Charlie 2/9/16 - Remission ?

Discussion in 'Lantus / Basaglar (glargine) and Levemir (detemir)' started by Elaine - Charlie, Feb 9, 2016.

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  1. Elaine - Charlie

    Elaine - Charlie Member

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    Dec 15, 2015
  2. Elaine - Charlie

    Elaine - Charlie Member

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    Dec 15, 2015
    And what is the number when he is low, that I can stop freaking out at :)
     
  3. Sienne and Gabby (GA)

    Sienne and Gabby (GA) Senior Member Moderator

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    Dec 28, 2009
    If you're not giving insulin, there's not anything you're doing that should be causing such low numbers. I'd talk to your vet and maybe have Charlie seen and get some labs run just to be on the safe side. A 35 after 4 days of no insulin is unusual but not unheard of. Some cats naturally run low. How are you feeding Charlie? Also, his numbers may be dropping due to fluids.

    I don't know that I'm confident that this is remission. You're seeing a fair amount of numbers that are outside of normal range.
     
  4. Elaine - Charlie

    Elaine - Charlie Member

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    Dec 15, 2015
    Ironically the vet just called me, regarding another matter. But, I also told him about the numbers and I'd given him the link to check my chart. I just had labs done within the last week and he said apart from the Potassium being a bit over, all looked good, slighlty enimic. He suggested going to a Specialist, but, it's not local, so, another hurdle to cross :(
    I have IV fluids to give him, but, don't give them everyday, but, with him so low, I'm not taking a chance on them until I can get his numbers up.
     
  5. LindaMS

    LindaMS Well-Known Member

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    Oct 17, 2013
    Looks to me that Charlie has something upsetting him. I see your note on your spreadsheet that he has been throwing up. I would encourage you to make sure that whatever he eats has a good calorie count right now, so go to medium carb/high carb if you can until he keeps his food down well.
     
  6. Elaine - Charlie

    Elaine - Charlie Member

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    Dec 15, 2015
    I have him on Soulastic Grain Free - Shrimply Divine Tuna & Shrimp dinner in gelee and also
    Soulastic Grain Free Gluten Free - Beef & Salmon Dinner in Gelee.
    We are having a Heatwave here at the moment, I'm in California and it's in the upper 80's
     
  7. Elaine - Charlie

    Elaine - Charlie Member

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    Dec 15, 2015
    I mention the weather, as I think, it could be partly from him having too much sun as well.
     
  8. Elaine - Charlie

    Elaine - Charlie Member

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    Dec 15, 2015
    I had posted earlier, but, someone suggested I try again.

    Getting totally confused as his numbers are so low, but, not had insulin for 5 days.

    Some people are saying the numbers are good and some are worried ??

    I've spend all day trying to get numbers up, but, it seems I don't have to ??
     
  9. kse

    kse Well-Known Member

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    Feb 10, 2011
    I have not posted in FDMB in awhile and have only used Prozinc. But, I saw this posted on FB and asked her to post here. Her kitty has had no insulin in 5 days- the numbers look great to me. Can anyone please give some feedback other than me. Thanks
     
  10. Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey

    Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey Well-Known Member

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    Jul 18, 2011
    Elaine, we ask that you only do one condo, or thread a day, as it gets to confusing for people to follow two. Hopefully one of the moderators can merge these two, since someone already replied, which makes it impossible for you to just delete it. @Jill & Alex (GA), can you help, please?

    I'll respond on the original condo.
     
  11. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Nov 15, 2013
    Is he an outdoor cat? If inside I doubt it's from the heat. I'm in Los Angeles and its been in the 100's here when my air went out and that never happened. I'm wondering if he has some GI issues or perhaps pancreatitis?
     
  12. Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey

    Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey Well-Known Member

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    Hi Elaine.

    Please don't be offended that I told you not to do two condos - it's a policy here to prevent mass confusion. It's much easier to help someone if you have all the responses for that day in the same condo. Then you start a new one the next day and add a link to the past one, making it easier to follow along. Does that make sense?

    If you want to get more eyes on your condo, the best way is to change the subject line and add a ? icon. Just click on Thread Tools and choose Edit Subject. At the left, if you put your cursor where it says "no prefix", you can select that ? icon. Then change your subject to whatever you want - the request to look at your SS that you used in your other condo is fine.

    You've already gotten some good feedback from Sienne, who is one of most experienced members. To be considered in remission, a cat needs to be in "normal" numbers for 14 consecutive days without insulin. From the sticky on TR:

     
  13. Elaine - Charlie

    Elaine - Charlie Member

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    He is indoor only, but, I have an enclosed courtyard that has no roof, so, he can get the best of both worlds, without actually going outside :)
    I set up an area with a shade for him to lay, but, he does sneak out into the sun every now and then :)
     
  14. Elaine - Charlie

    Elaine - Charlie Member

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    Dec 15, 2015
    No, no problem I'm not offended, I'm not very good with all this computer stuff and all the jargon... Thread Tools etc :)
    So, no worries :)
    I'm just making myself sick, not knowing what's going on with my cat Now :(
    I can't stay up 24/7 and if he is going this low in the day, and he usually goes lower at night as well :(
    But, then some say it could be ok, if he hasn't taken insulin.
    So, basically if he goes under 50, do I freak out or not :)
     
  15. Elaine - Charlie

    Elaine - Charlie Member

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    Dec 15, 2015
    Another thing i should point out, he is also very underweight, not like the icon photo, more like one of those cat skeletons they sold at Halloween, that thin :(
     
  16. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    No worries if he is under 50 without insulin. Is he only 6 months old?
     
  17. julie & punkin (ga)

    julie & punkin (ga) Well-Known Member

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    Feb 17, 2011
    Unless a cat has a medical condition, they usually can't have a hypo event unless one is injecting insulin. I have seen cats in the 30's when they were in remission. I've also heard of one cat that had a specific, unusual condition that caused the cat to have a hypo even though the cat was not getting insulin. My guess is that Charlie is just settling in and the 30's might be normal off-of-insulin numbers for him.

    Today he's in great numbers, so I'd just keep testing twice a day for the next 2 weeks and see what happens. I wouldn't give him high carb to try to keep him over 50 at this point. I'd stick to low carb.

    Here are the guidelines on remission:

    REMISSION:
    From Tilly's Diabetes Homepage, Phase 5: Remission

    14 days without insulin and normal blood glucose values. Most remission cats are able to stay in the normal range all of the time (50 to 80 mg/dl), although there are a few cases of sporadic higher and lower BGs. Don't stop feeding low-carb and try to avoid cortisone if possible.

    Test the cat's BGs once per month.Approximately 25% cats that achieved remission using this protocol relapsed and required insulin again (frequent causes are hyperthyroidism or bouts of pancreatitis). Therefore, it is important to keep your diabetes kit up-to-date. Then you can react immediately by giving insulin and home testing. Importantly, the sooner you react to a relapse (i.e. preventing hyperglycemia and initiating other necessary veterinary treatment), the more likely a second remission will become.

    The longer a cat has had diabetes, the less likely it will go into remission. Many long-term diabetics get stuck in Phase 3 or 4. Yet there is a benefit of using this method for such a cat as well: keeping the cat's BG levels as normal as possible is much healthier for it long term. Insulin requirements will often decrease to very low levels too."


    Glycemic Status and Predictors of Relapse for Diabetic Cats in Remission

     
  18. Elaine - Charlie

    Elaine - Charlie Member

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    Dec 15, 2015
    No, he is 1 1/2 years, can't figure out how to change it, but, thats ok :)
     
  19. julie & punkin (ga)

    julie & punkin (ga) Well-Known Member

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    Feb 17, 2011
    Do you know what caused his diabetes? Was he on dry food before diagnosis? Did he have steroid shots? It's a bit unusual for a cat to become diabetic that young.
     
  20. Elaine - Charlie

    Elaine - Charlie Member

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    Dec 15, 2015
    Yes, he loved his dried food and I also gave him wet. I think it was from a steroid shot he was given, which I believe (my mind is buzzing at the moment) was given due to his hairless appearance when first found.
    Yeah, both my vets have run different tests and even they admit they are stumped and suggested I get a consult from a Internal Specialist
     
  21. julie & punkin (ga)

    julie & punkin (ga) Well-Known Member

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    Steroid shots are well-known causes of feline diabetes, so if you know he got one, that may be the source right there.

    I wouldn't pursue it further at this point.
     
  22. Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey

    Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey Well-Known Member

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    Jul 18, 2011
    Okay, you might not want to do this right now, but when your brain feels up to it, take your cursor to the top of the page where your name is and a box will drop down. On the left side you'll see "signature". Click on that and you can then make any changes to your signature line. Then click on "save changes" and you're done!
     
  23. julie & punkin (ga)

    julie & punkin (ga) Well-Known Member

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    Feb 17, 2011
    I should have clarified that my comment above was specifically in response to the comment right above with the suggestion that you get a consult from an internal specialist.

    Would you continue posting so we can help you monitor what's going on in the next couple of weeks? If you have lab results from the tests the vets have run, it's really helpful to add them to your spreadsheet. It's already set up with a tab and the names of the usual tests.
     
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