8/07 Butters PM+3 45/+3.3 49/+3.6 38/+4 61/+4.5 63/+5.5 43/+6 56/+6.5 56/+7 70/+7.5 45/+8 74/+8.7 99

Yesterday

Continuing a reduced dose of .75U, 2nd cycle this morning.

Have a lovely day/evening, all.

 

Good luck with the 0.75 units

 

Good luck with that new dose...I hope Butters breaks this bounce quickly.

Have a great day!

 

I hope Butters slides back down and surfs on the new dose.

 

Computer has not been working, I've been writing everything by hand and busy testing and talking to IT support .

I think I can finally take a small breather so here is what went down tonight (spoiler alert: it is Butters; she went down tonight big time):

PMPS 160
+2 was 72 Fed 2 tsp LC + 1 tsp MC (16%) gravy
+3 was 45 Fed 1 TBSP HC (26%) gravy + 1 drop of sugar syrup
+3.3 was 49 Fed 1 TBSP HC (26%) gravy + 1 drop of sugar syrup
+3.6 was 38 Fed 1 TBSP HC (26%) gravy + 1 huge drop of sugar syrup
+4 was 61 Fed Nothing
+4.5 was 63 Fed Nothing

I am working on updating her spreadsheet.

 

I know I gave way too much HC and sugar syrup. At +3 without my computer working I did not want to mess around, so the large amount of carbs was my attempt at aborting her cycle.

I would have expected her to have some immediate reaction to the HC and sugar syrup. She didn't.

We ended up veering off our normal insulin schedule yesterday PM by 45 minutes due to me stalling. Today's AM cycle, I moved back by 25 minutes, which I believe from what I read is fine to do within a full day. I then gave tonight's PM dose 12 hours later.

Could my action of moving her insulin back by 25 minutes this morning have caused this drop. Or is this my big mistake from yesterday (shooting a PMPS 49) coming back to haunt me.

 

I don't know what else to feed her to bring her back up!!! What am I doing wrong? Please help.

 

no hypo symptoms and not gone below 38. I am feeding gobs of carbs and almost no reaction?! What else can I do? I don't feel like I am in control

 

Hi!

I can't give advice, but I can stay with you until someone more experienced arrives.

Hang in there, you got this.

 

Thanks...I am just...I guess I keep shoving syrup into her? I have no idea why she isn't really reacting.

 

Are you still at +5.5? Did you feed again? Looks like you haven't fed since +3.6. I would be inclined personally to feed a MC snack with some gravy.

 

Do you have High Carb food...20% or better?

 

When dealing with low #s this is how the order goes. Carb them up...if using food re-test in 30 mins after carbing. If using Karo test 15-20 min after administration. Karo wears off quicker than food

 

Yes....I have been feeding a tonne, see below:

PMPS 160
+2 was 72 Fed 2 tsp LC + 1 tsp MC (16%) gravy
+3 was 45 Fed 1 TBSP HC (26%) gravy + 1 drop of sugar syrup
+3.3 was 49 Fed 1 TBSP HC (26%) gravy + 1 drop of sugar syrup
+3.6 was 38 Fed 1 TBSP HC (26%) gravy + 1 huge drop of sugar syrup
+4 was 61 Fed Nothing
+4.5 was 63 Fed Nothing

I am trying to monitor and feed her and update the spreadsheet at the same time. My computer has been down.

 

Ok I am going to feed 2 tsp MC and gravy. I thought I was supposed to keep her above 50. Do you think I shouldn't be so panicky with these numbers?

 

I would feed and then a test at +6. You are doing well! Time to come up little kitty!

 

As long as she's acting ok well keep carbing and testing until she comes up. Sry I just logged in and wasn't around to help

 

If you haven't noticed a good reaction from the carbs you can always increase the amount you give....just not over doing it, cause we want them to continue to eat. you can also add some karo to the MC/HC for an added kick

 

i fed 2 tsp MC and gravy. I'll take the 911 out of my title. You both seem so calm about this...I guess I didn't need to panic.

 

It's always scary when they are lower than we are used to and then we do our best to help them ride the wave You are present and monitoring... That's great!

 

I don't really know what Karo is but I have sugar syrup, which should have the same effect. It is pure sugar. I've been mixing it with the HC food I gave earlier!

 

Karo's the same thing basically. You're doing fine Lyla Great catch BTW

 

She just finished eating....+6 is in about 10 minutes, so that's when I test next?

Thank you both so much for coming here to help me.

 

Karo is the sugar syrup for diabetics. Sugar syrup, honey, etc. Are good too!

How long are we till +6?

How are you doing?

 

+6 in five minutes.

I'm doing okay! So thankful that you both generously came here to help me.

 

If you, Tanya, and you @Briere Fur Mom didn't show up, I'd be a mess.

@Briere Fur Mom apologies I do not know your name.

As soon as I get the test I will post.

 

K going back and reading...
you did everything you were suppose to.. carbed appropriately and tested. She just decided to take another dive after the rise you got(61 and 63). The carbs/sugar syrup wore off and down she went. Good thing you kept testing! WTG Mom!! My name is Mandy...I just don't tell everyone

 

She is 56 @+6. She went up a bit!

 

Do I wait 30 minutes and test @+6.5?

 

I won't tell anyone .

 

If it was me I'd bump her again with some LC/MC food...no sugar syrup this time. We want her a lil higher...not much though 60's is good. Her insulin she start to wane some after +6.
Butters earned another reduction with that 38. We typically don't like back to back reductions but this is the 3rd cycle since you reduced. If for some reason her reduction fails, you can always go back up.


ETA: Should have said...her insulin should start to wane not she insulin should start to wane

 

Ok I just put down 1 tsp LC and 1 tsp MC. She is eating it willingly, like she can't believe she gets more snacks.

 

How will I recognize if the reduction fails?

 

Yay, thanks for coming up a bit Butters!

My phone keeps freezing when I try to look at your SS to see where Nadir tends to happen for you. I would watch to see that Butters keeps rising once the food wears off (similar to earlier).

 

Her #s will trend back up after she clears her bounce if she has one.

 

I haven't really been able to figure it out. It seems to be a moving target?! I think she sometimes nadirs around +6. Depends on the day. She is very bouncy.

 

Her pattern has been a cycle of low numbers followed by a bounce that lasts 2 or 3 days. So I am never sure how to spot a failed reduction. She was low last night's cycle, then bounced high this morning...fastest she has ever cleared a bounce I think.

 

Maybe she's starting to get the hang of things. Her lil body isn't protesting as much to the more normal #s.

 

56 @ +6.5....I'll test again @+7. Should I feed more?

 

@thebigfuzz I didn't mean to jump in and take over or anythingYou've been on the board far longer than I. I saw post #9 and thought maybe y'all could use a bit of backup etc. Wasn't trying to step on any toes

 

She isn't rising yet...but holding steady. Is it ok to not feed and then to test again @+7?

 

I would love to have her a bit higher but let's see if she'll surf here since she's beyond +6 now
The other option would be to feed her some more and continue to test until she really rises and than not feed...you know

 

@thebigfuzz @Briere Fur Mom I am thankful that you are both here helping me.

@Briere Fur Mom I'm now remembering that you caught that I shot Butters when she was at 49 yesterday evening....thank you for catching that.

 

Not at all! Happy to have the company!!! We were not online for long back in 2012 (Elie went into remission fast) and we just returned in May, so I'm sure you know more than me

 

Def get the +7. Your choice on whether to feed or not. The only benefit of not bumping her again is you probably be able to stop testing sooner if she rises. Hope that made sense

 

I think it makes sense. Because I can't stop testing until I know if she is rising without using food?

She is due for her AMPS and insulin in about five hours...sleep seems to be in scarce supply around here.

 

Agree on the +7! We don't know yet if the rise is organic or just being offset by the snacks

 

And as I just read what I typed, @thebigfuzz @Briere Fur Mom you have spent so much time with me tonight already. I want you both to know I am feeling okay so you can feel okay to leave me if you need to.

 

What an exciting Friday night!!! pulling an all nighter

 

I'm good

 

Thank you Tanya and Mandy! It is really so comforting to have the support.

 

She is 70 @+7!

What do you recommend I do now? Do I need to stay up to get another test?

 

YAY!!! Woohoo. Get 1 more and if it's rising still off to bed for you

 

She's probably good but just to be safe make sure that 70 has no carb influence and the insulin is starting to wane

 

One more...so @+7.5 right? Ok!

 

Since Butters was so hard to bring up, next time try less gravy and more syrup.
Make notes of what you fed and put them in the Notes part of your SS. Always good to be able to refer to when figuring what works and when. Of course, cats do like to confuse us.

And a reduction in the a.m. to 0.5 units. Congrats.

 

Yay! Saturday is a great day for a nap LOL.

Thanks for having me and great job Lyla and Butters!

@Briere Fur Mom @Butters & Lyla have a fantastic evening! I have to work in the am, so hope you have a great night

 

Thank you so much @thebigfuzz !! So grateful. Hope you get a good night's sleep and have a great day tomorrow.

 

Looks like I'm learning who the night owls are.

Thanks Red. I will try more syrup next time. My SS is a hot mess for this cycle right now. I'll get it all fixed up with all the food info and everything tomorrow.

 

When you got that 70 @ +7, in theory we could have waited an hour, +8, to get the final test. But, since she's beyond +6 her somewhat nadir time and you really need to get to bed a +7.5 should work. Let's keep our paws crossed she's finished with the funny business!

 

I mean, I don't really need to go to bed. Like I'm super tired and feeling punch drunk...this is my second night in a row of this, though yesterday wasn't quite as intense. I don't have to work in the morning, though. Should I wait the full hour? No expectation for you to wait with me! You've done so much already.

 

I'm going to go get that +7.5...

 

I was going to reply to the other post that a +7.5 should be good enough. The +8 just gives you the benefit of more time w/o food to ensure the # is coming up on it's own w/o food.

 

She is 47 @+7.5....I don't have the words...

 

Can you re-check that # just to make sure. If you get a 40s again put sugar syrup on her gums and give her the HC food

 

I use a q-tip to rub the syrup on the gums. This isn't emergency measures so don't panic. I'm just tired of her games and really wanna force her up

 

Rechecked. Got another 47.

 

I will do that right now and then give some HC.

 

Ok she ate another 1 tbsp of HC, I spread syrup on her gums (and whiskers and my couch...everywhere) and I mixed a bit in with the LC.

 

You can use the syrup as Red recommended earlier....a very small amount of food(~1/2 tsp) and about 1/4 tsp of the syrup. Applying it directly to the gums generally results in a quicker # climb but also a quicker # drop

 

I wasn't that successful getting it all over her gums. But I am dipping a couple of freeze dried treats into it and she is eating those.

 

SHe has eaten LOTS of syrup. I'm waiting to do a +8....

 

Thank goodness you got that +7.5. If we would have waited til the +8 as I suggested she might of made her way back into the 30s again. Great job Lyla! Know thy cat

 

We are 74 @+8!

Could it even be possible for her to drop again at this point? How is the insulin not wearing off?

 

Every time I think I figure something out about her, she changes it up. At least I got this right!

 

Yay! I'm sure this is sugar/carb influenced though....as you know. I don't quite understand why were not seeing the insulin "wearing" off a bit. This was a bounce breaking cycle which is always very exciting. The only other thing I can think of would be a double dip. They dip for nadir than dip again before their next shot.

 

Mandy, it is almost coming on 2am for you and me! I feel like I have learned a tonne from both you and Tanya tonight...and Red jumping in with some tips on the syrup which surely helped get her up.

I am confident I can stay up and handle things from here...if you could guide me on how many more tests I need at this point? If she is higher than 74 @ +8.5, is that enough for me to go to sleep...or do I just give into the all nighter and keep testing? She gets her insulin in 3.5 hours! LOL.

 

Oh for clarity....I feel like you should get some sleep!

 

A Mod or another member with far more experience may be able to answer why this cycle was sooo dramatic.

Something to throw out there. I'm sure other have probably already mentioned dosing with calipers. The reason I began using calipers is because of the inaccuracy of insulin syringes. Out of a box of 100 syringes only 30 had correctly placed zero lines. Meaning I was giving inconsistent doses. I used my 16x jewelers loop to get a good look at the zero line marks. They were all over the place. Some were high and low and even slanted. Not trying to overwhelm you at all mind you.

 

I am putting this here more for posterity for this thread than anything else...but I definitely shot the correct dose of insulin. I triple check every dose and I always measure against a syringe I filled with coloured water that is at the right dose.

Am I even making sense anymore...lolol....I ahve no idea.

 

Funny enough, I had noticed that you have calipers in your signature. I have been trying the eyeball method and keeping a pre-filled syringe to compare against, but it is really hard to do.
Are calipers easy to use? Do you need any other special equipment or just digital calipers and a 16x jeweler's loop?

 

I wanna say she's good. But that's what i thought last time. Get one more...if you can in 30 min. If you can't you can always put MC food down and let her free feed which will somewhat "abort" the cycle.

I'm sure you can handle it from here as well. So, 1 more test in 30 if you can prop your eyes open or free feed(abort) until you need to pull her food prior to testing.

 

Will do! I can wait for sure. Thank you for everything tonight! There are no adequate words to tell you how much it means that you spent this time helping me.

I may reach out to you for more info on the calipers!

 

Digital calipers and that all most people use. I like to be super accurate so I bought a light board to illuminate the background.Makes seeing the lines easier. Already had the jewelers loop. Some peeps use magnifying glasses and other types products. Once you get the hang of using the calipers and getting the proper dose using them...it's a lifesaver. You never have to question the syringes or yourself again. Here's a link on how to use them https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/dosing-with-calipers-updated-w-videos.79851/ I had a love/hate relationship with them in the beginning but learned to rely on them. Some other members use them as well. @Sue and Luci is one.


ETA That is all most people use.

 

I'm starting to get very typoey...LOL! I made a new word(probably not). I'm sure you understand what I mean. Even the edits at the bottom aren't really making sense!!! Aaah

 

You're very welcome BTW. I was helped a bunch in the beginning. It's nice to keep the tradition alive. I'm sure you'll pass the favor along down the line

 

lolol thank you for that I didn't even notice the typos. I have been avoiding it because I feel overwhelmed with all the other stuff, but I think it is time to tackle it and figure out how to do it. Thank you for the advice!

 

Are you good? If you're sure you guys are fine I'll be off. I know you can handle everything

 

What a ride Butter’s has been giving you! You’re doing such a great job! Hopefully those BG numbers start to rise so you can get some sleep tonight! If not there’s always coffee

 

100% I will! It is hard to imagine right now that I will know enough to help others, but if that day comes I will absolutely do it with pleasure.

 

Yes we are great! Thank you again!! Have a good night!

 

Thanks! I had a tonne of help!!!

I think I have given up on any thoughts of sleep. Her AMPS is three hours from now...thank goodness for caffeine...it is going to be my bff today...

 

If for some reason Butters gets crazy again...you know the drill. Sugar syrup is you friend. Also if you need support look on the main forum page and tag someone you think can help...or just tag someone
Goodnight Lyla. Be good Butters!

 

What a night! So wonderful that you had @Briere Fur Mom in your corner!

 

@Briere Fur Mom and @thebigfuzz were both awesome. @Red & Rover (GA) also came by with a tip to use more syrup, which has been helping me keep Butters' numbers higher. This community is something else...nothing short of amazing. I have never known anything remotely like it in my life.

 

I will do that. Sleep well! Thank you again.

 

99 @+8.75. Can't wait to see what AMPS will be three hours from now after all the syrup I gave her @+7.5.

Thank you again @thebigfuzz and @Briere Fur Mom for guiding me through this.

 

Think of the bounce as an opportunity to catch up on some much needed zzzzzz !

 

Good Morning!

Looks like the excitement didn't quite end last night

Hope the last part of the cycle went OK?

 

Maybe another hour an a half or so . It is a bit of a blur, but @Briere Fur Mom had me try to coat her gums in sugar syrup and then I soaked freeze dried treats in the stuff. Butters and I were both sticky messes, but doing that finally brought her up! I did a final test at 8.75 and was confident she wouldn't drop before her AMPS.