05/14 - Small Kitty amps : 477 +3 328 +6 272 pmps : 518 +2 320 +4 193

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Photorecon

Photorecon

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Good morning their friends,

First I'd like to say thanks to all of you who answer the call during the last few days. Numbers are high
this morning but at least we seem to have an idea on where nadir is, around +5.

With all information provided I start to understand feline diabetes probably better the my own vet, cause of you and resources on the internet.

So I went on with a slightly more then .5 dose increase, would like to have those high numbers go down
to stop the ravage.

Small kitty seems to be feeling as alert as yesterday, eaten as much if not more then yesterday. I opened the
valve on food this week, 2/3 of a can this morning, just hope I'm not doing any damage to the liver.

I'll keep on testing before noon at +3 intervals, hope there will be no bounce...:(

13/05
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/posts/1676221/
12/05
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/posts/1675875/
11/05
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/posts/1674980/
 
Good luck with the dose increase and glad that Small Kitty is alert and eating. Did you decide if you are getting a ketone meter? I use the Precision Xtra and I have some strips that I will be selling in the supply closet for a good price.(they are pricey) I over bought when Bubba had ketones and these strips are good through 1/31/17. If interested look in Supply Closet.
 
Hope that the increase brings Small Kitty's numbers down for you! I followed your emergency on the Health forum and you did an amazing job with her!
 
Yeah, seems we're getting somewhere with this 2.5 : 272 !!! + he's eating like mad, almost 3 small
cans of Fancy Feast Classic like the ones I was recommended + seems he's feeling great (sleeping time) :

IMG_6415.JPG


Time for me to go outside and take some sun, been hiding since spring this year.

Will resume testing later today, hope Gl will go even lower, crossing my fingers.
 
Sebastian, can you please keep Small Kitty's spreadsheet up to date? It'll help us to help you and Small Kitty better. I can't tell exactly what dose you shot today, but everyone in yesterday's thread was recommending just a 0.25U increase. The TR protocol calls for a 0.25U number when you have been seeing yellow on a dose. Which you were seeing on 2.0 units. And remember that you are using an AlphaTrak, so the numbers will look a little higher than for those of us using human meters.

Lantus is a depot insulin and does not work quickly to yank down numbers. It requires patience as the depot is built. That patience is the hardest thing most of us have to learn. Please go back to 2.25U tonight.
 
I agree with Wendy. Lantus isn't a fast-acting insulin - which is part of why it's so great for diabetic cats. When you're dosing with Lantus, it's like you are steering a large barge. Small correction to the steering wheel then wait while the unwieldy beast moves the direction you want. Many people initially think it's more like a speedboat with a quick response, but if you're seeing a quick response that may not be a good thing.

When you increase the dose, it can take a few cycles for that depot to "grow" to fit the size of the new, larger dose. Small correction, then wait to see what it can do. You'll be amazed at what a difference 0.25u can make to a cat's blood sugar. Such a small amount but insulin is a powerful hormone and our kitties have very small bodies. Following the Tight Reg guidelines for how much to increase and how long to wait in between dose increases is a great foundational point to start with. As time goes on, you'll want to adjust what you do to "fit" SK, but it usually takes at least a couple of months to get a good grasp of how Lantus works in one's cat.

We have a saying here that is very true, "it's a marathon, not a sprint." It's likely that SK was diabetic for some time before it was discovered, which is true of most of our cats. He's not going to heal overnight.

I'd also encourage you go back to 2.25u this evening. Oddly enough, too much insulin can also cause high numbers, so it's important to not overshoot the "right" dose by increasing by too much at a time.

Hope you got outside to enjoy your Saturday! Love the pic of SK - he looks a lot like my McGee. Love tuxedo kitties!
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Sebastian, can you please keep Small Kitty's spreadsheet up to date? It'll help us to help you and Small Kitty better. I can't tell exactly what dose you shot today, but everyone in yesterday's thread was recommending just a 0.25U increase. The TR protocol calls for a 0.25U number when you have been seeing yellow on a dose. Which you were seeing on 2.0 units. And remember that you are using an AlphaTrak, so the numbers will look a little higher than for those of us using human meters.

Lantus is a depot insulin and does not work quickly to yank down numbers. It requires patience as the depot is built. That patience is the hardest thing most of us have to learn. Please go back to 2.25U tonight.
Click to expand...

The spread sheet is up to date, my understanding was that 2.5 would be appropriate with all the red and black results.
and the Small Kitty context. I'v just administered the pm shot the same as this morning, 2.5. Small Kitty is eating a lot,
weight increased since the last 3 days (spread sheet updated).

So should change to 2.25 ?
 
Today has not been great for me, been sick this during the day. With the beautiful sun I decided to go to my second
job by bike cycle and it could have turned very bad. This was to be the first time I was going there
by bike and it's quite a mess to get there. 1h into the ride I started to have epileptic feeling, called an aura.
I stopped somewhere and almost don't remember what happened. I did a full scale seizure then took the
bike to what I tough was the streets to go to the building but I got lost. It probably took me 3h to get back
home, I dont remember how. As I really wanted to get rid of the job today I went there by bus and subwa and probably
made another seizure. I always do the grocery when at this place and I bought things I already had and noting
I needed. On full ''auto pilot''.

Thanks God nothing happened, kind of lucky. Hope SK will have the same luck as I had today.

Feeling tired now, will not sleep very lately. Epilepsy seizures are like a storm in the brain, it's very frightening.
 
Sorry to hear about the seizures - that must have been very unsettling. I am glad you are OK. :bighug:
Photorecon said:
The spread sheet is up to date, my understanding was that 2.5 would be appropriate with all the red and black results.
and the Small Kitty context. I'v just administered the pm shot the same as this morning, 2.5. Small Kitty is eating a lot,
weight increased since the last 3 days (spread sheet updated).

So should change to 2.25 ?
Click to expand...
Thanks for updating the SS. We determine the Lantus dose based on how low it takes the kitty. SK got into the yellows on 2.0 units which means 2.25 units would be the next dose. As hard as it is, try to ignore the high numbers.

One other thing to note, the +2 tests on Lantus can be really interesting. If you see a +2 test that is a low lower than the preshot, that is an indicator of an active cycle that may need more testing. If you see that and can't monitor because you are very tired, make sure you leave out lots of food for SK to munch on, to bring himself up if he needs to.
 
Thanks for helping Wendy, seems you know a bit about Lantus !

Can the increase of 2 units made today been seen by his system as something to react, like
reducing insulin production ? Is one day at a higher dose enough to disturb the pancreas ?
Hope not, the spread sheet is already a very bad sight.

And yes, I'll leave food in good quantity because I'll be sleeping very early.

More results will come tomorrow, I'll be preparing raw food for the cats, hope they're gonna
like it :)
 
How scary on the seizure!! Glad you're home and OK!!

Photorecon said:
I'll be preparing raw food for the cats, hope they're gonna
like it :)
Click to expand...

Don't be surprised if they don't.....it's a totally different texture from anything they've ever eaten and texture is an important part in what our kitties will eat. Transition them slowly for the best results

Photorecon said:
Can the increase of 2 units made today been seen by his system as something to react, like
reducing insulin production ? Is one day at a higher dose enough to disturb the pancreas ?
Click to expand...

The concern we have is that if you increase too much (or too fast) you could go past the "best dose" for Small Kitty. Since he made it down to the 200's last night, you should have only increased .25 instead of .5, so you should go back to a 2.25 dose for now

Since it looks like you already gave 2.5 this morning and tonight, just make sure you get a +2 on him tonight and if the +2 is lower than the PMPS, you will need to get at least one more test in later tonight if at all possible.

I'm sure the stress you've been under isn't helping your health, so we'll try to keep in mind that you need your sleep when we make our recommendations....but we also want to keep Small Kitty safe (which is the only reason we'd suggest setting an alarm to get more tests in at night when we think it's really important)

Edited to add...when you post your new post tomorrow, you only need to put the link to today's post in. You don't need to put all the links from all your older posts....Just the most recent one from the prior day
 
Photorecon said:
Can the increase of 2 units made today been seen by his system as something to react, like
reducing insulin production ? Is one day at a higher dose enough to disturb the pancreas ?
Hope not, the spread sheet is already a very bad sight.
Click to expand...

It doesn't really work like that.

However, some cats will react to a larger dose by increasing their blood sugar temporarily. We call it New Dose Wonkiness . So in that way, yes, it's possible you'll see some higher numbers before they come down. There is a second post in that thread I just linked on NDW that explains it a little more in simpler terms if that would be helpful to you.

The focus for most of your decision-making on doses is on the low numbers. You always want to be asking the question, "how low can THIS dose make my cat's blood sugar go?" Jill wrote a post a few years ago called "Should I Increase the Dose?" that might be helpful. My concern, as I've already mentioned a couple of times, is that we really don't know yet how low even the 2.0u dose was getting Small Kitty. Somehow that information needs to be gotten. If you have a day off soon I would encourage you to do a curve, although if it's a bounce day, don't bother. The high numbers aren't helpful. If you get up to go to the bathroom during the night, try to grab a test.

You're not the first person to increase the dose based upon the high numbers - it's a natural reaction. But the way the depot insulins work isn't always intuitive.

That sounds very scary and disconcerting. I'm sorry you had such a rough day and hope tomorrow will be better. :bighug:
 
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