Mimis mom
Member Since 2019
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...ool-off-in-the-lagoon-89.223984/#post-2505600
hopefully she doesn’t sun bathe too much today!
hopefully she doesn’t sun bathe too much today!
Mimi 1/8 AMPS 217
- Thread starter Mimis mom
- Start date
carfurby (GA)
Member Since 2012
How adorable. I hope Mimi slides down today.
Ti-Mousse (GA) Pepe (GA)
Member Since 2018
She's really enjoying it! 
Maybe a green again today !!
Maybe a green again today !!
JoyBee&Ravan
Member Since 2018
Sue and Luci
Member Since 2017
How beautiful she is in the beaming sun Enjoy your day!
Enjoy your day!
Rosa PMd me with the following questions so I’m providing answers here in case any other member has input.
Her BG won’t drop after eating at this point like humans do because her pancreas is not yet working. We don’t usually see that until the dose gets down to about 0.1u and the cat is all green. If she drops, it’s because of the insulin you give, not because of her pancreas and it’s not likely tied to eating except late in the cycle when eating can slow down the duration unless she’s clearing a bounce.
You will have to figure out how often she needs to eat. It varies by cat. My Gracie ate at PS, +1, +2, +3 on lantus and PS, +2, +4, +5 on levemir. ECID.
No, she didn’t eat every hour. She ate every hour from AMPS to +3. Many cats do.
She generally did not eat after +3 unless her numbers were dropping. She didn’t eat in the two hours prior to preshot.
If you read the post on Dealing with Low Numbers, you’ll see that when they first hit green in a cycle, unless it’s very early in the cycle and they’ve dropped or it’s a number below 50, you give a couple tsps of low carb food to try and get them to stay safely at flat green numbers above 50.
That may or may not work with Mimi with your schedule and I wouldn’t try it on a day you have to work.
You need to feed her the number of calories she needs. I knew how many calories Gracie needed and I divided her food up into portions so she got the calories she needed. Don’t decrease the amount of food she’s getting if it keeps her weight stable.
YOU have to figure out what works best for Mimi. As an example, I started feeding Gracie equal portions at PS, +1, +2, +3 but that didn’t work for her. So I started feeding her bigger portions at PS and +1 and less at +2 and +3 but still the same exact overall amount. That helped.
Feeding minimeals helps the pancreas not get overloaded. It also works with the insulin as the insulin onsets but it’s different for every cat. A cat, like Sienne’s that onset quick and nadired early needs a different plan then a cat like Gracie. However, feeding most of the food before mid cycle helps the duration of the insulin continue longer.
Some people here free feed their cats and they do fine. It’s up to YOU to figure out what is best for Mimi. Feeding her after her nadir could be clipping her duration short.
I mean feeding the same portion didn’t work because she onset at +2 and needed to have more food on board before she onset to counteract the drop.
You know what works for Mimi by starting in the same place we all did...look at her SS, see where she drops, and make a feeding plan to work with her insulin to flatten her out a bit. It’s trial and error....again, like for all of us.
I’m not sure who told you that the insulin stays the same up until two hours after +12 because that’s incorrect. Until a cat is tightly regulated, an active cycle looks like this (remember this from the New to the Group sticky):
+0 - PreShot number.
+1 - Usually higher than PreShot number because of the last shot wearing off. May see a food spike in this number.
+2 - Often similar to the PreShot number. Onset begins around +2 for most cats. You'll probably see an active cycle if the +2 is the same/similar OR lower than the preshot number. Continue testing!
+3 - Often lower than the PreShot number.
+4 - Lower.
+5 - Lower.
+6 - Nadir/Peak (the lowest number of cycle. NOTE: ECID. Not every cat has a mid-cycle nadir. Adjust the hours on this example to fit your cat.)
+7 - Surf (hang around the nadir number).
+8 - Slight rise.
+9 - Slight rise.
+10 - Rising.
+11 - Rising (one of the quirks of Lantus/Basaglar/Levemir: some cat's blood glucose numbers dip around +10 or +11... not to be confused with nadir).
+12 - PreShot number.
Look at post 15, by Jill, in this condo and I’ll let her explanation suffice here as it is a good one.
Her BG won’t drop after eating at this point like humans do because her pancreas is not yet working. We don’t usually see that until the dose gets down to about 0.1u and the cat is all green. If she drops, it’s because of the insulin you give, not because of her pancreas and it’s not likely tied to eating except late in the cycle when eating can slow down the duration unless she’s clearing a bounce.
You will have to figure out how often she needs to eat. It varies by cat. My Gracie ate at PS, +1, +2, +3 on lantus and PS, +2, +4, +5 on levemir. ECID.
No, she didn’t eat every hour. She ate every hour from AMPS to +3. Many cats do.
She generally did not eat after +3 unless her numbers were dropping. She didn’t eat in the two hours prior to preshot.
If you read the post on Dealing with Low Numbers, you’ll see that when they first hit green in a cycle, unless it’s very early in the cycle and they’ve dropped or it’s a number below 50, you give a couple tsps of low carb food to try and get them to stay safely at flat green numbers above 50.
That may or may not work with Mimi with your schedule and I wouldn’t try it on a day you have to work.
You need to feed her the number of calories she needs. I knew how many calories Gracie needed and I divided her food up into portions so she got the calories she needed. Don’t decrease the amount of food she’s getting if it keeps her weight stable.
YOU have to figure out what works best for Mimi. As an example, I started feeding Gracie equal portions at PS, +1, +2, +3 but that didn’t work for her. So I started feeding her bigger portions at PS and +1 and less at +2 and +3 but still the same exact overall amount. That helped.
Feeding minimeals helps the pancreas not get overloaded. It also works with the insulin as the insulin onsets but it’s different for every cat. A cat, like Sienne’s that onset quick and nadired early needs a different plan then a cat like Gracie. However, feeding most of the food before mid cycle helps the duration of the insulin continue longer.
Some people here free feed their cats and they do fine. It’s up to YOU to figure out what is best for Mimi. Feeding her after her nadir could be clipping her duration short.
I mean feeding the same portion didn’t work because she onset at +2 and needed to have more food on board before she onset to counteract the drop.
You know what works for Mimi by starting in the same place we all did...look at her SS, see where she drops, and make a feeding plan to work with her insulin to flatten her out a bit. It’s trial and error....again, like for all of us.
I’m not sure who told you that the insulin stays the same up until two hours after +12 because that’s incorrect. Until a cat is tightly regulated, an active cycle looks like this (remember this from the New to the Group sticky):
+0 - PreShot number.
+1 - Usually higher than PreShot number because of the last shot wearing off. May see a food spike in this number.
+2 - Often similar to the PreShot number. Onset begins around +2 for most cats. You'll probably see an active cycle if the +2 is the same/similar OR lower than the preshot number. Continue testing!
+3 - Often lower than the PreShot number.
+4 - Lower.
+5 - Lower.
+6 - Nadir/Peak (the lowest number of cycle. NOTE: ECID. Not every cat has a mid-cycle nadir. Adjust the hours on this example to fit your cat.)
+7 - Surf (hang around the nadir number).
+8 - Slight rise.
+9 - Slight rise.
+10 - Rising.
+11 - Rising (one of the quirks of Lantus/Basaglar/Levemir: some cat's blood glucose numbers dip around +10 or +11... not to be confused with nadir).
+12 - PreShot number.
Look at post 15, by Jill, in this condo and I’ll let her explanation suffice here as it is a good one.
Judy and Freckles
Member Since 2019
@Marje and Gracie excellent information Marje! Thank you and thanks for linking that condo by Jill. There's a lot of great information in there!
Mimis mom
Member Since 2019
I can’t really find when Mimi nadirs because she seems to be flat more than curve.
I’ve seen low numbers start at the beginning of the cycle, during the mid cycle and at the end of the cycle (from her 2019 chart)
Where is Mimi’s nadir? I would want to feed before that, and then keep her from rising too fast from food?
How do I know which meal plan is best for Mimi- I get nervous about going longer than a few hours between her meals because it could also spike ketones right? Also, I don’t want her to throw up from a hungry belly, Ive seen her do that.
I have to admit- I’m starting to get caregivers burnout...I feel like I’m going to somehow ef this up and my cat is going to end up back in the hospital and I will have no way of saving her financially.
I almost don’t feel intelligent enough (to retain and successfully apply all of this is a timely manner) to really do this correctly.
and then in the back of my mind, my coworker told me their cat had diabetes and lived for 5 years without even testing- just doing curves at the doctors once a month. I will never do that but I’m just saying- I’m going to somehow mess this up.
Everyone is so organized on here and that’s what Mimi needs- im not good at it- and I’m actually getting depressed about it.
I’ve seen low numbers start at the beginning of the cycle, during the mid cycle and at the end of the cycle (from her 2019 chart)
Where is Mimi’s nadir? I would want to feed before that, and then keep her from rising too fast from food?
How do I know which meal plan is best for Mimi- I get nervous about going longer than a few hours between her meals because it could also spike ketones right? Also, I don’t want her to throw up from a hungry belly, Ive seen her do that.
I have to admit- I’m starting to get caregivers burnout...I feel like I’m going to somehow ef this up and my cat is going to end up back in the hospital and I will have no way of saving her financially.
I almost don’t feel intelligent enough (to retain and successfully apply all of this is a timely manner) to really do this correctly.
and then in the back of my mind, my coworker told me their cat had diabetes and lived for 5 years without even testing- just doing curves at the doctors once a month. I will never do that but I’m just saying- I’m going to somehow mess this up.
Everyone is so organized on here and that’s what Mimi needs- im not good at it- and I’m actually getting depressed about it.
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Judy and Freckles
Member Since 2019
Rosa:
Mimi and Freckles started this FD journey around the same time and there certainly is a lot to learn, and think that we are just learning about our cat in particular... never mind all of the variables!
I hear your concern, you only want the best for Mimi and I think you are doing a great job. You are asking good questions, you are keeping good records, you are testing lots, and you are reading the information. To synthesize all of this information at this point is what we rely on the experienced FD people on this forum - we should be starting to form our own hypothesis but then check to see if we are way out in left field or if we are on the right track. No one wants to screw something up for their cat, that's why all of the people on this forum are sooooo generous with their time and knowledge. The experienced people on this board are our 'safety net' until we are better at figuring this stuff out. No one is expected to know everything but the combined knowledge and experience on this board is really comforting because even though ECID, I think the senior members on FDMB have pretty much seen it all! Mimi is very lucky to have a mom like you who CARES soooo much about her. Think back to another situation where you felt overwhelmed where things turned out that you could handle it. How did you do it? ECID but so is EPID (every person is different) - what works for one person to deal with a challenging situation may not work for another.
Crista & Ming
Member Since 2018
Rosa, it's okay. Breathe. You're doing great! Look at Mimi's SS! She's all blue and green! You're testing for ketones and you're using calipers. You're doing a lot and all of it very well.
I've only recently figured out Ming's onset and nadir (and still, he decides to change it every once in a while). And he's been diabetic for two years - half of which I didn't test and was dosing way too much. Nadirs also shift around and it doesn't help when they bounce. It drives us crazy but I eventually learned to roll my eyes and just accept it for what it is. I chose to focus on the little positives.
I do want to prescribe you some me-time. Lol! I think it would help you to do something you really enjoy and give yourself a little break. I know it's hard and sometimes our cats ruin our plans but whenever you can find it, take it!
If you're asking questions, trying your best to follow the methods here and considering the advice given here, I can't see how you can mess up.
I believe it will get better, Rosa. I look back at the beginning months of when I first started testing Ming and I would freak out if I saw a blue number. But now I get disappointed when I see it. I still freak out sometimes when he gets low or do something that wasn't ideal but everything is a learning opportunity if you let it.
I've only recently figured out Ming's onset and nadir (and still, he decides to change it every once in a while). And he's been diabetic for two years - half of which I didn't test and was dosing way too much. Nadirs also shift around and it doesn't help when they bounce. It drives us crazy but I eventually learned to roll my eyes and just accept it for what it is. I chose to focus on the little positives.
I do want to prescribe you some me-time. Lol! I think it would help you to do something you really enjoy and give yourself a little break. I know it's hard and sometimes our cats ruin our plans but whenever you can find it, take it!
That might have worked for your coworker's cat but I also would never do that. I think knowledge is power. But knowing things doesn't mean you can always change it. If Mimi wants to keep her nadir a secret for now, then we can only hope with time and data gathering, we'll figure out her secret.
If you're asking questions, trying your best to follow the methods here and considering the advice given here, I can't see how you can mess up.
I believe it will get better, Rosa. I look back at the beginning months of when I first started testing Ming and I would freak out if I saw a blue number. But now I get disappointed when I see it. I still freak out sometimes when he gets low or do something that wasn't ideal but everything is a learning opportunity if you let it.
I didn’t give you info to overwhelm you so take a deep breathI can’t really find when Mimi nadirs because she seems to be flat more than curve.
I’ve seen low numbers start at the beginning of the cycle, during the mid cycle and at the end of the cycle (from her 2019 chart)
Where is Mimi’s nadir? I would want to feed before that, and then keep her from rising too fast from food?
How do I know which meal plan is best for Mimi- I get nervous about going longer than a few hours between her meals because it could also spike ketones right? Also, I don’t want her to throw up from a hungry belly, Ive seen her do that.
I have to admit- I’m starting to get caregivers burnout...I feel like I’m going to somehow ef this up and my cat is going to end up back in the hospital and I will have no way of saving her financially.
I almost don’t feel intelligent enough (to retain and successfully apply all of this is a timely manner) to really do this correctly.
and then in the back of my mind, my coworker told me their cat had diabetes and lived for 5 years without even testing- just doing curves at the doctors once a month. I will never do that but I’m just saying- I’m going to somehow mess this up.
Everyone is so organized on here and that’s what Mimi needs- im not good at it- and I’m actually getting depressed about it.
For now, try to feed most of her food before +6 and leave her some LC snacks for later to keep her tummy from getting upset. You can use freeze dried chicken, boiled chicken, or whatever she likes and put it in her auto feeder.
No, having her go a few hours between meals does not cause ketones.
For every story I hear of one like your friend’s cat, I know three that didn’t end well. The fact that you are giving her insulin, monitoring her, and seeing her BG comes down is proof that you are doing things right.
FD has a steep learning curve. We are all still learning, even those of us with almost ten years or more of experience. What I knew at one year pales in comparison to what I knew by three years. Give yourself a break. Read as much as you can; but read closely. Keep asking questions. Perhaps keep a notebook that you can go back to.
Mimis mom
Member Since 2019
thank you everyone, I needed that.
Im just having a crappy few months. I am SO thankful Mimi made it out of ICU, but am still overwhelmed with the vet bill and worry if she gets sick again on any level, even am inexpensive one, how will I afford it.
Also, I have very little social life because I don't like to be gone from her for long, because I want to get tests, and two, because her time is 9:30 I don't go out because its just early enough and just late enough.. (I can't change it because my schedule makes me work till 8 or past some nights, and some days I leave for work at 9:30). I wish I worked 5 minutes from home. I do work only 15-20 but thats just long enough to make myself mad and possibly upset management for leaving. (I just have this feeling they'll think Im overdoing it and what I am doing is excessive because "their friends cat had diabetes and they never did the things I am doing and they turned out fine" blah blah blah. I might have to make up something just to get them to not ask questions- say she needs me to express her bladder mid-day, and I have to leave.
I could in the future try and do her shots at 8:30, but that means right after work I have to go home, and I sometimes like to do my grocery shopping, and Target runs around that time because its slower, and Im just not the kind of person to make special trips to do them.
My biggest thing, and I might post this in a separate condo on another forum is having someone else administer her shot, and test her BG, fill her auto feeder, and basically "be me" for even a couple of nights. I have tons of airline miles that I was about to use, then mimi got sick, and I put everything on hold. Just small trips like seeing my best friends in Denver, Colorado for a few days, or I used to live in San Diego and haven't been back in 7 years (sh..t) I haven't been on ANY trips in 3 years, or longer.
I really don't do a lot for myself, I am too worried and concerned with Mimi and Batmans well being, even more than my own at times.
How do you guys work with caregivers? what if the cat poses an "active cycle" and they need to hang around there to test for a while, and do all the things we do when they are dipping too low. I feel silly asking someone to just "live in my house while I am gone" .
Or other fears are "will they be able to get a BG reading? Will Mimi trust them to take it or will she be scared? Are they going to know how to give a proper subq shot and not a fur shot?" If something happened to mimi while I was away on these little "vacations" I so long to take, I will never forgive myself...
I don't even want to move because I don't want her to get stressed.
Why are cats so easily stressed? I wonder why biologically. Is it because they are always on edge because they are always looking for "prey"
What instinct makes them that way?
If you got this far down, thank you for listening to my incessant rambling.
Im just having a crappy few months. I am SO thankful Mimi made it out of ICU, but am still overwhelmed with the vet bill and worry if she gets sick again on any level, even am inexpensive one, how will I afford it.
Also, I have very little social life because I don't like to be gone from her for long, because I want to get tests, and two, because her time is 9:30 I don't go out because its just early enough and just late enough.. (I can't change it because my schedule makes me work till 8 or past some nights, and some days I leave for work at 9:30). I wish I worked 5 minutes from home. I do work only 15-20 but thats just long enough to make myself mad and possibly upset management for leaving. (I just have this feeling they'll think Im overdoing it and what I am doing is excessive because "their friends cat had diabetes and they never did the things I am doing and they turned out fine" blah blah blah. I might have to make up something just to get them to not ask questions- say she needs me to express her bladder mid-day, and I have to leave.
I could in the future try and do her shots at 8:30, but that means right after work I have to go home, and I sometimes like to do my grocery shopping, and Target runs around that time because its slower, and Im just not the kind of person to make special trips to do them.
My biggest thing, and I might post this in a separate condo on another forum is having someone else administer her shot, and test her BG, fill her auto feeder, and basically "be me" for even a couple of nights. I have tons of airline miles that I was about to use, then mimi got sick, and I put everything on hold. Just small trips like seeing my best friends in Denver, Colorado for a few days, or I used to live in San Diego and haven't been back in 7 years (sh..t) I haven't been on ANY trips in 3 years, or longer.
I really don't do a lot for myself, I am too worried and concerned with Mimi and Batmans well being, even more than my own at times.
How do you guys work with caregivers? what if the cat poses an "active cycle" and they need to hang around there to test for a while, and do all the things we do when they are dipping too low. I feel silly asking someone to just "live in my house while I am gone" .
Or other fears are "will they be able to get a BG reading? Will Mimi trust them to take it or will she be scared? Are they going to know how to give a proper subq shot and not a fur shot?" If something happened to mimi while I was away on these little "vacations" I so long to take, I will never forgive myself...
I don't even want to move because I don't want her to get stressed.
Why are cats so easily stressed? I wonder why biologically. Is it because they are always on edge because they are always looking for "prey"
What instinct makes them that way?
If you got this far down, thank you for listening to my incessant rambling.
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Mimis mom
Member Since 2019
I know, Im actually impressed with how patient you are at compiling everything together and remembering it all. You're very organized and I almost wish Mimi had someone like you to take care of her. I fear Ill mess it up somehow.
Thank you for making the feeding thing a little simpler (sometimes I need to be talked to like a 5 year old)
Ill try that- leave her little snacks.
From looking at her chart, where would you say her nadir tends to land? Also, do most cats have mid cycle nadirs? I know ECID, but percentage wise lets say- do 80% of them have mid cycle nadirs, being the most common?