? 02 -24 Panzer PMPS 100/101 ACTING OFF/85@+3.5/98@+8

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Chrispooky12

Chrispooky12

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Panzer has been doing some things that are pointing to the fact that he has a UTI which the vet just said he had a bladder infection (looking for a new vet) last night he started laying in the litter box, doing the pain meow,moving to a different spot in the box but still peeing. He was also very clingy in bed with me & flinching alot. I've been watching him since +8 feeding AMPS & he is still doing the litter box thing. He's peeing & pooping, no diarrhea, I've thought about checking for ketones but I haven't because his #s are still normal, I'm also a little afraid he might not pee if I stick my device under him to catch some pee? He's had his antibiotic first dose @+8 feeding & I gave him a dose of D Mannose @ PMPS I also just got his Boulardi probiotic +prebiotic medicine today. I haven't given any yet because I don't know if I should with everything going on & starting him on the D Mannose? Next feeding +4 is his MiraLax dose. He hasn't been as active as normal today but still loveable & getting into stuff always. @FrostD @Suzanne & Darcy @Bama Kitty Mom (GA) @Bandit's Mom @Diane Tyler's Mom @Wendy&Neko @Veronica & Babu-chiri @Bron and Sheba (GA) @Katherine&Ruby https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB...g-pmps-96-87-4-89-6-92-7.259566/#post-2916162
 
And, Christina, to me saying that he has a bladder infection is the same as saying a urinary tract infection... same thing really, just a different way of saying it.
 
Refresh my memory, which antibiotic did he get? So I don't have to look through all the old condos (which may not be linked). Zeniquin?
 
So if he started antibiotics on the 19th, he's been on it for six days. If that is true then you should have seen a definite positive improvement by now. If not, that's worrisome.
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
So if he started antibiotics on the 19th, he's been on it for six days. If that is true then you should have seen a definite positive improvement by now. If not, that's worrisome.
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Yeah I've been worried all day just wish I had a new vet it's not easy alot them aren't taking new patients & no $ except care credit which my crazy vet doesn't take
 
I hate to say this, but if I really thought that my cat was still in pain after 6 days on the antibiotics that the vet prescribed, I would at least call them and tell them what's going on. Didn't they also give him a Convenia injection? It's possible that they need to switch to a different antibiotic, but they may ask you to bring him in -- and that may be the best thing. I'm worried about him if he really seems uncomfortable. He really was crying? I don't think I could stand that. I'd call first and head to the vet as soon as I could get him there.
 
Yes. I remember talking about that being weird... the directions to split it into two doses since the prescribing directions for Zeniquin is once a day. They do studies on these drugs when they are being approved and they calculate the best way of dosing and administering the drugs so that they reach peak concentration to be effective, etc. But anyway, the point is that you followed the vet's directions exactly. They need to find out what's going on now. I feel soooo sorry for poor Panzer!
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
I hate to say this, but if I really thought that my cat was still in pain after 6 days on the antibiotics that the vet prescribed, I would at least call them and tell them what's going on. Didn't they also give him a Convenia injection? It's possible that they need to switch to a different antibiotic, but they may ask you to bring him in -- and that may be the best thing. I'm worried about him if he really seems uncomfortable. He really was crying? I don't think I could stand that. I'd call first and head to the vet as soon as I could get him there.
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He's done that twice but only in the litter box crying that is. The problem with taking him to my not very competent vet is paying for it, I will call them in the AM though anyways. He's doing his thing right now, trying to get my food so that's a good thing! I wonder if I call this vet that someone else recommended me to if they could see him tomorrow? If they are even taking new patients
 
He's been sleeping with me anytime I sleep so I see when he's acting out of the ordinary. I only left once today for maybe an hour & don't have to work until Monday.
 
I would go ahead and start the D-mannose for sure in his next food. It's really only effective if it's an E coli infection but it is not harmful to him in any way and may help. I would also start the probiotics today (since you just received them today.)
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
I would go ahead and start the D-mannose for sure in his next food. It's really only effective if it's an E coli infection but it is not harmful to him in any way and may help. I would also start the probiotics today (since you just received them today.)
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I gave him D-Mannose with his insulin feed, he's supposed to have his MiraLax the next feed then his antibiotic the one after that. Do you think it's okay to give him the probiotic with his antibiotic same time?
 
They never did culture the urine so we have no idea what actual organism was in there. So the whole thing was a gamble. Of course, I understand about the cost. I live it every day of my life with my cats.

One time one of my kitties was in a lot of pain from a UTI. I called the vet and they gave me some Buprenorphine for pain (it's really the ONLY one I would recommend using NOT Onsior, NOT Gabapentin, NEVER EVER EVER Metacam, by the way). It helped a LOT. I gave it to her twice a day on her gums (it's a liquid). Usually, my cats will be better in a day or two (with no symptoms) when they have a UTI and have started antibiotics -- but in this case, she was still very uncomfortable and we added in pain medication for a couple of days.
 
Chrispooky12 said:
I gave him D-Mannose with his insulin feed, he's supposed to have his MiraLax the next feed then his antibiotic the one after that. Do you think it's okay to give him the probiotic with his antibiotic same time?
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Also I'm not sure on the dosage on the probiotics
 
Chrispooky12 said:
I gave him D-Mannose with his insulin feed, he's supposed to have his MiraLax the next feed then his antibiotic the one after that. Do you think it's okay to give him the probiotic with his antibiotic same time?
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It is usually recommended to give probiotics and antibiotics at separate times because obviously the antibiotic works against (probably kills) the probiotic. S. Boulardii works a little differently than typical probiotics (since it is actually a yeast, so it may not matter so much -- you could do it for today and try to give it to him an hour of two after the antibiotics tomorrow.) The point is that it won't hurt Panzer to give it at the same time, it just may not be as effective as it could be. All these meds and supplements will make your schedule pretty crazy. Hugs.
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
They never did culture the urine so we have no idea what actual organism was in there. So the whole thing was a gamble. Of course, I understand about the cost. I live it every day of my life with my cats.

One time one of my kitties was in a lot of pain from a UTI. I called the vet and they gave me some Buprenorphine for pain (it's really the ONLY one I would recommend using NOT Onsior, NOT Gabapentin, NEVER EVER EVER Metacam, by the way). It helped a LOT. I gave it to her twice a day on her gums (it's a liquid). Usually, my cats will be better in a day or two (with no symptoms) when they have a UTI and have started antibiotics -- but in this case, she was still very uncomfortable and we added in pain medication for a couple of days.
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I asked for that & they insisted on the onisior which I asked you guys about & you said no, so he hasn't had any pain medicine. I had to give him Metacam after his dental surgery in Oct because they also wouldn't give me the buprenorphine different vet I fired them. He was supposed to take it for 10days but I was told on here that it was bad so he got it for 3 days. I'm so over these vets wanting to give them medicine that is harmful & give you no choice!
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
It is usually recommended to give probiotics and antibiotics at separate times because obviously the antibiotic works against (probably kills) the probiotic. S. Boulardii works a little differently than typical probiotics (since it is actually a yeast, so it may not matter so much -- you could do it for today and try to give it to him an hour of two after the antibiotics tomorrow.) The point is that it won't hurt Panzer to give it at the same time, it just may not be as effective as it could be. All these meds and supplements will make your schedule pretty crazy. Hugs.
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Yes they will. I will give him the probiotic @ AMPS I don't usually give him stuff with insulin but there's so much stuff that I'm giving & introducing to him that I'm going to have to, my poor boy :arghh:
 
This page (above) from IBDkitties gives all the details on how to use the s. boulardii. What brand did you get? Anyway, you see they recommend to start at a low dose and work your way up (unless you are doing the "emergency stop the diarrhea" dose, which you are not. Also they recommend putting it into a gelcap to administer -- but they say some cats will eat it in some food they like a lot. I used to mix mine into baby food. It never did help my poor Tabitha's diarrhea, but she had other problems too.
 
He may have FLUTD in addition to the fact that he has a UTI. He may need the pain medication that I mentioned (Buprenorphine) to help with that pain -- and the D Mannose may/may not help... but can't hurt! Still, I'm concerned that with both a Convenia (what was the date of that) and Zeniquin of six days he's still crying in the litter box!
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
This page (above) from IBDkitties gives all the details on how to use the s. boulardii. What brand did you get? Anyway, you see they recommend to start at a low dose and work your way up (unless you are doing the "emergency stop the diarrhea" dose, which you are not. Also they recommend putting it into a gelcap to administer -- but they say some cats will eat it in some food they like a lot. I used to mix mine into baby food. It never did help my poor Tabitha's diarrhea, but she had other problems too.
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It's Jarrow brand. Yeah so far no diarrhea & he's impossible to pill so I would have to mix it in his food for sure.
 
Chrispooky12 said:
Wow so that fortiflora that I've been giving him& that I give him when he turns up his nose to a certain flavor is not good for him:( I feel like everything I give him sucks!
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No! Not your fault. In my personal opinion (and there are many out there) there's nothing wrong with Forti Flora as an APPETITE STIMULANT because most cats go crazy for the taste of it and will eat really well with it sprinkled on or mixed in their food. It's not harmful, but it just is not really a great probiotic. Better choices are Proviable DC, Visbiome (expensive but good) and some others. And, of course, the s. boulardii is to help with diarrhea or, in this case, to help him not to get diarrhea from the Zeniquin. Personally, my cats have all done really well on Zeniquin with no side effects like vomiting and diarrhea. If he's been on it six days and hasn't had diarrhea, I would not prioritize the s. boulardii at this time. I'd put the antibiotic and the D-mannose as the first priorities.
 
Chrispooky12 said:
It's Jarrow brand. Yeah so far no diarrhea & he's impossible to pill so I would have to mix it in his food for sure.
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Does he like baby food? I always used to have luck mixing in stuff like that (as long as it doesn't have strong flavor) into straight baby food like Gerber ham baby food (the fave) or turkey or chicken and some people use beef, but my cat's aren't used to beef. Another FAVE food is Fancy Feast Savory Salmon Feast. Any baby food should have no onion or garlic in there (I'm sure you know that already) but meat and broth are okay.
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
He may have FLUTD in addition to the fact that he has a UTI. He may need the pain medication that I mentioned (Buprenorphine) to help with that pain -- and the D Mannose may/may not help... but can't hurt! Still, I'm concerned that with both a Convenia (what was the date of that) and Zeniquin of six days he's still crying in the litter box!
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Yeah I'm afraid of that I am going to call the vet in the am & see if they will give me the buprenorphine, I will tell them the onsior is not helping (even though Inever gave that crap to him)& describe what he is doing.
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
No! Not your fault. In my personal opinion (and there are many out there) there's nothing wrong with Forti Flora as an APPETITE STIMULANT because most cats go crazy for the taste of it and will eat really well with it sprinkled on or mixed in their food. It's not harmful, but it just is not really a great probiotic. Better choices are Proviable DC, Visbiome (expensive but good) and some others. And, of course, the s. boulardii is to help with diarrhea or, in this case, to help him not to get diarrhea from the Zeniquin. Personally, my cats have all done really well on Zeniquin with no side effects like vomiting and diarrhea. If he's been on it six days and hasn't had diarrhea, I would not prioritize the s. boulardii at this time. I'd put the antibiotic and the D-mannose as the first priorities.
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Okay I will do that
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Does he like baby food? I always used to have luck mixing in stuff like that (as long as it doesn't have strong flavor) into straight baby food like Gerber ham baby food (the fave) or turkey or chicken and some people use beef, but my cat's aren't used to beef. Another FAVE food is Fancy Feast Savory Salmon Feast. Any baby food should have no onion or garlic in there (I'm sure you know that already) but meat and broth are okay.
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He's never had baby food but I have some that I didn't have to use after his dental. I only have chicken flavor because they were out of everything at the time that I bought it. He's not picky so I will try giving him some before I feed the rest of them coming up in a little over an hour. It is Gerber brand & says ingredients are ground chicken & water.
 
Do you think you will be able to even give him the Bupe? I don't know how hard he is to handle. Buprenorphine needs to be kind of squirted (I say squirted but it is a TINY TINY amount) onto the gums to be effective. It is absorbed through the mucus membranes of the mouth (the gums) so it's best to try to shoot the oral syringe with the tiny amount of Bupe into the corner of their mouth where their cheek is (kind of in the corner of the jaw, if you can just slip it in there) and squirt. In some cats, it's almost impossible to get it into what they call the buccal pocket (inside cheek). Now, having said that... I have had some of these impossible cats and I managed to squirt it into their mouth and not so perfectly inside the cheek onto the gums... it still had some effect, so it must have absorbed in there somewhere! It is not absorbed through the GI tract like most meds.
 
Chrispooky12 said:
He's never had baby food but I have some that I didn't have to use after his dental. I only have chicken flavor because they were out of everything at the time that I bought it. He's not picky so I will try giving him some before I feed the rest of them coming up in a little over an hour. It is Gerber brand & says ingredients are ground chicken & water.
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That's perfect. All meat. Great for a diabetic cat snack, too!
 
I'm glad you didn't give him the Onsior. Too many warnings associated with that one in cats. It is for short-term use in cats, but I will no longer give it to any of my cats. At least they didn't try to give you Metacam. Don't give that to your cats.

Did you get the lecture about Convenia yet?
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
I'm glad you didn't give him the Onsior. Too many warnings associated with that one in cats. It is for short-term use in cats, but I will no longer give it to any of my cats. At least they didn't try to give you Metacam. Don't give that to your cats.

Did you get the lecture about Convenia yet?
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No but I read about convenia never again & never ever Metacam I was scared to give it to him the 3days that I did but had no choice, he had 15 teeth pulled! He loved the baby food, I gave him a couple of teaspoons & mixed in a little bit of the Boulardi
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Do you think you will be able to even give him the Bupe? I don't know how hard he is to handle. Buprenorphine needs to be kind of squirted (I say squirted but it is a TINY TINY amount) onto the gums to be effective. It is absorbed through the mucus membranes of the mouth (the gums) so it's best to try to shoot the oral syringe with the tiny amount of Bupe into the corner of their mouth where their cheek is (kind of in the corner of the jaw, if you can just slip it in there) and squirt. In some cats, it's almost impossible to get it into what they call the buccal pocket (inside cheek). Now, having said that... I have had some of these impossible cats and I managed to squirt it into their mouth and not so perfectly inside the cheek onto the gums... it still had some effect, so it must have absorbed in there somewhere! It is not absorbed through the GI tract like most meds.
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All I can do is try, Laura is coming over tomorrow so we can figure out the cat feeders & one of my inside camera's that I can't get it to connect so I will have her help me if the vet will even give it to him
 
Chrispooky12 said:
All I can do is try, Laura is coming over tomorrow so we can figure out the cat feeders & one of my inside camera's that I can't get it to connect so I will have her help me if the vet will even give it to him
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Is Laura your sister? I can't remember if you mentioned her before?
 
Chrispooky12 said:
No but I read about convenia
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I'm glad you read about it. I didn't want to talk about it to freak you out... back when he first had it... because it's so scary and it was already done... the vet already gave it to him so it was too late. The fact that it can cause Hemolytic Anemia is enough for me. That's deadly. But I have had a few cats who were given Convenia before I could stop the vet and they were okay -- so not every cat is going to react to it. It's just scary to have a medicine in your cat where you cannot stop it once it's in their system. Can't do anything about it. Dr. Lisa on her catinfo.org site has some scary information about Convenia.
 
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