? 1/7 Myagi amps 163, +2 133, +3 89, +5 61 avg, +6 70, +7 81, pmps 143, +2 127, +5 139

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...3-2-92-4-5-96-10-3-151-pmps-176-5-147.189212/

Amps 163, 0.5u, didn't eat a lot, but ate - seemed ok, think he just needed less.

 

+2 133 eating
(fyi, no timed feedings here, they are both grazers and eat round the clock except for pre shot windows).

 

Looks like he might be heading down to the lagoon again, with that drop @+2
He's looking good on this dose.

 

I hope Myagi keeps sliding down and gives you some green today.

 

Thanks! I hope he does, and (anti jinx) with no bouncing involved!

 

Myagi, there’s a nice pair of green surf shorts with your name on them by the beach.

 

Wearing them!!!! gotta learn to surf now!

+3 89

 

Yay Miagi! You look great in green!

 

+5 61 avg - 1st 56, 2nd 67, same drop blood - opened new test strips so always check with two.
Question - steer at all with carbs or just see what he does? He has eaten a bit of lc just now.

 

I think you’re good to feed him LC like you did and see if he surfs. It’s not a huge drop and he seems to be at his nadir anyway, which means he will likely head up on his own soon. Those 3 readings you got are pretty much the same number.

 

Thanks mama. Trying to keep big girl pants on and not mess him up. But the closer they get to lime, the scarier it is.

 

You can test on the half hour, it may reassure you. Always good to have data. You’re not messing him up, you’re fixing him up!

 

+6 70. whew

 

Nice

I agree with Stacy a little bit of LC is probably all he'll need to surf along.
He seems to have slowed down somewhat from his initial drop, probably leveling off.

As a general rule the earlier and the steeper the drop the more heavy handed you might need to be to steer effectively.
The later you are in the cycle and the slower the drop the lighter the touch.

With all that said, if they are angling for a reduction.........

 

This is a lovely read this morning.

 

Lol. He failed his earlier reductions, so I'd love to be able to hold this for a while so he's truly ready.

Does anyone else's kitty not care if they lay right on top of a dish of wet food?!? Omg!

 

LOL right beside it maybe.......

 

Nope! Ate, then rolled over right on it and stayed there till I moved it and wiped his coat. Now he's bathing like I did something wrong! not first time either. Lol

 

Heidi

Myagi is doing so well on this dose now that I’m not sure how much my observations can help you but I’ll give you a few. You may very well be aware of these.

• By and large, if his +2 is less than his PS, he’s going to have a pretty active cycle. If you look on 1/5 when you didn’t test until +3, he took a substantial drop. Most likely, he was dropping by +2 but you want to try and catch the drop early enough to just slow it down a bit and flatten him out. With Myagi, you might think about trying to give him some timed feedings of LC food earlier in the cycle (AMPS, +1, +2, +3) just to make him a bit flatter. He’s not a champion diver, but on lower doses, he was diving and bouncing.
• Controlling the drop with LC food can also allow you to hold the dose longer. I don’t know what % carbs you are using for him but if he’s a good eater, you can give him between 6-10% carbs to, hopefully, keep the nadir up a bit. Keeping the nadir = holding the dose (if it gets him into green) = healing pancreas
• A very good technique is “getting them on a surfboard”. We want to teach the liver to like green numbers. To do that, at the first green number, be sure and feed him a couple tsp of LC food and see if he will get on that surfboard and stay on it for longer periods of time. You don’t have to overfeed him but the goal is to teach the liver that “green is good” . This goes back to bullet 2 above.
  
• Like many FD cats, a flat yellow cycle with Myagi, often is followed by a bounce break. Look at 12/28. Down in blue, bounce and then he was pretty flat from PMPS (312) to AMPS (294) on 12/29 to +2 and then he cleared.
• He looks like he also gets a “high before the break” occasionally. He bounced again on p.m. cycle of 12/30, then came down so you probably thought he might clear, and then up to red on 1/1. Then guess what....he cleared the bounce that cycle. That red was the “high before the break”.

It will be interesting to see what patterns he develops going forward now that he’s on a dose that is getting him more consistently into green!!

Please let me know if you have questions about the above. You’re doing great with him!

 

@Marje and Gracie
Biggest hugs and thanks from me and Myagi and even Millie (cause she does love her some Myagi)!
More questions I'm sure will come, but for now it's only the food. He gets 0 to 3 carb food exclusively with young adult zero crunchies on top to entice when low appy. My cupboard goes straight to mc and hc for crises and I don't have resources to change it up. When I did have some 4 to 8 carb food he spiked on them (and enjoyed them lol), which is why all daily food has been 3 and under. Timed feeding not really an option as they won't touch the auto feeder, have always grazed, and my work schedule is about to radically change making me unavailable most of day (why I was so anxious to take as many steps with him now as possible, as he'd allow lol). So given that, can I still help him surf with the less than 3?

Also, and this is huge (And I keep forgetting to ask till wee hours alone). Is there a no shot number over 50?

If he's under 100 mostly for a week he gets a reduction?

If he drops below 49 on 3 separate occasions, he gets reduction? Or do I count as newbie and it's once under 50?

More later! Thanks again!

 

+7 81

 

Pmps 143, 0.5u, eating (tortured me first, but just wanted attention/ more lovings.)

 

+2 127 happy playing napping preening pottying but not eating and dang it mama is tired!

 

What I did when I didn't have a higher LC is mix some food up.

So if you have some 13% and some 1% if you mix it up in equal portions, that gives you some 7% (13+1)/2=7
Equally if you mixed 1tsp 13% with two TSP of 1% that would give you 5% (13+1+1)/3=5

 

+5 139

That's what I thought, but the last time I mentioned doing that and learning it here in forum, I was pretty much told I was nuts. That a 13 carb and 1 carb is now a portion of 14 carbs. Idk

 

The following that logic, if you give 2 portions of 1%carb does that make it 2%?
I think not.

We are talking percentages, not absolute carbs. I think whoever told you that is not understanding how to do the maths.

If we were talking grams of carbs that would be true it would give you total grams of carbs in the mixture.

Let me explain.
If you take 100g of 13% carbs that would have 13g of carbs in 100g.
Let's mix those 100g with 100g of 1% carb there would be 1g of carb in that.

So now you have 200g of food with 14g of carb.

So now let's work out the percentage in the mixture.
14g in 200 ---> 14/200=0.07 multiply by 100 to give you the %carbs and you get 7%

Does that make sense??

 

??? Have no idea what I did with the reply above but if you touch it you can see what I wrote.

 

Erk. Erm. Argh.
I was thinking to mix foods coz of limited availability. Nil/low carb + usual carb. Proportion to meal. Seemed to make math sense to me

 

But see M, if I give a whole can of 3 carb and a whole can of 1 carb, I've still given the 3 carb. The carbs don't disappear. Like when you give tsp 20 carb to raise bg - it's only a teaspoon, but it's still 20 carb. Idk

 

Missus. I think I am too tired too.

Sweet dreams.

 

If you reduce the portion does not the carb impact diminish?

xxx that you called me M. Tiz my nickname.


arghhhh...

We need weight watchers !

 

LOL on being too tired, it's morning here in Spain. I'll try and explain it another way, or see if I can find some previous posts where others have explained it.

I had to get a few cups of coffee before answering your questions, I function better.

Yes. But if unsure ask the question on your condo. I used to like to see George mostly in the 50-80 range for a week before taking a reduction. But at the time I was available to test midcycle, retrospectively, when he went all green like that I didn't need to test him as frequently as I did, because he basically went really flat, he did do the high before the low thing a couple of times to. But if I needed to be out I did feed him higher LC, or sometimes even MC if I was concerned, sometimes I could tell that I had over done it, because his numbers were up at the end of the cycle, the insulin had pooped out because of too much carbs, usually he recovered pretty well from any heavy handed carb abuse on my part. I didn't let it bother me as it was a way to keep him safe. I tended to er on the side of caution if I had to be away.

Reductions for one drop under 50 for a newly diagnosed cat (less than a year).
The 3x under 50 is for longterm diabetics or it can be a useful tactic if he has proved himself not to hold reductions.
Although you have had to go up after going down in dose, those reductions were not taken with drops under 50. In my experience, often, when reductions are taken when they are not earned, we see the CG having to go up in dose again. Great explanation in the thread by Gill, link below.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...ng-reductions-and-starting-otj-trials.150160/

So for now I would take the reductions for a single drop below 50.

That's a hard one to answer.
Generally on TR you would aim to shoot anything above 50. But anytime you are shooting lower than usual you would want to be around to monitor, or at the very least leave some higher carb food out if you need to dash out.

A lower than usual preshot needs to be taken in context. Where are the numbers heading?
Look at the earlier numbers, are they falling? flat? or on the rise?

Say for example you were to get 90 as a pmps. Look at the preceding cycle, is this number showing a rising trend or is it falling, could he be clearing a bounce?
Say you look back at the data for the preceding cycle and you see that he was 65 @ +9, then you would say he approaching the end of duration and the numbers on the rise, as the Lantus shot will not usually onset for a couple of hours, so shooting and feeding normally will often result in a nice flat cycle.

However if at +9 kitty was at 120 say and now he's at 90, number is falling, you can still shoot, but you may need to be a little proactive on the feeding testing front. See the link to myths debunked for a super explanation.

If you shoot when a bounce is clearing the numbers can gather a lot of momentum, it doesn't mean that you should not shoot, just that you need to be aware and again be prepared to be proactive with feeding and testing.

He hasn't given you a green PS yet so what we normally suggest is that you post up for help. Someone experienced will be able to look at the numbers take into consideration the points above and advise and stick with you till the excitement has passed.
Whenever we encourage someone to shoot low, it's an unwritten policy, that they stay with you until he is in the clear. With different time zones we will sometimes, 'play tag' and one experienced member will handover to another to be sure you are not left on your own.

It may be helpful, when you get some rest, to read the sticky on shooting and handling low numbers, I found I needed to read it many times for it to sink in. It will at least give you an idea of what to do should no one be around to help on the day you get a green.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/lantus-levemir-tight-regulation-shooting-handling-low-numbers.147/





And this is thread by Libby is also very informative, especially, on shooting low, and shooting a falling number, I know it helped answer a lot of my doubts/ questions when I started, and helped me feel more confident about shooting low.
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/tight-regulation-protocols-myths-debunked-combining-merging-protocols-good-idea.111088/

 

You said
'Maybe I'm just too tired cause it does AND it doesn't. If i give a whole can of 13 carb I've given a whole can of 13 carb. No matter how many cans of 1 carb He also eats, He still had a whole can of 13 carb. Right?

I think I'm too tired. Lol'

But perhaps since you're still up (for which I'm grateful), you might answer the shot and reduction questions I posed? Thanks! (Post 21)

But you are not giving a whole can of both, you are mixing them up in equal portions, and then giving him his portion, whatever that is. If you have mixed up equal portions, then there is a total of 14g in the 200g of mixed up food you have.

That equates to 7% carbs; (14/200)x 100 gives you the Percentage carbs. when you have made up the mix.
So that food is now 7% carbs.

Think about a cup coffee.
If you have one cup of coffee with one teaspoon of sugar
And then you have another cup of coffee with 3 teaspoons of sugar.

If you mix those two cups of coffee up in a jug, you now have 4 teaspoons of sugar in that jug, but it's disolved in twice the volume (2 cups)

Now pour out the coffee into two seperate cups.

You will have the equivalent of 2 teaspoons of sugar in each cup.

Does that help?

 

Good morning! Thank you!
That was awesome and really clear. So helpful. I've 're read shooting low many times and have copious notes on TR before starting, but you have cleared up what wasn't. Lol. I will read Libby after coffee

 

Don't kill me! It does IF you can look at carbs in that way. Bottom line - I originally thought it was a great idea. It does work for convenience. Worse case scenario he'd get a low hc food for a short window (which won't hurt him). Oy! Hope I didn't torture you!

 

Why wouldn't you??

Those teaspoons of sugar are just simple carbs.

 

Because you are adding the simple sugar to the existing liquid per volume. But like a can of soup the carbs are "in" it per serving. So if it says 20 and the can has 3 servings and you eat whole can you are eating 60, not 20.
So if Myagi was solo and ate 1 can 2 carb and 1 can 10 carb at the end of the day He ate 12 carbs that day. If I mix them in the morning and he finishes all, hasn't He still had 12 at end of day? But if you put Millie back in the equation (like your coffee analogy), and she had 1/3 to his 2/3, then is she having a 4 carb day and he's having an 8 carb day? Or is a 6 carb day for both? See the confusion? I do want to understand if it's ok to mix to get that higher lc food, but I promise it isn't critical. Lol