? Going too low again! +4 @ 54

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (The Main Forum)' started by Panic, Jul 12, 2019 at 12:06 PM.

  1. Panic

    Panic Member

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    I meant to check Panic at +3 and got distracted, just tested at +4 .... 54!! Two nights ago she dipped down to the 70s and stayed there all night but we're in the middle of the day and she hasn't hit nadir yet.

    I just gave her a can of LC Fancy Feast which she's working on, it's very very close to 50...do I break out the higher carb food yet or no? Should I consider a dose decrease or not yet?

    Crossposting to PZI forum in a moment.

    Tagging those who were here the other night:

    @Bron and Sheba
    @Red & Rover (GA)
    @MrWorfMen's Mom
    @AliceMeowliss&Cassandra
    @Keskat
     
  2. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    take a test in 30-45 min to see where is she.
    Then, if needed, go to MC.
     
  3. Panic

    Panic Member

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    Thanks Tanya! Was just about to tag you since I saw you were online. Does Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers count as MC?

    Just checked on Panic - she ate an ENTIRE 3oz can in 3 minutes. :eek:
     
  4. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    Would you please update the SS?
     
  5. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    No, it is HC.
    For the moment you don't need it but do keep any MC/ HC close by.
    I wanted to see how LC alone works - which the next test will reveal.
     
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  6. Panic

    Panic Member

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    Yes thank you for the reminder, doing it now!
     
  7. Panic

    Panic Member

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    + 4.5 is 57. Do I offer her MC?
     
  8. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    No.
    Take another test in 30 min to make sure she surfs there, in upper 50s.
     
  9. Panic

    Panic Member

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    Okay, thank you! Will update then.
     
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  10. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    I agree with @Tanya and Ducia No need to pull out the big cans. The LC is helping Panic to surf the greens very nicely so far.
     
  11. Panic

    Panic Member

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    Are MC and HC cans reserved only for below 50? So I'll know for next time :p
     
  12. FurBabiesMama

    FurBabiesMama Well-Known Member

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    I would decrease to 1.75.

    Expect higher numbers after this but give things a chance to 'calm down'. There could be some bouncing involved.
     
  13. Panic

    Panic Member

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    That makes sense, thank you. Since I'm using U-100 syringes for her U-40 insulin, the conversion chart doesn't list 1.75, only 1.6 and 1.8 conversion. Do I stick with one of those or is there an image somewhere that can help me eyeball it better?
     
  14. FurBabiesMama

    FurBabiesMama Well-Known Member

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    I didn't realize you were using U-100. You should be fine to go with 1.8.
     
  15. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps it's best to see the entire cycle unfolding and decide then?

    The 2 U dose is the first one to give good numbers repeatedly.
    I think I would have been compelled to keep it to continue getting to the Greens.
    If Panic still needs to gain weight you can feed her a bit more, as in larger portions, or more ofrequent to avoid going too low.

    But , again, I am not ProZ user and should not advise on the dosing.
     
  16. Panic

    Panic Member

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    +5 is 74! :D Do I test again in an hour or is she alright? Her nadir is normally +6 I think. I was going to go to the store but it'd be 2 hours I'd be out of the house, don't want to leave yet if I need to stick around.

    I should probably add that in my signature now that I think about it.

    My scale at home isn't the most accurate but I definitely think she's hit 7 lbs at least by now. I personally think she's at a good weight now, that's pretty much her normal. She is still eating 3-4 3oz cans a day (including night meals).

    She normally eats 1 full can for breakfast, then she gets scheduled mini meals at +2, +5, and +6.5. Treats or small bites of FF in between sometimes. Then another full can for dinner.
     
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  17. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    I cannot tell in full confidence that she is going to be ok. I think she will be but taking another test an hour from now to check where she is better. Can you postpone your going for an hour?
    If she is still in the 70s - offer a bit more like a Tablespoon of LC and I think 2 hours out is totally ok.
    The current read of 74 is the food speak - the portion was rather sizable and takes a bit longer for the solids to be absorbed completely. Besides, there are hardly tests in the between +5 and until much later - the test at +6 or +6.5 would be very useful.
     
  18. Panic

    Panic Member

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    Yes that's not a problem, I don't want to leave if she still needs me nearby.
    My mom will be home but of course she doesn't test.

    Ugh I know!! I'm actually quite irritated with my manager right now...my work schedule has me out of the house six days a week by +5 even though I should only be schedule three days. I'm only able to get those late numbers once a week.
     
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  19. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    :D really good to read she has gained!
    About the +6.5 scheduled meal - it might have shortening effect on the dose duration, only might.
    Maybe you can try replacing that last meal with a snack for a couple of days and check if the preshots get any better?
    To make up for calories you can feed more in the first half of the cycle.
     
  20. Panic

    Panic Member

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    Yes we're all quite pleased with her!
    Sure, I can do that. Originally it was at +7.5 I think but Linda suggested cranking it back an hour, that was a couple weeks ago at least.
     
  21. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    @MrWorfMen's Mom i suspect her reasoning was the same - not to cut the duration with late meals?
     
  22. Panic

    Panic Member

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    Yes I believe so!
     
  23. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    I see.
    Then let me ask you about today - did Panic eat her regular + meal? Same carbs level, same amount?

    I mean that if you'd taken the +2 test and then feed her somewhat higher LC the +4 drop would not have been so dramatic. I got it - you planned to test at +3 and it is good timing but the +2 test today would probably show you the start of the lowering and if you dispensed a little higher LC shack or mini meal the +4 would be not that low. ETA: maybe alternate the test times +1.5 one day, +2 the next, +2.5 or +3 the next and the last one "out of the door test close to +5 when you have to leave?
     
  24. Keskat&Rocket

    Keskat&Rocket Member

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    Sorry I just logged in- glad to see she’s on the rise! :cat:
     
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  25. Panic

    Panic Member

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    Hm, well she eats the Poultry & Beef variety so she either gets the Turkey & Giblets, the Tender Beef, or Chicken Pates. I know they're not all the exact same carb amount. I could of course write them down and give her the higher of the three in situations like that if it would help? Today she had her regular 1 can for breakfast, and at +2 she had her scheduled mini meal. Then at +4 I tested her, no snacks between +2 and +4 today.

    I know I typically don't test until +4 during the day, and I test at +3 during the night. I'm all about changing for the better though, so should I change my first day test to +2 or +3 to prevent this?
     
  26. Panic

    Panic Member

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  27. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    Super good!
     
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  28. Panic

    Panic Member

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    Thank you so much for guiding us through this! :D I'm so anxious to break out the HC haha.

    I'll make a post over on the PZI forum and check with other ProZinc members if they agree with @FurBabiesMama 's dosage adjustment ^-^
     
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  29. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    That's exactly what would help!
    I think I would try feeding the lowest LC for brekky, shot, test at +2 and then decide what to feed at +2 - the same or the highest you have as her reg LC. Same just prior to +5 scheduled meal.

    It is all trial and error.
    The earlier tests especially BC you have to be out by +5 would help to catch the drop at onset and put some breaks on to it to slow down.


    mix/alternate the times - one day at +2 another at +3.
    The +1 or +1.5 will reveal the food bump that particular portion of food at brekky gave her. If not much of a bump - it is your early warning of possible drop. Again extra LC or higher LC at this instance would slow down the drop.

    I think she is rising, and most likely will be bouncing.
    I cannot advise on the Proz dose.
    (tbh, I'd keep 2U, the numbers it produces are so very fantastic)

    Make a note as to which LC you gave her at BG 54 - the same food but in slightly lesser amount is the thing to try next. It brought her up nicely and you stayed withing LC range, no worries about MC or HC interfering with the BG for long after.
     
  30. Panic

    Panic Member

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    I will absolutely do that and start adding the food choice into the notes on the SS to help keep on track! Sadly I'm not sure what she was fed this morning...I've opened up and emptied so many cans today that I'm not sure which one was the breakfast can!

    I agree her numbers have been great on 2u but I hate to think of her dipping too low during the weekend when I'm not even home! :eek:

    I can totally start alternating the tests as well, no problem at all. Thank you so much for the advice. :D
     
  31. FurBabiesMama

    FurBabiesMama Well-Known Member

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    It is certainly your call on what you want to do with the dosing. Either way, you will be monitoring and can deal with whatever comes.

    You could hold the 2 units a bit longer and adjust your feeding times to see if that evens things out - schedule a meal at about the point you know she drops. Or, you could try a drop to 1.8. I suggested a slight decrease because things were definitely headed too low today, and you had to intervene, but also based on the way the rest of the numbers look to me. I always look for ways to calm things down/even things out. What I don't like to see is extreme ups and downs and/or cases where you start having very different pre-shots where one is high and the other is low enough that you have to stall/decide whether it's safe to give the full dose. I have found it to be better to have a dose that can consistently be given and that levels things out more and allows the cat's system to adjust. It is better to gradually have the numbers decrease overall than to create a ping pong ball situation. (It is much easier to create volatility with ProZinc than one of the L insulins.)

    I think either choice is fine at this point. Whatever you decide to do, you can probably expect some higher numbers as a result of how low she went today. So, just commit to a dose and hold it for at least a couple of days (with Mia, I found that it took 3 or 4 days to really see the impact of a dose and to allow any bouncing to fully clear) - the only exception being if you get a pre-shot that is so low you cannot safely hold the dose. Then re-evaluate the dose at that point.
     
  32. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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    @FurBabiesMama
    very valid points, thank you for providing diverse opinion!
    I am a Lantuser thru and thru - that why i suggest to talk to ProZincers.
    I tried to calm things down approach in the past with Ducia - it didn't really work very well and left me worrying about Glucose Toxicity all the time. But Panic is another cat. Things ought to be working differently for her.
    For now I am very happy to see her in good weight and in good numbers!
    And no one knows if she won't keep at it with decrease.
     
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  33. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Just seeing this now. Glad Tanya and FurBabiesMama were around to give you a hand.:joyful: I think you are bound to see a higher BG this evening or tomorrow from that major drop today. I'd tend towards lowering the dose to 1.8 and see if that lessens the drops and evens things out a bit. You can always increase again if need be but you don't want her going too low when you can't be there to monitor. :)
     
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  34. Panic

    Panic Member

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    Thank you all for the advice! Since ECID it's hard to know what the best method is. Because of my work schedule right now I am leaning toward lowering it and seeing how she does...and yes I can always go back up if needed.

    In case anyone was wondering, at +8 she was at 167! I hope she'll be high enough by PM o:
     
  35. FurBabiesMama

    FurBabiesMama Well-Known Member

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    Wow, that was a hard bounce. :eek:
     
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  36. MrWorfMen's Mom

    MrWorfMen's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Holy cow! You really need to put Panic's trampoline away! She must have overheard you worrying about whether she'd be high enough for her PM shot! ;)
     
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  37. CandyH and Catcat

    CandyH and Catcat Member

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    We were so glad to see that yellow for the AMPS .. c'mon Panic, back to the beach, play in the water, there are three of us sugarcats dabbling in and out, great little bonfire last night, we missed you -- okay if you freedive a little bit, let us know how it feels

    stay away from that carnival with the neon lights and screams
     
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  38. Panic

    Panic Member

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    RIGHT! :eek: She's a go big or go home kinda lady! Was happy to see her back in the yellow this morning but I'm keeping my eye on her today! o_O
     
  39. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Member

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    What is EDIC short for?
     
  40. CandyH and Catcat

    CandyH and Catcat Member

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    probably a typo for ECID -- every cat is different -- and yeah, EVERY :cat:cat:cat: is DIFFERENT -- they all want to be unique
     
  41. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Member

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    Thanks Candy, yes I typed it wrong
     
  42. Tanya and Ducia

    Tanya and Ducia Well-Known Member

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