Just started glucose meter testing and have ????

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (The Main Forum)' started by olivia1173, Sep 28, 2015.

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  1. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    I'm new to this so bear with me.

    The curves done at the vets off ice are as follows...
    8.18
    Using .5 units vetsulin
    9am 345
    3pm 98
    7pm 132

    8.26
    Using .5 units vetsulin
    830 482
    12noon 390
    3pm 295
    6pm 294

    9.3
    Using 1 unit vetsulin
    9am 538
    12noon 381
    3pm 361

    9.10
    Using 1 unit
    935 442
    1130 300
    2pm 361

    9.28
    Trying curve at home as I think bubba is very stressed at vets office. We have been using 1.5 units since 9/10.
    830 (before shot) 126
    -gave 1.5 units at 9am
    1130 55

    Questions
    1. What is a "good level" for a diabetic cat?
    2. When/how do I begin to adjust his dosage?
    3. Should I not have given him a **** this morning when he was 127? Then I'm off schedule...does that matter?
    *** Any suggestions are appreciated!
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2015
  2. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Hi - Can you please tell me what type of meter you are using; also how much time has gone by since you last tested your kitty and got that 55 BG reading?
     
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  3. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    I'm using the alpha track meter and I tested him 1 hour ago.
     
  4. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Ok, I use the AT meter, too. Please check his BG now and report that # here.
     
  5. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Ok...give me a second.
     
  6. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Olivia, if your kitty's BG is less than 69 now, I want you to do two things:
    1) Rub some Karo syrup or honey on his gums;
    2) Then give him some higher-carb food - either canned with gravy or dry kibble - whatever he'll eat.
    Then in 15 minutes, I want you to retest his BG and report that number here. (As we'll want to make sure his BG is rising after the syrup/food.)

    Here's why: That 50 # you got an hour ago is too low as measured on an Alpha Trak, and we don't want him to go hypoglycemic on you.
    So we want you to raise his BG # with some higher-carb food if the number you have now is @ less than 69.
    We do not recommend you shoot insulin when the pre-shot BG test is less than 200. But don't worry; we all have made mistakes, and this situation IS correctible if you follow the steps above.

    Please respond so I know that you've received this message. Thanks.:bighug:
     
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  7. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Ok....I just tested at it was 52 so I did it again and it was 45. What should I do?
     
  8. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    See my post above. You really do need to help his BG rise now.
    Syrup or honey on gums, then high-carb food. Then retest in 15 minutes & report that # here, please.
     
  9. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Ok...doing that now.
     
  10. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Great, Olivia! Once we get his BG # back up to within a safer range, we can talk more about the questions you'd posed earlier. (I'm so glad to know you're home testing, and that you decided to write in this morning!)
     
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  11. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Gave him food and Karo syrup. I will watch him and test in a few minutes. Thank you!!!! I knew the dose was too high....but when we do the curves at the vets office the numbers are so high.
     
  12. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    I'm so happy I posted today too! He is scheduled to go in for another curve this week but his stress level is off the charts when I pick him up that I thought I would give it a shot at home.
     
  13. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    And you were correct about kitties getting more stressed at the vet's office; this often results in higher BG readings than you'd get at home (unfortunately, then sometimes vets start a kitty at too high a dose). Is better to do your curves at home - as with your kitty more relaxed, there will be greater accuracy. (Not to mention that it will also save you considerable expense.)
    I would suggest you tell your vet (respectfully, of course) that as you already have a pet-specific meter that most vets recommend, that you think it's best for your kitty to have his curves done by you at home.

    What's your boy's name, btw?
     
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  14. Squalliesmom

    Squalliesmom Well-Known Member

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    A visit to the vet can be a very stressful event, and cause BG to rise a good bit. If you can manage it, a curve done at home is probably going to show lower numbers, and be a lot less stressful on you and your kitty.
     
  15. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Here's a little tidbit for you: Did you know that some cats can have BG spikes from stress during a veterinary visit of 100 points or more? Amazing, isn't it?
     
  16. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    He went from 45 to 50....I will continue to test. What is a good number?
     
  17. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    I need you to give him a little more of that high carb food, please. (Do you have some with gravy?) We want to see him at 69 or above before we're feeling comfortable with his #s. After you feed again, re-test in another 15 min & report the #. Thanks, Olivia!
     
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  18. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Just so you know: You usually need about 15 minutes or so, after the feedings, before you start seeing a rise in the BG# (gives the syrup/food a little time to do its job).
     
  19. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    His name is bubba....he is 14 and was diagnosed last month. I will tell our vet that I'm going to do curves at home. Her office is very chaotic and i think I will get a better picture if I do it when he is calm.
     
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  20. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    And even if this results in him running a little higher # than you normally would see at pre-shot test time, that's okay!
    We often say around here: "Better too high for a day, than too low for a moment."
     
  21. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Ha, Bubba! We have another Bubba here, too! His mom's name is Bobbie & she's a great gal - no doubt she'll pop in to introduce herself soon!:)
     
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  22. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    He has a twin brother named Brutus. They came to us as fosters along with their sisters and mother a little over 14 years ago! Their mom passed last summer (cancer) and his brother has mega colon. We have 2 other cats that are 18 and 19 years old. My husband says we run a cat rest home. It's a bit overwhelming. I will admit the diabetes diagnosis almost put me over the edge!!
     
  23. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Yes, diabetes can make you feel pretty overwhelmed at the start. But that's what's so great about this forum - there's such great support here, and we all do our best to help one another. And over time, you learn that it's really not so hard to treat successfully!

    Before I forget: Did Bubba get that additional ration, and are you about to do another test shortly? As we need to make sure he's rising sufficiently. Please let me know, ok?
     
  24. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    I offered it but he did not eat it....so I gave him more Karo. Going to test now.
     
  25. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    He is at 59...ate a bit more food.
     
  26. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Should I give him more Karo?
     
  27. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Ok, am glad we're seeing a little rise happening --- BUT we'll need you to keep on with the steering with food & retesting every 15 minutes until we have him at least to 69 or more on your meter. Yes, a little more Karo certainly won't hurt; do it.
     
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  28. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Also ... how is Bubba behaving now? Is he walking around easily, etc? Not acting strangely?
     
  29. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    He is in his favorite chair...walking fine. Seems alert and is acting "normal".
     
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  30. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Ok....will continue.
     
  31. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    That's good.

    Just so you know, Olivia: I was reviewing the records of the curves on Bubba done in-office vs. what happened when you dosed him this morning at home.
    And I would recommend that for the pm dose (if you have a BG at 200 or more, otherwise you may need to skip) you probably want to drop his dose down. (Look at that first curve done on 8/18.)

    I'd rather see you go with 0.5U tonight, even if that means his pre-shot BG test tomorrow morning is a higher # than you'd like to see. As we know that Bubba gets very stressed at the vet's office, I think it would be prudent for you to go back to that 0.5U dose at home this next time, then check him mid-cycle. (Vetsulin usually doesn't cause a nadir drop until +4 hrs. or so after the injection. (Which may mean you'll need to set an alarm to get that mid-cycle BG test in tonight.) Based on those curves in your first post, you'd probably want to be checking him somewhere tonight between +4 and +6 hours after the dose.

    Does this make sense to you? As we can always adjust his dose up a bit later on, if his mid-cycle numbers indicate that's what's needed.

    What time zone are you in, btw? What time is it now where you are?

    ETA: And what time would you be giving his next dose?
     
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  32. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Just tested him and he is 83.

    Thank you for that information....that is exactly what I was going to ask you. So if he is under 200 I won't dose him tonight...but if over 200 I will do the .5 dose and check him at 4-6 hrs.

    I am going to keep monitoring him today....what if his numbers go up too high before its time for his shot?

    I'm in the eastern time zone its 230 pm. I give his 2nd dose at 9pm.
     
  33. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    It's great that he's risen to 83 - that's what we wanted; great job, Olivia! I'd say, based on his #s rising now, that you can hold off on feeding him any more & just recheck him in an hour. It is important that you recheck him, just to make certain he's not dropping again (but I tend to think he won't after having had several rounds of Karo + higher carb food).

    Also: As long as his numbers stay up, please avoid feeding him in the two-hour window directly before his pre-shot test. That's something you want to try to hold to in regard to both AM & PM shots. As, generally, you don't really want his #s "artificially" raised by food before giving a dose of insulin.

    If his #s start to run high before his next scheduled shot, that's okay. (As is better he's too high than too low, remember? And you did need to steer him out of too-low #s today, but not to worry - it'll all even out later on.)

    If, say, he were at 170 at pre-shot test time, what you'd normally do is stall for about 15 to 20 minutes - withholding food - then retest his BG: Often, a cat's BG will start rising in anticipation of the meal! Then if the # you get on the second test were at, for example, 195, I'd imagine you'd probably be fine to shoot after feeding him his normal meal as long as you plan to monitor at mid-cycle.

    But that said, we really prefer that he's registering at least 200 on the meter - and that's especially true for an Alpha Trak user. I will make sure I check in with you a bit before your pre-shot test time, too. (I am in AZ, so am 3 hours behind you in time - so your PM shot time is 6 pm my time.)
     
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  34. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    OK so it is more important that his number is above 200 before I give them the shot more so than to stay on schedule like the vet suggested....got it. So if he goes without a shot in the morning because of a low glucose reading then I would continue to test him throughout the day to make sure he is staying under 200 if he goes above 200 then I would give the dose? What is the cut off before I just give him the evening dose?

    I can not thank you enough for this information!!!
     
  35. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    So now I have some additional questions for you, Olivia:

    Does Bubba have any other health problems besides diabetes? (Kidney disease, pancreatitis, urinary tract infections, bouts of diarrhea, etc?)
    Is he on any medications or supplements (or has he been recently) at this time besides Vetsulin?
    What is his weight? Overweight/ underweight?
    What type of food does he typically eat (brand/formula) and how much does he get per day (in ounces)?
    How often during the day do you usually feed him?

    We have a spreadsheet template for you, in which you can plug his BG #s - we now have one that is specifically for Alpha Trak users, too: You'll see that in the instructions, and here's the link to that (just put a call out for help on the Main Forum if you have trouble getting that Spreadsheet up and running):
    FDMB SPREADSHEET INSTRUCTIONS
     
  36. Squalliesmom

    Squalliesmom Well-Known Member

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    Yes, if it's his usual scheduled time for his shot. If he is under 200 at shot time, he will probably rise throughout the day, but better safe than sorry. You won't want to dose him again until his next shot time.
     
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  37. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Well, you really want to keep him on a pretty regular schedule for his dosing; I'm assuming you're doing twice a day? Now as Vetsulin is an intermediate-acting insulin -and IF your schedule allows - it's probably ok for you to dose, say at +11 hours after the last dose if Bubba is already up past 200.

    As for keeping him below 200 throughout the cycle; right now that's not really critical: The important thing at present is that you keep him from going too LOW: And on an Alpha-Trak meter, I'd say that - because you're new at this - you might not want to let Bubba go below 80 at nadir (the lowest point in the cycle) on your AT meter. As your spreadsheet fills in with numbers, you'll be able to start seeing what Bubba's own patterns are. This is why we recommend getting some mid-cycle #s, both daytime & nighttime cycles if at all possible, as these - along with the preshot #s - will give you a clear indication of how the insulin is working and whether or not a dose adjustment is required. I'd recommend that you consult the more experienced folks on the forums before deciding on any dose changes - as there are folks here who are very familiar with Vetsulin, and have used it with their own kitties.
     
  38. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    The reason I mentioned using the Main Forum when you have a dosing question or other concern is that you'll get lots more eyes on your post. (You can, of course, post in the Vetsulin forum, as well.)

    Also, if you have an emergency or an impending hypo-type situation (similar to what was happening earlier today with Bubba's very low BG#) you can use the red "911" icon: This alerts others that you need a response immediately.

    And if it's just a general question, you can use the blue "?" icon. (Just so you know.):)
     
  39. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    There's a little prefix drop-down menu that allows you to insert one of those icons when you click on "Start a New Thread" and where you insert the title of the thread...
     
  40. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Bubba has no other health issues. No other medications.

    14 lbs....he is a very big cat...not over weight. Vet is happy with his weight.

    Food...before diabetes is fancy feast dry and wet and all our cats are free fed. Like I said before bubba is our youngest cat and he is 14 so I pretty much give them any food the wanted. Most days I'm just happy that they eat!
    After diabetes and doing all my reading about food. They are still free fed but they eat natural balance dry and both natural balance/fancy feast

    Thanks for the spreadsheet...I will populate it when I get time.
     
  41. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Sounds good, Olivia.
    Also (not trying to overwhelm you;)) ... but when you get the chance, please go to your profile page to put together your signature so it will appear with your posts (see mine above for an example) - noting things like Bubba's diagnosis date/ insulin type/ food, etc. & put ALPHA TRAK 2 METER and ALPHA TRAK SS (once you have your spreadsheet up & running) in caps so that people are well aware that you use a pet-specific meter rather than a human-type meter.
    I'm SO happy to hear that Bubba has no other health problems;that's great!!! And I'll say it again: You did a terrific job steering Bubba back into a safe BG zone today!:bighug:
    (Ok, Olivia - I'm done bugging you, for now ...:p)
     
  42. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    I couldn't have done it without your help! Thank you so much!!!

    Just did another reading and he is at 138.
     
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  43. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Yea! I LOVE that number!!!:D

    ETA: And now you can probably give his ears (and yourself) a break until pre-shot test time comes around.
     
  44. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Just tested again and it's 142 (850pm)....so no shot for now but I will test in another hour. If it's still below 200 do I need to test in the middle of the night?
     
  45. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Let's see what you get in another hour; and if he's not up @ 200, you'll just need to skip tonight; and the bonus there is that you won't need to test again until his AMPS test time!
     
  46. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Please withhold food until after that next test result, ok?
     
  47. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Hi Olivia, I just wanted to say welcome and wow! you had quite a scare this afternoon and thank Goodness you posted and Robin assisted you. She is wonderful! Glad you found this forum as you will learn a lot to be able to help your Bubba. See you around the forum.
     
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  48. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Ok. His poor ears!! I'm hoping the testing will get easier!
     
  49. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Thanks! Yeah...I'm not sure what we would have done without this forum!! Especially Robin!!
     
  50. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Aw, you guys ... thanks! You're making me blush ... or, er... wait --- Maybe it's another hot flash!!!:p
     
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  51. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    How cool is this? DOUBLE BUBBAS!
     
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  52. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Isn't that a bubble gum!??
     
  53. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I think there was a gum ... called "Double Bubble?" So I guess we could go with Dubba Bubbas, eh?
     
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  54. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    What was that retest #, Olivia?
     
  55. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    167. I'm good to not give a shot....right? I'm nervous!!!!
     
  56. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    You're doing GREAT, Olivia! Yes, skip the shot tonight. Go ahead & feed him his dinner.
     
  57. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    He did not want dinner...just some cuddles! I'm so bad at getting blood from his ears...they are like Swiss cheese right now. Poor guy!
     
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  58. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Well, then it's especially good that you can give his little ears a break overnight.:) You might try to give him a little something to eat before you go to bed ...

    For tomorrow morning: Test at his usual pre-shot time; if you're above 200 (which I'm assuming he will be by then) go ahead & feed him his usual meal, then shoot: I'd recommend going down to 0.5U (like where your vet had started him on 8/18), then get a mid cycle # or two, around +4 to +6. If you see him start to drop below 80 on your AT2 meter, give him a little (about .75 oz.) - that's about 2/8ths of a can of FF - then recheck him in 15 to 20 minutes. I think he'll do much better for you tomorrow at the reduced dose. At least this is what I would do if this was my cat. I would rather see him run a little higher than too low again until we see how he does at a lower dose.

    P.S. You've handled all of this so well today; I'm really proud of you!:bighug:
     
  59. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Ok...this is the plan for tomorrow! I will let you know how it goes.
     
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  60. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    And don't worry - his ears will "toughen up" some over time. It's really more like a mosquito bite to a kitty, because there are few nerve endings in the edges of the ears - not at all like when we prick one of our fingertips! But I know it's hard at the beginning, when you're worried that you may be making your kitty uncomfortable. But trust me: They really do get used to the routine. And all the cuddles after testing are a very good thing. Give Bubba an extra scritch under the chin for me & tell him I think he's a real trooper. (And that Bat-Bat thinks he's a hottie!:D:cat:)
     
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  61. Chris & China

    Chris & China Well-Known Member

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    Have you got some Neosporin with pain relief ointment?? A little dab can really help heal those ears as well as providing a little extra relief from any little stings he might be feeling (but it's true...there really aren't many pain receptors in the edges of their ears)

    The ointment can also help by getting the blood drop to "bead up" (like oil and water)....just a thin film is enough
     
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  62. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Ok...tested at 8am (normally begin feeding cats at 830 for a 9am shot). And his number is 167!!!!! I'm sure it's because he didn't eat much last night but he was hungry this morning.

    So....he just ate a little...I will test at 930-10am and see where he's at.
     
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  63. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Hi Olivia ~ it could be very well be because he didn't eat last night. When the number is that close to 200 you can also stall 20 minutes without feeding and retest. Sometime, you might have to stall without food for several 20 minute cycles before you can shoot. If he is 200 or above you can shoot. Glad he is eating.
     
  64. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Good morning, Olivia! How much did Bubba actually eat after you got that 167?
     
  65. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Did not eat very much....did his normal lick it and take a bite or two. I just tested him again and he is at 86. What the heck is going on???
     
  66. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    This may have been a bad test (it happens sometimes). Please recheck now, using his other ear.
     
  67. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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  68. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Other ear is 80
     
  69. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Ok, you're going to skip his dose this cycle, as he's not going to rise for you. I want you to feed him, though - don't overfeed, just see if he'll go ahead and eat his usual meal. As he has no insulin in his system right now, that 80 BG is NOT a danger. Actually, that's a darned good number, given that he's off insulin since yesterday morning!

    ETA: And my next question is: How's his behavior in general? Is he peeing/ pooping/ purring/ playing/ preening (bathing himself) as usual?
     
  70. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Cleaning himself in his chair and purring when I pet him...he seemed tired this morning....he usually wakes me up for food but this morning I was worried about him so I woke up early and went looking for him. Then he ate like normal and went to his chair in the sunroom....everything very normal other than the early morning wake up call.

    Should I put down the food I know he will eat (ff dry) or the grain free food he only eats when starving?
     
  71. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Are both foods you're talking about here dry food formulas? Can you give me the Fancy Feast dry formula name on the bag, as well as the name on the grain free that you're mentioning?
     
  72. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Both are dry

    Natural balance wild pursuit tuna

    Fancy feast dry ocean white fish
     
  73. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    So does Bubba not like canned food? Is he what you'd call a "dry food addict?" (As some cats can be ...)
     
  74. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Aug 18, 2015
    Yes...he is a dry food addict. He will lick the canned stuff but rarely eats it unless it's one of the broth kinds which I was told are not good.
     
  75. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Sep 28, 2013
    I have a question: Are you at home with your kitties most of the time? (i.e., not working outside the home, I mean, where you'd have a less flexible schedule in your life ...)
     
  76. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Aug 18, 2015
    I am at home. I free feed because I worked outside the home for 12 years of our cats life so now they are just used to having food there all the time. Since bubbas diagnosis I have switched to grain free dry and I put cans down for him when he begs. Making sure that he has eaten something before his shots.
     
  77. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2013
    Sorry ... really long post ahead here!;)
    I understand, Olivia, I really do! My cat used to be a dry-food addict, too. Bat-Bat was free-feeding for almost 10 years, mainly because (if I'm totally honest with myself about it:oops:) it was just a heck of a lot more convenient for me, given my very busy schedule over those years ...

    I am now firmly convinced that free-feeding her almost 100% dry kibble was a big factor in her developing diabetes, and Bat-Bat had ballooned up to 18 lbs.:eek: (Her optimum weight is 11 lbs; she's pretty big-boned & long, for a female cat.)

    So then I started trying to slow my chow-hound, dry-food-addicted kitty down on the eating, & cut back on her dry rations some: Used a "kibble ball" (she had to play with it/get exercise in order to retrieve the dry kibble bits inside), and even a bought a special bowl that looked like a flying saucer (she had to dig the dry kibble out of various holes in her "spaceship" in order to eat it).

    When she'd lost a lot of weight over time, at first I was relieved ... until I found out that the reason she'd lost all that weight (oops, down to about 9.5 lbs!) was because she was - by then - severely diabetic.:arghh:

    I have attached two documents here: Both are by veterinarian Dr. Lisa Pierson, who is known as one of the foremost experts on healthy eating habits for cats in general - and on the whys/hows of feeding of diabetic cats in particular! One is a food chart for your reference - there are so many, many choices in low-carb canned foods.
    (I feel confident that you'll eventually find some on that list that Bubba ends up loving!) :cat:

    The other doc provides great tips for transitioning dry-food addicts to wet/canned foods - I strongly encourage you to read this. (And yep - it usually does take some time!:rolleyes:)

    Olivia, I know that having a diabetic kitty in the household is stressful:nailbiting: and overwhelming:(. Believe me, everyone here knows the kinds of feelings you've been having since being told that your kitty has diabetes. (There were days, in the beginning, when I just wanted to crawl into my bed and cry!)
    Some of the changes/challenges we face in learning to treat our sugar-kitties effectively can feel really daunting at first, but it's all "do-able" - just ask anybody here! Please know for sure that all of us @ FDMB "have your back" ... we're here to support you; to cheer you on and to help ensure your success in treating Bubba.

    Let me know how Bubba's eating for you today (as we definitely want him to eat) and please avoid that two-hour window before his p.m. pre-shot time, as we want him to be hungry so that he'll eat right before he gets another shot of insulin. Tonight, if he's around the 160's when you test at shot-time, WITHHOLD FOOD, wait another 15-20 minutes and test his BG again to see if it will rise on its own while he's anticipating his dinner. This may take 2-3 rounds of withholding food & retesting before his BG rises. (It has taken me up to an hour of that routine sometimes to get my girl's BG to rise all on its own.)

    As to why he had to skip a dose again this morning: It may be that his body is still recovering from too high a dose yesterday morning & the resulting deep BG drop mid-cycle; it could even be that his pancreas is actually starting to kick in. (Wouldn't that be great!:))

    Time and careful monitoring over the next few days will start providing you some clearer direction. (Am I correct in assuming that your vet didn't give you much in the way of instructions when he started Bubba on insulin, except to tell you to bring him in for those BG curves in-office?)

    :bighug::bighug::bighug: - Robin (P.S. Please don't forget to put up a shout-out thread on the Main Forum if you need help getting a spreadsheet up & running; unfortunately, I'm of no use there - I needed a lot of help with that, too!:rolleyes:)
     

    Attached Files:

  78. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2015
    Great info...thanks again Robin.

    The free feeding is totally out of convenience for me. Bubba has always been a food hog and when I would feed them all at the same time (wet) he would literally push the others out of the way and lick theirs (then they wouldn't eat it). I tried lots of different methods for correcting this and the easiest was to put lots of wet food down in different rooms and hope for the best (I have 4 very fussy cats). Then I left a small bowl of dry food in case they didn't like what I put down.

    Bubba did eat again shortly after my last post. Now his normal routine is to sleep for a good portion of the day.

    You are correct...my vet gave me ZERO information! Just to keep doing these curves at the office until we get the dose correct.

    I'm going to pray that his pancrease is kicking in.

    I will give this info a read when I get a second.
     
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  79. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2013
    Boy, except for you having more than one cat, your feeding situation with Bubba sounds so much like mine had been!!! Before our dear old dog, Glassy passed away 4 years ago (age 17, liver cancer), I'd actually catch Bat-Bat trying to steal HER food, too - we ended up having to feed poor Glassy outdoors!

    One thing I've come to face about myself: I allowed Bat-Bat to turn into a "finicky" dry-food addict. I realize now that cats are a lot like young children: They can be taught - via our own habits/reactions in dealing with their behaviors - to be pretty darned bratty. Did Bat-Bat like having to be fed on a schedule? Heck, no! Did she yowl at me & follow me around, begging for more food, a lot of the time? You bet'cha! But I held my ground, even though it was really hard and resulted - at first - in some skipped insulin doses that I would have preferred not to have skipped ... but if she wasn't eating at preshot time, I was afraid of the insulin making her crash hard later. Putting our kitties on a schedule to eat - whether those total daily rations (based on each cat's optimum weight) are divided up into two meals a day or four meals a day (whatever works) - ultimately makes your life easier ... and the cats end up healthier, too!

    If Bat didn't eat her scheduled meal within 45 min to an hour after I set it down, it got removed until the next scheduled meal time, regardless of how mad she was at not being allowed to free-feed anymore. She really rioted, but I forced myself to hang tight to my resolve to get her eating habits turned around. Portion control is an important part of keeping a diabetic cat regulated, too - and for maintaining that kitty's healthy weight. (I was actually weighing Bat-Bat every day for a while; now I generally weigh her only once a week, since her daily rations are carefully measured.)

    What I found out: My cat really was not going to starve herself to death because I was transitioning her over to canned foods & a onto tighter feeding schedule; changing those old eating habits didn't harm her one bit! (Even though she wanted me to believe I was totally torturing her. You should have heard the racket she made around here for awhile - yikes, some days I thought I'd lose my mind!)

    Anyway ... enjoy reading Dr. Pierson's tips & I'll check in with you later on. :bighug:
     
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  80. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2015
    Olivia, my Bubba is part hog too, which is probably how he got to be a diabetic. He also ate dry food too, which I quickly stopped after his diabetic DX. Robin really helped me with the feeding schedule thing too. With our kitties grazing all day, it is impossible to find the nadir of their schedule. Your Bubba will probably cry a bit too at first but it did not take long for my Bubba to realize that momma bear meant business. Also, since he is a food hound too, you might want to isolate him in another room away from the other cats. Whenever I get lacks and think I can feed my two cats side by side, Bubba , my Bubba,(Red Bubba) quickly reminds me that he will scarf down Forrest's food in a heart beat if I turn my back. Geez.......:( Cats are very territorial with their food source it turns out. And, It turned out that it was a matter of me sticking to a routine that was in everyone's best interest. I understand your dilemma.
     
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  81. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Aug 18, 2015
    I totally agree that they are like toddlers...bubba was used to even eating off my plate at dinner time which caused all sorts of problems! He would watch you eat and try to swat the food as you ate! We broke him of that habit many years ago but he has always been very territorial when it comes to food.

    He never eats the whole can of food....just licks it to death and walks away...then he wants a fresh can in a few hours. I feel guilty so I open a fresh can and it all starts again.

    I will do the reading and figure out a plan. I feel like I've done nothing but research and read for the last month but I'm beginning to get a clear picture of what needs to be done.
     
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  82. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Jun 15, 2015
    Red Bubba, stands on his hind legs while we are eating and tries to swat food off my plate too!, so oh, I know what you are going through!
     
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  83. Olive & Paula

    Olive & Paula Well-Known Member

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    Sep 6, 2015
    My Smokey is a big fluffy hog. My two civvies knew when to stop eating. Smokey doesn't. No free feeding in this house. If the two civvies miss the mealtime. Oh well they wait till next time (wish I followed the rule for myself) lol. They are fed at 7am, +3, +6 then they all sleep and meals start again at 7pm, +3, +6. Smokey gets boiled chicken at the 3 & 6 times. Seems to be working.
     
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  84. Chris & China

    Chris & China Well-Known Member

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    May 10, 2013
    If you're guilty, you're in good company!! I think we all have life sentences! China only likes the "wettest" part of the food, which usually lasts about half a can of Fancy Feast...after that, you'd think I was trying to get her to eat chalk......so the civvies get the leftovers and China gets a fresh can!!

    But seriously...if he likes the "wet part", you could try adding a little warm water to each serving...a lot of times it'll help get them to eat a little more...and the extra water is great for their kidneys
     
  85. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2013
    Wow! Only goes to show: We all have LOTS in common in dealing with our sugar-kitties! Sure does help to know we're definitely not alone in dealing with things like this, doesn't it?
     
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  86. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Aug 18, 2015
    Ok...just tested in prep for his 9pm shot and he is 127 (no food for about 1.5 hours).
     
  87. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Sep 28, 2013
    Wow, this is really impressive!!! Did Bubba eat reasonably well for you today?
     
  88. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Sep 28, 2013
    Gotta tell you, Olivia ... from here it's looking like Bubba may actually be going for yet another skip tonight, as he's hanging in with some really marvelous a.m. & p.m. BG #s! As long as he's eating for you and the 5 P's are fine (peeing/pooping/purring/playing/preening), I'd say: Count your blessings! Go, Bubba, go!!!:D
     
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  89. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Aug 18, 2015
    Yes...he ate fine today. I did the normal open a can when he cries for food (4 cans total...mostly licking)...also left the grain free dry down for him today.

    So next steps.....test again in about an hour? Can I feed him now?
     
  90. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Jun 15, 2015
    Wow! Go Bubba, Go!!! Awesome numbers!
     
  91. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Sep 28, 2013
    What you need to know: After the first BG am/pm test, you withhold food & test again in about 15-20 minutes after the first test. But I really don't think he's going to rise enough for you to warrant a dose. Can you go ahead and do a recheck right now with the other ear to confirm his low #?
     
  92. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Aug 18, 2015
    Sure...give me a second
     
  93. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Aug 18, 2015
    130

    I'm spinning right now!
     
  94. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Spinning for joy, I hope? Because tonight is most definitely a skip-the-dose night! Go ahead & feed him his usual dinner meal. And you'll be able to get a good night's sleep, Bubba's ears will get a break & just test him again in the morning at the usual pre-shot time.:)
     
  95. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Aug 18, 2015
    Yes...very happy! he is eating now....he is really sick of me touching his ears....I swear he is giving me the evil eye!
     
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  96. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Jun 15, 2015
    It's looking very nice for Bubba. What a testimony for home testing rather than the vet's office where our kitties are so stressed and resulting in higher numbers and higher doses based on those numbers. Good job Olivia!
     
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  97. Robin&BB

    Robin&BB Well-Known Member

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    Sep 28, 2013
    Oh, I know! Although Bat-Bat is generally good about her ear pokes, every time I have to pick her up to put her on the chair to "assume the position" she makes this little tiny "reh"-type meow; her own little brand of complaint which makes me think she's saying, "Oh, crap .. THAT again ..."
     
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  98. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Jun 15, 2015
    I'll the "reh" rather than a swat or a bite.......he is hating it and won't let me test the right ear to give the poor left one a break.
     
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  99. olivia1173

    olivia1173 Member

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    Aug 18, 2015
    Just tested

    129 left ear
    Waited 15 mins
    130 right ear

    Just fed him.....
     
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  100. Bobbie And Bubba

    Bobbie And Bubba Well-Known Member

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    Jun 15, 2015
    Olivia, this is so great to see! Your Bubba is doing so awesome. I am enjoying seeing his great progress!
     
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