-27 gauge make a bigger hole than the standard 31 gauge people use)
Get the ear hot enough
Poke in the right area. The vein runs down the ear; you are aiming for the capillaries that run off the vein to the edge of the ear. Use a flashlight to see the ear before you poke. You can put small thin smear of Vaseline where you want to poke. The Vaseline helps the blood bead up.
Double poke to make the hole bigger
Put something behind the ear to poke against: folded kleenix, small make up sponge, the pill bottle
Angle the lancet instead of poking straight in

And the most important thing - treats! Every time you poke, he gets a treat - successful or not.

Don't get discouraged I think it took me about a week of poking poor Onyx before I got it right, luckily since I adopted both my diabetics I had the time to practice before actually getting my hands on a kitty that I HAD to know what their BGs were. Heating the ear until it is pretty warm was the key for us in the beginning, but their ears do learn to bleed. Now I think I could just about look at Musette's ear and it would bleed...lol. It does get easier and we have tons of tips and tricks to help you out.

The other thing that really helped me in the beginning was to take the cap off the lancet pen and just use it sort of free hand but with the pen as a handle and the spring loaded action to get it done quickly. That way I could see better where I was aiming but couldn't chicken out on the poke.

Eventually you will be able to test in your sleep, I know I have, there have been a couple times that the next morning I have to check the meter's memory to see if I actually tested her or just dreamed that I did.

Mel, Maxwell, Musette & The Fur Gang

Thanks guys! I called today & the vet said she's not willing to send him home as his BG is still running around 350. Hopefully tomorrow though! They said their giving him Prozinc so I'm assuming that's a good one. I told them I bought the meter & she said just bring it in, we'll show you how to use it. She seemed very happy & totally supportive that I was gonna be home testing so I feel a lot better about her caring for him. However I really wonder how much it would come down naturally on the can that he'll be eating at home, I know they have him on that w/d dry. She also said she loved Bitty so much she wouldn't mind keeping him. He is a great cat but no way would I ever give him away! :shock: I'm gonna try the meter again tonight & use some of your tricks. Wish me luck!

ProZinc is a mild, long lasting insulin that works well for many cats. Here is a huge document with lots of information on how to dose etc. Too big to read all at once but lots of good info:

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=59611

If your vet insists on wd dry, then you can agree to disagree. That's what I did with my vet and I still use her and like her. She wanted me to feed the prescription food; I fed Fancy Feast and got him into remission. The vet isn't there when you open the can. You could also take her this website by another FD specialist vet who advocates wet lo carb: http://www.catinfo.org

Welcome to FDMB
You are doing right by home testing and all the research on food
You are doing a great job!
just keep in mind when you bring him home, the BG will drop from not being at the vet'
and if you change foods he will probably go even lower, so just make sure to watch the dose
and collect as much info as you can
Come on over to the PZI board, we are here for you for anything you might need

We are hoping the vet will start her on a nice low dose of PZI. We like .5 or one unit 2X daily to start. You can always raise the dose as the numbers guide you. But if you start higher, sometimes you get a very low number and then have to guess how much to reduce.

He might want to start higher if the numbers he has gotten at his office are higher, but remember stress can raise bg levels. You want to dose based on the numbers at home. You can send him the numbers (or your spreadsheet) to get guidance but use your numbers.