11/5 Zener PMPS 366;2 206;3 144;4 118;5 86;+6.5 111 A Trak

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Anne & Zener GA

Anne & Zener GA

Member Since 2011
After "one of those nights", it's a bouncy Caturday. flip_cat
Yesterday
11/04/11 Zener Alpha Trak
AMPS 259, 3rd cycle @f0.75
+2 271
~5 184
+10 99, 4 pill pockets with 3 mg zobaline & 2.5mg pepcid ac
PMPS 207, 4th cycle @f0.75u
+2 86
+2.5 77
+2.8 88
+3.1 92
+3.8 83
+4.3 105
+5 101
+6 135
+7.3 202

Today
11/05/11 Zener Alpha Trak
AMPS 437, 5th cycle @0.75u, 1.55oz 8%
+2 384, 1.1oz 8%

Not surprised by the big bounce after last night's cycle and good fuds fest. We opted to keep shooting the f0.75u through the bounce and not take the reduction yet. My question is - last night, Zener earned a reduction dropping into the 70s on the alpha trak (40s on human meter) and we had to work pretty hard with HC and treats to keep him up. But, we have had a hard time with him holding reductions since we've been below 1u insulin. We've bounced up and down on the current dose a couple of times. Would love advice on when we should take the reduction this time - when it looks like bounce is breaking, or should we have him earn a reduction more than once before reducing the dose?

Also, I have a queestion about Zener's perisistent weight loss. We weight Zener every week since his diagnosis. Since his transition to wet food, he has a steady weekly loss averaging about 1 oz and today was no different - 12lbs 3.5oz, down 1.5oz from last week. He seems so much smaller than his 14+ lbs 8 months ago. Our vet told us several months ago 12 lbs would be a good weight for him, and we were shocked. Now he is almost there. His appetite has been a consistent issue and we use fortiflora, pepcid to help with his appy, we have not been able to increase his amount of food very much. Is this weight loss something we should be worried about and if so are there any options to increase his caloric intake?

We got about 3" of snow last night, so snow shoveling is the order of the day. The kitties are not volunteering. ;-)
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384 reduction? weight loss?A Trak

Hi Anne, Hope you get some dose advice on Zener. I know you are torn as to whether to reduce with Zener not holding the dose. Liz posted earlier in my condo, and I thought it was you and had asked about sledding and skiing. I guess not enough snow yet for those fun things. No advice on the weight issue, Maggie did lose a little weight transitioning to wet but now holds onto her weight okay.
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384 reduction? weight loss?A Trak

Thanks Ann, it helps to know how other kitties respond to the weight changes on wet food too. If Liz is posting she will sign Liz so as not be be confusing, maybe we need another system so it's clear who is writing what! :lol:

No immediate decisions are necessary yet about the reduction, so plenty of time to see what others have done.

We don't have enough snow in town for much other than shoveling driveways and sidewalks, but they got a foot about 15 minutes out of town up at our ski area. Paths are cleared in the backyard for kitties to get to their favorite spots. More snow in the forecast for Sun-Mon. Yahoo! :-D
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384 reduction? weight loss?A Trak

With reductions, you can wait until Zener drops three times below 80 before reducing if you're concerned about the reduction holding. I'd also shave the dose vs. taking a full 0.25u reduction the way you've been doing.

As far as weight, I'd see if you can find a higher calorie food that Zener will eat.
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384 reduction? weight loss?A Trak

I guess it was a good night for a pj party! Good job Zener! I don't have any advice on his weight.

Snow shoveling sympathy!
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384 reduction? weight loss?A Trak

Thanks for the info Sienne. I'll study the food charts a bit more and see if there is anything else that is higher calorie that we have not tried yet or haven't tried in a few months.

Thanks for stopping by Linda, it was quite the PJ party with entertainment provided by Mother Nature!
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393 A Trak

If Liz is posting she will sign Liz so as not be be confusing, maybe we need another system so it's clear who is writing what!
Click to expand...

:lol: :lol: It's clear; Maggie's sleepy Bean just doesn't see what's before her eyes! Good luck on the three 70's for a shave. I hope it will help with Zener holding the dosecreases.
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393 A Trak

binks is bringing a friend to help with the snow...

funny-pictures-cat-can-part-snow.jpg
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393 A Trak

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Two winters ago we had 144" and snow didn't melt until late spring. We had these sorts of paths in our yard for the kitties. We were in great shape from all the shoveling! Liz could stand on the piles of snow next to our house and get right up on the roof! The next year we got a snow blower. :-D
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393 A Trak

Good luck w/ shaving the dose, Tess always had a hard time holding and was put on the "3x" rule early too.

I worried for a long time about Tess's weight, but she has stabilize just under 8.5 lbs. and i finally accept that this is her ideal weight. FD cats gain weight from stored fat from cars they can't use, it slowly goes away as they can use more of their food. As long as the weight loss isn't too fast and the vet thinks 12lbs is where he should be, i wouldn't worry. If you are concerned and he won't eat more go for the higher kcal /oz foods. FF and Friskies are in the 25-32kcal/oz range, Wellness & EVO tends to be around 40 and Some of the Blue Buffalo is the highest. Unfortunately often that comes from more fat%.

I remember shoveling the roof when I lived in MN. We had a flat roof! Not pretty! One nice thing about CA, no snow shoveling and better yet, no ice dams on the roof!
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393 A Trak

Hi guys,
We were given the advice to raise a dose by .25, but when reducing the dose, to do it by skinnying. This maximizes the success rate. Good luck!
Sorry, no advice on the weight- loss problem. I assume that Zener has had the various blood tests and health profiles and that all of the serious causes of weight loss have been ruled out (e.g., Hyper Thyroidism). Stu lost a lot of weight in the spring and summer of 2010 and it turned out that he had Hyper T., among other things. We didn't know enough to have him tested.

If it's just a food issue, study the charts and find something with more calories!!

Enjoy your snow. We will be getting it soon and until then we want to enjoy what is left of the fall.

Ella & Rusty
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393 A Trak

Thanks so much Tess, this is great! :thumbup
I use the food charts religiously but get lost in the numbers sometimes. Right now fancy feast is what Zener will eat. I tried Blue Buffalo early, also Evo and Wellness, but not in quite sometime. Will have to give them another go now that he has transitioned to exclusively wet food. We try not to worry about his weight but we want to make sure we are giving him enough to eat. :roll:

Ice dams.....aaargghhh! We have a roof rake for our roof which fortunately is NOT flat. Though ice dams caused lots of damage to roofs here the winter we had 144". We were lucky and didn't have too much trouble, because Liz raked our roof regularly. Then, some winters we hardly get any snow, which is not good because fire season starts early! It's always something! :lol:
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393 A Trak

I skinny the dose also, or add drops if need be..Never knew there was such snow in Ariz!!
Wow already?? we had some here, but you got worse.
Hope Zen comes down from his bounce--Have a good evening--Hugs & Lub from us! :mrgreen:
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393 A Trak

Ella & Rusty & Stu(GA) said:
We were given the advice to raise a dose by .25, but when reducing the dose, to do it by skinnying. This maximizes the success rate. Good luck!
Click to expand...
We got that same advice for skinnying the decreases and have been doing that recently. We've used the increase by 0.25 most of the time, unless we were going back to a dose we had decreased for safety when I was traveling. It seems to be a better option for Zener.

Ella & Rusty & Stu(GA) said:
Sorry, no advice on the weight- loss problem. I assume that Zener has had the various blood tests and health profiles and that all of the serious causes of weight loss have been ruled out (e.g., Hyper Thyroidism). Stu lost a lot of weight in the spring and summer of 2010 and it turned out that he had Hyper T., among other things. We didn't know enough to have him tested.
Click to expand...
Thanks to finding FDMB, we've had those tests run and our vet rechecks them every 6 months. So far, all has been good with no Hyper T or other issues.

Ella & Rusty & Stu(GA) said:
If it's just a food issue, study the charts and find something with more calories!!
Click to expand...
It does seem to be a food issue, and partly it is lack of appetite and transitioning to wet food. We used to use cypro to stimulate his appetite, but after learning about pepcid here, we started dosing him with that daily and has gotten to where he eats 6-8 oz on a regular basis without any stimulant. It may be time to try a few different foods again!

Thank you!
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393 A Trak

Wow what a PURTY cycle last night!!!!! Glad you shot through the bounce today. I agree with Sienne that it's worth trying for him to go below 80 (AT) three times before you shave.

IMHO...like Ann...I think if he's at a good weight now, then I'd just keep track of it so that he's maintaining and not get too worried about feeding alot more calories. If he loses more, especially with the extra fud he gets when you manage his curve, then I'd rethink the food issue. But just cutting out dry will usually cause them to lose weight.

Have a great day...hope you aren't freezing like we are!!
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393 A Trak

Roni and Moonie said:
I skinny the dose also, or add drops if need be..Never knew there was such snow in Ariz!!
Wow already?? we had some here, but you got worse.
Click to expand...
It is amazing what one little drop (one more or one less) can do! We could hardly believe it until we saw how it worked for Zener. :shock:

We live at 7,000 feet in the high country of Arizona, about an hour from Grand Canyon National Park, so we get snow regularly in the winter. If you don't like the snow, all you have to do is drive down the hill about 30 minutes south where it's shorts and T-shirt weather. Course, those folks all come up here in the summer! ;-)

Thanks Roni!
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393 A Trak

Marjorie and Gracie said:
Wow what a PURTY cycle last night!!!!! Glad you shot through the bounce today. I agree with Sienne that it's worth trying for him to go below 80 (AT) three times before you shave.
Click to expand...
It was a lovely green and blue PJ party. I knew at +7 we would see a bounce today. We are going to try the 3x below 80 and see if this helps him hold the reductions. If he drops below 70 though, we may reduce anyway depending on how things look.

Marjorie and Gracie said:
IMHO...like Ann...I think if he's at a good weight now, then I'd just keep track of it so that he's maintaining and not get too worried about feeding alot more calories. If he loses more, especially with the extra fud he gets when you manage his curve, then I'd rethink the food issue. But just cutting out dry will usually cause them to lose weight.
Click to expand...
Our vet said pretty much the same thing when we got him on wet food and thought he would end up stabilizing around 12 lbs or a bit less. He's been as much as 15 lbs (maybe that's part of why he became diabetic) and we were advised by a previous vet to go on a reduced calories kibble which he ate for years, only lost about 1/2lb and then became diabetic. Hmmm....

We will follow yours and Ann's advice and chill out. We can study up on the charts again and look at a few other foods for possible trials.

Marjorie and Gracie said:
Have a great day...hope you aren't freezing like we are!!
Click to expand...
It's pretty chilly here and quite dramatic last night with all the wind, rain and snow. We've been so warm and had such a beautiful autumn we can't complain too much about our lower temps since it is November at 7000 feet!

The good news about your colder weather, it should slow down Mr RSnake or better yet, send him to hibernation land. ;-) Stay cuddled up with the furr kids and stay warm! :-D Thanks Marje!
 
Re: 11/5 Zener AMPS 437;+2 384;+5 393;+10 367 A Trak

Thanks to everyone who stopped by today and answered by never-ending questions! We appreciate all your support with our sugar dance. dancing_cat
Today
11/05/11 Zener Alpha Trak
AMPS 437, 5th cycle @0.75u, 1.55oz 8%
+2 384, 1.1oz 8%
+4 393, 0.4oz 11%, 1 pill pocket with 2.5mg pepcid ac
+7 0.35oz 9%
+9 3 pill pockets with 3 mg Zobaline
+10 367, FDCK with poke ;-)

It's been a trampoline day. :roll:
flip_cat flip_cat flip_cat
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366 A Trak

It's been a stinkus pinkus bounce day. :roll:
Today
11/05/11 Zener Alpha Trak
AMPS 437, 5th cycle @0.75u, 1.55oz 8%
+2 384, 1.1oz 8%
+4 393, 0.4oz 11%, 1 pill pocket with 2.5mg pepcid ac
+7 0.35oz 9%
+9 3 pill pockets with 3 mg Zobaline
+10 367, FDCK with poke
PMPS 366, 6th cycle @0.75u, 0.9oz 8%

Zener was pretty flat today. Funny how we don't seem his cycles flat much unless they are that unattractive pink color. ;-)
Zener did enjoy his break from pokefest city. Paws are crossed this bounce doesn't last too long.
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366 A Trak

Good evening!! I'm just getting around to condos tonight.

On the weight issue, I agree with the others. Tarragon was 15 pounds pre FD in his hey day. He was at around 8 lbs at diagnosis. When we switched to canned it was a struggle to get him to gain since he is only motivated by hard food. He has slowly slowly put on weight and is at 10.5 and stayed there. He looks good and eats fine so I have stopped worrying about adding more weight on. Maybe Zener is at a comfortable weight for him. T will only eat FF and you know how hard it is to find something they will eat so I am content with it.

144' of snow? Wow! We lived in SD for 4 years before we moved to Tulsa while DH got his PhD. It was brutal.

Have a wonderful night!!
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366;+2 206 A Trak

Hi Melissa, Zener is with you on the fancy feast. We feed him a mix of FF 5% with 11% purina pro plan, but when he drops like a rock, like he is doing this cycle, we give him the 11% and more, if necessary. That's interesting T was also 15lbs pre-diagnosis and is 10.5 now. Our vet said a range of 9-12 for Zener and we were freakin'! :o

So, we will take a chill pill about the weight and just keep monitoring as we have been. A lighter weight will make it easier for him to get around with his cerebellar hypoplasia as he ages, so there is a plus to the weight loss! We just want to make sure we are giving him enough to eat, funny beans! ;-)

Our weather is nowhere near as brutal as SD or even the midwest. It snows here, and then the sun comes out! We don't have terrible winds and gray skies for long. :-D Hope you and yours have a great weekend!
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366;+2 206 A Trak

Looks like Zener is busting this bounce after one cycle and is on the express train! I think I wrote this last night - "whoa nelly"! ohmygod_smile
Today
11/05/11 Zener Alpha Trak
AMPS 437, 5th cycle @0.75u, 1.55oz 8%
+2 384, 1.1oz 8%
+4 393, 0.4oz 11%, 1 pill pocket with 2.5mg pepcid ac
+7 0.35oz 9%
+9 3 pill pockets with 3 mg Zobaline
+10 367, FDCK with poke
PMPS 366, 6th cycle @0.75u, 0.9oz 8%
+1 0.45oz 8%
+2 206, 0.95oz 11%

Sure is some action jackson at +2. If so, this may be the shortest Zener bounce so far. He sure loved the good fuds and party last night, maybe so much, he wants to do it all over again. @-) Now, why was it I didn't take a nap today?

Will check again at +3 to see if we need to start selecting our party jammies for the night. ;-)
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366;+2 206 A Trak

:lol: :lol: :lol:
Sometimes when we pick him up, he feels like a different cat! Thanks for the big belly laugh. Laughter is such good medicine and you are Dr Humor of LL! :-D
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366;+2 206;+3 144 A Trak

Yep, the party is getting under way! Hope punkin can make it. We just gave Zener some 17% to try to slow this down. His bounces are definitely getting shorter, sure wish they would get lower.

Melissa: we get 144 INCHES of snow, not 144 feet (144'). :lol: :lol: :lol: The inches were enough.
Liz
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366;+2 206;+3 144 A Trak

fun condo here today - sorry I am so late in visiting.

I too ask Mannie to go below the 40 mark three times before educing, and I shave as well. He doesn't hold reductions well if we take the full .25. Good luck - and good luck with tonight. Zener is on a mission!
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366;+2 206;+3 144;+4 118 A Trak

Hi Michelle, thanks for stopping in - and the fun just won't stop here today. Come on down for the all night PJ party, punkin's on the way over. I recommend flannel PJs for tonight's party, or fleece - it's cold here and we had 6 inches of snow last night! :-D

We're going to give the three times is the charm method a try and see if we can't get the next reduction to stick when it happens. It seems at the small amounts of insulin we're on now, shaving is the way to go. We're sure glad it's the weekend for the night action we had last night and may tonight! :roll:
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366;+2 206;+3 144;+4 118 A Trak

It's time to put the BLUE kettle on! ~O) ~O) ~O)
PMPS 366, 6th cycle @f0.75u, 0.9oz 8%
+1 0.45oz 8%
+2 206, 0.95oz 11%
+3 144, 0.5oz 17%
+4 118, 2t. 14%
Zener is picking out his favorite party music for the Saturday night flannel party. dancing_cat
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366;+2 206;+3 144;+4 118;+5 86 A Trak

Zener's Saturday night PJ party is moving to the GREEN lagoon! :mrgreen:

PMPS 366, 6th cycle @f0.75u, 0.9oz 8%
+1 0.45oz 8%
+2 206, 0.95oz 11%
+3 144, 0.5oz 17%
+4 118, 2t. 14%
+5 86, 2t. 17%
+5.5 84, 1.5t 17%

Wow, from a bounce one cycle to green the next. :mrgreen: It's been a rainbow day. :shock:
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366;+2 206;+3 144;+4 118;+5 86 A Trak

i was just thinking he's sure traveled today! wowser!

hope you both get some sleep tonight. you do an awesome job taking care of him. zener is a lucky boy!
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366;+2 206;+3 144;+4 118;+5 86 A Trak

Thank you for the kind words Julie. Two nights of PJ parties are a little much, thank goodness it is the weekend and no work in the mornings. We keep paws crossed he will level out one of these days. :roll:
 
Re: 11/5 Zener PMPS 366;2 206;3 144;4 118;5 86;+6.5 111 A Tr

Looks like the PJ party is winding down here. @-)
PMPS 366, 6th cycle @f0.75u, 0.9oz 8%
+1 0.45oz 8%
+2 206, 0.95oz 11%
+3 144, 0.5oz 17%
+4 118, 2t. 14%
+5 86, 2t. 17%
+5.5 84, 1.5t 17%
+6.5 111, 1t. 14%

Leaving the green lagoon and heading to the blue bayou. This bean's heading to bed. Ni Ni LL! I-)
 
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