? Wynk low at +6.5

Discussion in 'Prozinc / PZI' started by Cara and Wynken (GA), Jan 4, 2016.

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  1. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    ran home at lunch and HAVE to go back to work. I will come home early if you guys think I should. Take a look... Usually nadir at +9... I better pretend to get sick and come home, right? Advise?
     
  2. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Looking at SS brb
     
  3. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Tough call. Cara. It is a great nadir if he starts back up. Which he has done as often as he has nadired late. When will you be home tonight (+?)

    Either stay home and watch or leave some food out so he can bring himself up if he drops low and leave work early?

    The dose was great this am and should be fine, but he does surprise us......
     
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  4. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Looks like you have to go back to work so I would leave out some food and try to get home early. He should be fine but if his pancreas is helping out, it is hard to know.

    You might invest in an automatic feeder that you could set to feed every 2 hours on days like this. He seems to eat anything he sees, so that would spread it out.
     
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  5. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Yes, I had already left for work when I got your messages, but no big deal! I did not leave out any food, because I want to see what he does. I usually don't get home till +10 at the earliest… Or more usually at +11. I think I'll go back to my desk and stay for about an hour and then invent some excuse why I need to leave. That will put me home right about at +8. I don't expect him to dive in the next hour and a half, do you? Honestly, I suppose I could turn around go back home right now… What do you think?
     
  6. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    I am guessing he will be fine. His pattern has not been to drop fast but to have a gentle drop until he is lower at nadir, or to nadir around +6 and then go back up. Either of those scenarios would keep him safe.
     
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  7. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    My gut also tells me this, so thanks for looking at his numbers and corroborating what I feel. It's actually a beautiful sunny day in the sunporch that they live on is really nice and feels good. Besides checking his blood sugar we also played with the Mousey on the wand and he and his sister had a fabulous time! :p I'm still going to try to be home here sometime in the next hour… Just to be sure. And also to find out whether he headed lower or whether he went back up, which might be valuable information later?
     
  8. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    He's fine. Will check at +10, weigh at +11, and give him the *same dang meal* he ate this morning ;) after I check his PMPS.... (can you hear him complaining already? LOL)
     
  9. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    My wacky "bouncing baby boy" went up tremendously at +10. It was so weird to see that value that I double checked it a couple minutes later. :confused: Yup. Pink. Quick too, since he was blue an hour ago... Or was THAT reading off? I have to run a different kitty to the vet at 5:15, but will be interested in Mr. Unpredictable's PMPS.:rolleyes:
     
  10. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Well, the good news that he had a normal nadir and stayed in that range for 3 hours. And yes, then up fast. I vote for a bounce as he has done it before, both up and dropping down by a bunch. Sir Wynken seems to like extremes.....

    Will watch for the pmps.
     
  11. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Yes he does!:banghead: 469

    2u?
     
  12. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    2 units sounds reasonable to me.
     
  13. Carol & Murphy

    Carol & Murphy Well-Known Member

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    quite the roller coaster ride today, Cara.
     
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  14. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Yup. :eek::rolleyes::confused: And there's more....

    This evening I got involved in rescuing a "dumped " DECLAWED cat at a low-income apt complex. It's supposed to get down in the teens tonight. Soooo... I'm suddenly missing almost 2 hours of my life! But the kitty is safe in my outbuilding which is warm, and she now has everything she needs. I hope she settles in. She seemed very afraid although I tried to get to know her while she was still in the carrier. Makes me mad... She is not feral! And I'm pretty sure that at one time she was cared for… ((sigh))

    I built lots of spots for her with soft beds and once she explores she'll find she has a pretty good set up!
    I know it happens thousands of times a day, but how can people declaw a cat? And then just abandon it in the outdoors in the winter? :mad:

    This "crazy cat lady crap" is not for the weak of heart!
     
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  15. Carol & Murphy

    Carol & Murphy Well-Known Member

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    Oh, bless you for rescuing this poor abandoned baby - I hope she calms down. How long will she be with you?
     
  16. Lol. Furever. :);):D
     
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  17. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Well, I don't have any plans to keep her. Just to make sure that she's safe and warm. I really have far too many cats! And once I take one on, they're with me "furever" as Carl said. I have successfully found homes for many cat over the years. I am left with a lot of kitties that became mine, primarily because they were unadoptable. What no one really understands as they are the most perfect cats! :joyful:
    I am too tired to check blood sugar before bed or during the night tonight. Hopefully tomorrow's cycle will not be a themepark thrill ride, like today was.
     
  18. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    Oh Cara, thank you for taking care of that sweet baby! People who declaw cats just make me so mad...and then to just leave them at the mercy of the wild! Without their natural defenses! Grrrrr
     
  19. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Here she is, Rachel! She hid all night and wouldn't come out this morning or at lunch when I buzzed home to check Wynk's BG. But tonight I woo-ed her out and she is SO SWEET!! I could just kill whoever abandoned her.
     

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  20. Carol & Murphy

    Carol & Murphy Well-Known Member

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    She is beyond adorable. She looks so young!! Oh, I pray she finds a great forever home very soon
     
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  21. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    Oh my goodness! She is so completely adorable! I love her!!!!!
     
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  22. Sharon14

    Sharon14 Well-Known Member

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    She's beautiful!!! I too have rescued lots of kitties through the years(have 14 now) so I know how hard it is to find good homes. Good luck!
     
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  23. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Sharon, we must share a gene. I had 14 cats for many years... Lost 3 last year and then took on what turned into a "foster failure." So I have 12 currently with 5 being 17+.
    I have to find a home for her, as cute as she is, and SWEET personality!

    Even though they all pull at my heartstrings, it wouldn't be fair to my others if I kept her. Too many of them need too much of my time! (Darn). :rolleyes:
     
  24. Sharon14

    Sharon14 Well-Known Member

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    My oldest is 23. Since Colin became diabetic, I can't take any more either. Can't afford it! It's so hard around here to find good homes though...
     
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  25. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Twenty three! WOWZA. That is impressive (and wonderful!) I hear you about finding good homes. There is not a terribly strong spay-neuter awareness here in NW Ohio and there are many that are dumped or unwanted in the shelters. (((sigh))). Once they are under my control, though, they either get a good home, or I keep them. :cat:
     
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  26. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    His amps looks fine - only 20+points since the last two days. Your 1.8 looks good. Hope we can hold it for a few cycles and see if he settles in.

    I am a big fan of two shootable shoots a day with a normal nadir time. So much easier to deal with than a late nadir, stalling and then having to skip. Hope this pattern continues.
     
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  27. I am a big fan of two shootable numbers a day too. That's why I feel that the sooner a caregiver gets comfortable with shooting lower numbers with a lower dose, the better. As far as when nadir happens, we can't control that. Given that the rate of insulin absorption can vary by up to 50% on any given cycle, and lots of other factors like food timing, amounts, carb content, what the pancreas is doing or not doing, etc?... nadir timing can be influenced, but not controlled.
     
  28. Merlin

    Merlin Well-Known Member

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    Bless you for rescuing that so very adorable kitty. She is so precious.
     
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  29. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Yes, Cindi she really is! I already love her. You can't rescue them all, but you can rescue some!!
     
  30. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Dang.... What's UP WITH THIS CAT? I just got a PMPS of 123 @Sue and Oliver (GA)

    I will stall and retest at 6:30... He better be above 150!!!!!
     
  31. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    He is very unpredictable! Just when I thought he was going to be a little more "normal" for us. Yes, I hope he goes up.
     
  32. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    He is!! And he has eaten the same meal for the last 4 cycles... :banghead:
     
  33. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    I waited until 6:40..... 132 dammit.....

    Now how come I can't assume (or check) that his blood glucose is higher in 20 minutes after I feed him and inject the insulin then? He is eating like a horse. His plate will be clean in about 4 minutes
     
  34. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    All I can do is tell you what I would/wouldn't do. You get to decide for yourself. 132 on an AlphaTrak is low to shoot. Yes, he'll likely come up with food, but it's the food that will bring him up while the insulin is taking him down. It could mean a night of bringing him up with food, to keep his numbers up. IMHO, it's not safe or beneficial to do that. It is necessary when they hypo, but I wouldn't want to set up a scenario like that on purpose.

    You might be able to give a token dose of .5 or lower, but then I would get tests tonight to make sure he stays in safe numbers.
     
  35. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Ok. That helps. I really don't get the technical reason for it - because every time I skipped shooting in the evening he's sky high later that nite and seriously high for the next AMPS. BUT I believe you and I trust you... And (selfishly) I ... want to sleep. ;)

    Thank you Sue. :bighug:
     
  36. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    If you didn't have to work tomorrow, I'd advise waiting 2 hours after he eats and if he is 150+, then give him a token dose. Then tomorrow, you'd need to check 12 hours since this new shot time and shoot when he is high enough. "Chasing" the number is a way to be more aggressive with ProZinc. (Waiting until he reaches your target). But it only works if you are around and can test. It's often the way cats go OTJ, on small doses, shooting when it is safe.

    The good news is that his amps is generally lowering and he has some nice blues and greens stuck in there. Considering he has been on insulin several years, he is doing well. Maybe what today tells you is that 1.6 is a better dose for that 250-300 range. And maybe he needs a dose held for a couple days while he drops and rises and then settles.
     
  37. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Ah, I think I see the logic in that technique! How I wish I could just take the day off and try that! I just checked at +1 (which I never do) because I was curious. 219 :) I will check at +3 as well. May be good to know how fast he rises, with no juice, eating this particular meal. :D

    Thanks for reminding me I did 1.8u this morning. I won't do that again, but just 1.6 for that range. What I actually have written down now is:

    325+. 2u
    225-325. 1.6u (just wrote "do not give 1.8" by that)
    150-225. 1u

    Question: what do you mean by "maybe he needs a dose held for a couple days" when it will depend on where he is in the table above? Or do you just mean don't give 1.8, when I should have given 1.6 like the mormings before?
     
  38. Merlin

    Merlin Well-Known Member

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    I know it is hard to skip a dose and I hated to skip a dose too, so I decided that when I see a lower dose, I am going to start shooting. So at first, of course, I was not shooting anything under 200. Then I decided that I would shoot a token dose at 180 like a 0.2u. Typically, that was never enough so after a few shots at 180, I lowered the no shoot number to 160. I shot 0.20u and that seemed to work pretty good. When I got a 140 one time, I didn't want to stall so I thought I would shoot 0.2u. That worked good too. So one time I got a 130 and 0.2u worked good too. That is the lowest that I shot and I was using a human meter. Anyway, what I am trying to say is to slowly start to lower your no shoot number and start shooting and, of course, test to get the results. Even though Wynk is a little unpredictable, you still may be able to find your lowest number and you can stay with your regular 12 hour cycle.
     
  39. I wish I'd seen this before now...

    Back in a minute, gotta switch keyboards.
     
  40. You could have. In fact, although we probably don't realize it, we do that every time we give insulin. We always know that the number will be higher, due to food, by the time the insulin kicks in 2 or 3 hours later. We just don't think about it when we see a "normal shootable number" at AMPS or PMPS.

    Exactly. Because the food pushes the number up, gives you a higher number that has got no insulin working against it, and next morning you see the effect of no insulin for 24 hours.

    1.8 wasn't "too much", or at least you don't know that for sure. "Too much" would have been a dose that dropped him under 90, or under 68, or whatever number you decide is "under normal". SLGS says on an AT meter, you reduce the dose by default if a cat drops below 90. If you were following tight regulation for Lantus you'd reduce automatically if below 68 on an AT meter. Not sure what number gets an automatic reduction if you were following the TR protocol for Prozinc/PZI because nobody really follows that protocol here. Wynk might have gone lower in between +5 and PMPS, or he might have reached nadir at +12. No way to know for sure.

    Interesting that Sue mention this, and she is right that when a cat is close to going OTJ, it's a technique that some people use. Rather than wait until 12 hours later, people will determine that at some time after +12, when a cat reaches a specific BG number, they will give insulin before the number goes higher. They might end up shooting every 18 hours instead of every 12 hours, using small doses to keep the BG in low number ranges. Eventually, then don't need to shoot any more.
    I say it is "interesting" because it is also what the Tight Regulation protocol for PZI calls for. The BIG difference is that people pick their "shoot number" and as soon as the cat gets that high, they shoot insulin. As long as it has been at least 6+ hours after the previous shot. They routinely shoot three times a day. The goal being to keep the numbers from ever getting "too high". Extremely aggressive protocol and requires LOTS of testing.

    Agree, sort of. If you were to do that, you'd be shooting at +14 instead of at +12. But you DON'T need to wait until 12 hours later, or create a "new" shot time the next shot. You can test at the normal shot time, and if the number is high enough, you could shoot. Technically, that would be at +10 from the previous shot, but it would be back to your "normal" schedule. There is no rule that says that you have to shoot Prozinc every 12 hours. It is supposed to last, according to the manufacturer, between 10-14 hours. Not 12. Today's cycle looks like it ran longer than 12 hours. Some cycles you might see it "poop out" and last only 10 hours. That doesn't mean you have to wait to shoot on the long cycles. And it doesn't mean you have to wait 12 hours to shoot on the short cycles. There isn't an insulin in the world that lasts 12 hours exactly for any cat. The primary reason behind a 12/12 cycle is because it works best for "human schedules". It inserts a degree of control and regularity into the diabetes treatment routine, it splits the day in half, and it helps us to evaluate the whole thing with some degree of control over what we are seeing.

    Cats can't tell time. Their bodies don't work like clockwork. Time controls human lives, not the rest of the natural world.
     
  41. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Thank you for the additional food for thought, Cindi and Carl. I really appreciate all the info about how to think about this... He did go up to 390 at+3... it will be a few bouncing cycles, if his pattern holds... Sigh.

    I feel like after not shooting, any progress getting him regulated basically gets erased, because he goes back to wild extremes... Blacks then blues and sometimes greens... Is this true, about losing progress towards regulating him? Or am I just making it seem worse than it is? :(
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2016
  42. It's not a huge setback. What you lose is "momentum". Sort of two steps forward, one step back, but not back to square one. Every day is a learning experience, so don't worry about it :)
     
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  43. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Ok, I'll try not to!
     
  44. How's he doing "beyond the numbers"?
     
  45. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Fine, really. Since I've been paying a lot more attention to him during all of this testing it seems to me he sleeps a lot -but he probably always has. Also he doesn't want to go outside into his outdoor enclosure as much, but that's probably because it's really cold outside now. He always perks up when he sees the sock filled with rice. He jumps right up on the wicker bench he gets tested on. Although sometimes he hates me messing with his ears he always holds still and lets me do it. I see him washing his face and looking outside the window. During times I've tried to get him to play with the mouse on the wand, he engages immediately and jumps around after it like I would want him to. So clinically, he's fine. :DThanks for asking!
     
  46. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    Cara, if it helps to know, I would have skipped the dose too. On an AT, I would never have shot at the numbers you got.

    I think Sue is saying that Wynk may need the dose to remain the same for a few cycles. Some cats need a few cycles to let the dose really start to work and bring them down. Again, it's an ECID thing...but something you could try.
     
  47. Carol & Murphy

    Carol & Murphy Well-Known Member

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    Hang in there, Cara. Back when I thought I could get Murphy regulated, these were the worst of the worst for me - low pmps and wondering what to do I would usually give a token dose after he ate
     
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  48. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Thanks Rachel, that does help. I may try what Cindi talked about but only on a day I am home all day.
     
  49. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Thanks Carol... I may start doing that in the evening if he's close to shoot able.. But only if I think I can drag myself out of bed to check him in the nite.
     
  50. Carol & Murphy

    Carol & Murphy Well-Known Member

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    well, my thinking was that, just given a token dose (less than 1 unit) and after he ate & I checked it and he was high, I didn't have to worry that much I am not a fan of getting up in the middle of the night
     
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  51. How can she do that if she is using a scale for dosing? Which dose would you pick?
     
  52. Sue and Oliver (GA)

    Sue and Oliver (GA) Well-Known Member

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    If I were you, Cara, I would stick with the 1.6 for the pre shots in the 250 range and 2 for the higher ranges. That's what I meant about shooting the same dose for a while. Switching to the 1.8 seemed to give you the late nadir and need to skip. The 2 units looks okay for today. It brought down an expected high preshot to a shootable pmps. I hope he will get back on track now with lower ranges overall. My thinking is that he has a few unpredictable wonky cycles after a low and after a skipped shot and it takes him awhile to settle back down and do a little more of the expected. The fewer skipped shots the better.

    This weekend when you can be around, it will be easier for you to be more aggressive with the dosing, if you want.
     
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  53. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    That all makes perfect sense to me, Sue. Thanks again so much for gently sharing your knowledge. You are a blessing! :joyful:
     
  54. I don't agree (big surprise :) ). As I said last night:
    If you take last night's numbers at face value, 123/132, you could argue that Wynk was rising, which means nadir happened sometime between +5 and +12.

    As far as a " shootable pmps" goes... If you take Cara's scale from above:

    325+. 2u
    225-325. 1.6u (just wrote "do not give 1.8" by that)
    150-225. 1u

    then last night's number was almost shootable.
     
  55. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    Personally, I'm with Sue. That way, hopefully you'd get 2 shootable preshots. Since stalling didn't bring him up to a shootable number, I'd want to reduce some so that hopefully I could shoot more often rather than skipping. Just my thoughts.

    Of course, you hold the syringe, so the decision is yours.
     
  56. Carol & Murphy

    Carol & Murphy Well-Known Member

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    I do as Rachel suggests
     
  57. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    Hmm. Well obviously there's more than one way to think about all of this. And that's ok. Like many things in life, our different individual experiences and outlooks shape our philosophy and cause us to approach things differently.

    The important thing here is that all of you are explaining why your approach makes sense to you, and everyone has Wynken's health as a priority....and I do appreciate it!
     
  58. Carol & Murphy

    Carol & Murphy Well-Known Member

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    Cara- I went through exactly what you are going through (well, except the part about possible going OTJ) a few months ago, so I was just relating how I approached it
    Carl - please don't give up - this stuff is extremely stressful to those of us having to deal with how much insulin to give- it really helps to have lots of advice from different points of view
     
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  59. Cara, I haven't given up on you and Wynk. It's like everyone else is looking at a different speadsheet than I am.

    In the 5 years I've been around, I have seen many people say, hundreds of times, that the big advantage of PZI/Prozinc is that it is "flexible".

    Unfortunately it is rare that people use it that way, and extremely discouraging to even more rarely see anyone advise people to take advantage of the flexibility.

    It's just "words".
     
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  60. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

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    I'm glad you are not giving up, Carl. I agree with Carol... It is stressful to not quite understand enough to be sure of what to do. Although I think I'm getting a better "feel" for it all the time.

    But it takes all kinds of different input to learn. Everyone has been good to share their knowledge. I don't believe there is an absolute right way and and absolute wrong way. Wynk is a little weird, it seems like. I have no experience like you and Sue do, looking at everybody's spreadsheet. I have tried to look at a few, and I can't see any theme or pattern emerging that I can comprehend. So no one here is wrong in what they are suggesting, IMHO. EPID - every person is also different.
     
  61. I never created a spreadsheet for Bob. I wish I had at times, just so people could see what I did. By the time I started posting on the board, he was almost OTJ, so I never asked for any dose advice.

    I will say that if people saw it, it'd probably scare the crap out of them. But it worked for Bob. Have you ever looked at Bandit's SS? It doesn't make me bat an eye...
     
  62. Rachel

    Rachel Well-Known Member

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    It's true. Everyone here has their own opinions and feelings on things. The good thing is that we are all able to explain why we feel the way we do. That's the point of a forum. We all give our thoughts behind our advice. The bean makes the decision based on what they read. And since we can all remain polite and civil here, it's a good experience for everyone.

    Carl doesn't bat an eye at Bandit's SS. That's fine. That's his opinion and he has given his reasons behind it. I do. It absolutely terrifies me and I'd never suggest anyone follow dosing like that. That's also fine because I have given my reasons behind it. Cara holds the syringe and can take both perspectives into account and make her decision from there.

    I'm glad we have this open forum so different perspectives can be talked about in a calm, friendly manner.
     
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  63. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    OMG! She is so sweet and looks like she will have Maine Coon in her. I want her! BUT, I can't. being unemployed and dealing with FD and now a epileptic dog, there are no more funds. But, gosh she is so sweet looking. You won't have any trouble getting her a forever home. Bless you for saving her!
     
  64. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    I keep coming back to look at that cute little face again. She looks like she is going to be a big girl with those big paws! Stop, my heart......
     
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  65. Sharon14

    Sharon14 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2015
    She's awfully cute, Bobbie....
     
  66. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2015
    I know..... how far is Ohio from PA??
     
    Cara and Wynken (GA) likes this.
  67. Sharon14

    Sharon14 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2015
    I believe they're right next door to each other...
     
  68. Here's the thing though, Rachel. Kevin is the caregiver, and he is following his vet's instructions. He's grateful for our suggestions, and doesn't resent our advice which is overwhelmingly negative to what he is doing. Except for me. And the reason that I don't bat an eye is because he isn't batting an eye. And his spreadsheet shows no reason, (other than our own preconceived notions about Prozinc and dosing), for concern. Would I tell someone to follow the method he's used? No, I'm not that aggressive. But I have no problem supporting HIS choices because he's taken full responsibility for doing things way more aggressive than anyone here might think is "okay". Which I have done every time he has posted an update.

    "Aggressive" works and I believe beyond a shadow of a doubt that it offers the greatest chance of remission. Just like with Lantus and Lev, an aggressive treatment method offers the best chance at remission. That doesn't mean "TR" for Prozinc. It means trying to get the numbers into lower ranges as quickly and as often as possible. It also means that every cat really is different, and each cat requires a different method of dosing. It means different doses on different BG preshots, and taking advantage of "long cycles". That's the way things used to be done in PZI. Look back at the oldest threads on this forum. And before that, on the old board that is no longer accessible, a whole lot of people did follow tight regulation for PZI. That's where most of my "thinking" comes from because I see that it worked. And although I wasn't posting here when Bob was diabetic, and most of those people were no longer around when I joined, I would have fit right in with them. I never asked for advice here. And that's not because I felt that the advice was "too conservative". It was because I (like Kevin) had total faith in my vet and her methods, which just happened to be aggressive. I had no clue that was true, it was just what I did.

    And I really, really don't mean to sound harsh or critical by saying this, but I have always believed that if I had joined FDMB and immediately started asking for dose advice here, Bob would never have gone into remission. So that's why I am the lone voice in the wilderness trying to make people understand how I think.
     
    Jill & Alex (GA) likes this.
  69. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2015
    In retrospect, I wish I had been more aggressive and that said each caregiver needs to be comfortable with what they can handle and be able to monitor. I understand that the advise givers need to feel Okay with what they are advising the beans to do.

    I think everyone here is wonderful and appreciate all the advise and opinions I received. None of them fell of deaf ears.
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2016
  70. I've been watching Bubba over your shoulder for quite a while. You're doing an awesome job, and he's looking fantastic! Love the eye patch too.:D
     
    Bobbie And Bubba likes this.
  71. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2015
    Well, I am extremely grateful that @Sue and Oliver (GA) planted the seed that Lantus could be a better fit for Bubba as she said it to me multiple times and to you @Carl & Polly & Bob (GA) that you nagged ( not really the right word) me to CHECK his ketones as you kept saying something was WRONG! I would have never thought to check ketones in the 200 range that he was stuck in.
     
  72. And I will always be happy that I was around to nag you ;). Also I'm happy that when "R" became a part of the equation, you had a couple of the greatest minds on the board guiding you and getting you through it!
    You probably could have used R with Prozinc. The thought never crossed my mind, because since I've joined, nobody has ever used R and P together. Prozinc is better suited than the L insulins really, because it offers the flexibility of adjusting dose and shot times around your R shots, while (as you've seen), Lantus doesn't. What you had to do was keep the Lantus doses and shots constant, while trying to figure out exactly when it was safe and helpful to give the R. Lots of fun with a kitty who nadirs at +12, huh?

    Years back, like 2009-2010, there were people here who used R. There are some old threads that I've found very interesting and informative. But now there's nobody here with practical experience with it any more.
    The great thing is that the path you chose was best for Bubba, and that's what matters!
     
  73. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2015
    Oh, I know that! Everyone's suggestions to us just fell into place! ;) @julie & punkin (ga) she responded to the ketones and tagged Jill and Libby and the rest is history.
     
  74. Cara and Wynken (GA)

    Cara and Wynken (GA) Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2012
    I am still here, and really enjoying reading all the posts! I'm sorry I haven't been able to respond to anyone, but I have enjoyed listening to the conversations… I've just been really busy with all of the kitties lately. Maybe I can catch up this weekend. :)
     
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