? New cat Big John - 146 bef shot - need advice on N insulin

Discussion in 'Caninsulin / Vetsulin and N / NPH' started by Yvonne & Big John & Andy, Feb 16, 2018.

  1. Yvonne & Big John & Andy

    Yvonne & Big John & Andy Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2015
    I just picked up a cat today, Big John aka Biggie, from a woman that is going into assisted living tomorrow. He is completely new to me so I can't give much history yet. He is on N, 6 u, twice a day. I am familiar with Lantus and PZI but not with N. I have read the info on N here. Biggie was not home-tested, she just fed and gave the shot. He is on DM wet and dry and eats about 1/4 can a day and more or less free-fed on the dry. I tested him after he ate his canned food tonight before giving his shot and he was 146 on Relion human meter. I did not give his shot yet based on the info I read about not giving under 250. Does this seem OK? What should be my next step? Looking for some guidance for tonight and tomorrow morning. I am surprised he was so low after leaving his home, riding in a car, and coming into a new home with all new cats, dogs and owners. I expected much higher. Thanks to anyone who can help!
     
  2. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Welcome! :) This is a small forum so if you don't get a response fast enough try posting on the main health forum. I'm glad you've read the info sticky on N here.

    That's a high dose. How long has he been on insulin? It's possible that his mainly dry food diet is keeping him from plummeting at this dose. Too early for you to know.

    Congrats on home testing. The no shot number is set a bit higher at 250 for N because of its ability to drop BG quickly and low. You were right to skip the shot with that test result of 146 - and that was after eating. He might have been lower before food.

    It would be best for you to get accustomed to the testing routine we recommend here before changing food, insulin dose, etc. Here's the basic routine:
    1. test every day AM and PM before feeding and injecting (no food at least 2 hours before) to see if the planned dose is safe
    2. test at least once near mid cycle or at bedtime daily to see how low the BG goes
    3. do extra tests on days off to fill in the response picture
    4. if indicated by consistently high numbers on your spreadsheet, increase the dose by no more than 0.25 u at a time so you don't accidentally go right past a good dose
    5. post here for advice whenever you're confused or unsure of what to do.
    It would also be very helpful if you'd set up the spreadsheet we use here. It's viewable by all members and is the first thing we look at before offering advice: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/

    So -keep the same dose and feeding regimen for now. Start the testing routine and follow it for a few days. Log the BG data in the spreadsheet and post here or on the main health forum for advice on what to do next. Ask any/all questions you have.
     
  3. Yvonne & Big John & Andy

    Yvonne & Big John & Andy Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2015
    Thank you Kris - he has been diabetic for yrs but I don't have his records yet so pretty much in the dark for him. She requested his records be transferred to my vet but it has not happened yet. His owner was 91 so she just did what the vet said. I have another diabetic cat on Lantus so I've been doing much of what you mentioned. But N being different, need someone to run things by since I can't call my own vet until he is seen. I just posted on the tech forum to find out if I can set up another membership for this new cat so it won't be so confusing. My current spreadsheet is for my 1st cat. I hope I have not confused you! My plan is to eventually get him off the DM and maybe switch his insulin to either Lantus or PZI but until then need some expertise from other users.
     
  4. Kris & Teasel

    Kris & Teasel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    We're here to help you with N as long as he's on it. :)
     
  5. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2016
    why not switch him to Lantus so thye can be on the same thing. I was wondering about that spreadsheet too... I'm glad you cleared that up. Just set up a second spreadsheet with a second link, but call the link by the cat's name that it's for. Definitely get him off the dry. I would say go on all wet (fancy feast classic/friskies/other low carb wet) and if it were my cat I would only give one or two units when over 250 until you have more data. I'd rather under dose then over dose. changing the food could make a big difference.
     
  6. Yvonne & Big John & Andy

    Yvonne & Big John & Andy Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2015
    Thanks Janet - that's the plan but just got him yesterday and everything is new to both of us. No history on him either yet. He was at 131 at +2 just now so he is eating a FF snack. He is not hungry though - needed coaxing. I think he is coming down way too fast and this was on only 3u.
     
  7. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2016
    146 preshot is just barely above normal rage, so keep a close eye on him today. do you have high carb food and honey/karo just in case?
     
  8. Yvonne & Big John & Andy

    Yvonne & Big John & Andy Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2015
    Yes I do. I have 20 other rescue cats with a wide range of diets. His previous owner told me he eats mainly the dry DM but he left that alone today which is probably why he dropped so fast. I had mixed a little Instinct canned in with his wet this am and he ate most of that so I am hoping he won't be so hard to switch to low carb canned. He is quite chubby too. He is not the cat pictured here, that's Andy my other sugarbaby who is very trim. Thx again!
     
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  9. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2016
    Wow 20!
     
  10. Yvonne & Big John & Andy

    Yvonne & Big John & Andy Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2015
    Yeah - I know - I am a crazy cat lady! After retirement, got involved at a local no-kill shelter and took many unwanted home. Then others found me and I have taken quite a few where people could no longer keep for various reasons. I am fortunate to be able to do it with a hubby that is a great help!
     
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  11. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2016
    The most I've had is 7.... Currently 6. Plus we care for a colony of 7 outside feral cats.
     

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