Low BG (85) at +2.5

Discussion in 'Prozinc / PZI' started by NoahFL, Jun 30, 2020.

  1. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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  2. Panic

    Panic Well-Known Member

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    I think Deb would say yes to the reduction tonight (let's see if I'm right!).

    Good job - keep up the LC every half hour till we get above 100, then stall 30 min.
     
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  3. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    Thank you. Wish I knew what his little pancreas was doing. This is so puzzling.
     
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  4. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    Down to 77 (40 mins later). Gave more LC FF
     
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  5. Panic

    Panic Well-Known Member

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    Good job, keep it up. Give him some HC if he drops below 68. Deb will have to tell me when a good time to introduce MC, I'm not too familiar with Alphatrak numbers, the rules are a little different.
     
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  6. Irish Pat

    Irish Pat Member

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    We are in the same boat today....I just gave Brady MC food to slow him down, now im going to try to let him ride out the greens for a little bit to see what happens later in the cycle, going to keep checking every so often to see how he is doing....good luck to you
     
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  7. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    Thanks! Same to you! These kitties really know how to shake us up.
     
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  8. Irish Pat

    Irish Pat Member

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    Amen to that!!!
     
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  9. Irish Pat

    Irish Pat Member

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    This is what Marje told me the other day when this happened to me....Just passing it on for information, obviously ECID so it may or may not apply to you...


    A few things to remember:
    • It takes about 30 mins after feeding to see a change to the BG so unless he’s in the 30s, I’d be careful about testing and feeding every 15 minutes or you will overdo the carbs and send him skyrocketing;
    • Once you stop a drop and he flattens, stick with LC and see if you can get him to “surf” green numbers
    • Look at where he is in the cycle and how much the drop is before you decide on carbs; often, mid to late cycle green numbers require less carbs than early in the cycle
    • He started out in pink and dropped to blue in three hours. That’s when I would have taken “action” (fed a good helping of LC) to try and keep him from dropping into the 60s and I definitely would have tested one hour after I got the blue number.
     
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  10. Shelley & Jess

    Shelley & Jess Member

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    Works for me too Pat - with Jess I always look at where we are in the cycle, the percentage of the drop and the momentum the drop has to help determine how hard I have to put on the breaks - LC/MC/HC.

    You're doing good Rebecca. You too Pat!!
     
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  11. Irish Pat

    Irish Pat Member

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    Thank you so much...im trying....
     
  12. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    We’re at 61, broke out the HC.
     
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  13. Irish Pat

    Irish Pat Member

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    Come on Max bounce up a little buddy!!!
     
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  14. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    Not going to lie. I’m getting nervous now. Never seen a light green before.
     
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  15. Shelley & Jess

    Shelley & Jess Member

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    Karo under 68
     
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  16. Shelley & Jess

    Shelley & Jess Member

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    Rub a few drops on the gums
     
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  17. Irish Pat

    Irish Pat Member

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    Deep breath you got this.....Come on Max
     
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  18. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    He more than willingly licked it off my finger. Check again in 30?
     
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  19. Shelley & Jess

    Shelley & Jess Member

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    Sooner - 15 to 20 minutes
     
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  20. Shelley & Jess

    Shelley & Jess Member

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    Did you feed HC too?
     
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  21. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    Yes
     
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  22. Shelley & Jess

    Shelley & Jess Member

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    That should be kicking in too.
     
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  23. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    This is the longest 20 mins. Thank goodness I’m teleworking due to COVID or this could have been bad.
     
  24. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    We’re at 91. Phew!
     
  25. Irish Pat

    Irish Pat Member

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    Thank goodness.....I got pulled away due to work, im at home too working......Glad everything is looking up
     
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  26. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    81 @ +5.75. Just gave him some baked chicken. Still acting normal, but hungry.
     
  27. Irish Pat

    Irish Pat Member

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    Looks like you made out pretty good....great job today!!
     
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  28. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    184 @ +8.75. Managed to catch him in the litter box so was able to do a couple tests. Still has a trace of ketones , but zero glucose in his urine. Haven’t seen that in almost a month!
     
  29. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    Thanks, you too! Between working from home and tending to a hypo kitty, it’s been quite the day!
     
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  30. Irish Pat

    Irish Pat Member

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    Thats awesome...Hopefully we both get some excellent results in the near future.....
     
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  31. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    @Deb & Wink , you missed a good party today. ;) I believe my guy definitely earned a dose reduction tonight. He’s 329 PMPS.
     
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  32. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

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    Yes, yes that is an automatic dose reduction, dropping below 90 mg/dL on the Prozinc SLGS dosing protocol.

    p.s. Max did it again!!!!!
     
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  33. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

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    Doesn't matter if the pre-shot is high. He EARNED that dose reduction down to 2.25U. Take it. Please. Let's keep Max safe.
     
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  34. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

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    When using an Alphatrak, I prefer to start the MC food if the BG is <80-90 mg/dL early in the cycle. If the LC food doesn't bring the number up > 80 at the next retest in 20 minutes, then you want to feed the MC food and to retest again in 20 minutes.

    WHEN that low happens is important. If you got that 80-90 later in the cycle, around +5 to +6, maybe a teaspoon of LC food would have done the trick.
    If you got a number <68 at mid-cycle, maybe a teaspoon of MC food would have been enough.
    Early in the cycle, <68, still dropping, bring out the HC food and have the simple sugar (karo, honey, corn syrup, etc.) standing by.

    It's all about "Know thy CAT" and how YOUR cat will react to the carb levels in the food.

    These are my opinions that I'm stating below. There is no hard and fast rule that talks about these numbers.

    Dropping <68 with an Alphatrak is like dropping <50 with a human meter. You need to monitor and bring those numbers up.
    Below 40 human meter, below 50 pet meter, you break out the karo syrup, no questions asked. And keep testing for at least 2 hours, and seeing rising numbers because those simple sugars wear off fast. If you are only feeding the gravy from the HC food, that wears off fast too, so you need to keep monitoring and feeding, until you see consistent rising numbers for at least 2 hours. Preferably until after nadir, as the insulin is still having an effect and may drop those BG levels again.

    With trace ketones, try that token dose, of 10-25% of the regular dose. You don't really want to skip if your cat has ketones.

    p.s. A DAYTIME pajama party?
    Cats pajamas 3.jpg
     
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  35. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    We got to 61 at +4, so I panicked a bit, but I think I handled it fine. This forum is so reassuring and got me through it. Hopefully we don’t have another party tonight. Even during his lowest point the only sign I saw was glassy eyes.
     
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  36. Panic

    Panic Well-Known Member

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    Thanks a bunch Deb, copied and stickied it onto my computer for future referencing! :)
     
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  37. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    When would you do this?
     
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  38. Deb & Wink

    Deb & Wink Well-Known Member

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    The token dose is for when Max is too low at pre-shot to give him his full dose, and stalling is not possible or does not show the BG levels rising up. By rising, I mean 20-25% or more. Right now, too low is <150 mg/dL. but that number can be lowered as you gain more experience.

    Max seems to drop pretty fast, at onset at +2, even when you are feeding him at +2. Could you feed him at +1, maybe a teaspoon of food or so? Let's see if that helps to slow down those fast drops.

    At <68, even a token dose would probably be too much, and you would need to delay the shot for 1-2 hours or more, retest, get rising numbers, and then shoot.

    It's the trace ketones that are worrisome. Will Max eat more food, if you give it to him?

    Extra food and extra water added to the food, help to keep those ketone levels lower. With the more food he won't be burning off fat and muscle which produce ketones as a toxic byproduct. With the more water (fluids), that helps to flush the ketones out of the blood, as the kidneys need to filter out more water, the ketones get filtered out too. Most times.

    So more food for Max for one.
     
  39. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    Max has no issues eating wet food, even before he was diabetic. I will give him more food. I will start with a tsp at +1 starting in the morning. Tonight I’ll do 1 tsp at +2. Will the extra food mess with his numbers? I’m trying to feed +1 and +5.
     
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  40. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    281 +2 , think it’s safe to say I can rest tonight after a day like today.
     
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  41. Shelley & Jess

    Shelley & Jess Member

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    You're only three weeks in and on a totally different ride than with your first diabetic kitty Callie. He's been bouncing and his body adjusting and you haven't had much time or a real chance to find out how Max responds to different time of day feedings and now different levels of carbs. He gave you a crash course on how to handle his lows this week - I think we all would have panicked more than a bit if we were in your shoes.
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2020
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  42. NoahFL

    NoahFL Member

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    Thank you! He is definitely giving me a crash course. He was 198 this morning (not bad). He’s eating right now then will give him his 2.25U. He got that deserved reduction last night. Hoping for a better day today.
     
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  43. Shelley & Jess

    Shelley & Jess Member

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    I'd say that's good! :cool:
    Me too! Max please behave for Mom today - no bouncing and no diving please :)
     
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