cowboy cookout question

Hi, I just gave Imogen a spoonful of Cowboy cookout as many people recommend it. She loved it. The ingredients concern me though (carrots, gravy etc) even though it says low glycemic. Can someone confirm? I have been giving her Purina D/M which she also likes but I haven't seen it recommended. She will start insulin tomorrow so want to make sure I have the best knowledge on her food.

 

On the Binky's page, it says it's 5% carbs Binky's Canned Chart. My cat won't eat it, but I know a lot of people on here feed it...

 

Hi Imogen's Person! (I love her name!) I can't give you the actual breakdown of nutritional information, but we fed my Rufus Cowboy Cookout for three years and he loved it, and was doing fairly well with it. In fact, the only reason we stopped buying it was that we couldn't find it locally anymore. One of the chief mottos around these parts is "ECID" (Every Cat is Different), though, so it might be that it isn't as good an idea for my neighbor's cat.

If you're testing, Imogen's numbers ought to tell you whether it's the right food for her, but unless she's a picky eater, there are lots of other good foods to choose from. :smile:

 

The Purina DM is a little higher in carbs than some of the over the counter stuff, and more expensive. Oliver wouldn't eat it and he ate everything! Too much liver I think. Cowboy Cookout sounds good. Have you checked out the food chart? Weebie gave you the URL. There are lots of options.

Have you tried to hometest? We really want you to do that so each shot you give her will be safe to give.

 

Thanks. haven't started insulin yet so only urine testing at this point. Vet says it's important to keep her on purina d/m to get her regulated. so many opinions, it's hard to figure out which is best!

 

I believe I remember Dr. Lisa (our "resident" vet) saying that Cowboy Cookout is as close to the nutritional makeup of a mouse as you can get in commercially-available food. It's an extremely good food. Don't worry about all those fruits and veggies in the ingredients list. Apparently, they are present in teeny-tiny amounts, not enough to mess up the excellent nutrition of this food.

I used to feed it to my transient diabetic (and she had wonderful numbers on it) but stopped because one of my civvies gets bad asthma "fits" if he gets any beef - just licking the already-polished bowl was enough to make him ill. So now I feed Grammie's Pot Pie (another Merrick flavor) instead, because it doesn't cause the asthma to kick up if the allergy-cat licks the diabetes-cat's bowl. The diabetes-cat's numbers are still good on that, but not quite as good as on Cowboy Cookout.

 

I know it is very hard to take advice over the internet over your vet. This site has gotten hundreds of cats into remission using hometesting, lo carb and insulin protocols. When I decided to take the advice here, I figured my vet was like a gp - she knew a little about a lot of things. The people here know a lot about feline diabetes.

The DM wet is better than dry and if she will eat it, it is not awfully high in carbs. But hometesting is vital. The urine testing will tell you how she is doing hours after the insulin because it has to work its way through the body to the urine. It won't tell you whether it is safe to give a dose of insulin. If you have read the recent hypo posts, you can see how important it is to know exactly what the blood glucose level is at any given moment. Only bg testing will give you that. The other analogy I like is that you wouldn't get a prescription for insulin for your child and then come back in 3 weeks to have her tested. It just wouldn't be safe.

 

Hello, again, Imogen's Mom!

I'm glad things are going well, so far. Even if Imogen is not yet on insulin, it's a good idea to start learning to hometest, as soon as possible. The urine testing is not accurate, though it's better than nothing. It took me a while to get Calliope into hometesting because she was less than cooperative, but we got it done and the first number I got was in the 40's. This didn't show up on the urine testing, so I was darn glad I got the hometesting accomplished. If I hadn't, I would have never known that it was time for a decrease on the dose.

I know things can be confusing when the vet tells you one thing and the folks here might suggest something else. I was in that boat. I like my vet, but nearly everything I did for Calliope was contrary to her advice because I decided to go with the suggestions given here. They were more conservative, in nature, and I found that to be logical. It was just that simple.

My vet first suggested I put Calliope to sleep because her blood sugar was at 500 and she was a sweet kitty, but not at the vet. My vet didn't think I could shoot or test her. I didn't either, at the time. I came here, posted and read and instead of bringing her to the vet for the last time, I got the insulin and testing supplies and started the journey.

At first, I bought the dry prescription food, but after learning here that low carb wet food was better, I returned all the dry food to the vet's office, must to my vet's disgust. She was certain that the dry was better. Well, now she calls me for the list of the foods I fed Calliope to give that list to other clients.

My vet told me to start with 4 units of lantus. I was thrilled that she used lantus since I'd read here that it was a good insulin, but not thrilled with the dose. I started at 1 unit rather than 4 with all kinds of warnings from my vet. I tested the urine for ketones, regularly, though, which you should do also. Good thing I listened to the folks here to start low on the insulin because it wasn't long before I had to reduce that dose. The wet low carb foods made a big difference with Calliope. Also, her blood sugar readings were lower at my house even though she was completely stressed out by the hometesting. We had very dramatic moments, but I knew the testing was for her own good, so I didn't let her drama queen tendencies get the best of me. It got better as time went on. The vet stress was much higher than at home, so the vet's numbers weren't even close to being accurate. My vet recognized that. To my surprise, I had no problems giving Calliope the shots. I did it while she ate and I don't think she ever knew she got a shot.

So, what happened was that Calliope was off insulin completely, in less than 3 weeks. The reason this happened was because I listened to the suggestions from the folks here. It doesn't happen in all kitties. Every cat is different. We were lucky, but the chances of a better result are higher with the protocols followed here. There's no doubt about that. All cats don't regulate immediately. All cats don't get off the insulin. However, there are plenty of things to try as you move toward regulation, which is really the goal. The folks here gave me another year and a half with a happy Calliope. She was 16 when she passed away due to causes unrelated to the Feline Diabetes. It was just her time to leave.

Well, that's the VERY SHORT version of my story. Remember that Imogen is YOUR kitty and YOU are the person who makes the decisions, whatever they may be, not your vet and not the folks here. Your vet works for you. You don't have to agree with everything a vet tells you.

My suggestions, for now, are:

Start low and go slow with the insulin doses.
Check for ketones. (You can get the strips to test the urine for these at the pharmacy.)
Start hometesting, immediately.
Feed low carb wet foods and watch how Imogen handles those. (Calliope loved them and we had some scarfing and barfing, so I had to feed smaller amounts at a time, at first. As her blood sugar levels decreased, she went back to her grazing habits of a little at a time, all day long.)
Keep a spreadsheet of the sugar readings you get when you test. Someone here can tell you how to stet that up, if you need help.
Introduce yourself on the lantus forum when you start the insulin. So much help there.
Read and educate yourself because when you do, all of the suggestions make a lot more sense and you can feel more comfortable in whatever decisions you make.
Love on Imogen! You will find that your relationship will become closer than you could have as you embark on this journey together and that's the silver lining in this cloud of feline diabetes. As Imogen feels better, she will know that you are the reason. It's special.

 

Thank you soooo much. Attempted home testing today which went over like a...I don't know what, but I'm still in a daze. Imogen spent the day at the vet yesterday so is still a bit grumpy so when I came at her with the ear test she was having none of it. I am consulting with Dr Spector on the phone who is working with my new vet (after my old vet said nothing could be done with diet and that using Lantus was taking my cat's life in my own hands if I wanted to kill her) Dr Spector has been AMAZING!! After researching and knowing lantus was the way to go I was thrilled to have the recommended by her. She foung a vet in NY for me to go to and is consulting with that vet as well. She has recommended starting with 2U's and has given me a chart on how to understand the readings and a chart for keeping track as well as doses I should switch to depending on her readings. She has said that it is important to start out with the Purina d/m and since Imogen has been eating it I figured it was fine. I throw in a teaspoon of cowboy cookout on occassion but so far she eats half of the bowl immediately and then grazes on the rest. (I'm given her a can and 1/4 a day) I think she has realized the days of dry food are over and has conceded. I do notice her coat had become not as silky and she has dandruff which is new but I am hoping that will correct itself when she is regulated.
Urine test still at 1% but that is all I have to go on since I am a disaster with home testing. My boyfriend will help me with the morning shift and we'll see how that goes.

 

I don't know what Imogen's blood glucose is running, but then kitties are first diagnosed and run in higher numbers, they can be pretty hungry because they aren't processing the food, correctly. I had to feed Calliope more food, at first, because she acted as if she was starving. That settled down, eventually. She went back to her usual grazing. Small meals during the day are easy on the pancreas. Some folks use timed feeders, here, for several reasons. One is to give the kitty small meals because it's better for them, as I mentioned, and the other is that there is food available during the day when they are away at work or wherever, so kitty can have something to eat just in case the sugar drops a bit. Some cats will instinctly eat something BEFORE it gets too low. Some don't.

Anyway, that's just a suggestion for you.

 

Hello Imogen, and welcome!

I would honestly serve her what she'll eat the best, if cowboy cookout is good for her and she loves it by all means give it to her! The vet has a job to do even if they are amazing vets, they gotta pay the bills to so having you buy their food makes her more money. I wasn't pleased with the ingredients at all in any of those foods, I'm very picky about the food I eat and my Jake n' Bake eats!

Here is a really informative video about home testing kitteh:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zE12-4fVn8

Good luck!

 

Her glucose at the vet was 338 but I am sure in reality is less. She gobbles up the 1st half of her meal and then grazes on the rest. She is definitely hungry by meal time and wakes me up at 6:45 knowing that 7am is her meal time. I'll try giving her a teaspoon of something before bed to see if that helps although we are trying to get her from 16 to 12 pounds. (she is a big girl).
I feel like no matter what I am doing, it could be the wrong thing and am stressed like I have never been in my life!! My boyfriend held her this morning in the burrito wrap (thank you!) and we did actually get blood, but not enough to get a reading. so close and yet so far! We can't imagine how anyone does it on their own!
Are there timed feeders for wet food?

 

Yes, there are. We love our PetSafe5 available at PetSmart. It is the only one we have found that our cats can't break into. It has a place for an ice pack, but I just freeze the food into cubes and stick it in the feeder. It's easy to set and use, and can be set for any time, not set prescribed times. We set it for 6am and then we get to sleep in awhile!

 

Imogen's mom! I was going to reply last night, but it turned out so long I felt like I was writing my "back to school" essay. (I considered ending it with "And that is how I spent my Summer Vacation"). So, I scrapped it. Today, I'll give you the abridged version.

I'm disabled (nothing that keeps me from moving about the house, though) and I live with my mom. Rufus was diagnosed nearly three years ago, and up until the very beginning of August she was caring for the cat that had been a belated birthday gift for me as a teenager! That is how long it took me to get over my fear of injecting him. Do not feel bad about having to tackle these things gradually. In my opinion, you're doing wonderfully.

As for the system? I think everyone needs to come up with their own method that works. Cats are truly individuals, and so are we, so not every technique is going to work for every cat. We can get inspiration from each other here, and sometimes other people can provide you with just-the-right idea.

I'll give you what I think is the catchall factor in the whole process, though: comfort. If you're new to testing and your rear is on the hard kitchen floor while Imogen wiggles around for freedom - you're going to be more likely to get frustrated, and eventually you may find yourself in tears while Imogen glares at you from the counter top, cleaning her bruised ears. (*cough* not like that's happened to me or anything).

All that being said, there is something that helps Rufus and I, and that is to sit in a certain soft, upholstered chair (one that he had already "claimed" as his own), and lay him down across my lap so that the arm of the chair is behind him and he can't back away out of my arms if he decides he doesn't want to play anymore. Sometimes (usually around meal times) he can get impatient and start struggling - this is the only time when I need help testing.

And just to give you a little bit of hope - this is a thirteen-year-old cat that hated being held and would only tolerate petting for moments at a time. You got blood - so, hang in there! (My first test was successful... followed by nearly a dozen abysmal failures! :lol: )

 

Good for getting blood even if not enough! That's a start. If it looks like I'm not going to get enough blood, I will massage the ear around the poke and bit and more will bead up, especially if you use a little vaseline on the ear. Next time, give that a try and see if it helps.

The manner in which you hometest is going to come to you, as you try different suggested methods. You'll will get a feel for the best position for you and kitty by trying out different things. Try not to be nervous as best you can because kitties pick up on that. I think that once the people get calmer, that's when it gets a little easier. You're not hurting your kitty. You are helping and you are keeping kitty safe. Keep that in your mind as you attempt to test. While kitties may like the position or having ears fooled with, you're not inflicting pain. They just don't like the act of it.

Eventually, it won't take two of you and eventually, you may not need the kitty wrap. I have a friend here who started out having to burrito wrap and it took she and her husband to test. Then, she and her husband were finally able to do it on their own with the wrap. Then, the kitty didn't need to be wrapped at all and THEN, the kitty started jumping up on the testing blanket to be tested because the kitty was looking forward to the Halo Liv a Little Chicken treats! Anything can happen so keep positive thoughts!

You are making progress each and every time you attempt to hometest!