? 9/24 Ivy Amps 163, +3 246, +5 95, + 8 188, Pmps 225, +2.75 299 Libre *UTI question

Staci & Ivy

Staci & Ivy

Very Active Member
9/23/24
Amps 163 Libre

Good morning, yesterday was a generally blue and yellow day on the Libre.
Maybe a reaction from Sunday night somewhat lower cycle?

*Ivy‘s lab work from last Tuesday seems to indicate she may have a UTI going on.

My vet kind of brushed it off (since I did a free catch at home and took for urine in).
However, a free catch is generally how I do it and she’s not had any indication of any bacteria or white blood cells in her urine in the last two years.

I did have her on a supplement for the past couple of years, but we removed it in May 2024, thinking she didn’t really need it anymore.
I was using Vetri Science UT support 2x every day for a week (once a month).
I don’t know if it’s coincidental that we took her off of that supplement or not.

About 3 to 4 years ago, she tended to have chronic UTIs and they stopped treating them with antibiotics (because they didn’t want her to build up a resistance to them) since she was never showing any physical signs of discomfort.
This was per my vet and an internal medicine vet Discussion/decision.

I then used a different internal medicine doc two years ago & she had a UTI. We treated it and then she hasn’t seemed to have had any problem in the last two years.

**Also, previous UTI’s were before we knew she had diabetes and before her recent dx of hyperthyroidism.

Question: So I’m trying to decide if I should push my new vet to put her on an antibiotic or if we should do nothing, or maybe restart the supplement. :arghh:

I don’t know what to do, any thoughts?? :banghead:

Have a safe day everyone :cat:
 
I cannot help, no experience with UTI (for Bella, I wish I did not personnally :arghh: ) but if she has an infection going on, that could explain higher numbers. Maybe redo the test in better conditions a few days later, if she does not have symptoms?
In any case, i hope you have a good day and that miss Ivy is not in pain! :bighug:
 
cecile & bella said:
I cannot help, no experience with UTI (for Bella, I wish I did not personnally :arghh: ) but if she has an infection going on, that could explain higher numbers. Maybe redo the test in better conditions a few days later, if she does not have symptoms?
In any case, i hope you have a good day and that miss Ivy is not in pain! :bighug:
Click to expand...
Her numbers aren’t really higher for her. She’s had lower cycles recently also.

And she shows no signs of pain or accidents outside the box. No vocalization. Not any more frequent pees in her box either.

Thanks, Cecile :bighug:
 
Hi Staci,

I am so sorry you have to deal with this additional concern. Did the vet do an antibiogram, so you know which bacteria they found? Maybe it could be useful to post this here. In Binies antibiogram we could also see, if the contamination was high or low. Maybe these factors are helpful to know, to make a decision.

I did a very quick research and found some hints which maybe helpful, but it needs a more qualified person to put them into perspective. But maybe it can be helpful for further research:

- CHatGPT said, that bacterias in the urine of cats are not always an indication for antibiotics. That matches my own experience with humans. To find the right supplements, it would be useful to know the bacteria. I give mannose to Binie, but that only helps if the infection is caused by e-coli. I also used the calmurofel, Shelly suggested.
- But: I found on Tanyas helpful site, that especially cats with CKD should be rather treatet with antibiotics, to not risk further damage:
http://felinecrf.org/pyelonephritis_utis.htm
That would outweigh the risk of resistancies.

Hope you get some helpful insights and what I hope most is, that it is an easy to treat issue or maybe not an issue at all.

All fingers and paws are crossed! :bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Nice start for Ivy. I hope she surfs safely today. If you think she may have a UTI, you can try D-Mannose. I used it for Furball when an antibiotic didn't clear up a UTI and it worked. I bought supplements that came in capsules with powder inside. I opened the capsules and put the powder in smaller capsules and gave it to Furball that way twice a day.

You can also buy it loose and add 1/4 tsp in the food a couple times a day.

  • A commonly used dose is 250-500mg twice a day.ManagingtheEcoliUTI(2011) KuKanich KSNAVC Clinician's BriefAug 2011pp61-66 mentions a dose of 250-1000mg twice daily.

  • With most (but not all) brands, a ¼ of a teaspoon of the powder is 500mg, so if you are giving 250-500mg, you would give ⅛-¼ teaspoon twice a day, but check with your vet.

  • Some people find it works better if they divide the total amount over 3-4 doses a day.

  • Keep giving it for a week after the symptoms have disappeared.
Since it is a type of sugar, D-Mannose has a pleasant taste. It can be easily mixed with wet food or mixed with water and syringed into the cat's mouth.
 
Hi Staci,
Like @Heike & BInie said above, I've read that cats can show bacteria without symptoms.
This article https://www.petmd.com/cat/conditions/urinary/utis-cats-urinary-tract-infections-cats
says that a healthy cat without symptoms can fight off UTI on her own - Not sure what they mean by "healthy", really.
Others with experience can chime in but I would think a candid discussion with your vet is definitely warranted?
Sorry that you got another thing to be concerned about. o_O
Hope you find a good option soon for sweet Ivy... :bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
carfurby (GA) said:
Nice start for Ivy. I hope she surfs safely today. If you think she may have a UTI, you can try D-Mannose. I used it for Furball when an antibiotic didn't clear up a UTI and it worked. I bought supplements that came in capsules with powder inside. I opened the capsules and put the powder in smaller capsules and gave it to Furball that way twice a day.

You can also buy it loose and add 1/4 tsp in the food a couple times a day.

  • A commonly used dose is 250-500mg twice a day.ManagingtheEcoliUTI(2011) KuKanich KSNAVC Clinician's BriefAug 2011pp61-66 mentions a dose of 250-1000mg twice daily.

  • With most (but not all) brands, a ¼ of a teaspoon of the powder is 500mg, so if you are giving 250-500mg, you would give ⅛-¼ teaspoon twice a day, but check with your vet.

  • Some people find it works better if they divide the total amount over 3-4 doses a day.

  • Keep giving it for a week after the symptoms have disappeared.
Since it is a type of sugar, D-Mannose has a pleasant taste. It can be easily mixed with wet food or mixed with water and syringed into the cat's mouth.
Click to expand...
Great info. thanks Carla!
 
Oh Staci, I'm sorry about the UTI. I'd be interested in the specific type of bacteria, and the concentration, and use that info to decide if you want antibiotics or not- the lab should have sent a recommendation to the vet for what antibiotic to use based on what type of bacteria they found...at least I know Antech does. When William was in the ER for his blockage and infection, I did some research, I will see if I can attach a pdf of what I found on antibiotics here, but if not, I'll pm you. As far as supplements, I don't see how it could hurt. Since the 2 male blockages at my house, and Jack's slowly rising phosphorus level, I put the majority of the herd on phos-bind but Epakitin works really well as well- I had an older female prone to UTIs on Epakitin years ago. Also, Cosequin has been shown to help bladder issues- I found that has helped a young female I rescued and rehomed to a friend with her recurring UTI (but because the vet felt it was a muscle tone/anatomy issue) Hope you find the info you need to make a decision you are comfortable with. Will be praying for Ivy to feel better. HUGS!! :bighug:
ETA: I get an error when I try to attach a file that says I don't have permission to perform this action, so I'll try to PM you the pdf
 
Staci & Ivy said:
9/23/24
Amps 163 Libre

Good morning, yesterday was a generally blue and yellow day on the Libre.
Maybe a reaction from Sunday night somewhat lower cycle?

*Ivy‘s lab work from last Tuesday seems to indicate she may have a UTI going on.

My vet kind of brushed it off (since I did a free catch at home and took for urine in).
However, a free catch is generally how I do it and she’s not had any indication of any bacteria or white blood cells in her urine in the last two years.

I did have her on a supplement for the past couple of years, but we removed it in May 2024, thinking she didn’t really need it anymore.
I was using Vetri Science UT support 2x every day for a week (once a month).
I don’t know if it’s coincidental that we took her off of that supplement or not.

About 3 to 4 years ago, she tended to have chronic UTIs and they stopped treating them with antibiotics (because they didn’t want her to build up a resistance to them) since she was never showing any physical signs of discomfort.
This was per my vet and an internal medicine vet Discussion/decision.

I then used a different internal medicine doc two years ago & she had a UTI. We treated it and then she hasn’t seemed to have had any problem in the last two years.

**Also, previous UTI’s were before we knew she had diabetes and before her recent dx of hyperthyroidism.

Question: So I’m trying to decide if I should push my new vet to put her on an antibiotic or if we should do nothing, or maybe restart the supplement. :arghh:

I don’t know what to do, any thoughts?? :banghead:

Have a safe day everyone :cat:
Click to expand...
 
Sorry, Staci that you are dealing with this. I don't have much experience with UTIs. I know when I have brought in a free catch urine sample my vet said that he needed a more sterile sample to be tested for bacteria and would do a straight catherization to collect. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Heike & BInie said:
Hi Staci,

I am so sorry you have to deal with this additional concern. Did the vet do an antibiogram, so you know which bacteria they found? Maybe it could be useful to post this here. In Binies antibiogram we could also see, if the contamination was high or low. Maybe these factors are helpful to know, to make a decision.

I did a very quick research and found some hints which maybe helpful, but it needs a more qualified person to put them into perspective. But maybe it can be helpful for further research:

- CHatGPT said, that bacterias in the urine of cats are not always an indication for antibiotics. That matches my own experience with humans. To find the right supplements, it would be useful to know the bacteria. I give mannose to Binie, but that only helps if the infection is caused by e-coli. I also used the calmurofel, Shelly suggested.
- But: I found on Tanyas helpful site, that especially cats with CKD should be rather treatet with antibiotics, to not risk further damage:
http://felinecrf.org/pyelonephritis_utis.htm
That would outweigh the risk of resistancies.

Hope you get some helpful insights and what I hope most is, that it is an easy to treat issue or maybe not an issue at all.

All fingers and paws are crossed! :bighug::bighug::bighug:
Click to expand...
Hi Heike, they only did a plain urinalysis, which showed Some (26/50) rods/bacteria and the WBC was 2-3.
No culture & sensitivity was done.

I will begin again to give her the UT supplement I had given before. It has d-manoose in it, just not high levels.
It’s given 2x a day and I have given it one week per month.

I’m still waiting to hear back from my vet. He seems to call at night.

I’m done working now so I’m hanging out waiting for Ivy to pee again so I can try to get another catch.
I think we are waiting each other out because she’s showing no signs of using her litter box.:banghead: When she pees tonight or tomorrow morning, which I know she will, I will attempt to get it if I’m in the right place at the right time.
I just want permission from the vet to bring over the urine so that they can send it out to the lab. (I don’t want the desk people to tell me they have no orders from the doc to send it out.)

Will try to run it again just to see what we find a week after the last test was run.
Thank you :bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
carfurby (GA) said:
Nice start for Ivy. I hope she surfs safely today. If you think she may have a UTI, you can try D-Mannose. I used it for Furball when an antibiotic didn't clear up a UTI and it worked. I bought supplements that came in capsules with powder inside. I opened the capsules and put the powder in smaller capsules and gave it to Furball that way twice a day.

You can also buy it loose and add 1/4 tsp in the food a couple times a day.

  • A commonly used dose is 250-500mg twice a day.ManagingtheEcoliUTI(2011) KuKanich KSNAVC Clinician's BriefAug 2011pp61-66 mentions a dose of 250-1000mg twice daily.

  • With most (but not all) brands, a ¼ of a teaspoon of the powder is 500mg, so if you are giving 250-500mg, you would give ⅛-¼ teaspoon twice a day, but check with your vet.

  • Some people find it works better if they divide the total amount over 3-4 doses a day.

  • Keep giving it for a week after the symptoms have disappeared.
Since it is a type of sugar, D-Mannose has a pleasant taste. It can be easily mixed with wet food or mixed with water and syringed into the cat's mouth.
Click to expand...
Thanks, Carla. Great information. Any particular brand you think was good?
I’ll place an order to have it around anyway.
Thanks again! :bighug::bighug:
 
Mikanmama said:
Hi Staci,
Like @Heike & BInie said above, I've read that cats can show bacteria without symptoms.
This article https://www.petmd.com/cat/conditions/urinary/utis-cats-urinary-tract-infections-cats
says that a healthy cat without symptoms can fight off UTI on her own - Not sure what they mean by "healthy", really.
Others with experience can chime in but I would think a candid discussion with your vet is definitely warranted?
Sorry that you got another thing to be concerned about. o_O
Hope you find a good option soon for sweet Ivy... :bighug::bighug::bighug:
Click to expand...
Thanks, Kit. I find it hard to believe anyone would call Ivy “healthy” with all her issues. But she doesn’t appear uncomfortable thank God.
Still waiting to hear back from the vet. (I seem to do a lot of that).
:bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Jack & Mopem'sMom said:
Oh Staci, I'm sorry about the UTI. I'd be interested in the specific type of bacteria, and the concentration, and use that info to decide if you want antibiotics or not- the lab should have sent a recommendation to the vet for what antibiotic to use based on what type of bacteria they found...at least I know Antech does. When William was in the ER for his blockage and infection, I did some research, I will see if I can attach a pdf of what I found on antibiotics here, but if not, I'll pm you. As far as supplements, I don't see how it could hurt. Since the 2 male blockages at my house, and Jack's slowly rising phosphorus level, I put the majority of the herd on phos-bind but Epakitin works really well as well- I had an older female prone to UTIs on Epakitin years ago. Also, Cosequin has been shown to help bladder issues- I found that has helped a young female I rescued and rehomed to a friend with her recurring UTI (but because the vet felt it was a muscle tone/anatomy issue) Hope you find the info you need to make a decision you are comfortable with. Will be praying for Ivy to feel better. HUGS!! :bighug:
ETA: I get an error when I try to attach a file that says I don't have permission to perform this action, so I'll try to PM you the pdf
Click to expand...
Thanks, Christine. I appreciate all the info. Luck Ivy doesn’t seem to feel poorly.
But I just would like a clean urine So I don’t have to worry.
And since I’m lying next to her near the litter boxes, she hasn’t peed all day.
ad soon as I go to get her dinner ready is when she will pee. I know her schedule. Little bugger!

Thanks for all the info and support. Hugs to you and the herd :bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Madeline528 said:
Sorry, Staci that you are dealing with this. I don't have much experience with UTIs. I know when I have brought in a free catch urine sample my vet said that he needed a more sterile sample to be tested for bacteria and would do a straight catherization to collect. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
Click to expand...
Thanks, Madeline! I hate to have to do a cystocentesis if we can avoid it. It’s another round of sedating her and all that. Sigh.
:bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Staci & Ivy said:
Hi Heike, they only did a plain urinalysis, which showed Some (26/50) rods/bacteria and the WBC was 2-3.
No culture & sensitivity was done.

I will begin again to give her the UT supplement I had given before. It has d-manoose in it, just not high levels.
It’s given 2x a day and I have given it one week per month.

I’m still waiting to hear back from my vet. He seems to call at night.

I’m done working now so I’m hanging out waiting for Ivy to pee again so I can try to get another catch.
I think we are waiting each other out because she’s showing no signs of using her litter box.:banghead: When she pees tonight or tomorrow morning, which I know she will, I will attempt to get it if I’m in the right place at the right time.
I just want permission from the vet to bring over the urine so that they can send it out to the lab. (I don’t want the desk people to tell me they have no orders from the doc to send it out.)

Will try to run it again just to see what we find a week after the last test was run.
Thank you :bighug::bighug::bighug:
Click to expand...

Hi Staci,

I think the supplements are good anyway. Good idea to give it one week every month! Maybe it would help to make a treatment choice to run a complete analysis?

Good luck with catching the urine! If you have a motion detector, I can recommand that. I place it at the bathroom door so she has to pass it if she wants to go to her box. Like that I get an alert without following her the whole day.

I hope the vet calls soon so you can discuss this with him.

I send you a hug and hope there will be a bit more clarity soon. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Heike & BInie said:
Hi Staci,

I think the supplements are good anyway. Good idea to give it one week every month! Maybe it would help to make a treatment choice to run a complete analysis?

Good luck with catching the urine! If you have a motion detector, I can recommand that. I place it at the bathroom door so she has to pass it if she wants to go to her box. Like that I get an alert without following her the whole day.

I hope the vet calls soon so you can discuss this with him.

I send you a hug and hope there will be a bit more clarity soon. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
Click to expand...
I like the motion detector idea. Thanks for that idea, Heike.
I want to ask the vet what test he thinks we should run.
Yet another project, right??
:bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
I've been wondering about a supplement for Kit's more frequent UTI's since the beginning of the year. I saw above you used the vetri science stuff - was that a chew/treat type one?
 
Alicia & Kit cat said:
I've been wondering about a supplement for Kit's more frequent UTI's since the beginning of the year. I saw above you used the vetri science stuff - was that a chew/treat type one?
Click to expand...
Yes, it’s a “chew” but it’s pretty hard. I have to use a pill splitter then I grind it to a powder (in the grinder side of the pill splitter, put it in her food) and she eats it with all her supplements in her food. :rolleyes:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top