Anya's update...

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jenjen00

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Ok, the Vet has not returned called me back yet to confirm if she does have a UTI. Her numbers are still up but starting yesturday I am trying to move everyone to all wet food. It is working I think. I have not completely took away all the dry food but it does not sit out 24/7 any longer. Does anyone have some hints as to what I need to do with regards to the units or should I wait to hear back from the Vet about the UTI?

Thanks
 
jenjen00 said:
Ok, the Vet has not returned called me back yet to confirm if she does have a UTI. Her numbers are still up but starting yesturday I am trying to move everyone to all wet food. It is working I think. I have not completely took away all the dry food but it does not sit out 24/7 any longer. Does anyone have some hints as to what I need to do with regards to the units or should I wait to hear back from the Vet about the UTI?

Thanks
Click to expand...


Hi Jen

you might want to contact ur vet again, just to make sure they're on the ball about your concerns.

as for the dry food switch, be very careful how fast you pull it, I say this because of the dose Anya is on right now.

According to ur SS, you have gone up to 3 units? And last nite you gave 2.5 units, correct?
I'm not about to suggest anything on dosing, other than, dose hopping will not make lantus work any faster or better.

Plus, u really need to gather some evening spotchecks, especially as u are doing the food switch to wet food.
This is very important to Anya's well being and for her safety.

If u can stick around thru the day, others will be by to offer suggestions, ok?
Please try to get some testing in during today's cycles.
 
Hi Jen....good job with attaching Anya's SS to your post!! :-D
Another thing we do is attach yesterday's post (condo) to our first post of the day....

Here is the link to the one you posted on thursday.... viewtopic.php?f=9&t=4285
And also here is one I found that you posted on Health too. viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4268

Again, welcome to LL. :-D Have you called your vet as yet this morning? Would be good if you have the UTI results.....

Many vets do start kitties out on higher doses but here we like to start low and go slow with our dosing. when there is a need to increase, usually we go up only .25u and we give the shots 2 times each day, 12 hours apart.
It is great that you are switching from dry to canned food (even for your other kitties too!)
It is also great that you know how to test....we always test before each shot...showing the numbers as AMPS and PMPS....
am numbers and pm preshot numbers. During the day, frequent testing helps to gather data for out SS so we can see how our kitty is reacting during the cycle (every 12 hours) We can then see when nadir is (lowest number of the cycle)

there are more experienced people who will be along during the day to give you advice or to just say hello. I hope you have had time to read over all the links that everyone has shared with you. any questiosn that you have can be added to your condo...one condo for each kitty each day. By logging in your data and posting each day, you will be well on your way to regulating Anya....so happy that you are here Jen!!! :mrgreen:
 
Vet finally called...

Ok, Italked to the vet and she says that she does not have a UTI and possibly we need to increase the insulin to 4 units (night time) and 3 units (day time). I am really not sure I am wanting to do that but I do not want to keep getting numbers in the 300's. I do not want to chance her getting and infection. Can someone please let me know what you think?

Thanks
 
I cannot wholeheartedly agree with this dosing method from your vet! I never heard of dosing like this with lantus insulin.
I think you need to put up some spot checks on Anya and we need to see her numbers during the day, for anyone here to help you!
I'm thinking you should be adding help with dosing to your subject heading-OK? next to anya's update
The more tests you get today, the better it will be for the compiling of info for your SS.
 
I do not agree with the dosage either. I just took her BG and it is 316 so it went down a little right now at +5. I will try to get another one before I leave for work if not I will get a couple more later tonight. I only work for about 5 hrs.

Thanks for the help. Every little bit that her BG goes down the happier I am.
 
Re: Vet finally called...

jenjen00 said:
Ok, Italked to the vet and she says that she does not have a UTI and possibly we need to increase the insulin to 4 units (night time) and 3 units (day time). I am really not sure I am wanting to do that but I do not want to keep getting numbers in the 300's. I do not want to chance her getting and infection. Can someone please let me know what you think?

Thanks
Click to expand...

My vet previously advised me to give Sami one dose in the morning and a different one at night, and at one time she even advised that maybe Sami only needed one dose per day. It wasn't until I came to this board 3 weeks ago that Sami finally started to stablize with her BG and the past three days she has been in the normal range for most of the day.

Even though I value the my vet's opinion and recommendations, I have found that sometimes the advice on this board is a better option. Just do your own research and look at all the options and decide what you feel will work best for you.
 
Hi Jen and welcome!

There are some shorter acting insulins that can be dosed in different amounts at AM and PM shots. With longer acting insulin such as Lantus and Levemir, this approach (usually the approach that most vets are familiar with) does not work well. Lantus and Levemir both require that there is a depot, or what we call a "shed" that is built up and acts almost like a storage silo for insulin. It creates a steady amount in the blood and also allows for the insulin to overlap between doses. As a result, unlike with shorter acting insulin, Anya will always have insulin in her system. This is one of the reasons that Lantus is a gentler acting insulin. It's not in and out of the system quickly resulting in big drops in BG (blood glucose) levels and high numbers later in the cycle when the insulin is used up. That's the long way of saying that Anya should get the same amount of insulin at each shot time so you don't end up playing havoc with her shed.

Do you happen to know what Anya's ideal weight is? Lantus' starting dose is based on ideal weight. Unless Anya is a really big kitty, it's likely that her starting dose will be somewhere around 1.0u. From your previous posting, I think you said Anya was started on 2.0u and you also indicated that the dose changes have been made in 0.5u changes. In most cases, we encourage a dose change of 0.25u based on the Tight Regulation (Tilly) Protocol. If you are comfortable with starting over, you could re-start at 1.0. However, you also noted that you had not tested for ketones and if you have found any more than a trace amount, I would be very reticent to change the insulin dose. It would also be helpful to have input about starting dose from some of the more experienced people here.
 
Hi Jen,

Sienne is right.

Just one thing I want to clarify-on ss you say peed around house (clear)-do you mean her urine was very clear? As in like straw coloured?

I think you have said yourself, but please do not increase Anya's dose again.

Do you have ketodiastix?
If you have, have you tested her urine?
As Sienne said anything above trace is serious.The main reason for keytones is a lack of insulin, hence the caution about offering thoughts on immediately dropping dose to 1u (the ethos of this board).

Those pinks could be a result of your increased pm shot and she dropped a fair bit lower.
Lower numbers can just be in the high 100's/200's for some cats (as body has forgotten that actually this is a high number). Body panics, releases glucagon and bg's sky rocket. It is a life saving mechanism (pretty neat actually)

However, we do also have some kitties here that do need high doses of insulin, hence the caution.
Add to this the dry food, which can seriously bump up bg's.

Example-Lucky, all dry food diet 482 (ish), one week on a wet diet, no dry and no insulin 257-that was her non-working pancreas-see the difference.

Can you get some more spot checks in? Not going to possibly give huge amounts of info, but there again they may.

As for your vet, she may have dosed Anya based on her actual weight not her ideal as Sienne has said. Also, she may be dosing similar to how you would use a short acting insulin, not realising that Lantus and Lev build up a shed.
 
Hi Jen, I posted on your condo yesterday and found you again today...good show! ;-)

I'm just going to throw a few things out there for you...first, I read yesterday that you are using the True Test Meter. Please read this condo from a few weeks back about the inconsistent and just plain bad numbers using that meter...it is rated one of the worst: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/view ... 820#p24820

I know we are just a bunch of strangers on the internet, but please consider using the dosing recommendations given here...the vets just aren't that up-to-date on the protocol with these newer insulins as they have been pushed, sometimes kicking and screaming, into having to prescibe them because their favorite, Vetsulin, was recalled. My own vet admitted to me that she treats only two diabetic kitties, mine and one other, who was on Vetsulin. I do not rely on her for ANY advice re diabetes and she is just as glad that I don't.

That 3 units and 4 units of insulin is a recipe for disaster. nailbite_smile :o :shock: What has probably kept Anya from getting in trouble thus far was the dry food, which you no longer feed. If it were me, and it WAS me 3 times, I'd start over at 1 unit and go from there....there, I said it! :RAHCAT We are here 24/7 to help you...while your vet will be tucked up snug in his/her bed when the s**t hits the fan. grr_red
 
Anya's ideal weight is 15 lbs (She and her brother are both big cats). Thanks everyone for all your input. I will be checking for the ketones tomorrow. Anya might be feeling a little better because she is playing more and getting into everything. She is also being more loving. I am not planning on changing any of the insulin units until I check the ketones.

Thanks again for the help I will be back tomorrow.

Jen :-D
 
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