Ginger Update

Discussion in 'Lantus / Levemir / Biosimilars' started by Dyana, Sep 11, 2016.

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  1. Dyana

    Dyana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    Previous Condo: Ginger Spec fPL Normal


    Ginger has been really hard to pill. She is on Cyproheptadine for appetite stimulant, and last night I finally tried it in a gelcap, and added some wet canned food to the end of the gelcap. After 4 tries of her spitting the gelcap out, the gelcap was pretty soggy and wet, so I was easily able to push one end of the gelcap in and make it smaller and finally put it in her mouth and held her mouth closed with my fingers, and when I released her mouth it was gone (down her throat?). She ate pretty well last night (mostly if not all gravy Fancy Feast).
    I am stopping the FortiFlora as it is not helping with the soft stinky stools, and it could possibly be contributing to her tummy issues. I am trying to sprinkle a little probiotics on top of her food instead.
    Last night, she kept wanting to go for walks. Every hour, I took her out on a harness and leash, and I did notice that she was holding her tail straight up and trotting and even galloping a little. Before, her tail was held low and was actually touching the ground with each stride, which is very unlike Ginger to let her tail touch the ground.

    This is the report from the ER:

    upload_2016-9-11_14-19-13.png

    She ate that night, and a little in the morning around 7:30am and was fasted until her appointment at 3:00pm (so close to 8 hours, since it took awhile before they actually did the ultrasound).


    This is the report from the IM doctor:

    upload_2016-9-11_14-21-13.png

    The IM doctor said that the next step is to fast her for 24 hours to get another xray, I guess to see if the food or hairball or other material is out of her stomach after that length of time.

    Her Spec fPL came back normal.

    This past Friday, I called our regular vet, and she suggested doing the xray and or endoscopy, but she would not be available on Monday (I have tomorrow off).
    I then told her about how hard Ginger is to pill and can she please call in a prescription for cyproheptadine to be compounded into a flavored liquid and I ordered some liver flavored to be mailed to me (it will take about a week in the mail).

    I then called the IM vet's office and asked them to send me the full report of Ginger's ultrasound as I got so little in the report (above). The doctor was not in and the receptionist told me that they don't release that information without the doctor's permission and she will not be back until Monday, so am awaiting her call back tomorrow.

    Today, she ate her first breakfast of Fancy Feast in gravy (CPC) and I put out Fancy Feast classic for second breakfast and she would not touch it.

    I was thinking as it became close to noon, that since Ginger only ate her first breakfast around 8:00am this morning, and wasn't eating this afternoon, that maybe I would withhold the cypro today and let her fast herself and then take her in tomorrow for that 24 hour fasted xray the IM doctor suggested.

    OT: I have to go to the dentist sometime, tomorrow,too. They want to call it an "emergency visit" even though I called them on Thursday about a tooth that was bothering me, and they will work me in, when they have time.

    So, the cats and I were outside around 1:30 today, and I for some reason decided to see if Ginger would eat out on the porch as my cats (J.D. & Ginger) used to love to "picnic" on the porch. I brought out a flat plate, a spoon, and a fresh can of Fancy Feast gravy, and there Ginger was at on the other side of the door meowing at me happily when I opened the door to come outside (because she always reads my mind, and knows when something yummy (HC) is being served). I smooshed 1/2 can down into the plate so she won't scarf & barf and she ate all of that and another 1/4 can afterwards.


    Hopefully, she will keep on eating without the cyproheptadine now.


    I have been keeping track of Ginger's information in a tab (still) called Ginger and Kitten in J.D.'s spreadsheet. One of these days, I will enter her blood work results in there, too.
     
  2. Gussie's mom (GA)

    Gussie's mom (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Jun 25, 2016
    Sending keep eating vines! :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
     
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  3. carfurby (GA)

    carfurby (GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2012
    I'm glad Ginger is eating for you. Maybe she'll get over whatever this is and you won't need any more tests. I hope she keeps eating. Sending prayers.
     
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  4. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    Have you tried nausea medication since they gave her the cerenia shot? If so did it help her appy? I have never fasted my cats more than 12 hours for an ultrasound. :bighug:Vines too
     
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  5. Ella & Rusty & Stu(GA)

    Ella & Rusty & Stu(GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2010
    What a great idea to have a picnic! Ginger, keep on eating those delicious fuds! "More picnics, mamabean, please."

    Hugs and scritches,

    Ella & Rusty
     
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  6. Dyana

    Dyana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    Thanks :bighug:
    After I posted, I took the rest of the can of HC gravy food outside and Ginger finished it, CPC.
    Then the cats partaked of some of the cat nip plant that is growing in a pot outside my condo.
    They both ate some, and Ginger was settling down for a nice snooze on the grass, and Jackson was lurking next to her. First he dared to touch her back foot with his paw and got a hiss from her. I told him to just lay down. He sat. He waited until she was almost in a nice sleep, and then jumped over her and disturbed her relaxation! I yelled at him that that was not very nice, Jackson, and he slank off under the bushes opening and closing his mouth, like he was saying something under his breath.

    I went inside, grabbed a big old folded comforter, a beer, and my laptop, and went to sit out in the nice weather (in the shade) with them. They both got on the blankie instantly acting like I had brought them treats. I didn't.

    The Wi-Fi is a little iffy out here, but seems to be working.
    Ginger has since moved to the bushes behind me to snooze, and Jackson is way off "staulking" something.

    On 08/29, I gave her 1/4 pill of Ondansetron around noon, and at 5:00pm, she had her vet visit and they gave her a shot on Cerenia, and I gave her another 1/4 pill of Ondansetron the next day, and none of it helped. It was not until late at night on Tuesday, when we were at the ER that they gave me some Cypro that she started to eat. I could tell she was hungry that late night at the ER, but she would only mouth the treats I brought her and then spit them out.
    I still see her chewing to the side, and saw her chewing with her face moved back and forth to the side when we were out here and she was eating some cat nip leaves. I had all three vets check her teeth and mouth and they all said they see some tartar, but the ER and the IM vet said they are "not a dentist", but her mouth looks okay.
     
  7. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    From personal experience 1/4 of an ondansetron wasn't enough for Max and he heeded cypro when first diagnosed. After a month I was told to up the dose. Soon cypro was not needed. He rarely vomited but was nauseous. Let us know what the fPL 1 shows. If positive before more diagnostics I would treat the nausea. JMHO as ECID. :bighug::bighug:

    I'm glad she is eating and keep giving her the cypro as long as it's needed.
     
  8. Dyana

    Dyana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    I just moved to my deck which has much better internet connection. I was and still am pretty disappointed with this new laptop, thinking incorrectly, that I would be able to access the internet wherever I carried it :banghead:


    Her Spec fPL was 1.8
    upload_2016-9-11_16-32-29.png
    My Ondansetron was for J.D. and he went to The Rainbow Bridge (it still breaks me up to say that...:() in November of 2014. The pills I used on Ginger were J.D.'s and already split and had been split for around 2 years.

    I did find a few Ondansetron tablets from the same "era" that have not been split yet, that I can try.
    It's just that the cypro was working and the ondansetron (I gave) was not doing anything.
     
  9. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2015
    Dyana, I am sorry you are going through this with your baby. I feel your pain. After Bubba had some outdoor time today, he is a new cat. Amazing. I hope you get some answers soon about Ginger and good luck with the dentist.
     
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  10. Dyana

    Dyana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    Thanks, I need the good luck with the dentist, part. I haven't been to see the dentist since this same dentist worked on the tooth that is hurting, in five years. I didn't eat on that side for over a year and a half. He kept coming back to my cubie and saying are you numb yet, and before I could say no and please give me more novacaine he was gone. Before him, I bragged about my dentists, all the time, at every opportunity. Then, one of my favorite dentists all of a sudden threw his drill against the counter because I jerked when he hurt me. What do you expect me to do if you hurt me? Anyway, from bragging about my dentists all the time, to now being afraid of them, that's me :nailbiting:

    I'm glad Bubba is feeling a lot better since he got outside :bighug:
     
  11. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Jun 15, 2015
    Dyana, having worked in that field for over 40 years, if my dentist I worked for ever pulled that crap with a patient , I would stand up and say "that's enough" and would walk out the door and quit on the spot! If you can feel the drill, you are not numb AND that is not your fault. There are methods to giving an injection that takes on hot teeth and he should learn them. Sorry for my rant but that crap makes me so mad!!! I realize that his frustration was out of not drilling into your cheek when you jerked but it is an automatic reaction for you to jerk.

    Preface your appointment with your experience and tell the dentist if you feel it you will raise your hand and you are trusting that he will stop ASAP and give you more anesthetic. I will be keeping really good thoughts for you tomorrow.
     
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  12. Dyana

    Dyana Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Thanks, Bobbie. I am not looking forward to it. It was actually two bad experiences. I used to go to a husband and wife team, and that's the husband who threw the drill. I know he was probably afraid that he was going to drill something he shouldn't. I just couldn't trust him again after that. Before that experience, I loved him, I bragged about him, I didn't feel the drill or have the anxiety that I now do (I loved the dentist I had when I was in California too, and bragged about her all the time). Soon after the drill throwing, I quit Dr. R's practice, and opted for another dental practice. I told Dr. S the story. Dr. S (the second dentist (I won't put bad words here)) seemed hyper and flashed in the office to ask if I was numb yet and flashed out before I could say "No".
    All I want is enough novacaine, that's all I want.
    In other news, for the last two weeks, my hip and back have not been hurting me much.
     
  13. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Jun 15, 2015
    :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug: Glad the hip and back are better, thank goodness as you don't need that right now. Lots and lots of good vetty vines to you tomorrow. Ask her if she knows how to deliver anesthetic into the bone for profound numbness. That is how we used to do it in the endodontic practice.
     
  14. Wendy&Neko

    Wendy&Neko Senior Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2012
    Sending good dental vines for you and appy/good vetty/X-ray vines for Ginger. :bighug::bighug:

    When my previous dentist quit due to a hand injury, it was hard for me to find another dentist. I finally found one through a friend, but now he's getting close on an age of retirement. :arghh:

    Neko is also hard to pill. I got the Buster pill gun, and it's been a life safer. You can put water into the piller first so you get pill and water in one go and it helps get the pill down. Before that, Neko was awfully quick with her tongue to get the gel cap out. She still does occasionally, but I win more often now. :)
     
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  15. Dyana

    Dyana Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    That pill gun looks interesting. The one I have is about 7 inches long and like a stick. I'm always afraid of bruising their throats with it when then jerk and twist and choke on it.
    Because Ginger ate today, and she just ate again, (more HC :rolleyes:), she will not be getting the xray tomorrow as the vet wanted her fasted for 24 hours. I will just talk to the IM vet on the phone about getting the ultrasound report mailed to me.
    "deliver anesthetic into the bone for profound numbness" sounds scary. I don't know if I will remember those words, but can write them down and take them with me :nailbiting:
    I have other problems so I haven't been thinking about my hip. I used to think my hip and back and walking problems were in my mind, because I can walk 12 steps completely normally and the next 12 steps can be with a huge limp. I'm like why? Is it all in my head? But the xrays show bone on bone arthritis, so I guess it's true..
    The cats have had a great day outside, but it's time to get them in, so I can go grocery shopping, for more HC food.
     
  16. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    :bighug::bighug::bighug:You have so much going on now. I'm sorry.

    Max needed cypro to eat when he didn't get the right dose of ondansetron. The problem with just cypro is that while it's getting her to eat, if she's not eating due to nausea it can cause food aversions. Try it for awhile because sometimes it's just not eating making her not want to eat and once she eats regularly she will be fine. It might be something else causing the inappetence but pancreatitis does ebb and wane. You might have tested when it was resolving?
     
  17. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2015
    The delivery system for delivering into the bone is called Stabi-dent. We actually had general practicioners that had trouble getting certain patient numb send them to us first to numb them and then they would go back to their dentist to have the dentistry done.
     
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  18. Dyana

    Dyana Well-Known Member

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    Dec 28, 2009
    Thanks, Bobbie. I will try to remember. I want Stabi-dent.
     
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  19. Kathy and TiTi

    Kathy and TiTi Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2016
    For what it's worth. In a study done about 10 years ago, dentistry "boasted" the highest rate of suicide of any othr profession.
     
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  20. Kathy and TiTi

    Kathy and TiTi Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2016
    Seems like she's eating now. Glad for you. As to pilling, well, this might or might not help: I stroke my kittys' throats , until they swallow-the stroking sometimes seems to cause an involuntary swallowing. Here's hoping Ginger gets well, you have an unremarkable dentistry, and your hip holds up.
     
  21. Gussie's mom (GA)

    Gussie's mom (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Jun 25, 2016
    Oh my......
     
  22. rhiannon and shadow (GA)

    rhiannon and shadow (GA) Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2012
    I am wondering aloud here....

    am I reading right?
    Her chewing seems a little off to you?

    since FORL is so very common for cats....
    if they are doing an xray of any body part.... I ask for a mouth xray too....
    simply because FORL is not visible by looking in a cat's mouth....at least not until the teeth are truly being resorbed.

    It could very well be a combination of hairball and some sore mouth issues....


    I empathize with your dentist issues....
    I hope your experience tomorrow is one of the better ones...
     
  23. Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey

    Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2011
    Sending good dental vines for you and good app vines for Ginger. :bighug:
     
  24. Dyana

    Dyana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2009
    Ginger ate more than her normal amount of food yesterday (although all HC when she normally eats LC).
    At bedtime, she came to get her treats and ate them but not with the gusto and purring that she usually does. She started to lay next to me and then went and slept in my bedroom closet all night. When I called her in the middle of the night to give her a few more treats, she did come to me and eat them, and then went back into the closet.
    She ate more than her normal amount of food (all HC) this morning, and spent some time outside. I wanted to get the cats back inside, so that I could shower and start to do some housecleaning, and she went the opposite way and around the condo building to the outside were the street/parking lot is, and sat between a neighbor's bushes and his deck, where I could not get her. I sat down on his porch steps and she still would not come out. I then saw white and movement, and Jackson had come all the way around the condo building to join us. I told him to get her, and he got right behind her and pressed (a little) against her, but she wasn't moving. So, Jackson and I went back around the building to my condo where I loaded up my squirt gun (it was either that or a broom stick, as she is not really all that interested in treats like usual). I came out of my house with the squirt gun, and there she was outside coming back around the corner and to my house. She reads minds.

    I just got off the phone with the IM vet we saw, and told her that Ginger has been eating without the cyproheptadine for 2 days and eating pretty well, and I do see improvement in her. Ginger was out in the living room with me... and the doctor and I were discussing the cyproheptadine and how she was becoming untrusting of me when I was giving it, hiding, and being very difficult to pill, and how I had ordered some liver flavored liquid cypro from a compounding pharmacy, ...and Ginger left to go hide in my bedroom closet while we were talking about it. She reads minds.

    I had originally called the doctor's office to ask for the full report on the ultrasound to be mailed to me. I asked her if she saw any thickening of her intestines and she said no. She said she does not believe it is IBD or Lymphoma but the only way to tell is a biopsi. I told her that I would probably do a dental before doing a biopsi.

    I told her that yesterday when she wasn't eating, that I was thinking about just fasting her the 24 hours and getting that xray done, but then she ate and ate and ate. She said because she is eating and not throwing up, that she has probably passed whatever was shown in her stomach on the last xrays.

    She asked what the Spec fPL came back as and I told her a 1.4 and she said the results can vary and she may still have pancreatitis. I asked about an anti-nausea medicine should she have pancreatitis and she said not all cats have nausea with pancreatitis and as long as she is eating with the cypro, that should be enough.

    I told her that I have one (old) cerenia pill left that I could give her and she said I could contact my regular vet should I want more. She said that the hyperthyroidism could be playing a roll in this, and agreed that persuing the i131 (once her T4 comes up) and/or the dental would be a next option.

    I have not called the dentist yet. I am chickening out. Maybe I will. If I don't eat on that side, it doesn't hurt.
    It's the same tooth that the doctor "fixed" the last time I went 5 years ago, and I didn't eat on that side for over 1 and 1/2 years, so am used to it. All he did was cap it, but...


    That's my story. I need to get housework and laundry done. It's a beautiful day outside too, so will be taking breaks by getting the cats out :cat:


    Thank you for the vines and well wishes. Please continue sending any spare vines you have to Ginger.
     
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